Bakster

I just searched fishing boats imaged at night and it looks like the various light sources can be mash of different colors from pure white, to yellow, to an almost green. Some of that probably altered by the camera, and some from what the various light sources are made from. The point though, they appear different.

Fishermen are frugal.   They shop for deck lighting by price (and longevity).  So, every hue is likely--and, yes, cameras only emphasize such effects.

Maritime law wants the light colors to be "pure" and do not really allow for much variation.

So, a pure white is entirely apt for mast and stern lights.  Even if all the other illumination is some other hue.

Hi Bakster!

      Hey, every thing you have been told is true. Now to add to that. Many skipper/owners will also use lights and other equipment that is coming off a boat that has reached the end of it's useful life. Such as lights and deck gear. Besides you MUST realize that many multi boat owners are too cheap to buy new-Re: the Andrea Gail!

 Surprisingly the boat owners from twenty years ago to today are more likely to fudge because of "Coastie" Regs. They are cheap, and fishing is one of the industries hit the hardest for employee retention. In my Uncles day the boats were family owned operated and crewed! So a Vessel that performed properly at all times was very important. From the lights to the food coolers and living conditions as well.

         Boat maintenance and equipment has gotten so expensive today that everything HAS to be up to snuff at all times. As long as it meets "Coastie" Mins it is good to go. Sadly there those that pass and then wind up in trouble or on the bottom with a loss of life. It is a viciously demanding job, both for the boat and the crew! So, That said,The color of lights that are not Nav lights will be somewhat different if seen in person or on Camera. The old saw here is " If it ain't broke ,don't fix it!"

Hey TB-- that is a great synopsis. I am learning much from you guys about these boats and life on them.

And let me tell you... no thanks. It sounds too dangerous for my blood. Sinking into the inky blackness makes me very uneasy. I don't want to become fish food. 

CapnMac82

 

 

Bakster

I just searched fishing boats imaged at night and it looks like the various light sources can be mash of different colors from pure white, to yellow, to an almost green. Some of that probably altered by the camera, and some from what the various light sources are made from. The point though, they appear different.

 

 

Fishermen are frugal.   They shop for deck lighting by price (and longevity).  So, every hue is likely--and, yes, cameras only emphasize such effects.

Maritime law wants the light colors to be "pure" and do not really allow for much variation.

So, a pure white is entirely apt for mast and stern lights.  Even if all the other illumination is some other hue.

 

That is fantastico! So far -- so good.

You know... I have some LEDs called cabin yellow. The odd thing is when they light up they are anything but yellow. They look more like an off green, maybe mixed with some yellow. Maybe they would be good for inside the wheelhouse. Considering a home for them. 

MR TOM SCHRY

Bakster,

I've been following along with this build and the work that you're doing to this "vintage" kit is amazing.  I have the same kit so I'm taking a ton of notes.  When this model is completed have you considered entering it in the annual Manitowoc Ship Model Contest or perhaps the 2024 IPMS Nationals which are being held in Madison, WI?  Something of this quality needs to be seen by a lot more people.

tjs

 

Say Tom-- first off-- thank you! Secondly--the fact this build is helping you is what drives me to post them. I know I am repeating myself when I say that but it is entirely true. If it helps anyone-- mission accomplished.

Knowing you are taking notes for your build, I will continue to communicate the things I find.

Hats off to Capn, TB, and Morrison. Their knowledge enlightens all of us. I could not do this build without their help. Or -- I could... but it would probably S U C K!!!

About the contests. Boy-- I don't know. I never considered myself good enough for that sort of thing and on top of that-- I build for the fun of it. I will toss it around a bit. But lets first see how this movie ends. Hopefully, not like the Titanic! 

Thanks again Tom for the encouragement and for following.

Cheers! 

Bakster

Or -- I could... but it would probably S U C K!!

Full circle back to knowing the function of a thing, all the better to model that thing.

If a person does not know that the rectanguar bump on the side of a tank turret, say, is actualy a looped grab handle, they will render that differently than if it were, say, a stand-off for applique armor.

That schertzen on German WWII tanks is best (at 1/32) represented with 0.015 sheet, and not the ±2" to scale styrene brovidd in the kit.

Or, for that matter, being able to notice that a mast ladder only needs a few stand-offs, and not the one-per-rung as moulded.

So, research is wanted.  And, perhaps I'm too academic in my polymath desires for knowledge.  But a lack of research is one of my gripes about some of the YT modelers out ther.e--OOB is only OOB.  So, ok, Zukia Mora is pushing that envelope hard, but the kit manufacturer is limited in what they can mould, and how well they can mould it.

Which is where the on-line fora come in handy.  Being able to talk to actual tankers, pilots, aviators, sailors--these can inform modelers so richly and deeply.

CapnMac82

 

 

Bakster

Or -- I could... but it would probably S U C K!!

 

 

Full circle back to knowing the function of a thing, all the better to model that thing.

