gregbale

Can't say as to the modeling world, but in the "rat rod" world of DIY car customization going back to the '40s and '50s, flat black was common from the get-go. Probably partly for the 'outlaw' look...and probably because a lot of them never progressed paint-wise past the black primer stage.

Didn't know that, and find it really interesting. More evidence that maybe it's true that there aren't any (many) truly 'new' ideas anymore.

Greg

Last time I was visiting Orange County one of my young relative-in-laws was painting his car flat black. He builds Gundam models. You just got me wondering, maybe black-basing is where the newish trend of painting cars in flat black came from?!?! Surprise Smile

Can't say as to the modeling world, but in the "rat rod" world of DIY car customization going back to the '40s and '50s, flat black was common from the get-go. Probably partly for the 'outlaw' look...and probably because a lot of them never progressed paint-wise past the black primer stage.

wpwar11

The Doogs Models site says an advantage of black basing is your project looks bad ass under black primer.  That plane looks really cool under the black.  Good luck with the technique.  Looking forward to the seeing the result.

 

Thanks for your encouragement. I'm procrasitinating out of fear my paint work might not be perfect, (and being the first time) which I always do. Need to go dive into it!

I recall Doog saying that in one of his videos, now that you mention it.

Last time I was visiting Orange County one of my young relative-in-laws was painting his car flat black. He builds Gundam models. You just got me wondering, maybe black-basing is where the newish trend of painting cars in flat black came from?!?!

The Doogs Models site says an advantage of black basing is your project looks bad ass under black primer.  That plane looks really cool under the black.  Good luck with the technique.  Looking forward to the seeing the result.

Greg

gregbale Great idea on the putty 'jig'. I've tried the same thing with those peel-off glue-dots...but your way looks better! I hesitated to post those repair shots, you just made it worth it.

Never hesitate to post hints, tips or technique my friend.

It's up to us wiley veterans to show the young whippersnappers how it's done....

gregbale

Usually the only time I get the "Gregory" is when I'm in trouble....

Oh boy does that hit home. The only people I recall calling me "Gregory" were Mom and Dad and my dear freind, pilot mentor, and former occasional FAA designated check pilot who are all gone now. Now that you mention it, I miss it so enjoy it. Even if it is your domestic superior and you are in trouble.

gregbale

 

 

Greg

Well Gregory, as you follow along if you end up buying one then that will have been an accomplishment for me.

 

 

Had me going for a minute there.

Usually the only time I get the "Gregory" is when I'm in trouble....

Great build, really enjoying it!

BTW, you're not alone in occasionally snipping off important bits that look like sprues! If I had the proverbial nickel.... (It's particularly easy to do with 1/700 ships...and any Eastern-European manufactured kit!)

Great idea on the putty 'jig'. I've tried the same thing with those peel-off glue-dots...but your way looks better!

 

That makes me feel better, thank you.

gregbale

Great idea on the putty 'jig'. I've tried the same thing with those peel-off glue-dots...but your way looks better!

I hesitated to post those repair shots, you just made it worth it.

Greg

Well Gregory, as you follow along if you end up buying one then that will have been an accomplishment for me.

Had me going for a minute there.

Usually the only time I get the "Gregory" is when I'm in trouble....

Great build, really enjoying it!

BTW, you're not alone in occasionally snipping off important bits that look like sprues! If I had the proverbial nickel.... (It's particularly easy to do with 1/700 ships...and any Eastern-European manufactured kit!)

Great idea on the putty 'jig'. I've tried the same thing with those peel-off glue-dots...but your way looks better!

The ailerons and flaps are two pieces each, and all 8 parts have at least one locating nub. I was happily cutting them from the sprues a few weeks back when I realized I had mistaken the locating nubs for injection points and cut them off.

Evidenced below; part 12 is where I nipped off the locating nubs. Part 11 is how it should have been

I came close to doing this a few times on this kit, so if you are new to ZM as I am, use caution as there are other instances of this.

I used the same idea to repair.

Amazingly, it worked. Everything lined up.

Again, for anyone interested in building one of the ZM Phantom series, if posing the controls surfaces other than neutral, these nubs are supposed to be cut off anyway. I wanted to pose the surfaces down, and wish I would have now, but that's another story.

Now, I should get off my rump and go paint something or other.

While I drink coffee and wake up, thought I'd share a couple of poster tac jig repairs from the past couple of weeks.

I've discovered poster tac (or BluTac depending on where we live) used with a sub-surface like a self-healing cutting board to be more useful than just masking camo. This is probably old news to most of you, but it was a big deal to me so I thought I'd share.

First one: This is a little bulkhead inside the nose gear bay that supports the actuator arm that opens and closes the side-facing nose gear door.

I was not paying attention and even the miniature side cutting Tamiya sprue nippers were too aggresive and broke the part.

This is the Rube-Goldberg jig I made to glue the fiddly parts together.

The break was just below the larger diameter of the arm. After everything was in position and Tamiya Extra Thin was brushed on the join, I applied a little 'press together' pressure on the poster tac until I saw the join bulge slightly with molten styrene. You can see my thumbnail impressions from that part of it.

The join was surprisingly strong. I proceeded to break it again not long after gluing in the part, though. Unbelievably was able to find it and it will now be a finishing touch/repair when I add the gear door down the road.

Looking great greg!  Seem work looks solid.  Can't wait for the color coats.  Btw,  what markings are you doing?

Tojo72

Very nice Greg,I had not checked in since you finished the cockpit

 

That's understandable, Tojo, becuase I'm so doggone SLOW.

Thanks for not giving up on me.

DRUMS01

Greg, that looks like a really nice kit, and your modeling skills make it look even better. 

I really like that primers satin and smooth finish. 

Keep bringin it!

 

Ben

 

Thanks, Ben! It's nice to have you along and I appreciate your encouragment.

mustang1989

Wow!!! That stuff does lay down smoothly.

