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Common errors

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  • Member since
    March 2004
Posted by Mourningstar on Friday, April 23, 2004 8:54 PM
the ruck that he is refering to is the storage or tote bad that is issued to all personel in the services, know to them as an Alice pack. I am fortinate to have a former tanker to build armor with, he's filled with alot of info.
  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Friday, April 23, 2004 8:44 PM
Scorn, sorry to hear of your injury. I guess I'm naive, is ruck what I think it might be?

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Sarepta, LA
Posted by Scorn on Friday, April 23, 2004 8:32 PM
btw is the name crockett any relation to where you live by chance?

Namely in Texas?????
  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Sarepta, LA
Posted by Scorn on Friday, April 23, 2004 8:30 PM
Thank you for the enlightenment. It has been almost 10 years since I was on a tank, but I remember very clearly these things you are talking about.

I lost one ruck and a large portion of my derrier in Saudi in '91 because I figured it would just stay in the bustle just fine and dandy. WRONG!

The tracks are another issue that is great that you pointed out. Thanks again.
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Southern Maine
Posted by spector822002 on Friday, April 23, 2004 6:42 PM
Track comments are definatly true , just look at any construction vehicle, if they sit for a week or so the rust sets in , sometimes it only takes a day of good rain . However move them and the rust disappears instantly, my solution after black undercoat , is rust the tracks first , then do a steel or aluminum drybrush on german or russian armour , that should cover it . modern stuff I just do a lighter coat drybrush ,emulating a worn rubber surface . A good thing to check out would be a construction site if you are not exsposed to military hardware , the beating is almost identicle , pay attention to where the rust settles and the dust and/ or mud .
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Friday, April 23, 2004 6:13 PM
Yeah, Steve, thanks for the reality check. Great info. Guess I'll head home and un-weather my armor a bit!!lol
Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Tochigi, Japan
Posted by J-Hulk on Friday, April 23, 2004 5:48 AM
Thanks for the great info and the willingness to share it freely!

Might be time to build that Tamiya M60A3 I've been saving for a rainy day.
~Brian
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Dahlonega, Georgia
Posted by lizardqing on Friday, April 23, 2004 12:36 AM
Great stuff Steve. As anouther who has never been around the real deal it helps eliminate the guess work. Already you are an asset to the forum.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, April 22, 2004 11:23 PM
Wow!!! LOL now all we need is MTV to do a reality series on this This is good stuff I am actually trying for this effect basiclly modern armor is kept in better shape than its WW2 counter partsBig Smile [:D]Big Smile [:D]Big Smile [:D]
  • Member since
    April 2004
  • From: The cornfields of Ohio
Posted by crockett on Thursday, April 22, 2004 11:14 PM
Thanks guys,

Armor (U.S.) builders, From 1972 to 1977, served as driver, loader, gunner and TC on M48A5, M60A1,A2, andA3. From 1977 to 1980, served as a tank commander during the prototype and operational testing of the XM1(2/6 CAV, Ft. Knox, KY), also, I worked at the Lima Army Tank Plant from 1980 to 1996. I've served on and built a lot of (real) tanks. I've got those insights and I know you've got questions.......so ask already!

Steve
  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:29 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Dwight Ta-ala
Well, as we always say..."reality bites".Big Smile [:D]
Thanks for the info, Steve.


LOL, in this case it does.

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Philippines
Posted by Dwight Ta-ala on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:25 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by tigerman

Wow, I guess I'd better toss my kits into the trash now. Thanks for the reality Steve.


Laugh [(-D]Laugh [(-D]Laugh [(-D]

Well, as we always say..."reality bites".Big Smile [:D]

Thanks for the info, Steve.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:23 PM
Thanks for sharing your experience with us, that kind of information is invaluable! Smile [:)]
  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:20 PM
Wow, I guess I'd better toss my kits into the trash now. Thanks for the reality Steve.

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:20 PM
Steve-
Since I've never been on or inside a 1/1 tank I really apreciate these real-life tips about what goes on in and around a tank as it goes about its business.

