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viking ship

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  • Member since
    July 2013
viking ship
Posted by steve5 on Saturday, February 27, 2021 5:31 PM

after the arizona and the bismarck , needed something light . 

gmorrison ,I know you did this mate , can you remember when , I would like to go over your build , for some refence material .

in the 3rd picture down , you will notice the bottom oar is way bent . any ideas on how to straighten it please .

 

  • Member since
    May 2006
  • From: Chapin, South Carolina
Posted by Shipwreck on Sunday, February 28, 2021 6:46 AM
Net, so what kit is it?

On the Bench:

Revell 1/96 USS Constitution

Trumpeter 1/350 USS Hornet CV-8

Revell 1/48 B-1B Lancer Prep & Reasearch

 

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Sunday, February 28, 2021 7:46 AM

Hi;

       That looks interesting. Now as to that oar. You can try some very distantly applied heat. That's why I keep a " BIC " in the shop! Or a kitchen match  that you just extinguished  and is still hot.

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Sunday, February 28, 2021 8:36 AM

I find a small heatgun less risky.  Also, if you can, clamp it straight before applying heat.

 

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Sunday, February 28, 2021 11:00 AM

I use hot running water to straighten bent or warped plastic parts. Simply hold the part under the hot water running from the kitchen tap, slowly straightening as you go.  It should only take a few minutes.  It's easy.

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Franklin Wi
Posted by Bakster on Sunday, February 28, 2021 2:05 PM

Hey Steve, cool project. Excited to see this come together. 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Sunday, February 28, 2021 2:58 PM

Were you able to open the link to my WIP thread from some years ago?

http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_subjects/f/7/t/169278.aspx

Those oars come in a number of lengths. Tilley and I worked up to the idea that this was to compensate for the oarsmen at the bow and stern being higher above the water than those amidships, due to shear.

The question I confronted was what to even use the oars for. It seems unrealistic to stick them out of the sides of the ship without oarsmen holding onto the end, and those are hard to come by.

We couldn't figure out just what those T shaped posts up and down the centerline are for. The three most likely candidates seem to be the mast and/or yard, but that would be a chore to get up on them and why?

It could be the leech pole; the poles that hold the leeches or edges of the sail away from the ship when the sail isn't full. That's my guess.

Or the could be for the oars.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Towson MD
Posted by gregbale on Sunday, February 28, 2021 3:03 PM

steve5
in the 3rd picture down , you will notice the bottom oar is way bent . any ideas on how to straighten it please .

That oar actually perfectly replicates the one used by the not-so-famous Viking explorer Ragnar the Disoriented. He and his unfortunate crew set out for a three-day sail from Norway to Denmark...and ended up accidentally discovering Tasmania.

The Tasmanians were none too happy about it....

[But seriously...Emhar does a set of 1/72 or so Viking oarsmen. Shows as being 'in stock' at Hobbylinc.]

Greg

 George Lewis:

"Every time you correct me on my grammar I love you a little fewer."
  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Sunday, February 28, 2021 3:09 PM

Dragging the ship across the Arctic must have been a lot of work. 

I made the decision (just me) not to use the oars as I didn't have a bunch of Bjorns, and their seat/ sea chests, to hold on the inboard ends. 

The chests of course were where they kept their personal grooming products.

 

Bill

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Sunday, February 28, 2021 4:35 PM

GMorrison
not to use the oars

Now I can't remember, did you also omit the shields as well, since you were not modeling a Kirk Douglas movie?

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Sunday, February 28, 2021 10:00 PM

I did. Research suggests that the shields were placed along funeral ships but were not present on sailing ships.

Strangely, one of the better sources for medieval ships are the Normans as they illustrated their ships, including once at large scale.

No shields there.

 

Bill

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Sunday, February 28, 2021 11:20 PM

Shipwreck
Net, so what kit is it?
 

Revell.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by steve5 on Sunday, February 28, 2021 11:42 PM

sorry guy's forgot to add this .

thanks for the link bill , this one worked ok . will sit down tonight with some coffee and study your build . luckily for me . it look's like you and the prof , have a good discussion about it .