 

Joe found the thread yet again! Yeh!!!

gregbale

It's been a long and adventurous slog...but she's looking magnificent. You have single-handedly made me hungry for one of these kits...the moreso, since I've got the old Monogram version 'stalled' under my desk with not even the cockpit finished up yet!

 

Well Gregory, as you follow along if you end up buying one then that will have been an accomplishment for me.

Thanks for your kind words, encouragement, and your patience.

mrmike

Great to see you at the priming stage - I've been enjoying your progress. You deserve kudos for persistence and for sharing the ups and downs of the build with us. Looking forward to your next post!

 

It's good to have you, Mike. Thanks for being here.

Since you mentioned interest in the ups and downs, I might just share my control surface boo boo and recovery from some weeks ago later.

crown r n7

Looks real good. I like the black baseing and you will do fine.

 

Thanks, Nick. Again, thanks for following along.

patrick206

I sense some increased modeling spirit from you, the quality of this ZM kit might have sparked more enjoyment and interest in the process, yes??? Not many kits do keep us motivated so well.

Your Spidey senses are working, Cap'n Patrick. The good quality of this kit is making it a more fun build so far.

You're welcome, and thank you for hanging in there with me as I progress at my usual snail's pace.

JOE RIX

Magnificent progress Greg. Good to see you moving along. The primer coats do indeed look excellent. I am intrigued to see how your priming technique turns out. It should work out quite well. It appears to me that you are having a good bit of fun with such a nice kit. Looking forward to your painting update. You're doing terrific. Keep it coming my friend.

 

Thanks for your encouragement, Joe. I am having fun, you're right.

Greg, that looks like a really nice kit, and your modeling skills make it look even better. 

I really like that primers satin and smooth finish. 

Keep bringin it!

Ben

Wow!!! That stuff does lay down smoothly.

It's been a long and adventurous slog...but she's looking magnificent. You have single-handedly made me hungry for one of these kits...the moreso, since I've got the old Monogram version 'stalled' under my desk with not even the cockpit finished up yet!

Great to see you at the priming stage - I've been enjoying your progress. You deserve kudos for persistence and for sharing the ups and downs of the build with us. Looking forward to your next post!

Looks real good. I like the black baseing and you will do fine.

Greg - Seriously a great build, your work is impressive. The fine details of the kit really do show up well, this will be one to watch throughout the project.

I sense some increased modeling spirit from you, the quality of this ZM kit might have sparked more enjoyment and interest in the process, yes??? Not many kits do keep us motivated so well.

Thanks for the detailed posts and photos.

Patrick

Magnificent progress Greg. Good to see you moving along. The primer coats do indeed look excellent. I am intrigued to see how your priming technique turns out. It should work out quite well. It appears to me that you are having a good bit of fun with such a nice kit. Looking forward to your painting update. You're doing terrific. Keep it coming my friend.

So I got the Phantom primed. This will be my first go at black-basing, so wish me luck. Top is Stynylrez black (regular, not gloss) and bottom is Stynylrez grey which I am going to try the same techique as the light gull grey over black base, except insignia white over grey on the bottom.

I gotta hand it to Zukei Mura, this is the first prime job I've ever done where everything looks better after the primer. There are virtually no flaws. No putty. A couple of minor fills due to modeler error.

I forgot to finish sand the wing leading edges, I think I need to touch up the right leading edge flap a little, and maybe touch up around where I made a mess of installing the Master metal pitot tubes on the tail. Or not.

For some reason, this is the most fun I've had yet doing a prime job. The primer laid down so well, dried to a perfect smooth satin finish and all the ZM detail just popped.

mustang1989

I've gotta say that I really like how that Vallejo Metal Color turned out. Very convincing. I may have to pick some of this stuff up. 

Good save with the engines Greg.

 

Thanks, Joe. Sorry I'm so late replying, senior moments are becoming more frequent.

BTW, the Vallejo Metal Color not only looks good, it sprays like a dream IMO. Dries fast and is durable, too.

I've gotta say that I really like how that Vallejo Metal Color turned out. Very convincing. I may have to pick some of this stuff up. 

Good save with the engines Greg.

willuride

I'm thinking of doing a WIP with what I have left of it.

You should!

willuride

Also, I am going to try and get more involved on here.

That would be great!

I'm thinking of doing a WIP with what I have left of it.  I have to get it to where I am first.  I will have it by the first of September.  Also, I am going to try and get more involved on here.

willuride

I just saw this WIP thread.  I want a few of those kits but mama gets a little red faced if I get too much. 

I hear that, brother.

Just looked up the Monogram Black Bunny kit. Love the paint scheme. That would be a fun kit to have for the box art alone. Sure like to see it when you're done, or before.

Thanks for your kind words, and it's nice to have you following along. Haven't seen you around much, it's really just nice to see you, period.

JOE RIX

Gee, I'm a bit late to the engine party. Bravo Greg on your ingenious and effective recovery on the engine painting issue.

Better than being late to your own funeral, which my dad always said I would be.

Not sure how ingenious it was, but I sure do appreciate your encouragement and kind words Joe.

JOE RIX

It all looks to have come out in the wash.

The irony here is with all that engine detail, I keep wondering how a quick slop wash might look. But alas, I am hoping to get the fuselage attached to the belly and wings today, so I'd best keep moving forward.

lawdog114

Looking great Greg

 

Thanks Joe. I was catching up on your P-51 thread a bit ago and it occured to me that all these years and looking at your cockpits never gets old.

crown r n7

Greg. Those engines look great . I like the Vallejo metal paints too, I thin them a bit more for me that is. But over all 

 

 

Thanks, Nick.

I wish I'd have tried the Vallejo Metal Colors sooner. I remember watching the guy demoing them at the show, and me thinking "It can't be that easy". It appears that it is.

goldhammer

Saw the Angels at the Reno airshow in '70, and the T'birds in '73 at Beale, and again in '75 at Shaw.

