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New to Building Model ships. Intoducing myself, and I have a few questions!

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  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
New to Building Model ships. Intoducing myself, and I have a few questions!
Posted by BBorBust on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 9:52 AM

Hello all! My name is Matt and I have recently been really getting into WWII era warships. My interest in this really came from playing the game World of Warhips on xbox one. I follow a couple facebook groups for the mentioned game and have seen several people post up model warships they have built, and I really enjoyed looking at them. 

 

A few weeks ago I went to local discount store to just look around and stumbled across a random 1/400 scale model of the HMS Hood by Lindberg. It was only 15 bucks and I thought what better way to break myself into model ship building than a cheap model like that? Well the following day I started the assembly, and i was immediately hooked! I had the entire thing done (minus paint) in about 3 hours. 

 

Now I dont know much about brands and quality, but there parts left over, and the intrustions from Lindberg were pretty vague, but enough to get me through my first build. Not knowing much about these models I would give a personal rating of this kit a 2.5/5 stars. 

 

With my new addiction, I immediatly began looking at online retailers to find my next model to start. Through some research it seems that Trumpeter is a pretty good brand. I wanted to stick with a similiar size as my 1/400 Hood, and ended up buying the Trumpeter 1/350 HMS Queen Elizabeth 1943. I'm hoping it ships out today or tomorrow and i can start on it soon.

I do have a couple questions regarding paint though. I want to paint my models and make then look nice. I can manage painting the things like guns, superstructure, and hull, but i am wondering what paint/colors everyone uses to get a wood like finish on the plastic decking? I would like to paint the wooden(plastic) decking prior to starting assembly so i dont have to try to paint around the guns and structures on the deck. 

 

Any and all advice is welcome and appreciated!

 

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 11:51 AM

Hi and Welcome!

      As to your deck color. Take Testors or Tamiya's Light Tan Semi-Gloss paint. Then Add one drop of black or very light grey. Mix well and paint away.

 TIP:

      What I used to do years ago, and still do on anything smaller than 1/200 is this. Take a brand New, very Sharp X-Acto knife and turn the blade backwards to the surface. Now carefully letting the blade tip rest in the angle between the deck and whatever is molded on. Slide the knife backwards around the area gently. Do this twice.

     This will create a line to which the paint will go to, then stop if you are gentle and keep your brush lightly loaded. I learned this by accident while watching a painter re-paint around our kitchen cabinets after Hurricane damage. he cut a little groove between the cabinet edge and the plaster. The paint stayed on the plaster, Not! the cabinets!

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 12:36 PM

Tanker-Builder

Hi and Welcome!

      As to your deck color. Take Testors or Tamiya's Light Tan Semi-Gloss paint. Then Add one drop of black or very light grey. Mix well and paint away.

 TIP:

      What I used to do years ago, and still do on anything smaller than 1/200 is this. Take a brand New, very Sharp X-Acto knife and turn the blade backwards to the surface. Now carefully letting the blade tip rest in the angle between the deck and whatever is molded on. Slide the knife backwards around the area gently. Do this twice.

     This will create a line to which the paint will go to, then stop if you are gentle and keep your brush lightly loaded. I learned this by accident while watching a painter re-paint around our kitchen cabinets after Hurricane damage. he cut a little groove between the cabinet edge and the plaster. The paint stayed on the plaster, Not! the cabinets!

 

 

Thanks for the tips! Do you have a suggested retailer that carry the mentioned paints in stock and have a quick delivery time? Just got the update that my new model has shipped, would like to get the paint (at least for the decking) at the same time. My plan is to paint the deck the wood color with your mentioned method, and then do the assembly. Come back with a fine brush and paint everything else.

 

 

  • Member since
    August 2014
  • From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posted by goldhammer on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 12:52 PM

Take a look at Scalehobbiest or Sprue Bros.  They have fair pricing and ship quickly.  If you have a hobbystore nearby you might check them out as well.

Brush painting a 1/350 battleship with a brush is going to be a chore.

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Boise ID area
Posted by modelcrazy on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 12:58 PM

Well well well, BBorBust have you open yourelf a can of worms. Ships, what a wide world of sports.

WoWs hmm? I show up there on occasion. Their ship rendering is excelent, colors not so much. I refrence them on occasion for rigging and such. Their computer modeling is well researched.
I am supper excited to see another modler intrested in the dark art of ship modeling.