 

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by steve5 on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 12:10 AM

glued the hull halves together .

knocked the knees off of the deck , will post pic's when I make my own . I am leaving the ones on the crone for the time being .

this piece of board should do for the display

 

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Franklin Wi
Posted by Bakster on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 12:46 AM

Hey Steve, the link below is to a build I doubt is "accurate" -- but it might inspire you anyway. This guys has a decent channel and for me, the cool thing, he lives in my home State. Thought you might enjoy seeing his build.

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by steve5 on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 4:08 AM

nice steve , liked his weathering . thank's for showing me mate , what's his name would like to see some of wooden ships .

gmorrison , I have a question for you please , a guy on another forum , said to throw the anchor , as the vikings had no metal , and to use a large rock and rope , well they had swords , did they have anchors mate .?

 

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Towson MD
Posted by gregbale on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 5:23 AM

steve5
gmorrison , I have a question for you please , a guy on another forum , said to throw the anchor , as the vikings had no metal , and to use a large rock and rope , well they had swords , did they have anchors mate .?

Steve, don't know whether you've encountered this site, but it's got some useful stuff...including pics of both metal and stone/wood anchor styles:

https://regia.org/research/ships/Ships2.htm

(Scroll down to 'Controlling the Ship.' Individual images open in b/w instead of 'negative.')

Really enjoying your project!

Cheers

Greg

 George Lewis:

"Every time you correct me on my grammar I love you a little fewer."
  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 8:16 AM

steve5

nice steve , liked his weathering . thank's for showing me mate , what's his name would like to see some of wooden ships .

gmorrison , I have a question for you please , a guy on another forum , said to throw the anchor , as the vikings had no metal , and to use a large rock and rope , well they had swords , did they have anchors mate .?

 

My understanding is that the Vikings were expert metal workers.  There was an exhibition at our Historical Society of Viking artifacts, and they made pretty fancy jewelry and ornamental objects from iron, as well as fancy helmets.  BTW, they did not use animal horns on them.  Their helmets liked much like other European helmets of the time.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Franklin Wi
Posted by Bakster on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 8:55 AM

steve5
nice steve , liked his weathering . thank's for showing me mate , what's his name would like to see some of wooden ships .

Steve, search for Hpiguysworkshop. I subscribed to his channel. He has some ships, but he builds everything. His builds are fun to watch because he doesn't get caught up in too much of the details, and he's having fun doing it. And even though he shortcuts things here and there, his builds look pretty decent. I have learned some techniques from watching him. Is a fun channel.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Tuesday, March 2, 2021 9:01 AM

At Oseberg, an anchor without a stock, and two other stocks, were found.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Wednesday, March 3, 2021 7:06 PM

GMorrison
At Oseberg, an anchor without a stock, and two other stocks, were found.

The viking era sailors, from what we know, gberally moored by beaching, or by going pier or quay side.

The "anchor" they needed was going to be more of a grapnel or hook.   Although a stocked anchor might be handy for pulling a laden vessel off a beach.  But, that bit of kit might not have the flukes and crown of a 17th century anchor.

And, IIRC, there's debate on whether a 1st/2nd century anchor stock would be parallel or perpedictular to the hook/flute ends.  I find the academic parallels to Danforth anchors uncompelling as an actual sailor, with more than passing experience warping vessels off a beach.  The obvious utility of a cross-stocked anchor would wind up being obvious, even if complicatign stowage.

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Towson MD
Posted by gregbale on Wednesday, March 3, 2021 7:52 PM

CapnMac82
The obvious utility of a cross-stocked anchor would wind up being obvious, even if complicatign stowage.

Not so complicated to stow, since they knew the trick: by rounding the top of the anchor shaft, the stock could be slid upward off of the square part of the shaft, then turned to lay flat for stowage. Even the Greeks and Romans knew about that one.

Greg

 George Lewis:

"Every time you correct me on my grammar I love you a little fewer."
  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, March 4, 2021 12:13 AM

A real question that remains unclear is chain vs. cable. But it's a detail.

The best Viking ships found are the Oseberg and the Gokstad ships.

The Revell kit is a nearly perfect model of the latter.

Both are funeral ships and were buried far from any coast. The items found at those ships can only truly be attributed to the rite.

They both are on display in Oslo, Norway. It's a bucket list for medieval ship historians.

The shields at Gokstad were arranged in a ring around the ship, outside those are skeletons of dogs and other animals.