The first 2 were in Phantoms, the last after they transitioned out of double ugly.

She's coming along fine.  Hope other versions come out soon.  Will keep an eye out for the early "E".

 

You guys who got to see these fly are sure lucky.

Seems to be alot of fans of the E version here waiting for it's release from ZM. Y'all have me interested.

Rob Beach

Greg, I had forgotten about the 'sprue display stand' in the kit, but reminded of that, I'm sure that gave me the idea!  I cannot recall what the sprue cost, but I seem to remember ordering from the Volks-USA website.  Side benefit (besides getting *two* engines on the tree...) is the landing gear - wheels and all - are also on the sprue so can help spruce up another F-4 model.

I love spare parts!

;^)

Regards, Robert

 

That's a neat idea using the extra landing gear with all that detail on some other Phantom. I like spares too. Unfortunately, I'm one of those who has a hard time throwing stuff out, so keeping spare parts is sort of a natural thing. My better-looking half doesn't seem to think it's so natural, though.

knox

I am also building this model, but I got side tracked with some Titan models for a GW game.  Love your work, and I’m enjoying following along. 

 

I remembered somebody else had started another ZM Phantom. Now I remember!

I'm happy to have you and thank you for your encouragement.

Real G

Yep, saw the Blue Angels in 1970 - I was in kindergarten! I can no longer remember a lot of stuff from back then, but those F-4s stuck in my memory.

Wow, it's neat that you remember seeing them. The things we do and don't remember from childhood is interesting.

Real G

Revell did a Blue Angels four ship formation kit with stand in 1/72, as well as the Thunderbirds counterpart. A friend had the Blues and I had the Thunderbirds. Ah those were the days.

They were indeed. But isn't it just great that some of us are lucky enough to have rediscovered a childhood hobby (and the select few of you who never stopped building at all)? I recall mentioning to my older sister several years back that I had taken up building models again. She said "Oh, you used to sit in the basement and work on them for hours and hours on end".

I just saw this WIP thread.  I want a few of those kits but mama gets a little red faced if I get too much.  You should see my closet.  Anyway, great job on the plane.  I'm working on the Monogram Black Bunny plane from the 80's and it has nowhere near the detail that kit has.  I did not spend as much time as you did on the cockpit as Monogram's is sparse with detail.  I will be using some of your techniques you shared on my Academy kits though.  Great job so far!!  I can't wait to see it finished.

Gee, I'm a bit late to the engine party. Bravo Greg on your ingenious and effective recovery on the engine painting issue. It all looks to have come out in the wash. Well done my friend.

Looking great Greg

Greg. Those engines look great . I like the Vallejo metal paints too, I thin them a bit more for me that is. But over all 

Saw the Angels at the Reno airshow in '70, and the T'birds in '73 at Beale, and again in '75 at Shaw.

The first 2 were in Phantoms, the last after they transitioned out of double ugly.

She's coming along fine.  Hope other versions come out soon.  Will keep an eye out for the early "E".

Greg, I had forgotten about the 'sprue display stand' in the kit, but reminded of that, I'm sure that gave me the idea!  I cannot recall what the sprue cost, but I seem to remember ordering from the Volks-USA website.  Side benefit (besides getting *two* engines on the tree...) is the landing gear - wheels and all - are also on the sprue so can help spruce up another F-4 model.

I love spare parts!

;^)

Regards, Robert

I am also building this model, but I got side tracked with some Titan models for a GW game.  Love your work, and I’m enjoying following along. 

Greg,

Yep, saw the Blue Angels in 1970 - I was in kindergarten!  I can no longer remember a lot of stuff from back then, but those F-4s stuck in my memory.

Revell did a Blue Angels four ship formation kit with stand in 1/72, as well as the Thunderbirds counterpart.  A friend had the Blues and I had the Thunderbirds.  Ah those were the days.

Thanks for sticking with me, John.

And you too, G. I hope this long-nosed version meets all y'alls expectations when it comes out. I'm looking forward to learning more about the various Phantom versions. It is neat you got to see the Blue Angels flying them. Really cool. It looks like they flew them '69-'74, my high school years.

Robert, that's sure a great idea on the extra engine. You may recall that ZM includes some moldings on the sprue itself to cut out and make a display (or maintenence stand). I sort of scratched my head at that since the engines need to be installed to properly locate the exhaust nozzles among other things.

Volks USA is the distributor of ZM over here. I met some folks from there at the Nats some years ago, really nice people. Maybe they'd be able to help with the extra sprue if anyone wanted to 'borrow' your idea.

Thanks for adding to the discussion.

Hey, everyone.

Aside thought on the engines.  Because they are really nice, I wanted to display one outside the model.  Unfortunately, that would of course leave a big empty hole in the model.  So, I reached out to the ZM-USA folks and was able to purchase the sprue with the engine parts (they are all on the one sprue) and bob's yer uncle, my dream is now possible...

One aspect of modeling for me is appreciation for the technology of the original machines.  For aircraft, the powerplants are a huge part of the story (and often the source of the success or failure of said machines) so it is nice when you can display some of that with the models.  It provides a nice illustration when a scale figure is placed next to one of these engines, really highlighting the size if nothing else.

Anyway, just a quick share and congrats Greg on your progress!

Regards, Robert

That’s coming along nicely Greg!  The Phantom was the biggest, baddest jet fighter around when I was a kid.  I saw the Blue Angels fly them, and though they basically just flew around in a diamond formation, the thunder of those J-79 engines seemed like their very sound could crush you!

I’m another guy waiting for the long nosed USAF F-4E to come out.  According to ZM’s website, the “early” version is due out at the end of the month.  That’s the Viet Nam version with the short gun fairing and unslatted wings, which is the one I want.

Keep up the good work!  

