Lindberg Monitor & Merrimac 1/245 & Pyro Monitor

Bill, Our last Kitty passed away several years back. 

     I have had cats my whole life.  My recollections of parts as play things stems mostly from the 60's. It was fun to watch'em play and it was impossible to stop; Cats are too fast. Back then I built models over a tiled floor.  My dad would sweep up the floor and I would go through the dust pan for any plastic.  

    About 10 years ago we inherited a Lab, compliments of my Youngest daughter who could not keep him at college. So we had a Kitty and a "Puppy".  Fortunately Molly(C) and Charlie(D) got along great.  Slept together, Played together, Stole food from each other...Great Times.

     Our Dog is now 90+lbs. He is mostly very safe with Models but he is also pretty big so when he wags his tail near a table it leaves the same destructive swath as a cat, but all at once.

  But I digress...

Gene has done it again. He is fast approaching 90 and still loves the smell of "modeling" in the morning. I give him a few ideas and tips based on plans and official records and he overwhelms my suggestions with ingenuity and perfection.

  Gene,  Thank You for complimenting me in so many of your Posts.  You are a true inspiration.  

    So, is this your Third Monitor or Fourth? ( Pretty sure it's the Fourth!)

    It is a fun ship to build. So many interesting differences between the Battle version, Cruising version, Re-fitted version and AS Sunk.  Building it brings out the History of the time. A great way to discover and learn from the past.      And, as appropriately stated, (and I quote..) "is an excuse to buy books".(Thanks GM.   Best "signature" ever.)

  Nino

P.S.  This latest Post by Gene, of his USS Monitor model, is the Battle Axe 1/144 kit. It is truely a "Craftsman" kit in that most everything needs some attention.  It was based on some "early" drawings so there are location issues on some of the deck details.  The kit was a Short Run issue too so not many of these OOP kits can be found anymore. 

P.S.  Anyone planning on building the newest plastic USS Monitor kit, Micro-Mir's 1/144 Monitor, may want to PM or email me as I have some insight on correcting and building it. 

Jim,

My cat likes to scatter my model parts. She does the same with my wife's jigsaw puzzle pieces.  Where's your old cat?

Bill

Gene, That is some great progress on this old kit.

This Battle Axe version of the Monitor is most definetly a "Craftsman" kit.

The turret is realy looking good compared to the original part. As you have seen, you can easily put enough time and parts into the Turret to effectivly make it a seperate model.

Wood:  Good idea. Ya don't want it to sink like the original, especially after you put all this work into it.                                                                                                          You know me with my Grandkids and their curiosity. When I build mine I will add ballast till it sits a scale 18 inches high in the sink. The only drawback to all that ballast is if my weighted model get dropped, I bet it won't bounce. 

     Wish I still had a Cat.  My last one could find any little thing on the floor or in the rug. Since I started modeling again I am short a bunch of 20mm guns, mast sections, and PE.  (Although, when I was in Grade school, a Cat is how little parts got on the floor in the first place...) 

     Jim.

Hey !

 You got Blocks of wood in there? Trying to make it unsinkable? LOL! LOL! I Know,it's so you can attach the base to it!

I bought a 2005 Subaru Outback new & I drove it for 15 years & the only thing i did to it was 2 rear wheel bearings & 2 CV joints. I don't count oil & brakes & tires. I never drove a car over 2 or 3 years & I had 3 other Subarus that  were the same. I sold my 2005 to my son & moved up to a low mileage 2012. It has been perfect too. I figured at 90 I don't  need a new car.

   I need the 4 wheel drive where I llive on the side of a mountain. My 2005 was still erfect & everything worked & it got 23 mpg city & 32 Hwy. My new one is a little better gas wise.

     My new Monitor is really going great Bill & I wll get pictures & maybe a new WIP on it because the bigger one does take detail well. You would like to detail this one. I got most everything in it.

Here are a few early shots. It is 1/144 & nino ,Jim, gave it to me. You guys keep an old man happy. I still have a Victory to finish. 

The Newport was a pretty line of cars.

Hi;

 You know I think the 63 Newport 2dr,HT was one of the prettiest.

