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Hot OTB R. Petty's 68 roadrunner

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  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: Westland. MI USA
Hot OTB R. Petty's 68 roadrunner
Posted by mkhoot on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 6:53 PM




When in doubt just build it. Mark http://www.ipmslivonia.org/ipms/
  • Member since
    June 2007
Posted by squeakie on Thursday, June 12, 2008 12:05 AM

dang! you even got the correct intake manifold on it (open plenum torque box was the name before everybody else stole the design).

gary

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Thursday, June 12, 2008 8:15 AM

Nice build, mkhoot!

Great decalling!  

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 7:07 PM

Wow, did you do a great job.  Hardly anyone knows about this one, the Firecracker 400 car.  I'm working on the Black topped Daytona car myself at the moment, trying to capture all of the sort of trick aspecs to it like the massaged fenders, raised smoothed bumpers, slightly altered wheelbase, under hood streamling etc.  But that's more common.  Never though I'd see the white and blue one.  thanks for putting this one on here for all to see.  Really clean.

Dave B.

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Oh yeah.  I forgot.  You even got the offset roof number right.Thumbs Up [tup]
Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    June 2007
Posted by squeakie on Thursday, September 25, 2008 11:24 AM
 UnderdogF7U wrote:

Wow, did you do a great job.  Hardly anyone knows about this one, the Firecracker 400 car.  I'm working on the Black topped Daytona car myself at the moment, trying to capture all of the sort of trick aspecs to it like the massaged fenders, raised smoothed bumpers, slightly altered wheelbase, under hood streamling etc.  But that's more common.  Never though I'd see the white and blue one.  thanks for putting this one on here for all to see.  Really clean.

Dave B.

don't forget that roof line has a different shape than the OEM one. If I remember right it's flatter and maybe a couple inches lower with the windshield being laid back a few degrees. I can't remember for the life of me, but the rear window maybe different as well. The front fenders are very similar to Superbird fenders for what it's worth.

gary

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Thursday, September 25, 2008 3:53 PM

Thanks Gary, you're right and I wouldn't have changed the windshield slope if you hadn't reminded me.  I can't remember the shape of the rear window being different, however, I have a real good picture. I'll check that and try to get a post up of that for anyone else thats interested.

Thanks Dave

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    June 2007
Posted by squeakie on Friday, September 26, 2008 12:01 AM
 UnderdogF7U wrote:

Thanks Gary, you're right and I wouldn't have changed the windshield slope if you hadn't reminded me.  I can't remember the shape of the rear window being different, however, I have a real good picture. I'll check that and try to get a post up of that for anyone else thats interested.

Thanks Dave

I'm not positive about the rear window, but it seems to me that whole roof was different; yet sorta similar. I think the rear window was similar to what was on a 1969 Charger 500, and not concave like the OEM one. The rear quarter panels are much flatter ontop like the front fenders. With Yunick cheating like it was going out of style I guess he thought he'd do the samething. In the end Yunick got the usual slap on the wrist and told not to bring his car back again (bear in mind that he had already been caught cheating the year before doing the samething).

    Thinking back to the year of 1968 and 1969, and then looking at 1970 one has to kinda wonder if the Superbird fenders and quarter panels were not the samething that Petty used on that Roadrunner. The Superbird roof is still different than Petty's, but pretty much the samething as a 1969 Charger 500. I kinda wonder what NASCAR would have done if the "ball stud hemi" had have gone into production? Dyno pulls back then were showing close to 900hp on pump gas with two four barrels. Ford was pushing to get NASCAR to allow them to run their SOHC 427 that really wasn't that great of a motor due to a poor port configuration, and Chrysler had their own "cammer" that was making close to 1000hp on one carb! When NASCAR got wind of this; that was the end of the overhead cam business for good. And knowing what I know about Chrysler; they'd have had them running out the production line for anybody to buy.

gary

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Friday, September 26, 2008 3:41 PM

6804vi-vi68DaytonaPetty.jpg image by dabayerada     ty43PlymouthAlUnserDodge1968vi-vi.jpg image by dabayerada

Gary, here are a couple of photos, I tried to bring them up bigger on the post but failed.  In their full size versions however, it is clear that the fenders at least started life as the 68 , 69 types with the creases on their sides near the top. They aren't the type that came on the 70 Roadrunners or Superbirds (in fact, I believe the Superbird front fenders were 70 Coronet units)but they appear to be heavily reworked.  While not radiused much, they are subtley flared front and back.  The rear fender bottom in fact seems to be widened or pushed out just enough to meet completely flush with the edge of the rear bumper.  The other thing I can see from these photos is that the front bumper, in addition to having all its openings covered over, is moved up so that that little body colored bar or scoop type opening between the bumper and grille is removed and the top of the bumper is flush right up to the grille.  These pictures came from a Fotki album site called El Camino Billy.