Those engines are cool!  Looking good Greg 

Hey, thanks, Ernie! We just cross-posted.

Well, turns out I should have listened to TB. He told me to paint those GE engines!

So here's one of those failures to plan ahead. After I glued on the engines, I realized there are two ports under both of them that will have little doors open down the road. As you can see, I had sprayed one a half-hearted gunmetal, and the other nothing....

This would drive me pretty much batty, and removing the engines is not an option because per ZM's sound advice, these don't want to move or break free down the road. So instead of fussing for my usual month, I masked them off ...

And got in there the best I could. I used some of the newer Vallejo Metal Color in the bigger bottle for the first time....

Better, I can live with it even though it's half-baked.

BTW, the Vallejo Metal Color is really neat. I watched some guy from Vallejo spraying it on at the nats in Ohio some years back, always wanted to try the stuff. Since I had it out I hit the engines with some on the accessible side to see how it looked....

The top half of the engines is the new Vallejo Metal Color. The bottom half is the old Vallejo Model Air color Gunmetal 71.072 I think maybe it is. The new stuff is surprisingly better at detail enhancement, finish, and color. It also dried very quickly as advertised.

Anyway, next time maybe I'll listen, TB.

She is looking Phantastic Greg!

Joe! (Mustang)....so glad you found the thread, and thanks for stopping by. It would be nice to have you along for sure.

Johnny, I'm sure glad to have you too, and glad you found the thread. Thanks!

Nathan T

Nice tidy work Greg! Now that ZM is finally coming out with the long nose versions I can stop building the out dated Hasegawa kits, as the long nose Phantoms tend to be my favorite. 

 

FOUND IT!!! This is looking great so far Greg!!! ZM does have a habit of a complete engine build up that is usually hidden. But aint it fun to build this stuff?? I'll be looking for a ZM Ho-229 in 1/48 scale pretty soon. 

Looking forward to more of this beauty buddy.

Thank you, Nathan! I always enjoy hearing from you.

I'm glad ZM is releasing the style Phantom you like. Being a newbie, I'm just learning what a Phantom looks like, not sophisticated enough yet to differentiate between models.

Nice tidy work Greg! Now that ZM is finally coming out with the long nose versions I can stop building the out dated Hasegawa kits, as the long nose Phantoms tend to be my favorite. 

Thank you, Joe.

Coming along nice Greg. 

I hear you, TB. Details are fun and if you enjoy it, it's great to spend plenty of time on them.

I feel I need to move forward on this one to keep me motivated, otherwise I'd be doing more. That said, that assy with the intakes and engines is not glued down yet, and until I do I still have time to play with the engines if I so choose.

Thanks John. Interested to know more about the Hasegawa. Being my first Phantom, I have no point of reference.

looking good greg.  That engine / intake detail is cool!  I can tell you the hasegawa kits have no such thing.  

No, You Don't! Greg !

      The first four or five hours of an Automobile Build for me is the dashboard and interior so you can NEVER really spend too much time on the details. It took over nine weeks for me to do the Tamiya M.E.262 Clear version. Never had so much fun building an airplane. Can you say even the fuel tanks?

     That's why I like anything to do with 1/48 armor with full interiors( can anybody say Old 70s-80s Bandaii?)I did a Tammy M113 before P.E. became the norm. Took me 11 weeks. My Hassy ships take way longer. I stretch the time so I get super entertainment from the bucks I spend. I guess that's why I like Scratching Tankers and modifying Lindberg Kits.

      I have my own Trumpy 1/200 Arizona. it's now been three years off and on and I haven't even put the full deck on yet! Details to me are fun. That's where the models then POP ! And remember even in 1/700( the Buchanon) I do full wheel house detail!

Thanks for hanging in with, wpwar. Good to have you here. I instinctively wanted to paint that engine up , but I'll be lucky to finish this thing by fall as it is!

Thanks chemteacher for your kind words. The phantom is quickly becoming a new favorite of mine too. It seems several folk here feel that way, even (lawdog) Joe who otherwise doesn't much care for jets.

The engine detail on that thing is great.  You know it’s there and now we know it’s there.  

Glad you are enjoying the build.  Keep the pictures coming.  I’m enjoying following along.

hogfanfs

Looking great, Greg! It is a shame to close in all that detail on the engines. And I did get one, the S. Seems you are a bad/good influence! lol

 

Thanks, Bruce. Good for you, I hope you share your S model build.

I'm going to consider being a bad influence on you a compliment in this case.

crown r n7

Looking good Greg. I finally got my F4-C been watching this taking notes. I need to wrap up the f-15 1st.

 

Thanks, Nick. I'll be looking forward to your F4-C.

bvallot

Very cool Greg!! I can't wait to get my hands on one of those. =]

 

Thanks for hanging in there with me, Britt. I'm sure you'd do one justice!

Looking great, Greg! It is a shame to close in all that detail on the engines. And I did get one, the S. Seems you are a bad/good influence! lol

Looking good Greg. I finally got my F4-C been watching this taking notes. I need to wrap up the f-15 1st.

Very cool Greg!! I can't wait to get my hands on one of those. =]

Oops, lost the second pic, no way I'm going to try to edit the above the way the the forum is behaving!

Here it is, late and out of sequence....sorry.

Thought I'd share the great detail on this GE engine half that soon will never be seen again.....

Even though the engine detail will be lost, it has been fun to learn how the intakes, engines and exhausts are configured in the Phantom. (My first one, as a reminder) As you can see, I'm sort of using the engines to play with some various paints and stuff. (please refer to the next reply below, that pic should be here)

I've been fussing about the fit of the intake covers and those separator plates which I don't even understand. They are shown just dry-fitted. They just seem to fall into place. The fit of this Zukei Mura kit so far is great. At this point, I gotta figure if something doesn't fit it must be my fault.