Tanker,

I traded mine even up for a 1965 Chrysler Newport with hard top, V-8 engine, and tail fins.  The week after the trade, the young man I traded with wrapped the Corvair around a telephone pole. Luckily, he escaped uninjured. I drove my Newport for years afterwards!

Bill

Well; Gene:

      By the grace of God I hit 77. The ticker is just puttin along. Gotta take it slower. I have to get a turorial on my New Camera and then get some pics up to Flikr. Then You'll hopefully see what I am up too.

   Remember,when I was stationed in San Diego I had a Ford Model " A " convertible? had window frames around the doors. Metal Mesh floors too! 50$ and complete except for tires. Took me two months to find some. Just before the Provost Marshal was going to sieze and junk it for not moving!

     I think it was called a Cabriolet? Wifey made a new top for it! Then the best car I ever owned came into my life. A Ford! A Skyline Convertible, that lasted all of a week!

 Seems a driver for Dominion Freight didn't like Ford Convertibles in front of him. Pushed me through the intersection of West and Sepulveda, They figure he was going 50 when he couldn't stop. I was at the light on my way to report for the day! Got to ride in the Front of a CHP cruiser!

Bill;

        I owned a Convertible Corvair too. Mine never leaked either water or rain. But the wind whistle around the winndows was aggravating. Mine was a 65 Corsa! Other than the Noise thing the best Darned G.M car outside of Pontiac Ventura and Cadillac coupe de-Ville my dad left me. Put enough miles on it that instead of rebuilding the engine the garage scrapped it!

Gene,

$125.00?  That is exactly how much I paid for my first car, a 1964 convertible Corvair Monza with 3-speed manual transmission.  The convertible to leaked every time it rained on every seat but the driver's. I miss that car!  However, I have never seen a kit for it.

Bill

Hi Doc, I always enjoy hearing from you. Glad you kept going on that Model A.. My first car in 1946 was a 1930 Model A coupe. I think I paid $125 fo/r it. It was in great shape & I ran all over in it. My second in 48 was a 1936 Ford Coupe. I spent a year redoing it from stem to  stern & then drove it to Florida before I joined the Air Force. 

  I remember the Gertrude Thebaud & Skipjack kits. I am working on another bigger 1/144 Monitor that nno, Jim, gave me. They are rare, but I am really detail.ing it. Full Turret detail inside & I made a lot of details on it.

   Lets see what  you are building. I will be 90 in a month & still love building models, it has been 80 years since I started.  

                  Take care,, Gene

Hi Gene!

     Still progressing on the Wire wheels for the car I got from you. It's still challenging , But, calms me down. What I always wished was that somebody would've done the Monitor and the Virginia in the same scale before now. Point of fact, my Uncles ( All six of them) owned Tuna Boats like the Life-Like/Pyro/Lindberg model, they brought out.

      I gravitated to many Pyro kits just because of the uniqueness. After all they were all over the board. The BEST one and one I still remember, Well Two, were the Gertrude Thebaud( Fore and Aft rigged Fish Schooner) and the SkipJack.

  The Skipjack was simple and clean. Kind gave you the feel of a One Hander for Oyster Fishing. Very neat Model. At that time neither one had Plastic sails either! On hand but off side is my Paper Model of the Cairo. Very Interesting!

Gene,

I hope the you and Mary Ann are okay after your falls!  Be careful!

As I've said, I wish that Lindberg had paid greater attention to their "Merrimack" model.  The port side is woefully incorrect with their gun placements.  That stern platform is easily corrected. Otherwise, it is okay, but that port side needs a lot of work.  Maybe the Flagship Models 1/192 kit is better; at $150.00 it had better be!

Bill

 Bill, I am taking Jims part & am not near smart enough to do that. There weretwo different Lindberg kits of the Monitor & Merrimac. The first was the 1/210 Monitor with the offset Turret & a 1/300 Merrimac. This was the kit same as Pyro & Life Like with offset turrets. The second kit was the one we both have with 1/245 scale on both ships.  This Monitor has a correct placed turret.

