Transition from Aztek 470 to ??

QUOTE: The experts I am talking about are not scientists in ivory towers, I am talking about people who know airbrushes and use them every day such as people like Dave Monnig at Coast Airbrush. I highly doubt he would recommend an HP-C for modelers, but if you like the feel better then that's fine.

i was just trying to paint a picture mike. just an analogy. i knew you were talking about airbrush experts ok. well, your man dave is wrong in my case. i dont know if you've read any of my posts on my experience with the iwata purchases, but let me do a little review. when i first purchased the hp-c i was disappointed with the results. i kept reading the praises of the hp-cs so i found out the n/n combo was larger than my hp-c so i figured this had something to do with it. so, i look at the dixieart page to purchase a hp-cs and see the .4mm n/n conversion kit for my hp-c. i buy that instead and im in love instantly with the set up. yes, i posted here on this forum that i wouldn't recommend going this route. yes, i spent $180 bucks to get that set up. do you have to spend that much money to get a decent airbrush that will do fine lines with ease? of course not. i agree 100% that you couldn't tell the difference between a hp-c line and an hp-cs line. were on the same page big time on that one. i too am trying to save a person some money by not recommending what ive done. but since i did go this route out of total ignorance, the hp-c is my favorite airbrush out of the 3 gravity feeds that i own. i use the hp-c far more than any of the 3 brushes that i have.

QUOTE: Ok, relax Salty and MikeV!

dont worry armormaster, mike and i are cool my friend. mike's my buddy and i intend for it to stay that way. we just shootin' the breeze a little. later.

sigman: you can do as salty done, i would.

MikeV (Aka mikedaddy) i know, its just he bragging. ie:
<person 1>I have a mercedes s600.
<person 2> I have a maybach 62. WAHAHAHAH pwned!!! i own you. now polish my shoes

the point is, its just for the bragging factor.

Ok, relax Salty and MikeV! All I know is the iwata hp-cs is boss () and I wouldn't go judging a bager or pachee because I've never handled one before. I wouldn't bring dis-credit on an airbrush I've never used before, but thats just me. Now MikeV, don't take that the wrong way. We all know your one of the best and most knowligdable people on ABing in this forum. And CNicoll, you made a great decision and I know your going to love it!

QUOTE: Originally posted by saltydog we can look at NASA and find plenty of "experts" of particular fields and then look back in history to the accidents and see that even experts are wrong occasionally. they are very wrong in my case.

Chris,

The experts I am talking about are not scientists in ivory towers, I am talking about people who know airbrushes and use them every day such as people like Dave Monnig at Coast Airbrush. I highly doubt he would recommend an HP-C for modelers, but if you like the feel better then that's fine.

QUOTE: i would hate for someone to read a post on here and not ever try something just because someone said it wasnt worth it.

I am not saying the airbrush is not worth buying, I am saying it is not going to give him better results than the HP-CS for his needs so why pay the extra money?
Going back to the Micron example, would it be wrong for me to not recommend one of them also since some people actually buy them for modeling and like them?
I am trying to be unbiased and yet not lead someone into spending more money on an airbrush than they need to. That is what I was trying to do here.
He wanted an airbrush for finer lines and out of the HP-C and HP-CS I doubt you could see the difference.

Mike

yes, i did buy the .4mm n/n combo for my hp-c. and i have posted many times since that i would recommend the hp-cs before i would a hp-c because of the .05mm difference in the size of the n/n combo. the reason i do this is because if you purchase the hp-c, it is sent to you with the .3mm n/n combo which i never got good results with unless i did some really extreme thinning. so, i recommend the hp-cs because i can achieve everything i want to achieve as far as modelling goes, but i prefer the hp-c over the hp-cs because of the comfort. and that is totally personal, the next person will hate the wieght and bulk of the hp-c, but i like it. im not saying you've gotta buy a high dollar airbrush to get the ultra fine line, im saying that im so glad i purchased it for the comfort and warm fuzzy i get when i use it. these are intangible i know, but they are very important and why my omni collects dust most of the time. we can look at NASA and find plenty of "experts" of particular fields and then look back in history to the accidents and see that even experts are wrong occasionally. they are very wrong in my case. i consider myself a rookie airbrush user because ive only been airbrushing for a total of 18 months of my entire life. i would hate for someone to read a post on here and not ever try something just because someone said it wasnt worth it. yes, when you get to the bottom line, i paid around $180 bucks to get an hp-c with the .4mm n/n combo, but its the best set up ive ever used and was worth every penny because i'm a very happy modeller since the arrival of the hp-c and .4mm n/n to my workbench. but, i heard so many good things about the hp-cs that i couldn't resist purchasing one to find out .....whats the word you used.... "hoopla" was all about. now, since ive used the hp-cs, i recommend it to anyone looking for a good all around airbrush because it is way cheaper than going the route that i went with the hp-c. i hope that makes sense to you mike. later.