As you have discovered....Lindberg....I'd give them a 1 ot of 5 myself, however there are some nice ones I've heard. Trumperer, Tamiya, Hasegawa, Fujimi, Hobby Boss and some Revell (Revell of Germany [blue box] that is) are nice kits.....95% of them. 1/350 is a super nice, all be it, large scale. 1/200 is really nice but few have the room. 1/700 is also nice, and small enough to display, however it takes a little work to keep them from looking like toys. unless you want more practice, I'd stay away from the other scales as they were typically made before there were standard scales. 

There's a whole world of after market parts, paints, photo etch for your little navy.

As far as paints, I will typiclly use Vallejo, simply because it's very easy to brush and you will have much to brush. I don't know if you have an air buush but they don't spray easy unless you thin them correctly, Vallejo air is made for spraying. And as you have found, painting the deck first is you best bet, infact I usually build the hull and deck, paint those then move onto the superstructure.

I have going now, two group builds, British and American ships, which you are more than encouraged to join, with a Greman ship GB coming online in September. No experance nessecary and you will learn much. Any question answered, usually by the likes of long time ship modelers and others who like to dable in the dark arts on occasion.

Ask away with your questions and good luck with your builds.

P.S. do consider the GB's

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 1:34 PM

Thanks for the warm welcome! And yead I really want to start on American Ships, but since i found the Hood as a surprise buy, i figured I would keep the theme going and get another British dreadknought. The aforementioned Queen Elizabeth.

And pardon my not knowing, but you mentioned something about group builds? I would interested in more information on that.

I have been looking into some german BB's too. I would love to build the 2 sets of sister ships. Being the Bismark, and Tirpitz, and the Scarnhorst, and Gneisenau.

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 2:05 PM

Also, mentioned above is a method of paint to paint the deck of my models. Says a semi-gloss tan, with a drop of semi-gloss black, mix well and paint. I found these on Scale Hobbyist. would these be a good fit?

https://www.scalehobbyist.com/catagories/Paint_and_Construction/tan-semi-gloss/GSI00000C44/product.php

https://www.scalehobbyist.com/catagories/Paint_and_Construction/black-semi-gloss/GSI00000C92/product.php

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Boise ID area
Posted by modelcrazy on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 2:50 PM

Fine ships all. Aaand I have a British ships GB at the link below

http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_subjects/f/29/t/179138.aspx

And the American link, so you can jump in and ask questions or just watch.

http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_subjects/f/29/t/182307.aspx

A correction, the German GB will start on 1 Aug and I'll have the official thread up in July.

A Group build is just a bunch of members getting together on the forum and building something similar, be it subject I.E. ships, tanks, planes, or timeframe, I.E. 1942, or Cold War etc., or even manufacturer I.E. Airfix, Monogram etc. within a timeframe.
You would tell the host, or co-host if there is one, in this case me, what you wanted to build like the Hood and/or QE.

A group build host is simply the idiot who comes up with a cool idea, poses said cool idea and others who think it's a cool idea as well and says "hey, that sound like a cool idea, I want to play".
There's no cost (other than the kit), requirement (other that the kit), experence or anything other than your willingness to participate. If you fail to complete said kit...nothing happens, you just don't finish in time. Most GB host also create a badge that you can proudly display in your signature line, as you probably have noticed. This badge is your reward for completing said kit within the GB's timeframe. Read the rules the host posts and see if it is something your intrested in, willing to commit within the timeframe, or not, and join up.

I really enjoy GB's. It gives me the feeling of comradery, a way to show off my work in progress (WIP) without starting a seperate thread and a great place for questions and answeres, again without starting a new thread. The thread may veer off the track on occasion but that's part of the fun of a bunch of friends gathering around and doing something together. They also encourage one to finish and press the envelope and do better with each new build. My skills have risen 95% since I joined in 2014 and participated in GB's.

BTW, the British Ships GB's is a little slow at the moment but it doesn't mean that members aren't watching and participating. If fact, I still have several I need to build for it and I will always be in it.

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Boise ID area
Posted by modelcrazy on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 2:53 PM

BBorBust

Also, mentioned above is a method of paint to paint the deck of my models. Says a semi-gloss tan, with a drop of semi-gloss black, mix well and paint. I found these on Scale Hobbyist. would these be a good fit?

https://www.scalehobbyist.com/catagories/Paint_and_Construction/tan-semi-gloss/GSI00000C44/product.php

https://www.scalehobbyist.com/catagories/Paint_and_Construction/black-semi-gloss/GSI00000C92/product.php

 

Mr Color is an acrylic lacquer and difficult to brush I've found, if you are brushing. It's a little touchy to spray as well IMO. They make great colors though.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 3:44 PM

Welcome!