If a person does not know that the rectanguar bump on the side of a tank turret, say, is actualy a looped grab handle, they will render that differently than if it were, say, a stand-off for applique armor.

That schertzen on German WWII tanks is best (at 1/32) represented with 0.015 sheet, and not the ±2" to scale styrene brovidd in the kit.

Or, for that matter, being able to notice that a mast ladder only needs a few stand-offs, and not the one-per-rung as moulded.

So, research is wanted.  And, perhaps I'm too academic in my polymath desires for knowledge.  But a lack of research is one of my gripes about some of the YT modelers out ther.e--OOB is only OOB.  So, ok, Zukia Mora is pushing that envelope hard, but the kit manufacturer is limited in what they can mould, and how well they can mould it.

Which is where the on-line fora come in handy.  Being able to talk to actual tankers, pilots, aviators, sailors--these can inform modelers so richly and deeply.

 

Hey Tom Schry... here is a fantastic resource for Ross Tiger images.

https://www.facebook.com/RossTigerTrawler

With the exception of the wheelhouse, interior lighting is done.

Just a reminder that the camera is blowing out the light and skewing the color some too. In person it looks much more balanced.

Some things I can note:

1. I will go back and redo the light blocking. I left it as is so you can see what was done. If it was all black, you would not be able to tell what was done.

2. The larger 3 mil FO comes with a vinyl (or similar) outer jacket. I had to strip the jacket back at the connection points. Where they connect to the bulkhead, I stripped them back maybe 1/8 inch. This allowed me to insert the optic into the portholes providing a mechanical connection and it gives the appearance of recessed glass. On the other end I stripped them back maybe 3/4 inch. I used Evergreen tubing for the light engine and stripping the insulation allowed me to use a smaller diameter tube. I was able to stuff both optics into the tube with a nice solid fit. It is tight enough that I didn't need to glue them. I had no choice doing this because anything larger with the tube would have interfered with closing the roof. Btw. I had to expand the portholes very slightly in order for the FO to fit. It was minimal. I few swipes with a round file and bang--a nice tight fit. 

3. I used hobby epoxy to secure the smaller FO and when I was installing the 3 mil optics, I had one of the epoxy joins fail. It popped off like nobodys business. That epoxy continues to fail me. Over the years it has failed me at least 4 times. It is junk! I thought maybe it was bad luck but no. I repaired the damage and then slathered all the connections with slow curing JB Weld. That is good stuff, and I don't see that failing on me. Below is the junk I am referring to. 

4. The UV resin I have was handy too. The 3 mil FO LED placement was critical. There is a sweet spot to get both portals to light evenly. I needed something I could tack the LED in place when I got it positioned. UV resin worked great for that. Once it was tacked, I followed up with JB epoxy. 

I guess at this point I will begin work on the exterior lights above the wheelhouse.

I made the lamps following the process I outlined on the mast light. These are just too small to completely duplicate the 1:1. I cut Evergreen stock, sized, angled the piece to a wedge, and then drilled holes for the wiring to go through.

Installing them was a treat. The wires twist the piece in every direction other than where you want it. Try glueing them in the correct orientation without making a mess was a battle. Below was the best I could muster.

 

The wheelhouse is not secured. Wiring kept the piece from seating. They will be routed into the hull once when ready to mount it.

Light is blown out, as usual. What I did certainly not perfect but it is what it is.

I went with a yellow 0805 LED chip.

that's looking great , steve .

I think it looks great.

Thanks Lurch and Steve. I noticed in the third image there is light leakage around the LED housings. As a result I went back and applied solarez around them, zapped it with UV light, and then painted it with black craft paint. That should help with the light spilling out around the housings. Other than that, must be good enough.

I think from here I will start working on the wheelhouse lighting and windows.

This is getting "gooder and gooder" 

WOW!  That looks AWESOME!!!

tjs

Well!

      The decklights work so git yer B*&&% on deck straightening the deck ya swabs! Nice work with that lighting. I am still following this with Avidity for sure.

Bakster

Light is blown out, as usual. What I did certainly not perfect but it is what it is.

I went with a yellow 0805 LED chip.

 

 

Looks good to me.  Spot on (NPI) ome to cases

Now, as to light leaks around the fitttings . . .

Actual maritime lighting:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Klh7AauDX7o

Which also illustrates one of my gripes about navigating inshore waters at night.

Compare this to a "saltie" (e.g. an ocean-going vessel operating on the Great Lakes) under night illumination.  Note how clearly you can pick out the red & green nav lights.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJlebMI4mY4&list=TLPQMDkxMjIwMjLbfvfyGAfAKw&index=2

As well, thanks TB, Tom, and Duster for your enthusiasm!

Those are cool videos, Capn. And thanks for your input too.

Here are new images after cleaning up the gaps around the light assemblies. It  improved things.  

And now onto lighting the wheelhouse.

Bakster

And now onto lighting the wheelhouse.

Bill

GMorrison

 

 

Bakster

And now onto lighting the wheelhouse.

 

 

 

Keep it pretty dark. Might just be the binnacle light on the helm's face.

