Diorama "Ukraine, Summer 1943"

Thanks so much for your kind compliments and support, camaroqb!  It's about time the general public say NO to disgusting & despicable comments made by uneducated bullies around here.

HeavyArty

Yup, great way to get started in a forum where your first two posts blast the members without any knowledge of what has transpired here over the last few years.  Really classy.  Good job.

Gino, not very encouraging words.  Just wondering why some on this forum can say their opinion whilst others cannot.  Frankly these comments destroy rather than allow thev process of friendly discourse.  As for knowledge - Hmmn! history shows me that if we [society] do not learn from it we [society] are doomed to repeat history warts and all.  Regardless of the motives of anyone - collector, modeller and/or show off they should be shown the same respect.  So for me, when one has to resort to one line sarcastic comments tinged with I am bigger than you as I know more, reeks of attacks on the person/individual not the model, or in this case, the diorama.  Moderators, if posters could keep to the task of this forum - dioramas - rather than attacks on individuals I for one could learn a lot more.   Now please, can we talk about the diorama.

My only point is that is a great way to enter a forum.  Try walking into a bar or a party and telling everyone they are all screwed up and see what that gets you.  I have never said anyone can't say what they want here.  The history comment is the history with good ol' MM.  He hasn't changed his ways over the years, probably never will.  If you read the critiques, you will learn a lot, so stick around.

major nuisance

   Now please, can we talk about the diorama.

What is there to talk about?  There is no diorama here.  A diorama should tell a story.  This does not.  Or if it does, that story is so complex as to be unintelligible. 

This is a collection of reasonably well built models placed together on the same base.  The scenery is pretty good, the water is nice.

bbrowniii

major nuisance:

   Now please, can we talk about the diorama.

 

What is there to talk about?  There is no diorama here.  A diorama should tell a story.  This does not.  Or if it does, that story is so complex as to be unintelligible. 

This is a collection of reasonably well built models placed together on the same base.  The scenery is pretty good, the water is nice.

 

Good point. 

I got a bit nosey and checked out a few sites to see what definitions of diorama was out there.  If a person was building a diorama "a la" convention then the following would matter.  Apologies to IPMS USA however there is some very good guidelines there.

IPMS/USA Competition Handbook 2002

http://www.ipmsusa.org/competition_handbook/CompHandbook2002.html

This paragraph would appear to sum up what is the crux of the critique of the Ukraine Diorama and similar Dioramas.

"A diorama is a combination of model(s) and a believable setting that tells a story, sets a mood, or creates a charged atmosphere. In addition to evaluating the modeling of a diorama's individual elements, the judges will consider the strength of the diorama's story line or mood and the overall presentation of the diorama. These three factors are equally important. Dioramas with superbly modeled components but a weak story line and presentation will almost certainly lose to a diorama with well-modeled components and strong story and presentation."

Taking into account the individual elements is equally important eg removing flash, pin marks, and all of the other 101 things to do in construction.  Then of course there is the painting or finishing.

"Model Components: The individual model components of a diorama will be judged according to the criteria specified in the appropriate individual class. That is, armor pieces will be subject to armor judging criteria while figures will be evaluated according to the figure modeling guidelines. As always, the basics of construction and finishing are of prime importance. Terrain, roadwork, buildings, and accessories that set the scene of the diorama will be evaluated similarly to the primary model components. Basic construction and finish are once again paramount."

Check out the IPMS/USA website for additional information.

Now the above is applicable if a person wants to apply or build to convention, or what is the accepted norm in the world of the diorama however the dark side might be that the diorama might be something that brings a person joy in the construction or the viewing that does not fit into this so called convention.  Shep Paine wrote about what might be true in real life does not make sense in the world of the miniature.  Oh well! back to the drawing board.

I trust these notes will uncover where some some of the other posters on this forum are coming from.  I agree that this hobby should be fun and not and many of you learn so much from other postings.  Still, for me, my enjoyment is this - I build for myself and yet that has gained me enough kudos to be commisioned to produce individual items and dioramas for individuals here and overseas including the National Army Musuem and other Military and City Museuems.  As for winning at competitions, I gave that up years ago after winning numerous awards at National and Local levels.  Why am I saying this.  I am prepared to lay my credentials on the line which gives me some understanding of knowing what the hang I am talking about.  I have not stopped learning from others and there is some amazing work on this and other sites that puts my own work to shame.

Me thinks about myself "Enough of this pratting on and ego puffing stance"

Power to your paint brush

I like the diorama.  MM likes what he made and wanted to share.  Good on him.  Also, I see nothing wrong with the constructive criticism as many of you have pointed out a few things on my builds that helped raise my game.  But I find it counterproductive when some choose to go down the cut-down route.  I am glad MM has thick skin.

hutchdh

I like the diorama.  MM likes what he made and wanted to share.  Good on him.  Also, I see nothing wrong with the constructive criticism as many of you have pointed out a few things on my builds that helped raise my game.  But I find it counterproductive when some choose to go down the cut-down route.  I am glad MM has thick skin.

