Gluing

Yeah , I use that too .But , I forgot to tell Cowboy that I use Aleen's " Tacky Glue " Exclusively for clear parts . It has a better bond than Elmers and is well known to be easy to clean if you are sloppy by accident .

Stretched sprue filler, I like that!

I only use styrene cements, liquid or tube, to bond styrene parts together.  I want that chemical reaction that melts and welds the plastic.  I'll use CA glue to attach non-like substances, like resin to styrene, metal to styrene or resin, and also in resin to resin bonds.  But where I can get that weld, I like to have that kind of a bond.

With liquid styrene cement and capillary action to flow the cement in the joint, I will try to leave a hair's breadth of space, then squeeze the parts together and get that little bead of melted plastic to ooze out of the seam.  That's a big help, when trying to clean up seams.  Of course, a piece of stretched sprue laid over the seam and then melted in with the liquid cement is very effective, too.  But in either case, I put the parts together first, then apply the liquid cement.

If I want a real strong bond I will use styreen glue; then after it cures apply CA. For example I just closed the gear bay doors on my in flight B-29. I built an infra-structure for them to sit on with styreen rod, Glued the doors in with tube styreen, and 24 hours later coated the seems from the inside with CA. I do not want to be punching these doors in after it is complete.

Capillary attraction limits the amount of glue and hence the thickness of the bond. It is sort of an automatic quantity control.  Painting it on by hand may put too much in the gap.  Now, with solvent glue it makes no difference because the glue will evaporate, but with thin CA it can make a difference by minimizing the amount of glue.  CA does not evaporate, it all hardens.

the Baron

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when I use liquid styrene cement.  I've always placed the parts together and then flowed the glue along the seam and into the seam.

Yep.  I don't see any other ways of using liquid styrene cement.

Digital_Cowboy

Misty,

    I know what capillary action is, I was curious as to when and why one would use it as opposed to "painting" glue on both pieces and then joining them together.  As well as other than the obvious of thin glues which glues lend themselves best to the technique.  As well as which forms the stronger bond.

I would imagine that in painting the liquid glue on the mating surfaces, you lose a little bit of time, however small, as you then put the two pieces together.  That is, that as soon as the glue hits the surface, it starts dissolving the material but also starts curing.  I've never used that technique, when I use liquid styrene cement.  I've always placed the parts together and then flowed the glue along the seam and into the seam.

If the bulk properties of the glue are weaker than the materials you are gluing together, then a thin bond is stronger- a thicker bond starts depending on the bulk properties.

Chrisk-k,

    Thank you, and that actually makes sense.  If one is using a type of cement/glue that isn't designed for a particular type of material then the best application techniques in the world aren't going to help form a strong bond.

Digital_Cowboy

AndrewW,

    I agree, as I recall seeing styrene "melt" due to the chemical reaction between the cement and the styrene.  Does capillary action produce a stronger bond then applying it to the two pieces and holding them together?

The level of bonding strength depends more on the type of cement than on application methods.

I think ALL kinds of glue have their use in model building,  with the possible exception of horsehide glue. I keep four types of glue on my modeling bench, and use them all for various tasks.

Yep, makes since. I just prefer CA. I use Mod Podge or Elmer's white glue to attach canopies instead of CA. I learned the hard way. made a total mess of it.

MC,

    I can see what you're saying, up to a point.  But given that plastic cement/glue is forumlated to work with styrene plastic does it not make sense to use it?  And yes, I can see using CA for attaching PE, vinyl or resin to styrene.

    And of course it goes without saying that it likewise makes sense to use a cement/glue that isn't quite so volatile, as it were when attaching clear plastic.

    Just asking.

From what I've found some glues just work best for certain applications, IMHO, I like CA for photoetch and those tiny bits that I want a little extra time to set but want a good strong adhesion that likely wont get bumped (interior details or small parts on landing gear).  I like the plastic glue like Plastistruct and Tenex, especially for fuselage seams and wings.  I too like the black Testors glue as well, it will fill a gap and seems very strong as well, even if it does take awhile to dry.

Steve, after seeing your kits first hand, I'd say you are a master with the CA!  Keep it up!

I'ts all preference. It seems some guys think I'm off my rocker, but I have learned to use CA with all it's strengths and weaknesses over the last 20 years. That's my preference. Plastic glues just take too long IMHO and you run into the possibility of marring the plastic as it melts. I just don't care to clamp, tape, hold the piece while it dries.

Don,

    Thank you for the information.  Obviously I haven't tried it yet, but I have read people talking about it and was courious to learn more about it.  Thank you and everyone else who has helped.

Chris,

    Thank you for the information.  Right now i am using the Testors that comes with a purple lable, it is number 3502.  I haven't seen the stuff in a black bottle, but will have to look around for it.

