Greetings from Calgary (Space Shuttle Discussion)

Yeah some pics would be real nice. I picked up the realspace payload bay kit does a great job of 'updating' the model, lots of Photo etched parts and some metal radiators for the doors... worth the money to get it up here, and for an extra tenner you get the cd-rom bursting with good upclose pics of the shuttle. what other mods have you made to it? is it going on the stack or in 'orbit'?

Madd Dawg

Ya know it's gonna be a bad day when you fall out of bed and miss the floor!

Would love to see the completed model, Caine!!!

Okay I admit it... I plan to tackle the task of scribing all the tile lines into my 1/72 shuttle kit. I origninally bought the Monogram full stack, but decided the Revell kit was better detailed for that scale. After buying the kit I was rather disapointed with the tile details and decided to make my own...

The technique I found that works for scribing is to use sections of that labling tape that you can buy at the grocery store. You know the kind that you feed in that gun looking thing with the rotary head covered in letters. Anyway, that tape is rather thick and doesn't stick too tightly to the plastic. So I use its thick edge as a guid for my X-acto blade (of course brand new blades only). I have been sketching the tile lines in pencil first so I can avoid starting at one end and ending up totaly off on the other.

As for resourses I have the Walk Around, but it doesn't compare to some of the books you can get at Barnes & Nobel or other book stores. My favorite is "Space Shuttle: The History of the National Space Transportation System: The first 100 missions" by Dennis R Jenkins. It has more detail about the shuttle than most people could stand.. but I am an engineer and I love that stuff.

All shuttle kits with maybe the exception of those early Enterprise kits will have the Columbia name on the decal sheet. The only shuttle kits out right now with the new look Meatball decals are the 1/72 Revell kit, the current Airfix release in 1/144, and the revised Minicraft kit in 1/144. All these kits show the meatball on the box art. Realspace Models offers a decal sheet with the meatballs for all scale shuttles including the 1/100 Tamiya offering. Cutting Edge is about to release a comprehensive shuttle decal sheet in both 1/72 and 1/144 which will cover all the orbiters with both the NASA wurm and meatball markings.
Hope this helps

Did a search for Monogram and Revell Space Shuttle kits, found only one at the Monogram/Revell site. Any others out there? Anyone still issuing Apollo CSM/LEM kits?

Thanks for the realspace reference WSgarside, I logged into their site, they have some very
impressive stuff. If your a space history buff they definatly want checking out, the prices aren't to bad
alittle on the steep side for me after the exchange, but I still ordered their cargo bay kit and cd-rom as
well as the updated decals for the 1/72 kit, should be here in a couple of weeks

Thanks again

Madd Dawg

Great stuff, Scott. How did you deal with the tile 'problem', then?

Hi All,

The good folks at www.realspcaemodels.com have an excellent set of Shuttle decals and a seperate sheet of accurately colored meatballs. Really good stuff!

Nice to hear that the Columbia disaster has inspired a desire to commemorate it in scale. My recently completed old Revel Shuttle Stack/Launch Tower model of Columbia in 1/144 was accepted last week by the Museum of Flight at Boeing Field as part of their permanent memorial. I'm very proud - and very sad.

Scott

This is just too cool

The first time I picked up an issue of FSM I was impressed, The articles were great (tho' would like to see more sci-fi), the
pictures actually showed detail and my favorite section the hints and tips, was always a help. I have learned a great deal
over the years. But I never would have believed that it would lead to a hopefully long time correspondance across the big
pond, as we call it here in Canada! FSM I thank you. This site may be the best thing that has happened to the hobbie ever since
the air brush. It may very well be the injection it needed. Our numbers have grown to over seven thousand in a matter of a few
months! Can you imagine in a few years? Just think of it, all the model builders of the world gathered on one website. Talk about
your masse united, the model makers would have a direct link to their consumers ,then maybe we all would get that one kit we want most of all. (like a Yamaha XS-650 twin). " Well Done FSM" Who ever came up with the idea at Kalmbach should get a really "Big" Attaboy! Now if only we could get our perspective governments to work like this?
I look forward to our correspondance dj, from reading your other responses here, I think we may have similar interists, always
wanted a pen pal when I was a kid.

May your eyes keep you on the right path, and your feet never falter.... Madd Dawg

Hi Madd Dawg,

no problem discussing Shuttles and more and sending you, via scanner and the net, this booklet. Just e-mail me your address and I'll get started

djmodels1999@aol.com

Wow! Go away for a couple days and look what happens

I have no problem what so ever the changes you have made, I have to admit I'm alittle pleased
with myself that my project has has prompted a thread of its own. Being able to not only swap model ideas
with someone, but to consult on a specific model itself is very helpful. Maybe we could call it the model space shuttle
support group.LOL

Thanks for the refs dnd I will be sure to check them out.