I also have an older Circle Track magazine which has a nice rear 3/4 of the car racing.  The window looks kind of half way between stock and the flush Superbird type, kind of a super smooth, flush mounted yet stock shaped window, with the trailing edge of the trunk just flared up ever so slightly.

Thanks for you continuing advice and interest. and your package went in the mail today.

Dave

 

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    June 2007
Posted by squeakie on Friday, September 26, 2008 5:48 PM

I ran those two pics thru photoshop, and they were way to grainy to tell anything.

gary

  • Member since
    June 2007
Posted by squeakie on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:29 AM

 UnderdogF7U wrote:
Oh yeah.  I forgot.  You even got the offset roof number right.Thumbs Up [tup]

got the box in the mail today. The headers are nice!

gary

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Inland Northwest
Posted by Summit on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 4:00 AM
Very Impressive,Thumbs Up [tup]Thumbs Up [tup]  I was a youngster in King Richard's era, Back in the Day's of the old model mailorder company "Auto World".  At that time era I scrimped and saved to buy every "Petty" car that Johan manufactured.  After seeing this Fantasic build I will be searching ebay for "Petty Johan's"  Thanks for reviving the fire !
Sean "I've reached nearly fifty years of age with my system." Weekend GB 2008
  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 11:38 AM

Summit,  I suppose I should really let mkhoot be the one to provide the most commentary since it is his wonderful model and I'd like to hear some more myself.

What I can tell you is that your task may be easier than you think.  I believe he used an AMT Ertl 68 Roadrunner here as his base kit and modified and added to it.  I see he opened up the inner fenders but retained their basic structure for strength and added bracing and mounts for the shocks.  It also looks like he found some Holman Moody wheels, and some MPC 1970 and up Goodyear tires which are slightly different than the 68s but are a nicely detailed, better looking and more aggressive sort of tire if 100% accuracy doesn't bother you.

Now, going to my own experience and advice, so as to not further step on any toes or make guesses on mkhoots great car,the wheels to which I refer were in many early MPC stock car kits and the tires were in a plethora of kits, including all the Model King MPC reissues of that series out now  (Torino, Cyclone, Laguna, Monte Carlo) and numerous odd balls have pairs of them, like the current AMT 72 GTO (which also contains an extreemly detailed replica of a NHRA pro starting line Christmas tree) and the mislabeled 75 Duster (really a Dart Sport.)

If you can pick up a swap meet 70's MPC Annual Camaro kit, they all had these wheels for their stock car option which I think the kits had every year from at least 1973 through 81 and the bonus there is the roll cage. It is pretty accurate, you can modify it a bit by adding some bars unique to Richards Cars but the "score" you make here is it fits on the interior floor and inside of those AMT ERTL Roadrunner and GTX kits like it was made for them, right height,width and all, no trimming necessary. I'm using this on my black topped Petty Roadrunner discussed elsewhere in this thread and have built a short track version using these parts already. The Camaro also contains headers that fit the Hemi 9though there are good headers included on the tree in the Roadrunner kit) and the bathtub or open plenum type intake manifold you need to top off the Hemi, for the single 4 bbl. is also in the Camaro. 

The interior in the Roadrunner is great because you can leave the inner door panels off, or, turn them around and sand and fill them flat and slice off and apply only the window cranks to be perfectly accurate. There are no seats molded in saving you a ton of work.  Its perfect for a stock car.  Further the chassis is accurate since there is no exhaust detail molded in. You can turn the front king pins upside down to lower the front suspension slightly and thats all you should have to do there.  Add some aluminum tube exhaust pipes and your are good to go.  Bottom line, if you just wanted to scratch build a roll cage and order some HM wheels from the Modelhaus or Plastic Performance Products,(the Decal Man and BSR carry these on their sites as well as a generic cage which is nice but has to be narrowed quite a bit to fit in anything but a Ford Galaxie)  order a set of decals from one of numerous on line sources and paint with Tamiya Gloss Light blue or Testors model master laquor system AMC Big Bad Blue you would be all set, with a model more accurate and with less work in it and for a far lower price than a 68 or 69 Johan if you can find one.  The suspensions are far more detailed than the molded in ones on the Johans, you'd also have to do a ton of work to remove the molded in stock exhaust from the Johans, the wheels aren't entirely accurate with those (though they are real good representations of early Mopar Super stock drag racing steel wheels) and the headers and engines would be more up to date than in the Johans.  The Johans of any year however, do have the absolutely accurate tires for the 68 Roadrunner.