    Again, thank you for the information, it would be interesting to learn if there is or isn't a difference in strength between the two types of joining pieces together, i.e. using capillary action or applying to one or both sides.

    And I know what you mean, and it seems like "Murphy's Law" goes into full force sending that little "fiddly bit" off somewhere where it won't be found until years later.

I am not sure about applying to each piece, Cowboy, as most of the solvent cements I use have a very fast drying time.  Because of the drying time, this is where capillary action is preferable.   The touch -n- flow I use is just a clean way of applying,  and aligning the parts before joining prevents any gaps or screw ups.  Of course, I am referring to large pieces, wng halves, fuselage halves.  For tiny bits, I set a dop on a surface with the touch -n- flow, set my piece into the drop, and later allow a drop to work around the outside of it.  I think with melt and evaporation time, you'd not have time to paint the solvent on, align the pieces and clamp them.  Also, the application is very neat, there's no risk of accidentally applying to an unwanted area and melting detail or giving yourself a soft spot to leave a fingerprint impression in.  Remember, the solvent does soften the styrene during the weld, until it 'cools' again.  For the price of the touch-n-flow,  which as I recall is not much, I think all the benefits are worth it.

Nathan T,

    Right now, I've only used CA for joining dissimilar materials, i.e. chrome plated and regular unplated styrene.  Or when attaching vinyl seats to the inside of a car.

roll eyes.......

AndrewW,

    I agree, as I recall seeing styrene "melt" due to the chemical reaction between the cement and the styrene.  Does capillary action produce a stronger bond then applying it to the two pieces and holding them together?

BlackSheep TwoOneFour,

    Agreed, from what I have seen it appears that those who us CA generally use it for joining two dissimilar pieces together, i.e. PE to styrene, or vinyl ot styrene.  Although as has been noted some use it exclusively, or almost exclusively.

The "capillary action" method works best with very smooth, close fit.  The method prevents too much glue and too thick a bond layer.  But it means the joint must fit super smooth (little natural gap) in order to achieve that.

D_C,

It's hard to say which is better all around. I use both, but it depends on the situation.

I use liquid solvent cements (Tamiya extra thin, Tenax) with capillary action whenever I want the seam to disappear. Fuselage halves, wing halves, are a good example of this. The capillary action technique really lends itself to hiding the seam.

If the seem does not need to disappear, I use Testors cement in a black bottle with the applicator. (This glue is underrated, IMHO). Pilot seat, control stick, some wing to fuselage joints, are good examples of when I use this stuff. This stuff is thicker and gives me some working time to make sure I can get proper alignment. Obviously, the higher viscosity of this glue means capillary action won't work. I just apply the glue to one part, not both. I apply this stuff sparingly because it will ooze out too much if I don't. (In fact, I don't use the needle applicator--it applies too much glue).

I have no idea which one makes a stronger bond. Both have solvents that fuse plastic together, but the thicker stuff in the black bottle also has a solid binder. I once used the black bottle cement to glue a fiddly bit on a Sherman tank (looks like a pair of tiny wings on the back of the turret, not sure what those things are called). I decided to model a different version and so had to remove the bits. I had a devil of a time doing so. I grabbed it, pulled it, twisted it. The thing wouldn't come off. Usually fiddly bits will just "ping" right off with a flick of a finger (usually accidentally). But these things were holding on tenaciously! This stuff is surprisingly strong!

Chris

Digital_Cowboy

Misty,

    I know what capillary action is, I was curious as to when and why one would use it as opposed to "painting" glue on both pieces and then joining them together.  As well as other than the obvious of thin glues which glues lend themselves best to the technique.  As well as which forms the stronger bond.

Solvent glues are by far the strongest, much stronger than CA. Man, I can't imagine using that stuff exclusively!!?? With a thin solvent glue, there is no need to brush it on the parts first, then join them. Just put the parts together, dab a little solvent on the seam, apply pressure-bingo. Done! Welded together. Any extra glue that oozes out can be sanded down and actually acts as filler. This all happens almost instantly. I can't imagine how using CA saves time over solvent glues, unless its absolutely necessary. 

The strongest bond on styrene will be a liquid 'welder' solvent cement, and these are easiest appliied by capillary action, i.e. a touch-n-flow applicator.   CA glue is brittle but strong,  welding cements make two pieces of styrene one, but do not work well on painted parts.  Just my 2 cents, hope it helps.

I guess it comes down to preference. Some like using CA exclusively, others for special applications, etc...

Misty,

    I know what capillary action is, I was curious as to when and why one would use it as opposed to "painting" glue on both pieces and then joining them together.  As well as other than the obvious of thin glues which glues lend themselves best to the technique.  As well as which forms the stronger bond.