    I think Jim would be proud of me with that explanation. I didn't think I would write this because I just took my first old age fall on our porch.I did take 3 others, one tripped on the fat cat, 2 standing on one leg trying to clip toenails & 3 stepped on a rock step that fell away. All landed on my butt & this one too.90 years old looks like a real blast.

         Gene

Gene,

I just measured my Monitor.  It is 8" in length and the turret center sits at precisely the 4" point. The fore and aft leading edges of the turret sit at 3.5 inches from the ends.  The turret on the model is dead center.  I do not doubt your information, but there was apparently one model of the Monitor that is dimensionally accurate.  I am not sure that the Virginia and the Monitor are in scale with each other, but I could be wrong.  I do know that the Virginia's port side is incorrect in that there is no offset of the gun ports when compared with the starboard side. The stern platform is also incorrectly shaped. 

That said, I will look at these models again and rebuild them to my standards today.  

Bill

Bill,   I tried to measure your picture of your Monitor & Virginia & they came out just about the same as my 2 I just finished. They are the newer set that are 1/245 for both. The earlier Lindberg set was the same as the Pyro & Life Like set with a 1/210 Monitor & a 1/300 Virginia. This is the monitor with the off center Turret. The turret has to be moved about 5/8" rearward to be correct & that is what I did & it matched John Tilley's paper plan exactly.

    I made my front cut exactly at the front of the turret on a section line & the rear cut 10 sections back at the last section before the smokestacksor funnels. I filled the funnels & moved the smoke stack back. They screwed everything up.

                              Gene

Jim and Gene,

As I have shown in private emails between us, I was able to find an old "Monitor and Merrimack" set that I had built way back in 1968.  I cannot remember if the kit was from Pyro or Lindberg, but one interesting point is that the overhead view of the Monitor looks exactly like the finished product of post-cut Monitors you both have built.  I suspect that the earlier renditions of this ship were more accurate.  It is a shame that the manufacturer did not pay close attention to the CSS Virginia!  But, the Monitor that I built from one of the kits in 1968 sure looks the part.

Bill

Jim,  Your Monitor really looks good.You need more pictures here of it. Show more of your detail & what you did to get there. I take picture of some of my build, but then I can't find them.

  I have the Blockade Runner by Lindberg & have wanted to build it, it's easy.

      No Life-like or Pyro kits of the Monitor and "Merrimac" are being made anymore. Lindberg (Round2) did pick up a few Pyro molds and has re-issued those.                   So you can still get a Barbary Pirate and even a Brig of War but not much else of the Old Pyro "pirates" ship kits. ( Academy still sells a New Bedford Whaler that seems to be the old Pyro mold Charles W. Morgan.)

You are right. The cut in front of the turret has to be as close to the turret as possible.  The cut to the rear sets the distance to the correct Turret location.  That's the tough one. 

Yep, that's the oldest Grandson holding the Monitor.  He assisted on the kit, his third if you count Star wars stuff. As I recall he also did the coiled ropes on the deck after I told him your method. Was very disappointed that both guns could not fire at the same time. ( I had to do a temp fix to point both guns out of the Turret while he was here.)

   My last PM to the Professor was about his paper model which was starting to show up on eBay. He was tickled that it was still around.  Bet he had no idea it would come in handy to help correct the old plastic Monitor kits.

     Jim.

  Edit:  It seems that the Civil War Blockade runner (Pyro's Harriet Lane) gets re-released on occasion by Lindberg/Round2 models.  That is a fine kit.  There have been a few "Threads" created on it at FSM.

There are a few other Pyro ship models that have been released again recently. i.e.:Henry Morgan Pirate (Pyro:St. Louis), Lindberg/Pyro's North Atlantic Fishing Trawler.

 Jim, you are the most welcome guy I know to tell me information on most anything, especially the Monitor. Other than the resin Monitor kit this is my first plastic ironclad & you gave me all the info on it.

       My cuts were the exact front of the turret & 10 sections of deck back to the rear cut & then just turn it around. I finally remembered that I filled in the kit smoke stacks & moved them back . I had forgotten about that, but at nearly 90 I do forget things.