Soon as some glue dries, the intake covers and plates will be checked one last time for fit over the intake channels, then I think I can move forward with more assy.

Hey Britt! It's great to have you, thanks for being here.

This is my first modern fighter in decades, and I hear you regarding the intimidation I was and still am intimidated by it. Working at my own pace and having all the great support here hopefully will get me though.

And thanks for your kind works on the ejection seat pull handles.

Greg, I meant to reply to this post a while back when you started it and evidently didn't. I like how you tackled painting the ejection seat grips. Very clever! Your cockpit is very sharp as well. Very clean. I really like it. You'll have my attention for sure on this build. I have one on my list to do soon. A friend of mine flew the F4-E back in the 80s. I've been waiting to improve enough to make a really polished Phantom before getting started, so I keep bumping it. 

Carry on. Looking forward to whatever treats you bring out next. =]

Thanks, Bruce. Go for it! So far, I'm finding the fit and detail really good. Hopefully will know more soon.

Thanks for your kind words, Joe.

Incidentally, the difficult to find Eduard fabric seatbelt/PE kit for 1/48th Phantom arrived in very short order from Scalehobbyist. I've had good luck with them, thanks to whomever suggested them years back.

I'm stuggling to find a seat cover color I like in my way-too-much paint inventory. Isn't it funny how that happens?!?!?

That cockpit looks superb Greg. 

Greg,

The office looks amazing! I really want to get one of these kits now! lol

Thanks for the feedback on the cloth belts, Ernie.

I've seen well done resin seats that have been washed, they do look good.

Greg

 

 

plasticjunkie

I love the details of the resin seats IMO much better than pe.

 

 

 

 

I'm mezmorised by the level of detail on resin seats, Ernie. Would you believe I've yet to do one? I think I'm intimidated by the painting.

 

But I've fallen out of love with PE seatbelts so maybe I'll get to the Mig with the nice resin seat one of these days. Ever tried one of the cloth seatbelts kits? I've no idea what I'm getting myself into here.

 

Yes I have tried the cloth type belts and they look good. The trick is to drape them so it looks natural. 

The details on the resin seats are unbeatly realistic and quite easy to paint. Throw some washes on and you're done.

Tojo72

One small step for man, something like that, really worth the effort, looks great.

 

Hey Tojo, what a nice and positive way to excuse my procrastination and laziness! You da man!

crown r n7

Greg I managed to catch up on your F4 stunning detail work !!!

I've been busy with some other new stuff on some builds

 

 

Thanks Nick! Appreciate your kind words.

Glad you are busy, that's almost always a good thing

goldhammer

Nice looking pit. Will be watching, looked at this one when it came out, but more familiar with the D,E, and RF4C.  Might have to add her in if the rest is as good.

 

Couple of months late, but take a set of small needle files to the metal struts and see if they clean up enough to work for you

 

Thanks Goldhammer. I'll try to move along best I can while your interest is still piqued.

I think my small needle file set and some patience will be what the doctor ordered regarding the struts, I agree.

JOE RIX

Stellar work on the office my friend. Very nice detail painting. Good to see you at it again and looking forward to some additional progress. 

 

Thanks, Joe!

I'm looking forward to some progress, too.

keavdog

Sure looks good Greg.  Nice work.

 

Thanks, John. I'm sure glad to have you following along.

plasticjunkie

I love the details of the resin seats IMO much better than pe.

 

But I've fallen out of love with PE seatbelts so maybe I'll get to the Mig with the nice resin seat one of these days. Ever tried one of the cloth seatbelts kits? I've no idea what I'm getting myself into here.

Greg I managed to catch up on your F4 stunning detail work !!!

I've been busy with some other new stuff on some builds

Nice looking pit. Will be watching, looked at this one when it came out, but more familiar with the D,E, and RF4C.  Might have to add her in if the rest is as good.

Couple of months late, but take a set of small needle files to the metal struts and see if they clean up enough to work for you

Stellar work on the office my friend. Very nice detail painting. Good to see you at it again and looking forward to some additional progress. 

Sure looks good Greg.  Nice work.

Greg

 

Actually, I now realize this kit deserves resin seats.

 

I love the details of the resin seats IMO much better than pe.

Thanks Ernie!

No, they are the kit seats.

I recently found an Eduard generic F4 cloth seatbelt set (out of production) and have it on order. Hoping that will dress the kit seats up adequately.

Actually, I now realize this kit deserves resin seats.

Great looking office Greg. Are the seats resin?

By the way, Jeaton and Snapdragon,

I keep forgetting to pass along that I recieved my Aizo masking tape along with a nice personal note from John at Model Paint Solutions, where I ended up ordering from.

Good stuff, thanks again!

Gosh Joe, I would have swore I responded. Sorry! Thanks for checking in, I sure appreciate it.

I think the cockpit is about ready (finally, I know) and I thought I'd post a few proof of progress pics.

And a dry fit before closing her up. I guess the seats drop in later, which is great because they are not done anyway.

As a reminder, this is my first Zoukei-Mura kit. I know I'm not very far into it, but I hope the fit of the cockpit is an indicator of things to come, because everything fit very well.

Sorry I missed this Greg.  Stellar work.  The F-4 is one of the few jets I would build.  I have the Academy Olds version in the stash for the right time.

RadMax8

Believe it or not I joined this forum when I was in High School. Yep, I was definitely one of the cool kids

Good for you for joining here whilst in high school, I think that's pretty darned cool.

The graphic quality of the PE is a bit of a conundrum. From normal viewing distance by a person with decent eyes, they look pretty convincing I suppose.

Thanks again for adding to the discussion.

Greg, I might have been here a long time but that just means I've collected a lot of dust haha!

Believe it or not I joined this forum when I was in High School. Yep, I was definitely one of the cool kids

I have a hard time getting on board with some of the pre-printed PE stuff... the colors oftentimes look off to me and the resolution seems a bit dodgey. I used a 1/24 Eduard racing seatbelt for a car I built, and I bought ribbon to use for belts the next time I was at the craft store.