Hi sspoonts. Yes, it does have the Columbia name on the sheet it even has the Enterprise for one so inclined,
BTW, my scanning over of pictures and drawings has led me to believe that the detail on the model is actually based on the Enterprise which as you know was the prototype and never actually had tiles on the ship, so any markings were only simulations of where the tiles would be (they were still under development themselves) and bears little resemblence to the actual configuration. Once I realized this it seem to make a little more sense. I don't know if you want to go to the point of removing
all detail and starting anew, it depends on the level of accuracy you want to achieve, myself, I'm probably to meticulous for my
own good. All I can say is, If I figure out a way of doing it easily I will be sure to post it here. As a word of encouragement just remember "The greater the task, the greater the reward of accomplishment" till then I help any way I can.

Hey djmodels, I read your comments under the feedback forum and I really liked the way you said you have made a few
friends on this site, I would like to be counted among them, I don't think I will be able to find the one book you speak of
you obviously have a scanner I was wondering if maybe you would like to swap e-mail addresses I wouldn't mind discussing this
off line, what do you think?

Madd Dawg.

If you are looking for some detail parts for the Shuttle here are a couple of links:
http://www.realspacemodels.com/html/catalog1.htm
http://www.realspacemodels.com/html/decals.htm
I seem to remember seeing decals for the tile a few years ago but I am not sure if they are available still. I have built a couple of shuttle models for the local planetarium and I am thinking about building another, but I am not sure if I want to take that big of a project on again. Hope these links help.

Many thanks for this!

QUOTE: Originally posted by djmodels1999 To the FSM staff, I wonder if it might not be worth moving this discussion to the Real Space Forum...

I went ahead and moved it to the Space Forum as you requested. In light of recent events, this may become a popular discussion thread with many people wanting to do something to remember the Columbia. I modified the subject/title to add some text indicating it was about the Space Shuttle. JChurch - I hope you don't mind I made the change. If you want to change the subject/title you can edit your original post at anytime.

There's been several re-issues of both rhe 1/72 Revell and Monogram kits and you might find that the decals changed over time, particularly after the introduction of Endeavour... I'm not sure if there are any recent re-issues with the NASA meatball logos, and other cosmetic changes of the post-Challenger era... Maybe other here know..?

To the FSM staff, I wonder if it might not be worth moving this discussion to the Real Space Forum...

I'm new to this board, and was looking for anything relating to models of Columbia. I found the 1/72 Revell shuttle model in a local shop today, but I couldn't tell if it had decals for Columbia included or if it just has the markings for Endeavor (I think that was the shuttle shown on the box cover, or possibly Discovery). Do you know if it has the Columbia decals. I grew up with the space program and love it... I also live in the Dallas area, so the explosion of Columbia last weekend overhead makes me want to build a nice model of the ship. But y'all are scaring me some with all this talk of tile simulation, though!

That's the problem when you want to model a shuttle.... There are very often little cosmetic changes to the orbiter (but also the ETs) with each new mission. Obviously, the cargo is different every time, and therefore finding enough shots and info showing you all the changes, details, cargo for any particular mission is next to impossible to assemble...

Thanks for the refs, be checking them out.

Doing the decal thing might be the way to go, would definatly have decals figured out by the time your finished! Coincidently, do you think this might be the reason they were left off the kit in the first place...? LOL

There must be alot of pictures of the Columbia in your book , there were many suttle changes to the fleet after her, the tile pattern is more efficient and a little less haphazard if you follow me. Many black tiles were changed to white especially around the "OMS" pods and the vertical stabilizer has been rounded off at the tip, and some tiles that were on the bay doors and sides have been replaced with what can only be described as thick white canvass? I presume these areas don't get as hot as expected on reentry.

Madd Dawg Out.

If I'm not mistaken, the tiling on the Revell kit is first of all raised and then overscale, so you'd still need to remove it, and do your own.... Maybe the way to do the copying thing is to draw blocks of tiling, print them onto decal sheet then cut them up into chunks to fit the body of the orbiter...

The book I was telling you about is called... Space Shuttle (!), and it's the 3rd booklet in the 'Space in Miniature' series; it's written by Michael J Mackowski. It's from 1991 and I only have an address to contact him: 1621 Waterwood Lane, St Louis, Missouri MI63146-4827

I think it's a must if you model an early mission (before STS40).

I purchased, yesterday, the DK/Smithsonian book to celebrate the first 20years of the Space Shuttle. It's a great book for details of the orbiter.

Don't remind me about the black and white numbers I'm still working on that one, the real shuttle is littered with them .

I'm building the monogram kit, which is actually quite smooth, Tho I've never seen one open I'm told the revell kit is much more detailed and does have the tiles somewhat, I hope Mr. DJ can back me up on this one I'm not up on the who's kit is best and what to look for kinda stuff, for me if I like the kit and the price is right thats all it takes. Actually if you pick up Lou Drendals "Space Shuttle The Walkaround", he has a good lay out of the tiles and are very accurate in comparison to his photos. I like the idea of the decal, I had planned on taking the picture from the book and blowing it up on a copier until it fits the model. But because the picture is flat and the model is three dimensional, the copy would become distorted on the curves and angles and be unuseable. Now if I take some frisket paper and wrap... there I go thinking again...!

