Official Natural Metal Finish Group Build II

NiceFit

 

maxfax:

 

Now, another problem. I seem to be running into them alot lately. I finally got the Alclad  Polished Aluminum on, and over all it looks reasonbly good, but not as smooth in areas I would like. I guess there were areas the black undercoating wasn't so smooth- perhaps slightly grainy, and many areas feel rough to the touch. I can easily live with this, but, I am wondering if I cover the plane in Future to smooth it out more, then add another layer of Alclad, if that would help.

 

 

MaxFax, I noticed the exact same thing. In my case, some of the Krylon was applied over Plastikote primer and some over enamel overspray. (I never got to the Alclad stage.) In my case, I think it was the primer underneath that was causing the gritty feel, because I didn't notice the problem in the overspray areas. At any rate, I decided to strip the plane and start over (for the umptenth time!). As someone else suggested, I re-started by applying a coat of Future directly over the plastic instead of using primer. I then painted my stripes and will soon mask them. I haven't gotten much further than that at this point. Krylon comes next.

Nicefit and Maxfax I dont know if anyone else has had this trouble but I found that you cant paint over Krylon  with more Krylon paint, because it orange peels like crazy. What I mean by that is you can second coat with in 15 or 20 minutes with no troubles at all but once the paint has dried you cant spray more Krylon paint over the first coats. They say you can wait a week for another color coat but for me that didnt work, I went so far as to do a test piece and let it cure a month and it still orange peeled. That may have been your problem Maxfax also Plasticoat is Krylon.

Scorpiomikey oh goodie we have another foil guy here Personally I havent used BMF but a word of warning is in order here. Be careful the BMF foil isnt too old as the adhesive goes bad and it will have a grainy or pebbly look to it after you apply it. I am not saying BMF is bad by any means I have seen some fine work done with it, just a word of caution. I use regular aluminum foil with an adhesive that is brushed on, its much much cheaper to use also.

You will have to coat the BMF or foil which ever you use with Future before you paint it or add decals as neither one will stick to the foil but the future will. I like to brush the first coat of future on foil then buff it after it dries then shoot a second coat ( not really needed but I do it anyway) with my AB. You can also achieve slight color contrasts by turning the grain of the foil in different directions on random panels. Sounds kind of strange but it does work well. Also there is a tutorial in the how to section here on the forum that will be of great help to you. Hope this helps you out some and I will be more than happy to answer any questions I can for ya

Hey Vetteman, thanks for the TIMELY heads-up about the length of time between Krylon coats. I'm beginning to wonder if it just might be easier to airbrush flat black enamel (don't have gloss on hand) since I plan to Future over the black anyway before proceeding with Alclad. Hmmm.... 

Nicefit I don't see why that wouldn't work, maybe a test panel to see if it will really work ? May save you some time and trouble ya know.

I painted the plane with Future full strength and it looks 1000X better already. I'll hopefully hit it with another layer of Alclad tonight. I would have left it with just the Future on it, but there are some areas that need more paint coverage- I made a few scratches when using a "soft cloth" when I was buffing the rough areas- it was my friggin' fingernail of all things. I thought this would have been a breeze after my first NMF P-51d was successful. 

Maxfax, I did the same with my first NMF, scratched it with my nail while buffing...Allclad scracthes easily i noticed.....Your P-51 in round 1 was awesome so i'm sure you will beat it in the end.....

WIP....Pic

Here's where i'm at with the Mustang, pic isn't very good, sorry.....The P-38 is stalled for now, the undercoat still has a slightly tacky feel to it....

Julez she's starting to look like the thouroughbred that she is!!!

Julez,

Thats looking sweet! I also like the color for the spinner and how it looks "crisp".

Julez,

Nice work. What paint did you use? How did you create what appears to be perfect circular bands on the spinner? I have tried that with tape, but haven't had the greatest luck with it.

Rob

Julez72 what can I say, your painting is top notch I think I am going to send you all my spinners and rudders to paint for me from now on. Your NMF is really good too, it even looks like you painted the exhaust panels to look like stainless steel. Your pony is gonna be a beauty me thinks

Thanks for the kind words Gents, much appreciated

Rob, I used a Scotch brand automotive pin striping tape for the spinner...Go back to page 19, i posted up pics of how i did it...Nicefit also posted up his method which is an excellent and easy way to paint stripes on spinners.....

Randy, Sure buddy go ahead and send em over Will cost you a bottle of future though(still unavailable here in Aus)....Yeah those exaust panels were a mix of MM magnesium and gunmetal, came out ok i think maybe a little lighter than i was hopeing for...I've started experimenting with different paints just to see how they compare.....