If you are interested, the colors used for your battleship can be a fairly tricky subject.

Here's a document that is pretty comprehensive to give you an idea of the choices and somerepresentation of what they look like. There's a line of paints named colourcoats that are specific to this and are accurate.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0730/0927/files/Royal_Navy_colours_of_World_War_Two_-_Standard_Camouflage_Colours_1941_to_1943.pdf?4510537543498049762

Here's a document that lists the various measures The QE was painted in at what times.

I have not built that kit. I would not follow the Trumpeter color callouts; I generally find them to be too vague.

I think this is a pretty ambitious kit and you should consider a few less complicated ones until you get a feeling for it.

 

Good luck, ships are fun models.

 

Bill

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 3:54 PM

GMorrison

Welcome!

If you are interested, the colors used for your battleship can be a fairly tricky subject.

Here's a document that is pretty comprehensive to give you an idea of the choices and somerepresentation of what they look like. There's a line of paints named colourcoats that are specific to this and are accurate.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0730/0927/files/Royal_Navy_colours_of_World_War_Two_-_Standard_Camouflage_Colours_1941_to_1943.pdf?4510537543498049762

Here's a document that lists the various measures The QE was painted in at what times.

I have not built that kit. I would not follow the Trumpeter color callouts; I generally find them to be too vague.

I think this is a pretty ambitious kit and you should consider a few less complicated ones until you get a feeling for it.

 

Good luck, ships are fun models.

 

Bill

 

 

Thanks for the welcome! I feel I am up for the challenge. I am new to these model ships, but not working with my hands. I found the 1/400 Hood from Lindberg I built to be easy. I had no difficultly at all.

 

I work on cars often, as well as guns. Real steel and airsoft. If you have never opened up an airsoft gun gearbox, there are a lot of little parts and springs that need to be put exactly into place in order for it operate properly. While I know this is not even close to the same type of work, I know that I have a steady hand and plenty of patience to do it. I feel where this new QE will show my inexperience will be in the paint. But I will do my best, and make it look as good as I can.

 

Thanks for the link too BTW, looking through it now.

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 8:08 PM

For 2¢ my peacetime RN wood deck finish was Unbleached Linen as the base coat.

This would get a coat of yellow ocher oil wash (around 4:1 thinner to paint).  Aproximately dry, (oil paint is forgiving that way) a wash of burnt umber (very thin, 5-6:1).

The ocher put a bit of modulation in the base coat, the umber picked out the moulded-in detail.

Tanker's idea of a gray wash would be cool, too.

For sailing ships, I might use Radome Tan as the base.

YMMV

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 10:58 AM

Hi;

       Well,with the Covid19 I don't about your municipality, I don't know. Hobby Lobby there might do curbside. Then you can use Testors, AK-Interactive, Vallejo or Tamiya. Whatever they have .With Tamiya, get a bottle of their retarder and it, when mixed will let the paint flow from a brush like silk.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 11:09 AM

Tanker-Builder

Hi;

       Well,with the Covid19 I don't about your municipality, I don't know. Hobby Lobby there might do curbside. 

LOLs!

I don't go to the place much, because when I do there's maybe 3-4 employees in a 20,000 sq. ft. store.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

  • Member since
    December 2015
  • From: providence ,r.i.
Posted by templar1099 on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 1:50 PM

modelcrazy
Well well well, BBorBust have you open yourelf a can of worms


All fine advice, here's mine; take all the info you've acquired ,add your enthusiasm and ability and find another HOOD and try to make it what you would do to the Queen Mary. I'll send you mine if you can't find one.

"le plaisir delicieux et toujours nouveau d'une occupation inutile"

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 3:21 PM

I literally have learned A TON of stuff from this website and few youtubers that I watch I would have known when building my Hood. I ordered some paint from scale hobbyist that has some pretty good reviews. I will take my time with the QE and make her as perfect as I can. I am really excited to get started on her! Tracking says the model will be on my doorstep this Friday.