On the other hand, if you want a Petty Superbird, the ebay or other auction route on the net is the only way to go, they are your only option and are rather plentiful as of late.  So are the 64 Belvederes, (I've not yet seen any of the Lindberg versions yet, but I'm sure they may be seen at any time.  The Johan kits will require the extra work as I described, but for those years they're the only game in town and you do of course get exquisite engine detail, crisp beautifully proportioned bodies, great racing dashboards, crude but modifiable roll cages and sturdy easy construction.  These years are more plentiful and not as pricy.

For a 67 or 66 Petty car, use the revell GTX kit.  You'll need to gather many of the parts I described above, but except for the intake manifold, needing a roll cage and a different stripped down interior, (the 68-69 AMT units modified a bit might work as well as the one, cut and modified abit in the Allison AMT Matador Stock cars that you still see around for a song) this is a very doable project for anyone beyond an absolute beginner.The cage in the Matador can be made to work too, an added bonus.  A little, very little, opening of the wheel openings may be needed to fit the Holman Moodys and bigger rubber.

You'd have to turn to the aftermarket, like the Modelhaus or Chuck Poi's Race Ready Replicas for earlier cars mainly.  Johan 63 , 62, 61, 60 and 59 Furys can be found on the net but for generally exhorbitant prices and would require lots of conversion work, though Chuck has all you need for a 63 practically, including wheels, tires, interior,dash, seats and complete body with glass bumpers grilles and all. From 71 on you've got aftermarket sources for the 71 and 72 Plymouth bodies all of which would mount up on those MPC Nascar/Southern Stocker type adjustable chassis which, while compromised in certain ways to be generic for many bodies, are very detailed, don't be fooled.  The Charger bodies and the Magnum (which you'd have to find in the aftermarket), even a 77-78 Revell Monte Carlo low rider body could go on these.  All the Chargers were kitted as Petty cars with this Chassis by MPC and can be found on net. Polar lights had a strange but in the end maybe not so bad Charger too.  Starting in 81, Monogram, Revell took care of every body style through the Kings retirement in detailed kit form except for the modified Grandprix fastback 2+2, but body conversions abound in the after market to put on the slope nose, fastback glass and rear clip which are cheap and easy to use.

So, there's a short " Petty Model History/How to" with extra emphasis on the years I figured you'd have the most interest in.  I'll get some pics up of my 68 when its done, but this ones a mega project so it might be a few months yet.  Hope this is all of use to you and even more inspiring.  Long live the King, the greatest race driver of all time.

Dave Bayer

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Inland Northwest
Posted by Summit on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:49 PM
Wow Dave Thank You so Much for taking the Time to write this up. I look very forward to seeing your completed 68, with your enthousiasm and knowledge I am sure it will be a showpiece. When I was growing up I could not wait for the "Wide World of Sports " to have a Nascar Race, 43 was always my # 1 pick. Today I dont even watch the races anymore as it just cant compare or compete with the legends.
Sean "I've reached nearly fifty years of age with my system." Weekend GB 2008
  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 8:49 AM

Summit,  You're welcome.  Sometimes I can get too wordy and am afraid I'm a pain more than a help.  Good luck and I'll keep you posted on that and other projects, I hope you do the same.  Right now, there's, yes I'm agahast at myself, a couple of short track fords going, some Dodge Super Stocks and a generic 63 Nascar Plymouth thats really coming along nicely with frequent contributor squeakie's help.  In spite of my love for Mopars he knows a good bit more about them that even I and is a good guy to converse with too.

Dave B.

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    May 2008
Posted by zgator on Tuesday, December 2, 2008 11:09 PM
Ok, now how about telling us how to build that Dick Landy AWB Dodge. A favroite of mine since forever!!!!
  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Saturday, December 6, 2008 1:01 PM

Wow Zgator, thanks for the confidence.  I've got Dandy Dick as an avatar here because, well who doesn't like Dandy Dick, and who wouldn't be left breathless by the monster torque of the Autoresearch Hemi twisting the ol B body itself all out of shape.