More Wip pics...

This Mustang seems to be going very smoothly and quite quickly, i only started it 10 days ago and i'ts already out of the paintshop...I'm still waiting on the decal sheet to arrive from Squadron but i can use the Tamiya stencils and Stars and Bars in the meantime...

Speaking of Superscale, they have made a mistake in their research, the sheet tells you 2 stripes on the wings but the wartime pic i found after a 5 min google search.......well....3

Nice to see everybodys work. im enjoying following this thread.

I have a question though, im about to purchase my first batch of BMF from sprue brothers (The LHS is dragging its heals getting it in) and i was wondering whats best for my jug? Chrome or Matte Aluminium? or a mixture of both? i tried tinfoil but its just sooo much work trying to squeese the adhesive out to get it to conform to the surface (it works, but it took me about an hour to do 1sq inch) also are there any tools i should have to work with it?

Ive just ordered a resin cockpit for it, its for the tamiya kit but im sure i can make it fit.

Thanks heaps in advance guys.

Julez - Nice work on the dirty old man! I picked up that decal set a few years back with the intention to build that plane. Nice save on the wing stripe too... sometimes it pays to do your homework. 

Mikey - I would go with the aluminum over the chrome unless you want a polished look, of course, I've never worked with foil so someone else might know better. Who makes the resin cockpit that you ordered?

I've been busy lately, so not much bench time. Hopefully things slow down soon and I can get something done.

Everyone is doing some nice work.

NiceFit,

Though I am new to NMF I did a test with my Alclads before I painted my Sabre.

If you are using Chrome - Gloss Black must be used.

I primed my Sabre overall with Walmart Flat Black and then I lay-ed Alclad Aluminum down. The Gun Panels were masked.

The "gun" panels on the left and right were primed with Walmart Gloss Black and then were painted with Alclad Chrome.

I hope this helps!

Scorpiomikey,

Though I have used BMF only a few times and have been pleased this is what I can share.

1. Visit there site for tips: http://www.bare-metal.com/ 
2. USE A SHARP "NEW" blade when cutting.
3. Use Q-tips to smooth out your work
4. Patience, Patience, Patience

Julez72 nice catch on the stripes, I have caught a few decal sheets wrong too and the picture surely does show 3 stripes. I am tellin ya your Mustang just looks better each time I see it.

Jmabx sure am looking forward to your build so I hope you can get lifes trials and tribulations all settled down and back to the bench soon.

Scoripomikey I havent used BMF but I do use foil all the time so I would guess the tools would be basically the same. I try and stay away from Q-Tips as the fibers when dry seem to get under the foil no matter what I do. Makes for a really bad looking finish I can tell you.  Instead I use womens makeup applicators the ones they use for eye shadow with the little sponge on the end to work the foil down at first then depending on detail being covered I use the rounded end of a small paint brush or a dulled round toothpick for panel lines and rivets and such. I do use Q-Tips dipped in 90% alcohol to clean off adhesive from adjoining areas that the foil has touched but not burnished to. For an older finish I would go with the matt aluminum, for a show plane look the chrome would work nicely. What you can do with the matt aluminum is turn the grain different directions on random panels, thats assuming the BMF is grainy like aluminum foil is. I would be interested in what kind of glue you used when you tried using foil. I use Microscale Bare Metal Adhesive and have not had any trouble with it at all. Oh and dont forget as was said above a brand new sharp hobby knife and a sharp pair of small scissors. Another thing you can do is after your final coat of gloss or Future to seal decals and such is to mask areas you want to look older and more worn mist a couple of coats of semi gloss on which will make the aluminum look older, umm corroded . However do NOT use a flat or dull coat over BMF or foil, really makes it look bad. Hope this helps you out some.

WOW that was long winded geeze

Heh gang!

Here is a picture (not very good) of a NMF Spitfire flown in Canada, 1946 as a traveling PR air display. It seems many war birds were stripped of their war time paint and markings in Canada post war and would make great subjects for this GB.

Anyone interested should pick up the book:

'Canadian Aircraft of WWII' by Carl Vincent

There are vintage pictures, paint and color descriptions and color drawings with a modelers reference and detail in mind. Page 57-58 describe P-40D Kittyhawks that had their paint removed for trainers in Boundary Bay, British Columbia late 1944. Here is a quote:

'The 5 OTU Kittyhawks had several things in common with the unit's Liberators and Mitchells. All three were eventually stripped down to a bare metal finish. The two larger types had this done over a period of time, resulting in multi-finish flight lines, while the Kittyhawks all seemed to undergone the stripping process at once.'