Model Maniac is a good example of how to soldier on under fire. He is satisfied with his collection of models and that is important.

Anyone who cannot admit to or point out a flaw or two in their own work lies or is delusional. From now on I will point out 10 flaws in my own builds on the rare occasion I get one completed in the 'GB&U' format.

MM likes what he made and wanted to share.  Good on him. 

No, all "his models"  are built by others and he simply collects them.  He hasn't built any of them.  It would be the same as someone buying a diecast toy and posting it looking for kudos of how good it looks.

His statement from another post sums up his take on it:

For me, these military models - Land, Air and Sea - are just toys for my collection. 

HeavyArty

 

MM likes what he made and wanted to share.  Good on him. 

 

No, all "his models"  are built by others and he simply collects them.  He hasn't built any of them.  It would be the same as someone buying a diecast toy and posting it looking for kudos of how good it looks.

His statement from another post sums up his take on it:

 

For me, these military models - Land, Air and Sea - are just toys for my collection. 

 

Oh.......now I see where you are coming from.  I guess I missed that subtle point. My bad.

One more point, to be clear.  I see nothing overly wrong with MM's approach.  He is open about his approach and this is the way he enjoys the hobby, so I can't be too critical. 

hutchdh

One more point, to be clear.  I see nothing overly wrong with MM's approach.  He is open about his approach and this is the way he enjoys the hobby, so I can't be too critical. 

Hi Hutch,

The only problem with MM's approach is that when he posts his er,... items, he only acknowledges the "attaboys" and usually completely ignores the constructive comments and suggestions offered in good faith.

For example, If you look at almost any tank/armour build by "Art Instructor", you will see that the roadwheel tyres are perfect black every time, despite the rest of the vehicle being heavily weathered. This has beem mentioned in replies to MM many, many times over the past several years, but it never gets back to his builder.

Ok, if he likes it that way then fine, but if one asks for comments, one should be prepared to accept all comments, not just the "attabloys". And THAT is the root of all the negativity that MM's posts incite.

Phil_H

 

hutchdh:

 

One more point, to be clear.  I see nothing overly wrong with MM's approach.  He is open about his approach and this is the way he enjoys the hobby, so I can't be too critical. 

 

 

Hi Hutch,

The only problem with MM's approach is that when he posts his er,... items, he only acknowledges the "attaboys" and usually completely ignores the constructive comments and suggestions offered in good faith.

For example, If you look at almost any tank/armour build by "Art Instructor", you will see that the roadwheel tyres are perfect black every time, despite the rest of the vehicle being heavily weathered. This has beem mentioned in replies to MM many, many times over the past several years, but it never gets back to his builder.

Ok, if he likes it that way then fine, but if one asks for comments, one should be prepared to accept all comments, not just the "attabloys". And THAT is the root of all the negativity that MM's posts incite.

Fair enough....I think that is a reasonable expectation for all of us that post. 

FineScale Modeler

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major nuisance, hutchch and SuppressionFire, thanks so much for your kind comments and support! I really appreciate them!

My modeler "Art Instructor" not only build very good armors and dio's, he also built them fast - much faster than most modelers anywhere in the world. In just over two weeks he's churned out 7 more pieces of armors and diorama (2 Talon robots count as only 1). And believe me, they're his labor of love!

Model Maniac

major nuisance, hutchch and SuppressionFire, thanks so much for your kind comments and support! I really appreciate them!

My modeler "Art Instructor" not only build very good armors and dio's, he also built them fast - much faster than most modelers anywhere in the world. In just over two weeks he's churned out 7 more pieces of armors and diorama (2 Talon robots count as only 1). And believe me, they're his labor of love!

churn  (chûrn) n. A vessel or device in which cream or milk is agitated to separate the oily globules from the caseous and serous parts, used to make butter. v. churned, churn·ing, churns v.tr. 1. a. To agitate or stir (milk or cream) in order to make butter. b. To make by the agitation of milk or cream: churn butter. 2. To shake or agitate vigorously: wind churning up the piles of leaves. See Synonyms at agitate. 3. To buy and sell (a client's securities) frequently, especially in order to generate commissions. v.intr. 1. To make butter by operating a device that agitates cream or milk. 2. To move with or produce great agitation: waves churning in the storm; so angry it made my stomach churn. Phrasal Verb: churn out To produce in an abundant and automatic manner: churns out four novels a year. [Middle English chirne, from Old English cyrn, cyrin.] churner n.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

churn out

Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003

That definition pretty much sums up the whole process. Maybe if you would slow him down a bit there wouldn't be so much negative criticism.  Food for thought.