Your update looks good, glad to see progress!

Stay well, my friend. 

wpwar11

Nice Job.  I think I saw this technique here or somewhere else and thanks for going through the process again.  You mentioned you are a slow builder. I don’t build them very fast either.  This kit would probably take me 3-4 months.  Just curious how long a more experienced modeler like yourself would take on this project.  

Cheers and good luck. 

 

Thanks for your kind words, wpwar.

If you can hang in there, you'll find out what slow means.

jeaton01

Aizu Tape

https://modelpaintsol.com/model-paint/aizu-project-micron-masking-tape

 

Thank you, John.

I just ordered their handy combo pack which should be perfect for me.

And thank you again Snapdragon, as well.

Gamera

Hmmm, white metal/pewter generally holds detail really well.

It just occurred to me that it might look completely different after being cleaned up, primed and painted. We shall see. The good news is I did a test fit of the nose gear and it seems to be perfect.

Gamera

But as the guys said it's probably better for more support than detailing. The only time I've used them was on a 1/72nd Minicraft B-29 which I was really afraid would collapse from the weight of the model and the ballast in the nose to keep if from tipping over.

Thanks for your input, Cliff.

JOE RIX

Excellent work on your cockpit Greg. The PE work looks all the part. Nicely done.

I also use a piece of poster tack on a toothpick to hold and place parts. Works well. I'm going to get me some of those Tamiya PE scissors. Per your suggestion, it seems they would be right handy.

Good to see an update from you.

 

Thanks Joe!

Before you order, I goofed. My PE scissors are the Zuron ones, not the Tamiya. I looked at the Tamiya, they might even be better but I don't know.

Nice Job.  I think I saw this technique here or somewhere else and thanks for going through the process again.  You mentioned you are a slow builder. I don’t build them very fast either.  This kit would probably take me 3-4 months.  Just curious how long a more experienced modeler like yourself would take on this project.  

Cheers and good luck. 

Hmmm, white metal/pewter generally holds detail really well. 

But as the guys said it's probably better for more support than detailing. The only time I've used them was on a 1/72nd Minicraft B-29 which I was really afraid would collapse from the weight of the model and the ballast in the nose to keep if from tipping over.  

Aizu Tape

https://modelpaintsol.com/model-paint/aizu-project-micron-masking-tape

Excellent work on your cockpit Greg. The PE work looks all the part. Nicely done.

I also use a piece of poster tack on a toothpick to hold and place parts. Works well. I'm going to get me some of those Tamiya PE scissors. Per your suggestion, it seems they would be right handy.

Good to see an update from you.

jeaton01

Your work looks real nice, Greg.  I'll second the recommendation on the Aizu tape.  I've been using it for a number of months and really like it.  I bought widths from .4mm to 2.5 and use it all the time. 

 

Thank you, John.

Can you recommend a US source for the Aizu tape? I was looking after Snapdragon posted the links back on page one, but I got side-tracked. I'm fine ordering from overseas, but this would be a really small order. Plus the UK store was out of stock at the time I was looking.

keavdog

I've used metal gear where the stock gear were spindley. I too have not been impressed with the detail. They dont add much outside of strength.

So that's two votes that the metal actually will increase the strength, and one in agreement that the detail isn't all that great.

Thank you, John.

GMorrison

Exactly for the reason you bought them, Einstein.

I'd say you just have a bunch of clean-up to do.

 Bill

On re-read, the way I phrased the question was sort of dorky. Better if I'd have said aside from any added strength, are there any benefits......

And on the cleanup, I seem to remember some metal kit car I had as a kid. I recall going at the casting mess with an exacto knife because I didn't know what else to do, and giving up in short order. Playing with the metal strut last night invoked such vivid memories of that.

Thanks for your input, smart#$$

Your work looks real nice, Greg.  I'll second the recommendation on the Aizu tape.  I've been using it for a number of months and really like it.  I bought widths from .4mm to 2.5 and use it all the time. 

keavdog

^^^^ asshat 

Bill

^^^^ asshat 

I've used metal gear where the stock gear were spindley.   I too have not been impressed with the detail.  They dont add much outside of strength. 

Exactly for the reason you bought them, Einstein.

I'd say you just have a bunch of clean-up to do.

 Bill

So here is my rookie question for all you modern jet folk.

I bought the ZM add-on metal struts figuring this kit might be a little heavy and the add-on struts might provide more solid support.

Before I assemble the nose gear bay, I am inspecting where the nose gear will fit and doing some prep work which prompted me to also inspect the nose strut itself.

The metal struts look no better than the kit ones, in fact the detail is worse and there is a lot of flash to clean up. I guess I expected the add-on struts to be more detailed, sort of like resin goodies. Not so much.

So finally, my question is; why do folks add aftermarket metal struts to aircraft models?

keavdog

How did I miss this?  Looking good Greg.  I understand these kits a really nice.  I've never built one.  How are you liking it?

 

John's here!

My first ZM, John. Too early to comment on fit, but am certainly impressed with the mold quality, detail, lack of flash, all very good. Instructions seem very good, nice-looking cartograph decals and a fine paint/decal graphic sheet.

I hope to be able to report good fits in time.

How did I miss this?  Looking good Greg.  I understand these kits a really nice.  I've never built one.  How are you liking it?

So sorry about the late reply above, thanks for your patience.

I think I have the cockpit PE pretty much done, time for some detail painting and assembly.

Here's the current state of the office. Little pieces parts. The toothpick with the poster tac on the end is my PE picker-upper and put in place tool thingie.

A closer look at some of the PE. It took a lot to get motivated, but once I got going it was fun to be snipping away at a PE fret again. I love my Tamiya PE scissors, what a time saver from how I used to remove PE parts from the frets.