Food for thought indeed & interesting NMF subjects!

Hey guys,

Here is a pic with the Alclad on. The cowling was done separately, and ended up a little darker than the rest of the plane, not surprising considering I had to paint the plane a few times to get it right.

I started to put the D-day stripes on the wings, but that was a total failure- the decal first of all didn't fit, and secondly, the damn thing easily fragmented into a hundred pieces. The cowling checkerboard decal could not possibly fit either, and I ended up tearing the damn thing up. I am surprised this happened- I thought Tamiya would have better quality decals.I am going to have to paint the stripes on, and I am not sure if I will attempt the checkerboard- I am now going to either get an aftermarket decal, or just paint part of the cowling a solid colour and use the rest of the kit's decals.

Now, what is a good white that I can use? I seem to have problems getting good coverage with white. I have a Tamiya white primer- would this be a good option?

Thanks

Rob

jmabx

Mikey - I would go with the aluminum over the chrome unless you want a polished look, of course, I've never worked with foil so someone else might know better. Who makes the resin cockpit that you ordered?

Cheers for all the help guys. as for the resin cockpit, its 1:48 True Details P-47D-15 thru P-47D-28 Thunderbolt Cockpit (TAM kit) #48499. also the glue i used was just Micro Kristal Klear.  im thinking it was too thick. ill have to keep an eye out for foil adhesive.

Ill be ordering some BMF on wednesday (payday) matte aluminium, how many packs? would one be enough? or should i get a couple?

Rob, finally got it sorted eh, and she looks great too, well done

Sorry to hear about your decal sheet, that sux...I have this decal sheet which i won't use and "Sleepy Jean 3rd" looks like it will fit your scheme but you may have to extend the OD on the cowl and add invasion stripes to the lower fueselage....Anyways it's yours if you want it

OK Randy I'm here! I started tonight on the P-35. I spayed all of the interior parts with Talon alluminum glued up the wing halves and started painting up the nice little engine supplied with the kit. Hobbycraft kits arw almost always inaccurate poorly detailed POS. Thos kit turned out to be a nice surprise when I checked the fit of all of the large parts. If you are a fan of the prewar aircraft I would definetely recomend grabbing one if you see it on Ebay. You can pick themm up cheap too. They make good subjects to pratice NMF techniques on because the overall fit is good and they are so cheap.

Soucrusher

Julez,

Thanks so much for your kind offer!!!!

I have already ordered a set of decals from a distibutor here in Canada. The set is the following:

http://flightdecs.ca/a_lifelike/LL48014.jpg

I think I will do the one with the yellow cowling and skull and crossbones. Canada Post is slow, so I will go ahead and finish up on attaching the accessories.

thanks again

Rob

soulcrusher

OK Randy I'm here! I started tonight on the P-35. I spayed all of the interior parts with Talon alluminum glued up the wing halves and started painting up the nice little engine supplied with the kit. Hobbycraft kits arw almost always inaccurate poorly detailed POS. Thos kit turned out to be a nice surprise when I checked the fit of all of the large parts. If you are a fan of the prewar aircraft I would definetely recomend grabbing one if you see it on Ebay. You can pick themm up cheap too. They make good subjects to pratice NMF techniques on because the overall fit is good and they are so cheap.

Soucrusher

Oh ye of little faith... I actually gotta say, while they may not be the most detailed kits out there, Hobbycraft kits have never had any fit problems for me. I have only built a half dozen or so, but they have all been decent if not pretty dang good. Not to mention they make kits of planes no one else does in 1/48.

stikpusher the fit on this one is excellent where it really counts. I glued the fuselage halves and the seems fit perfect and should only need a little primer I also glued the wing halves and they fit nicely once clamped together. The wing gap though even it going to be a bit to wide but the two sufaces are level so filling it and rescribing it should be no problem. I do not have to many Hobbycraft kits but the other ones I have do not come close to this kit. I  gave away the Ar 234 kit. It had almost no cockpit detail and crude detail. This one is a little gem thought!

Soulcrusher

I hear ya Soulcrusher. Mine is stalled at about the 80% built mark. It builds very nicely in my eyes, but I have just lost interest in it at this time. maybe as December approaches I will get mine done ( I am building it as one of the ones that flew and fought in the  Philippines in late 1941). Awhile back I found a Reheat PE set for this kit that I wish I had found before I started mine. That set would be the perfect touch for this kit. Like you said, it is a little gem. It is certainly one of their better kits, but I gotta tell you, their F4U-1 is even better. When are ya gonna post some progress pics of yours?