So as long as my paint makes it on time I will spend my time Friday evening going through the kit and familiarizing myself with everything, and maybe start mixing up a few of the colors I got until I am happy with the look and paint the decking. I will upload pictures on here and on the GB I joined in on.

Just wanted to say a quick thank you to everyone that has welcomed me, and given me great advise to start my path on the road of making these models show worthy to display on my bookshelf.

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 3:33 PM

I have another question for you guys. I want to sand rough edges where I seperate the pieces from the plastic that is holding it in place. What is the best grit sandpaper to use to smooth out the little chunks of plastic that breaks off on the molding? Should I just use sheets of sandpaper? Or sandpaper sticks?

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 4:09 PM

Be sure to cut the parts loose.

I buy cheap sanding sticks at the CVS in three-four grades. I wouldn't use anything rougher than medium fine to fine.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

  • Member since
    August 2014
  • From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posted by goldhammer on Wednesday, April 29, 2020 5:02 PM

I'll second GM...get the nail files from any beauty section of a local store, ie. Walmart etc.  Look for medium and fine grit.  If you go with the hobby made stuff, I generally go with 240 grit to smooth off parts and seams.

Primer and a final scuff generally hides scratches in a matt finish

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Boise ID area
Posted by modelcrazy on Thursday, April 30, 2020 7:42 AM

Ditto

Also, invest in a good pair of flush cutting diagonal cutters to cut the parts off. You will be amazed how much work it saves and filling that you'll avoid. There are sprue cutters for sale, and they are great tools but I've found that a pair of elecrtical wire cutters, as long as they cut flush, works just as well and are a little less expensive.

$10 from Home Depot

 

  • Member since
    July 2019
  • From: Vancouver, British Columbia
Posted by Bobstamp on Thursday, April 30, 2020 12:42 PM

modelcrazy

Also, invest in a good pair of flush cutting diagonal cutters to cut the parts off. You will be amazed how much work it saves and filling that you'll avoid.

Amen, but I'll go out on a limb and recommend a pair of GodHand SPN-120 sprue cutters. Early in my re-birth as a model builder, I was ready to buy a $20 sprue cutter that seemed better than the first, $10 one I had bought a month earlier. The hobby store clerk suggested the GodHand cutter instead. "They are very expensive," she said. "$99, but I think you will appreciate them."*

In talking with her on previous visits, I'd learned that she is a modeller herself, and very knowledgeable, so I decided to take her advice, and I'm glad I did -- that cutter is the finest hand tool I've ever owned. It removes parts from sprues so easily that the parts seem to fall off voluntarily. And the cutter leaves virtually no scars like "blunt force" cutters do; the cheap ones actually seem to tear rather than cut, and often leave hard-to-repair scars. Clint Eastwood might like to keep his gun in his cold, dead hands, but I'd prefer my GodHand sprue cutter!

Prices vary a good deal, so shop around. 

Bob

* That's $99 Canadian. Price in US is about $79.

Finished, finally: Airfix 1/72 HP.52 Hampden bomber & Minicraft 1/48 T-34 Mentor trainer. On the bench: Italeri 1/72 UH-34 Seahorse helicopter & Academy 1/72 F-86F Sabre.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, April 30, 2020 12:59 PM

Well it better be great for that price. I have a pair of toenail clippers with straight blades that serve me well.

 

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Thursday, April 30, 2020 3:20 PM

I do have some cutters i have used for electrical work and other things before. I will give them a shot. Still waiting on my paint to ship from scalehobbyist, hopefully shipping out today. My model will be here tomorrow and Im going to start doing some little things. Like drilling out the windows. May also run to the the local hobby shop to look for a few small things.

I have been following one guy on youtube that has done some incredible model ships. He uses a similiar deck paint that i bought, and once it dries uses a brown wash to bring out the details. This made a huge difference in the decking and is what i want to do accomplish.

So my next question is, I have seen people make their own washes with things like alcohol and other things. Then I see that you can buy washes too. Do you guys make your own washes, or buy them?

If you make your own, what is your process?

  • Member since
    July 2019
  • From: Vancouver, British Columbia
Posted by Bobstamp on Thursday, April 30, 2020 6:50 PM

I can't respond to your question about washes — I'm still trying to figure those out for myself! I did think of one thing to add about the GodHand sprue cutters: They are designed to remove parts from sprues, NOT to actually cut the thicker parts of the sprue, just as a surgeon uses a scalpel to make an incision, but would choose a bone saw for an amputation. What I especially like about the GodHand sprue cutter is that it so small that it easily fits into tight spaces on the sprue.

