Maybe this could make the forum a little more clearer

Ninetails,

Thanks for taking the time make a suggestion. We at FSM are always looking for ways to improve the Forum experience and appreciate input from members. I'll pass the suggestion on.

Cheers, Aaron

Aaron Skinner

Ninetails,

Thanks for taking the time make a suggestion. We at FSM are always looking for ways to improve the Forum experience and appreciate input from members. I'll pass the suggestion on.

 

Cheers, Aaron

Awesome!
It's really great to see that your ideas do get picked up by the developers!

Regards Ninetalis.

Just one thought - I rather like having the full active main page without having to dive down into subcategories. It's nice knowing the subcats are there, and posting appropriately, but I don't want to wade through sixteen different categories to follow current and new posts...

Ninetalis

 

Aaron Skinner:

 

Ninetails,

Thanks for taking the time make a suggestion. We at FSM are always looking for ways to improve the Forum experience and appreciate input from members. I'll pass the suggestion on.

 

Cheers, Aaron

 

 

Awesome!
It's really great to see that your ideas do get picked up by the developers!

Regards Ninetalis.

No worries. I don't know exactly what our designers will do with the suggestion, but at least they can take a look at the idea.

Cheers, Aaron

DoogsATX

Just one thought - I rather like having the full active main page without having to dive down into subcategories. It's nice knowing the subcats are there, and posting appropriately, but I don't want to wade through sixteen different categories to follow current and new posts...

AIRCRAFT (like now, each kind of models hads it's own category)
     BUILDS (no subcatories in here, and just all builds)
     COMPLETED BUILDS ( no subs in here either, those without a building topic on this forum)
     QUESTIONS (place to ask questions, share your knowledge, that sort of stuff)
     GROUP BUILDS (and there you could make some sub-categories, but just for each GB and one
                                        for each aircraft in that GB, but that's a MAX)

It's not so hard once you get the hang of it
Because now, If you want to see builds of other people, but you have to move through 7 pages of other stuff before you get to a topic you want... (matter of speaking offcourse)

Regards Ninetalis.

Ninetalis

DoogsATX:

Just one thought - I rather like having the full active main page without having to dive down into subcategories. It's nice knowing the subcats are there, and posting appropriately, but I don't want to wade through sixteen different categories to follow current and new posts...

 

Well, i agree that they shouldn't make it any harder than what I've just drawn right there,
and not make any more categories then neccesary (like WW2 aircraft en interwar) just plain and simple

AIRCRAFT (like now, each kind of models hads it's own category)
     BUILDS (no subcatories in here, and just all builds)
     COMPLETED BUILDS ( no subs in here either, those without a building topic on this forum)
     QUESTIONS (place to ask questions, share your knowledge, that sort of stuff)
     GROUP BUILDS (and there you could make some sub-categories, but just for each GB and one
                                        for each aircraft in that GB, but that's a MAX)

It's not so hard once you get the hang of it
Because now, If you want to see builds of other people, but you have to move through 7 pages of other stuff before you get to a topic you want... (matter of speaking offcourse)

Regards Ninetalis.

I see two problems with the layout that you suggested (not that it does not have merits, but let me focus on the negative first):

#1 If I start construction of an aircraft with a thread in the 'BUILDS' section, do I just end it and post finished pics in the "COMPLETED BUILDS' section - so anyone following along has to go to two different threads to see the whole process.

#2 GROUP BUILDS don't belong as a subcategory. There are too many that include subjects from different genres (see the 'Blitz in the West GB'). Additionally, I don't want to have to search out a bunch of subforums to follow all the GBs I might be interested in.

Don't get me wrong, I like the streamlined, tiered approach. I just think it would need some tweaking.

bbrowniii

#1 If I start construction of an aircraft with a thread in the 'BUILDS' section, do I just end it and post finished pics in the "COMPLETED BUILDS' section - so anyone following along has to go to two different threads to see the whole process.

No, that wrong, When you have started one in builds, you just finish it in that same topic, and it stays in there,
that's what i mean with 'these are builds that don't have a "BUILD" topic on this forum'
(so if you have a build-topic on an other forum but not here (on finescale)
, THEN you put it in "COMPLETED BUILDS"

bbrowniii

#2 GROUP BUILDS don't belong as a subcategory. There are too many that include subjects from different genres (see the 'Blitz in the West GB'). Additionally, I don't want to have to search out a bunch of subforums to follow all the GBs I might be interested in.