The Vikings feared the afterlife and buried their chiefs in a defensive condition, not an eternity of wealth and power.

The dragon heads most likely were "totems" displayed outside the tents either on board or onshore, of their leaders.

Main source for the above is:

A.w. Brogger and Haakon Shetelig, "The Viking Ships, Their Ancestry and Evolution", Dreyers Forlag, (Oslo- Norway, !953).

Bill

 

 

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Thursday, March 4, 2021 9:40 AM

I take online courses while I pass time (15 hours a week) during kidney dialysis.  By coincidence I happened to start a course on the Vikings yesterday.  I think that course, this thread, and having the Revell kit in my stash is going to make me pull the kit out and on my bench when I am done with the GeeBee.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by steve5 on Thursday, March 4, 2021 3:53 PM

thankyou guy's for all the information , I am currently waiting on some styrene , for the knees , is why I haven't posted anything lately , tried gluing some different sizes together , but that didn't work , as they had a tendency to fall apart . should be here early in the week .

 

  • Member since
    February 2005
  • From: Nashotah, WI
Posted by Glamdring on Thursday, March 4, 2021 4:11 PM

GMorrison

 

We couldn't figure out just what those T shaped posts up and down the centerline are for. The three most likely candidates seem to be the mast and/or yard, but that would be a chore to get up on them and why?

It could be the leech pole; the poles that hold the leeches or edges of the sail away from the ship when the sail isn't full. That's my guess.

 

Some years back I built a Viking ship, it was some version of the old Heller release, but it had a canvas tent that covered the rowers area.  I think that is what these posts are for on the Revell ship as well, even if the Heller kit is allegedly a depiction of the Oseberg ship.

Robert

"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." 

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Thursday, March 4, 2021 5:16 PM

GMorrison
A real question that remains unclear is chain vs. cable. But it's a detail.

Chain does not see a lot of maritime use until the 1800s, in the sens of a line or cable.

But, when it does, it's used everywhere and for everything. 

Anchor rodes were ludicrous expensive--all rope making was, this is why strands and yarns were preserved and re-used.  It took many yarns to make up a rope, and thre ropes to make a hawser, and so on to make a cable.  Which would only bend about 9x diameter (or 3x circumference) for beng natural fiber.  So, you needed long flats to stow anchor line. And, it had to be laid so that it did not kink when paid out.

Chain happily will radius about 1.25 link length, and pile in ways that did not not kink, and could be compressed in a vertical locker..

Sailors being a stubborn lot, and much given to tradition, never gave up the proven for the novel, unless it worked better.  So, chain leaders for anchors started the trend, this also offered some eather protection to the rodes on deck, too.

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by steve5 on Wednesday, March 10, 2021 12:56 AM

 

  • Member since
    July 2014
  • From: Franklin Wi
Posted by Bakster on Wednesday, March 10, 2021 9:16 AM

CapnMac82

 

 
GMorrison
A real question that remains unclear is chain vs. cable. But it's a detail.

 

Chain does not see a lot of maritime use until the 1800s, in the sens of a line or cable.

But, when it does, it's used everywhere and for everything. 

Anchor rodes were ludicrous expensive--all rope making was, this is why strands and yarns were preserved and re-used.  It took many yarns to make up a rope, and thre ropes to make a hawser, and so on to make a cable.  Which would only bend about 9x diameter (or 3x circumference) for beng natural fiber.  So, you needed long flats to stow anchor line. And, it had to be laid so that it did not kink when paid out.

Chain happily will radius about 1.25 link length, and pile in ways that did not not kink, and could be compressed in a vertical locker..

Sailors being a stubborn lot, and much given to tradition, never gave up the proven for the novel, unless it worked better.  So, chain leaders for anchors started the trend, this also offered some eather protection to the rodes on deck, too.

 

I have nothing to add other than, very interesting stuff. You have a lot of good help here ,Steve. Yes Enjoying the build and commentary. 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Wednesday, March 10, 2021 3:23 PM

Steve,

Great choice on a ship model. Definitely check out GMorrrison and Prof Tilly's build logs. Anyway, following along as I've been toying with either building this again or the Heller Osberg and William the Conquerer's ship. I have Norman shields for that one and even though the weren't displayed, I'm going to use them anyway.

Following along,

Steve

       

 

 

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