Paint peeling off with masks

Thank you. I did an experiment with MM Acryl paints, Vallejo model color and Tamiya with and without primer. The Model Master was the only one that peeled when Tamiya tape was lifted off of it if it wasn't primed. It doesn't have to do with washing the plastic because mine was washed. I'll prime for MM from now on but also will try to stay away from them if I can. 
thanks. 

Greg

He may well be slamming his fist down. I'm usually on my laptop, small screen, not-so-great eyes. Great combination.

 

No you're right, if you leave the curser hanging on the image in the selector page it says crying. And fwiw I don't see any better than you and I'm on my laptop !

Well anyway, to get on topic, the OP needs to prime. So do many others but just don't want to come to terms with the concept. I guess.

He may well be slamming his fist down. I'm usually on my laptop, small screen, not-so-great eyes. Great combination.

Greg

Well thanks, Bruce! That what I was going for, you just made my day.

OMG, all I saw was the crying face emoji, thought I messed up while trying to be witty. Thanks for squaring it all away.

 

Oh he's crying, I thought he was slamming his fist down on something. Oh well !! Anyway no issue here and your message was clear to me as well..

Well thanks, Bruce! That what I was going for, you just made my day.

OMG, all I saw was the crying face emoji, thought I messed up while trying to be witty. Thanks for squaring it all away.

Greg

Hey OMG, I hope it was clear that I am agreeing with you?

If it came off some other way, I sure didn't mean it too. I've had the same experience with Model Master acryls and am on the same page as you regarding priming. I agree, priming is necessary, that's all I meant.

 

I did an edit on that reply, maybe it makes more sense now Greg ! But no problem here at any rate, sorry for the confusion.

I'll be the second to agree with you oldermodelguy. 

Greg, I tought what you said was clear and rather witty!

Hey OMG, I hope it was clear that I am agreeing with you?

If it came off some other way, I sure didn't mean it too. I've had the same experience with Model Master acryls and am on the same page as you regarding priming. I agree, priming is necessary, that's all I meant.

Greg

 

11 year old thread, timeless advice.

The indisputable nature of the solution justifies your period. Period.

  That's me harping on primer again lol !!

oldermodelguy

You need primer under MM Acryl. Period.

11 year old thread, timeless advice.

The indisputable nature of the solution justifies your period. Period.

JimLo

Hi

did you ever figure out why the MM Acryl paint was peeling ? I'm having the same problem. I have three new bottles and airbrushed it using Model Master Acryl thinner. model was washed but I didn't use primer. A week after it dried using Tamiya masking tape it would peel off. I don't use primer for my Tamiya paints and never have this problem. Did I thin too much ? Not sure what's wrong? My other paints without primer do not peel like this. I had similar problems with my Vallejo paints too but for those I think it's because it's almost impossible to fully shake/mix them in their bottles without an agitator ball in the bottle. thanks. 

 

You need primer under MM Acryl. Period.

Hi

did you ever figure out why the MM Acryl paint was peeling ? I'm having the same problem. I have three new bottles and airbrushed it using Model Master Acryl thinner. model was washed but I didn't use primer. A week after it dried using Tamiya masking tape it would peel off. I don't use primer for my Tamiya paints and never have this problem. Did I thin too much ? Not sure what's wrong? My other paints without primer do not peel like this. I had similar problems with my Vallejo paints too but for those I think it's because it's almost impossible to fully shake/mix them in their bottles without an agitator ball in the bottle. thanks. 

Good suggestion.  I actually didn't prime the model again once I stripped it.  I used Plastic Prep first and then just sprayed a coat of flat black MM Acryl.  I let each coat dry about 10 minutes before I masked it.  I had no paint come off when removing the Tamiya tape.  I'm happy with those results. 

So, it's either junk primer, lack of cleaning the model, or both.  Either way, I learned something!

I just thought I'd update you guys on my process with the Bf 109.  I know the aircraft forum is probably better for this, but I don't think this model warrants a pic post, since it's my first model and my airbrush is still giving me quite the headache as you can see from the splatter camouflage.

Thanks for looking, and thanks again for your help!

That's a great idea.  I wish I would have thought about it before, but I'm just getting back into the swing of things.  I stripped the primer off the 109 this weekend so I have a clean slate.  I also ordered a duplicate kit, since I messed up the canopy pretty badly trying to apply a mask to that.  So, one way or another, I'll have some scrap plastic to practice with.

Have you considered doing the whole painting process on some scrap plastic before commiting to the kit?

Before I started airbrushing my first kit, I got some scrap plastic, primed it, colour coated it & clear coated it - several times before getting it right(ish). This allowed me to get to grips with the airbrush & the paints I was using, so I could hit my first kit with some level of confidence.

May save several frustrating wash-down's on your 109?

I haven't had the best luck with acrylics myself. I tried using Testors old formula of acrylics and found the paint lifting off very easily. I haven't yet tried to use their new "Acryl" paints but heard they are improved over the old.

Also once tried using an acrylic clear finish and ended up with a pebbled surface that ended up with me stripping the model to start again. 

I figured I'd post some pics of the awful state of the model, a Revell BF 109G-10.  That way, once it's done, you can see how much you guys have helped!

BeerGremlin wrote:

Do you think Testors Acryl airbrush cleaner would work for the time being?

I haven't used this product personally, but I would say No.

The airbrush cleaner is formulated to dissolve dry paint in your airbrush by dissolving/breaking down the binders in the paint.  Using this as a thinner may even further reduce the adhesion of your paint.

usmc1371 wrote:

You might also want to try a product call "Plastic Prep" available from Testors. It's great for preparing models for acrylic paint. If you don't want to buy "Plastic Prep", you can try wiping your model with alcohol before painting. -Jesse

I will second that, washing down on the sprue may help during construction or for cleaning hard to get to areas that require to be painted, but wont stand much ground when it comes to overall painting - as by then you model will probably have fingerprints & sanding dust all over it. Give it a blow over & than a wipe down with alcohol or meths & paint as soon as its dried.

I have used acrylic straight onto a kit & while it has worked ok, there is no doubt that a non-acrylic primer (such as Mr surfacer) will grip the plastic like there is no tomorrow in comparison, whereas acrylic is easily scratched, rubbed or scuffed of very easily. Using a primer like this gives the acrylic paint something better to hold onto as opposed to bare styrene.

Don't thin paint with tap water

Tap water has chlorine, minerals and all kinds of stuff in it.  Use distilled water instead

I also wash the model with hand type dish soap and luke warm water before each major paint coat.

First and foremost, thanks much for your help and quick replies. 

I primed my model with Model Master Acryl gray primer #4680.  I thinned it 2 parts primer, 1 part regular tap water (maybe a problem?)  I've heard some people spray acrylic paint right out of the bottle, but since it was the first time I used my airbrush, I was too worried about clogging it up right out of the shoot.  Not that I have much experience, but the paint flow seemed good.  Not watery, no runs, etc.  Maybe I laid it on too thick?  

I washed the model when I first got it with soap and water, before any assembly.  I did a fair amount of fitting and sanding, so I probably should have washed it again before laying the primer.  I did, at one time, brush water all over it and pat dry to remove any sanding dust.  Still, I would say I handled it a fair amount, so maybe it was too oily.

Temp in the house is 79 degrees.  I live in Arizona, so there is negligable humidity.

I have full confidence it's due to my lack of experience, so any help you could give would be much appreciated.