I don't know if you got me wrong here to but i mean, you have a list of Group builds,
Let's just say

       - Blitz in the west that is a SUB, when you open it, you get topics,
                               something like this

             GROUP BUILDS  - Blitz in the west -> - Brownie's Dewoitine D. 520
                                                                                  - Ninetalis BF 109 E
                                             - B-17 Group Build -> - Swanny his B-17
                                                                                     - Ninetalis Builds a B-17
                                                                                     - Brownie wants a memphis belle

bbrowniii

Don't get me wrong, I like the streamlined, tiered approach. I just think it would need some tweaking.

bbrowniii

 

 

I see two problems with the layout that you suggested (not that it does not have merits, but let me focus on the negative first):

#1 If I start construction of an aircraft with a thread in the 'BUILDS' section, do I just end it and post finished pics in the "COMPLETED BUILDS' section - so anyone following along has to go to two different threads to see the whole process.

Several other forums have this approach and I HATE it. Why? Because you come across a gorgeous build of something via Google or whatnot, with no way to trace back to the WIP thread. Or vice versa. Annoying.

DoogsATX

1 If I start construction of an aircraft with a thread in the 'BUILDS' section, do I just end it and post finished pics in the "COMPLETED BUILDS' section -

 

Several other forums have this approach and I HATE it. Why? Because you come across a gorgeous build of something via Google or whatnot, with no way to trace back to the WIP thread. Or vice versa. Annoying.

Will you please read my answer on brownie's question/commentairy before you post something like this?
I just said that that is not what i ment, If you build one with a report, you post the finishing pictures in THE SAME TOPIC! (NO NEW TOPIC in the "completed builds")
like this one

If you haven't made a topic , you just make a new topic in "COMPLETED BUILDS" with the result of that finished model!
Like this one

Thanks

I don't wish to sound overly negative, but while it's possible to categorise and sub-categorise everything, it's another to get people to use what is deemed to be the appropriate category for their post. (The old "leading a horse to water" adage comes into play here)

Look at the Community Assistance (aka Forum Help) forum and see what's posted there. We know its purpose is to ask questions regarding forum usage, like how to use "conversations" or how to post photographs. However, its title also simply sounds like a place where people can ask other members for assistance and so it is flooded with modelling related questions - painting, aircraft, decals, cars, ships, spare parts - they're all sitting there in one big jumble. Now these posts come up just like any other post in the "recent topics" list, so they do get answered, but they really should be in the appropriate category shouldn't they?

Ninetalis

bbrowniii:

#1 If I start construction of an aircraft with a thread in the 'BUILDS' section, do I just end it and post finished pics in the "COMPLETED BUILDS' section - so anyone following along has to go to two different threads to see the whole process.

 

No, that wrong, When you have started one in builds, you just finish it in that same topic, and it stays in there,
that's what i mean with 'these are builds that don't have a "BUILD" topic on this forum'
(so if you have a build-topic on an other forum but not here (on finescale)
, THEN you put it in "COMPLETED BUILDS"

bbrowniii:

#2 GROUP BUILDS don't belong as a subcategory. There are too many that include subjects from different genres (see the 'Blitz in the West GB'). Additionally, I don't want to have to search out a bunch of subforums to follow all the GBs I might be interested in.

 

I don't know if you got me wrong here to but i mean, you have a list of Group builds,
Let's just say

       - Blitz in the west that is a SUB, when you open it, you get topics,
                               something like this

             GROUP BUILDS  - Blitz in the west -> - Brownie's Dewoitine D. 520
                                                                                  - Ninetalis BF 109 E
                                             - B-17 Group Build -> - Swanny his B-17
                                                                                     - Ninetalis Builds a B-17
                                                                                     - Brownie wants a memphis belle

bbrowniii:

Don't get me wrong, I like the streamlined, tiered approach. I just think it would need some tweaking.

 

Hey that's okay, when you propose an idea, it is normal to get questions or commentairy,
I'll just keep on trying to explain my idea.

Regards Ninetalis

Hey Ninetalis

Thanks for the quick reply. It may just be that I'm not 'getting' you, but I'm not sure I understand your reply.

So, back to the 'BUILDS' vs 'COMPLETED BUILDS':

As I understand your reply, if I start a build log (in the 'BUILDS' forum - subforum technically), I'd carry that through to completion, right? On the other hand, if I've got a completed build that I never posted anything on, it would go in 'COMPLETED BUILDS'? Is that right?

That seems like it would be confusing to me. Of course, that is not to say that the current system does not have its own layers of confusion, so confusion by itself may not disqualify an idea. I'm just trying to conceptualize how this would look.