The Eduard panel color is too blue as usual. Out of the countless bottles of paint I have, never did find anything that matched too well. Once everything is put in place and the fuselage halves go together, never seems to make much difference. We shall see if that holds true here.

This is the back-seaters toys, I like the panel so I took a closer shot. I can't believe how close I can get with this phone camera, it's making me lazy (ier)

Painted PE sure looks funny close up, at least in this scale. I've always wondered if any of the other brands are better resolution?

Real G

the F-4 has 20 tons of personality that simply has no peer.

As I study the aircraft, I am starting to understand, G.

Est.1961

That made for good reading Greg, look forward to seeing what other interesting techniques you pull out of the bag during this WIP. 

Thanks for your kind words, 1961. I think that will make two of us who will be interested to see what happens, as I said, I'm pretty much clueless.

Hoss WA

Looking great so far. 

 

Thanks for hanging in there with me, Hoss.

plasticjunkie

Hey Greg you have one heck of a Phantastic Phabulous looking Phantom there.

I must say you have the hands of a surgeon with that masking on the pull rings. I have tried that before and luckully I have no hair on my head to pull while attempting it so no hair loss here. Your pull rings look great!

What I usually do is either cheat by getting the Eduard set that has a bunch of them or use thin wire painted yellow and masked as you did and painted black. I then can carefully bend the wire to shape and easily retouch any paint that may have chipped off in the handling process.

 

Thanks Ernie. I have my eye on that Eduard PE set for future 1/48 builds. Thanks for the techique tips!

Gamera

Greg: Those ejection seat handles look just right. Good luck with the instrument panel! 

 

Thanks, Cliff! Hopefull some instrument panel progress pics follow....

hogfanfs

Greg,

I'm really looking forward to seeing your progress in this F-4! This is one of my "to get" kits, and I'm very interested in seeing how well it goes together. And great job on the ejection handles, need to add this one to my techniques!

 

Hey Bruce, it's great to have you here. Thanks for your kind words on the handles.

RadMax8

Greg, I just wanted to drop in and say nice work so far! I don't have a whole lot in the stash right now with bang seats, but I will try to file your tip (borrowed as it may be) for when I do. There's only a couple jets I like, F-86, F-14, F-4, and the B-1. So, I'm definitely going to enjoy watching your progress!

 

Hey RadMax. I see you have been here for a long time. It's quite an honor to have you following along. Thanks for being here and for your kind words.

Everyone,

If I don't get distracted, a minor update follows. Please stay tuned..........

Greg, I just wanted to drop in and say nice work so far! I don't have a whole lot in the stash right now with bang seats, but I will try to file your tip (borrowed as it may be) for when I do. There's only a couple jets I like, F-86, F-14, F-4, and the B-1. So, I'm definitely going to enjoy watching your progress!

Greg,

I'm really looking forward to seeing your progress in this F-4! This is one of my "to get" kits, and I'm very interested in seeing how well it goes together. And great job on the ejection handles, need to add this one to my techniques!

Greg: Those ejection seat handles look just right. Good luck with the instrument panel! 

Hey Greg you have one heck of a Phantastic Phabulous looking Phantom there.

I must say you have the hands of a surgeon with that masking on the pull rings. I have tried that before and luckully I have no hair on my head to pull while attempting it so no hair loss here. Your pull rings look great!

What I usually do is either cheat by getting the Eduard set that has a bunch of them or use thin wire painted yellow and masked as you did and painted black. I then can carefully bend the wire to shape and easily retouch any paint that may have chipped off in the handling process.

Looking great so far. 

I looked at the Z. Phantom when it came out and passed on it.  Will be watching this come together in your hands.

My first close up look at one was at Udorn.  Looked down the gattling gun on an E from the shop truck.  Instant case of love at first sight.  

That made for good reading Greg, look forward to seeing what other interesting techniques you pull out of the bag during this WIP. 

My first sight of a real Phantom was when the Blue Angels came to Hawaii in the early 1970s.  They obviously didn’t do much aerobatics, but the noise and smoke from four pairs of J79s flying in a diamond formation made quite an impression on me!

The F-15 is a more capable fighter, and the F-16 is certainly prettier, but the F-4 has 20 tons of personality that simply has no peer.

Real G

That’s a neat trick to paint the pull rings.  I am going to try a variation meant for less patient modelers like myself.  It might save a lot of effort for the 1/72 modelers.  Will try it out and post piccies.

Good luck on your Phantom!  Such a phenomenal, phabulous, phantastic beast!  My favorite US jet fighter since childhood.

Thanks G! I would enjoy seeing what you come up in 1/72 scale. I say again, I don't know how you folks do what you do in 1/72. You amaze me.

And thanks for the well wishes. I must admit this is my first Phantom, and I'm embarrassed to admit I've never paid much attention the the aircraft. I already very smitten with the airframe, I think I'm quickly coming to understand where you are coming from.

Minor update:

Doing some painting and prep on the cockpit.

Started smoothing out some panel surfaces for PE today. This is the first time I've ever felt guilty removing surface detail. The ZM panel details are the best I've seen yet in 1/48th.

That’s a neat trick to paint the pull rings.  I am going to try a variation meant for less patient modelers like myself.  It might save a lot of effort for the 1/72 modelers.  Will try it out and post piccies.

Good luck on your Phantom!  Such a phenomenal, phabulous, phantastic beast!  My favorite US jet fighter since childhood.

waikong

Hey, beautiful job on masking those. Way more patience then I have, but I should learn from you.

 

You sir are too kind. Thank you, but I wonder is it patience or Covid restlessness?

Mopar Madness

What an excellent idea for making/painting those handles!

 

Thanks for stopping in, Chad!

I think I should give credit to the source where I borrowed the idea. He did it differently, and in 1/32nd scale, but I got the idea here.

Thanks Luc, wherever you are.