Bob

 

 

Finished, finally: Airfix 1/72 HP.52 Hampden bomber & Minicraft 1/48 T-34 Mentor trainer. On the bench: Italeri 1/72 UH-34 Seahorse helicopter & Academy 1/72 F-86F Sabre.

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Thursday, April 30, 2020 7:01 PM

BBorBust
If you make your own, what is your process?

Well, back in the Dark Ages when Tanker an I were "young," there were no pre-packaged washes.  I remember when model-specific water-base acrylics first started showing up in LHS.  (And, that was largely PolyS for the railroaders, to start.) 

You have to alternate paint chemistries, and/or use artis oils thinned with turps or odorless spirits.

Oils were very much like modle paint, much higher thinner to paint volumes.

We did things now considered obsqure and odd.  Like use actylics to paint a model, then heavily-thinned enamels to wash details in.  Or vice versa. 

You did not want to use the same thinner for your wash as for the model paint, lest if lift both.

It's now canon to used clear coats between finish paint and washes, not so much back then.  Which probably reflected the quality/thin-thickness of clear coats "back then."

So, really, there's no "formula" per se, so much as there's just practicing.  Which is what cheap kits are for.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, April 30, 2020 7:09 PM

Dilute India ink.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

  • Member since
    April 2020
  • From: Mountains of Western MD
Posted by BBorBust on Thursday, April 30, 2020 7:18 PM

CapnMac82
 
BBorBust
If you make your own, what is your process?

 

Well, back in the Dark Ages when Tanker an I were "young," there were no pre-packaged washes.  I remember when model-specific water-base acrylics first started showing up in LHS.  (And, that was largely PolyS for the railroaders, to start.) 

You have to alternate paint chemistries, and/or use artis oils thinned with turps or odorless spirits.

Oils were very much like modle paint, much higher thinner to paint volumes.

We did things now considered obsqure and odd.  Like use actylics to paint a model, then heavily-thinned enamels to wash details in.  Or vice versa. 

You did not want to use the same thinner for your wash as for the model paint, lest if lift both.

It's now canon to used clear coats between finish paint and washes, not so much back then.  Which probably reflected the quality/thin-thickness of clear coats "back then."

So, really, there's no "formula" per se, so much as there's just practicing.  Which is what cheap kits are for.

 

 

So you are saying that I should paint the deck, when clear coat it, and then add my wash on top of it?

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Boise ID area
Posted by modelcrazy on Friday, May 1, 2020 8:05 AM

BBorBust
So you are saying that I should paint the deck, when clear coat it, and then add my wash on top of it?

Yes, diffrent types of paints react diffrently to each other. Acrylics, enamels, laqures,acrylic laquers on and on each may or may not react to the other. If you paint enamel, then brush a lacqure over it, the enamel will disolve but not visa versa. I will SPRAY a laquer clear coat over a completed paint job prior to a wash. The wash won't adhear to the surface as well thus leaving the wash in the cracks when you wipe it off. Without a clear coat (gloss) the wash will bite into the paint, especially flats, and it is almost impossable to remove, leaving you paint job smeared. On ships, I paint, clear coat, weather the hull and first application to the deck. then spray another clear coat to protect them during the rest of the build. The build is sprayed with a flat or simi gloss after.

I've heard India Ink works well but I have never tried it. I just oils, almost exclusivly for weathering and details, but that's me.

Not to hi-jack your thread but just for an example. Both kits are still in progress.

The North Carolina hull before the wood deck.

The Prince of Wales.

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Friday, May 1, 2020 9:28 AM

Hi;

 I went to the link and I do believe that on that one You would need to use White till it was almost a light creme colour. Then just one drop of black in 2 ounces of paint. Mix well and lighten accordingly

 When you lighten do so with The original tan, one drop in at a time

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Friday, May 1, 2020 9:41 AM

Capn Mac;

         Are you insuating that we are ancient? Just because I used Diluted india ink for washes don't mean I was raised in a cave. Oh! wait a minute! That's right I blew a mouthful of soot and water at my hand in that cave didn't I ? LOL.LOL.

         Yes, I used diluted india ink back then. My neighbor was a high School art teacher and she showed me that this mix over testors paint ( The only choice then) wasn't affected by the alchohol used to thin the ink. The ink was the same used by Architects back then! 

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