Now, as to the GROUP BUILDS. You are right, I did misunderstand what your vision for the thread was. Now that I see, a little more clearly, what you have in mind, let me ask another question/comment:

Might it be a little cumbersome if every GROUP BUILD had a subthread for each participant? I mean, if I want to keep track of a GB, I'd end up clicking on bunched of different threads.

Having said that, I do see some value in the way that would 'streamline' things. One of the difficulties in the way GBs are currently done is that the WIPs often get co-mingled with a whole host ot random comments, so it can be difficult to follow. The one time that problem was 'minimized' was when we did the Marder Madness build and each member simply 'replied' to their initial WIP post, so all of the build was in one place. Wasn't a perfect solution, but it did compartmentalize things nicely.

Hmmmm, I'm going to have to try to thing about the GB idea of yours. There might be something to it....

bbrowniii

if I start a build log (in the 'BUILDS' forum - subforum technically), I'd carry that through to completion, right? On the other hand, if I've got a completed build that I never posted anything on, it would go in 'COMPLETED BUILDS'? Is that right?

Jep, you've got it! that's exactly what i mean!

bbrowniii

edifficulties in the way GBs are currently done is that the WIPs often get co-mingled with a whole host ot random comments, so it can be difficult to follow.

Hmmmm, I'm going to have to try to thing about the GB idea of yours. There might be something to it....

Yeah, I remember getting onto this forum (before i was a member) and i was really like 'omg they have a lot of fun GB's', but then you have a 100 pages of irrelative stuff, i could not even get to page 5 without getting overly bored and annoyed by all the stuff that I didn't even wanted to watch any further...

Regards Ninetalis

Ninetalis

Yeah, I remember getting onto this forum (before i was a member) and i was really like 'omg they have a lot of fun GB's', but then you have a 100 pages of irreletive stuff, i could not even get to page 5 without getting overly bored and annoyed by all the stuff that I didn't even wanted to watch any further...

Regards Ninetalis

I agree. One of the challenges of following (or participating) in a GB is to be able to follow the builds without getting distracted by all the comments and other 'stuff'. It can definately be a challenge and it would be nice if there was some way to streamline things a little bit....

I do like the idea of splitting up the topics a little bit. Like for instance in the airplane category, having a WIP, completed,  "research," question/answer, etc. Not saying to get rid of the page where all posts show up, but mostly to know what category a post will be before opening it. And it's true that people tend to post things in the wrong place sometimes, but I have seen on other forums where the moderator simply moves the thread to the right category. That might be helpful here too. And as far as when you complete a WIP thread, if you wanted too, I don't see why you couldn't post pictures on the WIP thread you have been doing, and a separate thread in the completed section. Some people on here already do that with their group builds.

Oh yeah, and bring back the odds and ends forum!

Just my

bbrowniii

It can definately be a challenge and it would be nice if there was some way to streamline things a little bit....

Okay, to any other modellers reading this
Please READ this topic before asking or commenting on anything we have allready discussed
It is a lot of work to explain everything 5times just because some people don't try to read but just post away,
Keep in mind, I AM FROM BELGUIM and I don't talk english as my native langauge so this isn't as easy for me to explain/defend myself as you guys

If you think this is a good thing, then post something SHORT, just to show the moderators that you are supporting this idea, so that if they will watch this topic (and they will) that maybe, something should be done

YES, we don't want a billion subtopics but they won't do that, so can we get over that?
we have allready pointed that out in our previous comments...

Regards Ninetalis.

Phil_H

I don't wish to sound overly negative, but while it's possible to categorise and sub-categorise everything, it's another to get people to use what is deemed to be the appropriate category for their post. (The old "leading a horse to water" adage comes into play here)

Look at the Community Assistance (aka Forum Help) forum and see what's posted there. We know its purpose is to ask questions regarding forum usage, like how to use "conversations" or how to post photographs. However, its title also simply sounds like a place where people can ask other members for assistance and so it is flooded with modelling related questions - painting, aircraft, decals, cars, ships, spare parts - they're all sitting there in one big jumble. Now these posts come up just like any other post in the "recent topics" list, so they do get answered, but they really should be in the appropriate category shouldn't they?

My sentiments exactly, Phil. To me, this is the main problem with the forum. Don't get me wrong, it's great, but there are areas where there could be more order. Too many sub-catagories, and you get something like what doogsatx mentioned. Actually, google can be fairly good at tracing back to fsm postings, but it's not interior here. Not enough categorization and you have what you mentioned above. perhaps it just comes down to discipline from the poster? I may be missing it, but there is not an adequate "search engine" for past posts.