DJ whats the name of that book and is it still available? Scouring the net for jpgs has gotten dreary and I have found there is a lack of decent shuttle pics in most books, except for orbital shots that is, good close ups are few.

Keep yer stick on the ice.... MD

This idea of printing decal is a good one, I think. It would be worth trying it out... As I said, the tile pattern itself is a problem, but each idividual tile also wear a serial number (in black on while tiles and in white on black ones, and having to cope with that as well as the tiles is mind boggling.

Having said that, I have a book about modeling Shuttles where the guy used surgical tape, lots of tiny bits of it, to replicate the tile pattern (or at least something that looks like it anyway) and the model is stunning. And that was at 1/144...

I started searching around the web to see what others had to say about the kit and tiles. Some of the posts I saw said that the kit has tiles etched in. Did they change the kit? Or is the tile effort on the kit pathetic?

This may sound strange, but I'm wondering if you could find some art work of the shuttle (photos or print) out there that could be converted into a decal sheet using a scanner and printer? Then perhaps you could peace together some of the odd shapes? Thinking out loud which often times leads to too much work

Good luck. It's an interesting project so I'll keep watching for posts on this one.
Dave

To DJ & David

Actually your both right!. Scribing all those tiles in IS going to be, lets say tedious for lack of a better term, But in 1/72 scale the model is way to clean, something must be done and yes the scribe lines most likely will be out of scale unless you have a lite touch, but I don't think it will be that noticeble. If you go to the nasa website and look up some jpg' s on the Atlantis specifically you can find some very nice and VERY large files. They were taken on the tarmac just as she was coming out after a major refit, some very good close ups of the under belly and sides, It was because of these pictures I noticed alot of inadequacies in the model, and being a Millwright by trade and a semi-artist by nature I took the harder road. I think my middle name should be meticulus.If you look closely you notice there is a definite pattern of major and minor blocks, following this should speed up the process some, painting in some blocks to give a new tile look is a good idea as well especially toward the bottom nose area, the hot plasma scorches this area to and almost battleship grey colour, and if you drag this back in long streaks like the trail left by a bad broom, and the paint in a few new tiles would look superp and not as hard as one might expect. I did an Enterprise D about ten years ago and painted in the light/dark pattern as well as the windows it was time consuming but my results took a first place ribbon at a local show!
Sorry for the long winded responses guys, It's been along time since I've been at my bench, and finally being able to BS with some one about it is just as satisfing.
Onward and upward Madd Dawg

You might be right David, but the size of that 1/72 shuttle requires something to be done about the tiles. If not, the model will look WAY to clean and bland....

Place the model against a picture of the shuttle that's just about the same size and the pic will show off a lot of tile details, including -albeit you can't read them - the tiles' code... Although I've never seen a shuttle in real, it's surface looks pretty rough.

Scribing all those tiles? Are you sure you want to do that? The reason I say that is that I'm of the belief that a model should have a scale look. Tiles on a shuttle are so tight and small that unless you are right next to the actual bird, you're not going to see the joints. If you were looking at the shuttle from a distance, in this case some 50 yards or more, would you see all those individual tiles? More importantly would you see the giant seams that would be reproduced by scribing? I'm not that familar with the kit, but something to consider. I wonder if you could paint in different shades here and there to give the appearance of replaced tiles? Even that would have to be pretty subtle. This is a tough problem. My guess is that producing tiles might not even be realistic until you got up into 1/48 scale or larger. Good luck with your project.

Yeah, although some were re-released by other companies... You can see them all at

http://modelbox.free.fr/dossiers/Eggs_P/index.html

including some out of this world conversion jobs..! The site is in French, but the pics speak for themselves!

Domi

DJ, that is hilarious - in a good way of course!

Thanks for posting that pic. I've never seen anything like that before. You said there were others, besides the space shuttle?! Were they all made by Hasegawa?

Yes, I wish I had bought all of those eggs back in the 80's... My favourite was the Blackbird, but could never find it in the shops... I'm sure that Romulan ship took a long time in the making. Don't be too frustrated from seeing what you feel are better models than what you can do. It took me a long while to get decent looking models. In fact it took me joining a model club to see what was possible. Nowadays, with sites such as this one, things are way easier, and looking at mags also helps. Well, as I said before, keep in touch.

DJ

Too cool! I've seen a few of these in the local shops, this is the first shuttle I.ve, seen most were fighters. I don,t have any pics of my work or the capabilitie to put them up for that matter, my lattest finished piece is hanging over my head. A Romulan Warbird, drilling out every single window took some time! That was two years ago and pace on my shuttle has been slow, but you and this site are giving me inspiration or more aptly, a kick in the butt to finish off my work bench, I need some way of making it cat proof without constantly disassembling my space every time I need to stop, seeing all this good work out there can be a little frustrating, GS-2003 has some real nice work, very impressive!

Madd Dawg!