 

 

Bill

 

GMorrison

Keep it pretty dark.

Our man Backo had stated (way back there) that he ws going for frosted pilothouse windows with only a general glow.

It's not entirely prototyical, but will "scan" better for the average viewer.

It also saves on having to greeble up a pilothouse at 1/142 scale, with no interior plans at all.

Now, my thoughts are torn on whether to shoot a coat or two of Smoke on the inside of the pilothouse glass, to help with both the glow, and the diffuse see-through.  Or some other solution.

My reflex would be to use some eposed Kodak analog film stock for the glazing--but, that's like to be epensive to source in our modern times.

CapnMac82

 

 

GMorrison

Keep it pretty dark.

 

 

Our man Backo had stated (way back there) that he ws going for frosted pilothouse windows with only a general glow.

It's not entirely prototyical, but will "scan" better for the average viewer.

It also saves on having to greeble up a pilothouse at 1/142 scale, with no interior plans at all.

Now, my thoughts are torn on whether to shoot a coat or two of Smoke on the inside of the pilothouse glass, to help with both the glow, and the diffuse see-through.  Or some other solution.

My reflex would be to use some eposed Kodak analog film stock for the glazing--but, that's like to be epensive to source in our modern times.

 

Hey Capn, you are a mind reader. This morning it occurred to me that maybe I should try smoked glass. That would allow, as you said, a glow. It might be easier than trying to scrim light to good affect, especially, if I don't frost the glass. And BTW... I am rethinking the frosted glass. Like you said, it would read better and that is why I was heading in that direction to begin with but...if I go the way of smoked glass, then I don't see the need for it. In this case, I think smoked glass will read better.

Long story short... I am gonna first test smoked glass and see how that reads. In theory, this sounds like the way to go. Won't know for sure until I try it.

PS: and yes, I did not want to detail the wheelhouse. That was the other reason for the frosted glass. And with this ... smoked glass might work to that end. I was also thinking I could add a figure that at best might read in silhouette or fuzzy form.

GMorrison

 

 

Bakster

And now onto lighting the wheelhouse.

 

 

 

Keep it pretty dark. Might just be the binnacle light on the helm's face.

 

 Bill

 

Open question: Where in this photo would the binnacle light be located?  This photo is from the Ross Tiger. Seems like a good topic to share some knowledge/history as well. 

Bakster

Where in this photo would the binnacle light be located?

Some vessels, it a light in the overhead.  This would be low-wattage, and shaded, so as to ony illuminate the compass card in the binnacle.

Sometimes that's on a gooseneck only a few inhes above the card (this emulated the prior practice where a on oil amp was used)

Give you even oddsm since there's a "repeater" compass visible, that these are all self-illuminated e.g. internally-lit.

Now, this does not preclude a mix of externally and internally lit.  Having a tiny 10W spot that has enough "bleed" to illuminate the throttles, rudder angle indicator, or other useful switches, can be very handy.

One can compare the illumination to that used on a conductors stand or similar podium.

CapnMac82

 

 

Bakster

Where in this photo would the binnacle light be located?

 

 

Some vessels, it a light in the overhead.  This would be low-wattage, and shaded, so as to ony illuminate the compass card in the binnacle.

Sometimes that's on a gooseneck only a few inhes above the card (this emulated the prior practice where a on oil amp was used)

Give you even oddsm since there's a "repeater" compass visible, that these are all self-illuminated e.g. internally-lit.

Now, this does not preclude a mix of externally and internally lit.  Having a tiny 10W spot that has enough "bleed" to illuminate the throttles, rudder angle indicator, or other useful switches, can be very handy.

One can compare the illumination to that used on a conductors stand or similar podium.

 

In "light" of that... I will probably try placing an LED around the wheel. I will see how it plays out.

Thanks, Compadre!

Just a bump to keep tou from falling off the first page.

Yeah, I hope all is well Bakster. In all the Christmas havoc I kinda let this slip my mind... 

littletimmy

Just a bump to keep tou from falling off the first page.

 

 

Thanks Tim but you might as well let it fall off. I don't know when I will get back to modeling. The reason for this is that I suffered more loss. Both my dad and brother passed away and both on the same day. They had underlying health issues but both were pushed over by Covid. As the funeral home was transporting my dad from the hospital, they got a call to stop at my dads house for a DB. That was my brother. Both were taken side by side in the same transport. You can't make this stuff up.

On Christmas Eve the mother of my best friend entered into hospice. The day after Christmas she passed. She considered me family and I felt the same. Then last week my best friend was near death. By Gods grace she was treated in time.

I lost nine loved ones in 2022. It's hard to believe but it is true. Stuff like this changes ones paradigm rather quickly. Maybe in time I will come back to modeling but right now, I don't see it happening soon.

Thanks for thinking of me. I could always count on you.

Mabye talk to you guys some other time.

Steve

Sorry to hear that Bakster.  That's alot.  I lost someone at the end of 2022 as well.  There's only time....