Now, I'm a bit more of a roundy round expert myself and while I'm no slouch,of course on this forum, Gary (squeakie) is really the Mopar expert. I enjoy talking about this stuff though and like trading ideas so here goes.

This car I believe to be a bit of an oddity anyway since I seem to recall that all the factory produced altered wheelbase cars in Hemi form were sedans, whereas the Max wedge cars were in the hardtop form with the smaller triangular C pillar like Dick's here.  I've heard the torque effect of the Hemi often cracked the windshieds of these cars in hardtop form.  So, this is a real "Dandy" if you pardon the pun.   To build, I would of course start with a Polar Lights 65 Dodge Coronet.  You would dechrome it suitably as it has full Coronet 500 trim, cool, but not on Dick's machine here.  Then the Lindberg 64 Dodge Super stock in any form is your next stop.  You could combine the side panels and dash of the 65 with the 64 with I would think just a little modification.  The 64's Dodge van seats would be the right choice I think but I believe this car would have just the driver's seat in it.  The roll bar in the 64 should be right as would the chassis and Hemi.  The Hemi is an automatic though, and while typical for this type of car, Dick may have run a 4 speed at times or all the time.  Those can be found virtually anywhere, Johan Hemis, which have really nice detail of course, the more recent crop of AMT Ertl B Bodys, MPC annuals,ie them Duke Boys' Charger, etc.  If you do choose to leave the Torqueflite though, use a column shift and if you're really into the detail, make the display a reverse pattern, "1 - 2 - D" instead of the factory "D - 2 - 1" modified as such so the driver wouldn't come up past D on the big end and slide into "R".................. eeewwww.

I tried to post a few pics for you but my new installation of firefox isn't cooperating with me right now so I'll work on that later but there are 3 really good, fairly big pics of this car on a web site you can reach by googling Pro Stock Hemi.  Its a photo site which has actually mostly Altered Wheelbase and AFX cars despite its title.  Search for Dick Landy and you'll see the pics.

I can't tell from the wheelstanding pic, but I would presume this car has a solid axle leaf spring front suspension which I would take from Lindbergs Little Red Wagon.  That should also be a good source for other parts for the Hemi, some racing safety equipment and wheels.  The car ran Landy's trademark Crager SS's in the back and what looks like American Torque thrusts in the front, with the spokes painted black, the rims a polished magnesium and no center caps.  You'll want to measure carefully and cut out the hood for the organ pipe Hilbourn Injectors, what other version would you want to build of course, and the LRW may be a source for these things too, I'm not sure, otherwise the ol parts box or earlier Revell kits on eBay, maybe even the recent AMT parts pack engines that were released all in the same box would be of some help.

I'd use Tamiya Metallic silver with a clearcoat and paint the top with the flat black of your choice followed by a flat or semi gloss clear coat to prevent the inevitable mars that the flat surface will develop, decals should be available from a variety of sources, Competition Resins/Slixx?   You of course will need to do lots of test fitting.  I would make the chassis first and then tailor the body to fit, cutting the wheelwells out of the fenders, removing the material in front of them in one piece too, then gluing the piece with the openings forward and gluing in the material originally from the front back behind them and reshaping as necessary with files putty, super glue, sandpaper etc. as you prefer.  If this isn't absolutely perfect but close, I think you'd have a good scale effect as to how things actually looked and were done back then.  OR.........

While I  have yet to try one of these, Model Car World, MCW does offer lots of different resin bodies in addition to their paints which you probably know about, and they offer an altered wheelbase 65 Dodge Hardtop with the work already done for you.  In fact they list just about any type of body from this era of drag racing 1960 to late 60s that you could imagine.

for now, Adios.

Dave B.

Dave Bayer
  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: 6023 47th Av. Kenosha, Wis.
Posted by UnderdogF7U on Saturday, December 6, 2008 2:13 PM

Photobucket[img]http://Photobucket" border="0" />[/img]Photobucket

Zgator I may have figured this out.  See if these are there?  By George, I think we may have it. I can copy the html out of photobucket, paste it in the image box and insert it.  Direct link and img code don't work, but yippie.

Dave

Dave Bayer
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