Many thanks-

Glenn
  • Member since
    April 2004
  • From: The cornfields of Ohio
Common errors
Posted by crockett on Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:04 PM
Hey team-

Since I spent many years on tanks in the field, I thought I would list a few "common" errors I see on a lot of finished projects.....don't worry, this ain't criticism, we all strive for realism so here it is-

Track and Suspension:

A well weathered model that is depicted "in action" with "rust" on end connectors, center guides, etc. NO! Only if we are sitting in the motorpool or by the side of the road for a week should any oxidizing to track components be depicted. Whether in soft mud ,sand, or running on the "hardball", from Europe to the Sahara, end connectors, center guides, and sprocket teeth will be as shiny as a new dime on bearing surfaces.

U.S. ,NATO, (or other) armor with rubberized track pads- a model depicted in service with battle damage, extreme weathering etc., but no "chunked" pads? Depending on the last track change (a bear of a job, by the way), these pads rip, tear,chunk, etc., sometimes even showing the track block pins. This is commonly overlooked and is important for absolute realism. Most reference photos of tanks in service can be deceiving, the track blocks that are visible may look perfectly intact.

Road wheels on certain tanks have "wear plates" bolted to the inside surface. These wear plates are associated with the cast aluminum roadwheels which are on most modern MBT's. The wear plates are steel and the purpose is to keep the center guides from gouging the aluminum and destroying the roadwheel. Every tank that has ever made a turn should be depicted with radial gouges (natural metal) on the inboard surfaces of all roadwheels and idlers. If you've ever wondered what the extra bolt pattern was for outside of the attachment to the hub - it's the wear plates - important for accuracy especially on larger scales! NOTE: even steel roadwheels should show radial scoring on the inboard surface that contacts the centerguides. Cast or Forged steel roadwheels usually have increased material thickness in this area to withstand wear.

Tools! my pet peave... External stowage of axes, mattox, hammers, track jacks, prybars- well, this is OK (German Armor) but..... the rule is, usually if you strap it to the hull you will lose it. I know, I know, we see a lot of photos (and models)showing this stuff roped, chained, and tied to the sides and rear of the hull. The point is, what situation are we trying to depict.? Usually, when you are not expecting combat and are road marching, etc., and you have a lot of stuff, yeah, you'll strap it on antwhere it will fit. But, into action, it get's dropped in place or is stowed in sponson boxes or out of the way on the turret bustle, etc. NEVER do we leave our precious tools outside strapped to the hull or turret to get mutilated, lost, damaged,or gummed up with goo to make them unserviceable. The worst thing in the world is having thrown a track, sheared a sprocket, blown a road wheel and have to work with tools that are dirty, rusted, etc.. you get the idea.

Upper Hull:

Tow cables usually rust only when used (a lot). Normaly, when you are in a situation where you must perform recovery, you've got help (M88, etc.) Since the tow cables on the tank are somewhat difficult to unclamp, (clamps are secured by bolts, they become corroded, etc.) the recovery vehicles cables are what are usually put into play. New cables are coated with a thick coat of corrosion resitant material and withstand the elements well.

Equipment (standard issue or otherwise) on the hull should never be located blocking back deck access doors, grill doors or fuel caps. No tanker in his right mind would stow anything in the way of accessing his engine compartment or fuel tanks. Fueling is a risky business in combat. You are relatively and most times exposed, immobile and vulnerable. Fueling is quick and sloppy. There should be plenty of stains around those fuel caps!

Fenders, skirts. etc. Even the most expert driver will inevitably break ,bend, dent, or tear off these babies. Most fender damage is from running into trees. A common practice when "loggering" up for the night, blacked out, backing into a woodline and crunch! Abrams, Challenger, Leopard guys, don't put dents in the "special armor" skirts, these bad boys do not bend! Abrams front fenders are aluminum alloy and are quite sloppy fit wise. It's easy to misbuild with kits that commonly mold these into the hull detail as if they were steel. These fenders should be sawn off and refitted with gaps readily visible, and let's not forget the retention spring (wire) that locks them into place. These are omitted on many projects. This is "L" shaped spring steel that lays across the fender and locks under tension in a bracket on the front slope. A must for absolute detail on the front slope.

That's it for now, turret and interior info tomorrow.......

Keep moving, shooting and communicating!

Steve
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