QUOTE: Originally posted by saltydog but mike, i have to call your hand on this one thing though. how do you know its not worth the extra money if you've never held or felt or sprayed paint through an iwata hp-c? it was worth the money to me and if i had it to do over again, i'd spend it again. you are basing your opinion on information you've collected from different people instead of hands on experience. i dont think you are qualified to make that statement in my opinion. and please dont take that in the wrong way, because i'm definetly not trying to start anything here, i know you are a qualified and bonefied airbrush user for sure, but if you havent actually tried the airbrush in question, how can you truelly form an opinion about it? thats all.

Chris,

That is a valid point and it is true that I have not used an HP-C to compare them, but I am giving an opinion based on what the experts in the airbrushing business would recommend. If you were to ask some of the top airbrush experts in the country which Iwata they would recommend for a modeling airbrush they would say the Eclipse series.
You yourself said you bought a .4mm needle and tip for your HP-C did you not?
The Eclipse CS has a .35mm tip and needle which should be capable of possibly an even finer line, so why is the extra money necessary for the HP-C?
If you like the feel of the HP-C better then that's fine, but why spend an extra $30 on an airbrush that offers no real advantage especially to an inexperienced airbrush user?
If you want to carry this type of thinking to it's logical conclusion then why not recommend the Iwata Micron to everyone? It is capable of the finest lines of any airbrush except the Sotar and the Paasche AB, so buy it and you can brag that you have the best, even though I guarantee you won't have any better results with it than you will with your HP-CS or Omni 5000.

Mike

i agree with mike, i can get the same line with my omni 5000 as i can with the hp-cs or hp-c. but, its easier for me to achieve the fine line with the iwata and i love my two iwatas for the comfort and feel more than any thing else. yes, the parts for the iwata are expensive, but the quality of the parts are better in my opinion. but mike, i have to call your hand on this one thing though. how do you know its not worth the extra money if you've never held or felt or sprayed paint through an iwata hp-c? it was worth the money to me and if i had it to do over again, i'd spend it again. you are basing your opinion on information you've collected from different people instead of hands on experience. i dont think you are qualified to make that statement in my opinion. and please dont take that in the wrong way, because i'm definetly not trying to start anything here, i know you are a qualified and bonefied airbrush user for sure, but if you havent actually tried the airbrush in question, how can you truelly form an opinion about it? thats all.

QUOTE: 1337, Can you control more of the thinness of spray if you have the preset handle?

sig, if i were you i'd put the preset handle out of my mind and just practice with the whole trigger. the preset handle is not worth the money for sure or the crown cap. i made a preset handle for my hp-c by drilling a hole in the end of the factory handle and tapped it. then, i bought an allen head screw thats flat on the end and could turn the screw clockwise to set the trigger travel. it works beautifully and the screw only cost 9 cents. the crown cap in my opinion is a rip off because i cant really tell any difference with in on or off. later.

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1337 <person 1> Hey i got an iwata eclipse cs. it can do lines about 1/16. <me> i have an iwata hp-c and it can do lines 1/32 (i think) WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA OWNED!!!11!!!

Person #1 needs to practice a lot and person #2 (you) have nothing to brag about because I can spray 1/32" lines with my Omnis, Anthem, 360, Vega 2000, and Vega 1000 any day. The brand does not matter!

Mike

1337, Can you control more of the thinness of spray if you have the preset handle?

MikeV: i would fork out the extra money if i needed to, cause i need the "edge" for graFIX class, and because people are like this:

<person 1> Hey i got an iwata eclipse cs. it can do lines about 1/16.
<me> i have an iwata hp-c and it can do lines 1/32 (i think) WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA OWNED!!!11!!!

Sigman: a custom trigger is exactly what it sounds like, just take a file or 2 to the trigger TOP until it's more comfortable, i don't advise doing it tho... ruins the chrome.

The cutaway preset is the one on the highline hp-ch, bh, or ah. try dixieart

Thanks everyone for your comments! I'll be ordering HP-CS very soon here!

Chris

QUOTE: iwata eclipse hp-cs hands down. later.

I transitioned from an Aztek to a hp-cs and it's like rags to riches!

This is what I did with my hp-cs and the black arrow is about the size of my thumbnail.

You're a brave man Mike!

CNicoll, you could take a look at an Omni.

I did, and I love it.

Karl

I say no, the HP-C is not worth the extra money.

Mike

Thanks for the posts guys! I take it the HP-C is different from the Eclipse HP-CS? The price is quite a bit different, but is it worth the price?

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1337 yeah: Hp-c with crown cap, custom trigger, cutaway preset handle, and 20 foot braided airhose. beats all.

1337, my HP-C has a crown cap, but I am wondering where i can buy a cut-away preset handle and what is custom trigger?

yeah: Hp-c with crown cap, custom trigger, cutaway preset handle, and 20 foot braided airhose. beats all.

QUOTE: Originally posted by saltydog iwata eclipse hp-cs hands down. later.

Or better HP-C.

iwata eclipse hp-cs hands down. later.