What an excellent idea for making/painting those handles!

snapdragonxxx

Well done on the masking tape, Greg. Welcome to the wonderful world of Zoukei-Mura. I am waiting for them to upgrade the Phantoms to 1/32.

Thanks Snapdragon, and also thanks for the welcome to the Zoukei-Mura world. I've only just begun, but so far I surely do like the quality, detail, and fit.

I am a such a sucker for modeling tools and supplies. .4mm? If my math is right, that's .0015" (15 thousandths)? Wow, that's skinny! I think I will have to buy a roll of it, and the next wider size just to have it!

Sorry to have left you two hanging for a few days, I sort of lost track of my own thread.

mrmike

Good to see you back and building a very interesting kit. I like your patient, steady build style and look forward to your posts. Happy modelling!

 

Thanks Mike! I do like the way you make being a slow poke sound like a virture.

Well done on the masking tape, Greg.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Zoukei-Mura. I am waiting for them to upgrade the Phantoms to 1/32.

About the masking tape. Maybe this would have been better...

https://www.scalemodelshop.co.uk/product/0-4mm-x-8m-micron-masking-tape-aizu-2001-1

https://www.scalemodelshop.co.uk/product/0-4mm-x-8m-micron-masking-tape-aizu-2001-1

Comes in six sizes on rolls of either 5m or 8m - 0.4mm, 0.7mm, 1.0mm, 1.5mm, 2.0mm and 2.5mm.

Good to see you back and building a very interesting kit. I like your patient, steady build style and look forward to your posts. Happy modelling!

Hey Tojo,

I've done 2 WIP's here, but have mostly participated in GB's.

This will be my first Phantom.

Tojo72

That’s a lot of effort for those handles !!!

It sure was. That's why I'm so slow!

Hi Nick,

I'd sure enjoy having you follow along.

I ordered my kit from Sprue Bros just a couple weeks ago, and I see they are backordered now. A couple other places I checked too, so I guess you're right. Some of the other variants by Zouke-Mura do seem to be available, though.

Hey nice kit I'll be most interested in this. Those kits are on back order still waiting for a few.

Joe, thanks for your kind words. It would be great to have you following along, that's for sure.

Patrick, thank you for stopping by and if you kept an eye on my antics here, I'd sure appreciate it.

Please do stay in touch and I hope any news you might be getting about your grand niece is good news.

Hi, Greg - Mighty clever job of the handle masking, looks really good. I saw one of these kits finished by a very talented builder, on display at my LHS. It was described as a fine kit with all around good fit, I'm sure you'll do it justice, I will be following this for sure.

Patrick

First off, let me start by saying how wonderful and refreshing it is to see you back at the bench again. It has been far too long for you to have been keeping your righteous talents from the forums. I am just happy beyond belief.

Now, what a way to get back at it. The ZM F-4 should be a grand one to watch. Excellent choice. I've often considered picking up a ZM kit so it will be nice to see you build one and get your input as you go. You can guarantee I'll be following along all the way.

Superb effort on the handles. Brilliant technique that produced outstanding results. Nice bit of patience to boot. Well done.

Lastly, Check your PM my friend. Been waiting to hear back from you and catch up.

Cheers, Joe

So now I can stop fussing temporarily and move forward with the rest of the cockpit.

I'm usually a paint then assemble person, for some reason I decided to put the ejection seat together (minus the pull handles), prime then dark grey and paint them as you experts would do with your fancy resin AM seats.

So here is the starting point. Now I have to stop boring you all and go paint stuff. Hand painting is not one of my strong points. Wish me luck.

I tend to spend too much time on cockpits. I enjoy working on them.

Nathan! What a treat to hear from you, it's been way too long.

I sure appreciate your dropping in, and I think it is so cool you are building Hasegawa Phantoms with your daughter. If that isn't worth a couple thumbs up, I don't know what is!

I didn't realize the Japanese flew Phantoms, I looked it up and thanks for the mini-history lesson. I want to build something with Japanese markings one day too.

I'm sure your hand painted handles look just fine. As I said, I enjoy driving myself crazy, I guess.

Stik, I'm so glad to have you here. Thanks a lot, and for your kind comments as well.

You are certainly welcome, and again, not my original idea but sounds like it was worthy of passing along. (note that the post is for my reference too, next time I build a fighter I'll forget how I did this so if I can find this thread and Google Photos hasn't pulled a Photobucket, I'll be all set) :)

That may have been drawn own, but certainly worth it for that little lesson on masking. What a fabulous idea! Thanks for sharing that with us. 

And no need to join any GBs for this kit. It’s a beauty and should not be rushed!

It starts with painting the handles yellow.

Not my best hand-painting job, but it looks fine in real life.

Next was to use a black marker on some Tamiya masking tape and slice it into a few very thin slices. This confused me at first, the black marker is just to add contrast to help see it when applying the mask. I had to read the fellow's post several times to sort out what in the world he was doing. The below strip ended up being too thick and I had to do it over, but it gives you an idea of what's going on.

Time to try to wrap the tape around the handle loop. Sometimes I call tweezers the most worthless tool in my modeling box. They sure came in handy for this wrapping around job!

So they end up looking like this. I thought they looked pretty good and I must admit I thought about shooting it with some clear sealant to try to seal the tape down, and call it a day. But I didn't.

Now for the scary part, painting black over everything....

And it got pretty tense as I started to remove the tape.

Before and after:

So they are not perfect, not as good as GregBale pulled off in 1:72, but in the real world without macro lenses I think they look pretty convincing. (the one with the thinnier masking tape turned out much better, btw)

That was pretty drawn out, if you made it this far, thank you.

Saaweeet! nice kit choice Greg. Haven’t built that one yet but currently building a phew Hasegawa ones right now. Both me and my Daughter are building one each in Japanese retirement markings. As far as the pull handles go, I just paint them by hand and live with it. Good luck on a better solution!