Max that is some great progress!!!! Sorry to hear about the decals tho.

Julez, good save on the stripes!!!!

Catching up with this great GB…

MaxFax – Pit and engine looks great! Ditto the comments left by others… I do like the fact that the cowling is a different ‘shade” than the rest of the fuselage.

NiceFit – Sorry for the delay in answering… I hand brush a lot, mostly small parts/assemblies in the winter. My AB cabinet is in an unheated attached garage.  I use MM/testors enamels. After a bit of trial and error, I found out that the brush makes a HUGE difference. I got myself some nice camel hair brushes (using the 50% coupons at Michael’s craft stores). I also have to thin the paint just a tad, nowhere near what you would thin for an AB of course. Finally, use slow steady overlapping strokes to diminish the “build up” at the end of the brush. Thanks for posting the spinner technique, will give it a try! For this one, I will try a rubber sleeve (shrinkable with heat). I cant recall the exact name of the product, its used to wrap electrical lines, apply heat, and the rubber sleeve shrinks.. it is basically an elastic tube, so you can pull the spinner (or ordinance) thru the sleeve till the paint demarcation line and AB away. Do not use heat of course lol

Julez72 – Ditto vetteman’s comments; looking forward to your build!  Academy, Haseg, all better than the old Revell ones! I have three boxed away to build once I have a clue what I am doing ;)  Looks like you definitively got things right, I will copy your ‘rig” idea to align the booms. Mustang coming along great!

Fermis – looks great! Hope my (Revell) BBD ends up looking half as good as yours.  You finish a model in the time it takes me to catch up reading the GB thread! LOL  Oh, and great stable shot! I am officially jealous

IBuild  - Beautiful work on your F-86F. I recently trashed an old testor’s P-51D (I know, a sacrilege!) But the molding was toylike, fit was horrible and the nostalgia effect wore off. I should have given it the fire-cracker treatment ;) Your decals/stripes paint jobs are spot on.

Stikpusher – Love how yours is coming along; I love the “old” lines of that jet (old referring to the jet, not the kit!).

vetteman42 – hope you feel better from your cold! (Yes, Im up to page 17!)

jmabx – very interesting bird! Love the pics, look forward to the rest of the build.

Scorpiomikey my guess would be from what I know the BMF foil comes in sheets of 6" X 12" and thinking of scrap and such I would say a minimum of 3 sheets to do the job, I dont know how many come in a pack. You might be able to get away with 2 sheets but you would have to be very careful about the layout of your cuts.

Supressionfire hey thanks for the heads up on the book, I dont see many Canadian aircraft ans its nice to build a model with not so common markings. I will be keeping my eyes open for it.

Maxfax your Jug is looking really good Actually I really like the shade difference between the cowl and  the rest of the model, you are really making that Testors kit look top notch. Seems to me that white always takes 3 or 4 coats to cover any other color even  bare aluminum, I have tried both enamel and acrylics. Yellow and red are 2 other colors that drive my nuts.

Soulcrusher cant wait to see what you do with the P-35 especially after witnessing your FW190 build. I have been looking for a P-26 Peashooter kit and now may have to look for the P-35 as well, geeze. So many to build and ....................

Jmart thanks buddy. The cold didn't go bad like it normally does so I got lucky this year, the cough is almost gone now. So now I have some modeling catch up to play as I have 2 group builds ending soon.

IBuild148 - Thank you for your answer to my question. I just airbrushed some flat black and will soon be on to the Alclad Aluminum. Finally! I plan to apply Future over the flat black, so essentially will have gloss black underneath the NMF. I have some Dark Aluminum on hand so I may highlight a few panels with that.

JMart - Thank you for your input too. I'm intrigued by the approach you mention for painting a spinner. It sounds simpler than the "hardware gauge" technique I outlined. Let us know how it turns out. Where did you buy the rubber sleeves? A hardware store?

OK here is where I am at right now. This kit is pretty basic and it went together pretty quick yesterday. It is definetely going to take alot more time to sand and fill all of the very small imperfections than it did to glue it together. I painted the cowl black so the NMF will be a bit darker on the cowl to give it some contrast. The engine is pretty nice right out of the box.

Soulcrusher

Rob, no worries mate the decal sheet you ordered is a very nice one, i like all 3 but the yellow nose with the skull is very cool....Looking forward to seein your completed build

SC, nice progress mate,those molds do look crisp and the engine looks superb