  All the new info you just sent me today will make it easy to build my second monitor. Did you say Life Like is still making them? When I saw that my cuts matched Tilley's paper kit I was very happy. 

 Jim is that last picture your Pyro Monitor?

Bill,

  Your requst for the correct spots to cut the Pyro mold of the Monitor is more of a personal preference.

     I pre-visualized it with a paper representation of the cut to lay over the deck to see how the Turret location would match up when rotated 180.  Gene and Greg Bale choose slightly different spots to "Make the Cut".

This method would require relocation of the Smoke stack vents since they will be too close to the turret. I skipped the vent reloc.  It is a fun kit to play around with.

I ended up doing a different method by adding more deck, effectively placing the turret closer to the center.  It made for a lot more work and changed the scale.

Some comparisons:

Pyro revised 1/200 scale          Pyro original Monitor             Lindberg 1/245 Mold

 Final:

Gene, Sorry for the slight "steal" of the thread.  You've seen most of this stuff already.

     Jim.

Gene,

Thanks!

Bill

 Hi Bill, please let me know if these are clear. I will draw something up I will send if this doesn't do it. I started my measurements from the forward of the small vent behind the big flue/ stack. Each section I will call secs. I made my rear cut 6 full secs from the front of the vent & the front cut 10 secs ahead at the very front of the turret hole. Just clear of that. right on the edge. It was about  1&22/32 forward, but use the front of tthe turret hole as a guide. Now I want you to move 1 sec back for your cut That is 5 secs forward of the vent. That will move the turret back 1 sec. Mine is too far forward still but I didn't know. 

                            Have Jim look at this, he is the smart one on this. I have changed & added so much on mine, it is hard to measure. tThat is why i do every thing in sections because cuts have to be on sections. 

   They are hard cuts with an Xacto & I start with a #11 scalpel . I forget if I ended up with a razor saw, but I think I did. Maybe with the refit you could tape along each joint to save the castings. I have a 12" sq.3/4" plywood with about 400 wet or dry sand paper on it to do square sanding. The paper has lasted for years. I think I contac cemented it on. Now if you need an A Bomb I maybe can do that too. 

                                      Gene  

Gene,

I saw several of the Lindberg kits for sale on Amazon going for around $30.00 to over $100.00.

Bill

 Baron, Lindberg, I believe had 2 sets of kits with the Monitor & Merrimac. The first was the same as Pyro with a larger Monitor & smaller Merrimac. Same as Pyro & they did this one with both in 1/245 scale. I would like to do another Pyro kit & get it more right.

Gene

Nice job superdetailing those classics!  Who says Lindberg kits can't be built into a nice model?

Is Lindberg's Monitor not the Pyro/Life-Like tooling, or they both develop their own kits?  I know the Lindberg acquired a lot of Pyro's molds and added them to their catalog. But something makes me think that they both had their own Monitors.

That history series of theirs is a lot of fun.  I have the Pearl Harbor kit, with the Arizona and Nevada.  The ships are very basic, but it's fun to tinker with them.

A post-script...

I went to Scalemates just now, to see what I could see there, and I see that Pyro's Monitor pre-dates the Lindberg set by several years.  It looks different, too.  So I think I've answered my own question.

Gene,

I really like your display of the Monitor and Virginia!  It is highly original.

Jim,

Can you post any plans to show where those cuts are to be made, as well as the 180 realignment?  Thanks!

Bill

Gene,  I am just catching up with the forum again.  Too much work at home giving me only intermittent time online.  Glad I found this as my 1st search of the "day"(2AM).

   The photo's are great. Best quality you have posted yet. And your latest Ironclad models are another supreme achievement especially considering what you had to work with.

   In case some folks don't know, the Pyro/Life-Like 1/210 scale Monitor had the kits Turret in the wrong spot.  It requires a major fix.  Two major cuts thru the Monitor deck, a 180 realigment of the turret deck section, and 2 tough seams to hide were required.  Nice work!

Your USS Cairo is really fine too.  That one is a Maserpiece.

"Keep'em coming" Gene!

       Jim