For instance, I was trying to find a reference to a post on "white washing" aircraft made a few weeks back. I couldn't search it, so I just had to wade back, eventually finding it. Who knows how many excellent posts are "lost in the void" back several years?

Negative, 9T

Used to be this forum was the opposite- everything was layed out on the home page.

I think there are too many sub catties already. I like to look for new stuff mostly, so the more upfront the better for me.

bondoman

Used to be this forum was the opposite- everything was layed out on the home page.

I think there are too many sub catties already. I like to look for new stuff mostly, so the more upfront the better for me.

I think the best solution would be that there are sub catogories,
But also a page where you can watch all the posts on the entire forum posted in chronological way,
(I mean where you can watch the new stuff like you said)

Everybody happy!

Regards Ninetalis.

Seems to me it's a complicated way to fix something that isn't broken.

Electric Blues

Seems to me it's a complicated way to fix something that isn't broken.

Regards Ninetalis.

One mans improvement is another mans hindrance. It's taken me long enough to get used to and kind of learn my way around the "new and improved" forums that were dumped on us with narry a thought.

 I get, and understand what you're saying, but I'd have to lean toward agreeing with most of the replies here. I was on another forum that was dedicated strictly to aircraft......awesome in it's own right! However, it was broken down into so many sub-cats, that it was just too much work to go through. It had kind of a wide open, deserted feel to it. I always found myself coming right back here, one click on "aircraft", and I can see everything that's going on.

I like the forum the way it is at the moment. Its a small yet flourishing community. If you expand the forum, and make it slightly more complex by adding subcategories I think that detracts from the community feel. You'll have fewer people posting on certain topics, and less people viewing models because they have to search for a particular category or overlook categories they don't find interesting. 

I think a general format, like this forum has, also makes it feel fresh and updated. Let me explain...I visit other forums on occasion that break down, for instance, the aircraft forum into several categories. (WWI, WWII, Cold War, Modern, Civilian, etc) It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that certain categories are going to get more play than others, leaving the less popular categories feeling rather stagnant and uninteresting. At least if there is one aircraft section or armor section or whatever, it is constantly changing, new posts will be noticed, and everything has a fair chance to be looked at. 

Just saying...

oddmanrush

 for instance, the aircraft forum into several categories. (WWI, WWII, Cold War, Modern, Civilian, etc) It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that certain categories are going to get more play than others, leaving the less popular categories feeling rather stagnant and uninteresting. At least if there is one aircraft section or armor section or whatever, it is constantly changing, new posts will be noticed, and everything has a fair chance to be looked at. 

I appreciate your support of the forum, but IMHO, I think your proposal just over-complicates things unnecessarily.

I like having the broad subject categories.  The Search function works well here and I've never found it difficult to find whatever I might be looking for within a category.

I also think a simpler forum arrangement is more user-friendly, especially for newbees. 

I frequent other model ship forums that use a similar system to your proposal and find them unnecessarily complicated and difficult to navigate.

Mark

Too complicated.

Too large.

There would be too much time wasted.

I don't want any more "changes" to the forum. The last one was a shock to the system, and took a LOONG time getting used to. There are other forums formatted in this style and I don't use them because I find it clumsy and cumbersome.

KISS-Rule Applies..

Keep It Simple, Stupid...

The biggest problem that I see with the forums is not the way they're laid out, but rather with the members that aren't very good at titling their threads... I HATE thread-titles that are simply " Question" or "Need Help" types... 

If folks would just make their titles CLEAR AND CONCISE, there would be less confusion...

And I still say that the Forum Rules and Guideline should be sticked at the top of EACH forum hooch.. Nobody reads them in their current location, and can't even see them if the don't know about filtering...

Hans von Hammer

And I still say that the Forum Rules and Guideline should be sticked at the top of EACH forum hooch.. Nobody reads them in their current location, and can't even see them if the don't know about filtering... 

THAT is a good idea, Hans. I am sure you've offered that as a suggestion to the mods?

bbrowniii

Hans von Hammer:

And I still say that the Forum Rules and Guideline should be sticked at the top of EACH forum hooch.. Nobody reads them in their current location, and can't even see them if the don't know about filtering... 

 

THAT is a good idea, Hans. I am sure you've offered that as a suggestion to the mods?

Scroll down the Suggestions and Feedback page a bit or click here:..

/forums/t/141386.aspx