Falklands/Malvinas War 30th Anniversary GB

I never realised how the tags worked. I had seen the list of words on the right on the main page, but just assumed it was common words that had been used. Now i know. Not that i would post just to add another tag, but i think this is good enough reason

Bish

I never realised how the tags worked. I had seen the list of words on the right on the main page, but just assumed it was common words that had been used. Now i know. Not that i would post just to add another tag, but i think this is good enough reason

Posting just to add another tag? Perish the thought! But using the system to promote the BG thread, I think we can get away with that!

Just about done with assembly on the Scimitar! Will be sure to snap a pre-paint pic for you guys. Question about uniforms - want to add a fig (or 3) to the build, but have NO idea how to paint them. Anyone have a decent reference for period uniforms?

Can't wait to see some pics dupes. As for the uniforms, this is a bit embarresing for me as a serving British soldier, but i think USAAFSPOOKS is the expert on that one. I think the patterns were the same as they are now. I am pretty sure the uniforms they wore in 82 would be the same as i was first issued in 90, but can't be 100% sure.

some little update and some help needed.. not finded pictures of left cockpit wall of super etendard

so, the right side is done

and on the harrier

glued the intakes and improved secondary intakes

the fits in this area are not so good , need some putty, sanding and some rescribe.

started te cockpit

using the kit original floor marker the ejection seat is out and collide with canopy

i downed the floor a little in correct height

even with this height the seat seems too big .. something probably is out dimension.

that's all , need more test fitting to find correct way 

Alot of work needed on that harrier. Is the seat designed for that brand of model, or is it for somthing else. I fitted and Eduard PE set for an Italeri MiG 23 to a Hasegawa MiG 23. The PE set was to big for the cockpit and had to be trimmed down a bit. You could have several kits of the same aircrfat by different brands and they could all be slightly different size wise.

Bish

Alot of work needed on that harrier. Is the seat designed for that brand of model, or is it for somthing else. I fitted and Eduard PE set for an Italeri MiG 23 to a Hasegawa MiG 23. The PE set was to big for the cockpit and had to be trimmed down a bit. You could have several kits of the same aircrfat by different brands and they could all be slightly different size wise.

in other work another seat must be scratched

the old metal seat from aeroclub was not designed for a specific kit, at the time aeroclub just proposed with the seat name. Try this afternoom to fit in right way, otherwise on bench have lots of plastic sheets

I will start my Twin Otter this weekend.

 

It seems that areoclubs 72nd scale is slightly different from italeris.You could just try and fit it in, my mig cockpit is now way to cramped for a pilot to get into, but once its together its hard to see. maybe if you could put the seat lower down and thin the reae if the bit allowing you to move the seat back, see how that works,

Bish

It seems that areoclubs 72nd scale is slightly different from italeris.You could just try and fit it in, my mig cockpit is now way to cramped for a pilot to get into, but once its together its hard to see. maybe if you could put the seat lower down and thin the reae if the bit allowing you to move the seat back, see how that works,

Bish

It seems that areoclubs 72nd scale is slightly different from italeris.You could just try and fit it in, my mig cockpit is now way to cramped for a pilot to get into, but once its together its hard to see. maybe if you could put the seat lower down and thin the reae if the bit allowing you to move the seat back, see how that works,

actually sanding hard with a metal rasp. I used on lots aircraft ,italeri academy and matchbox but ony problems in eight. None picture about left cockpit wall for the etendard? A picture of the 1/48 can be good

i see a matchbox kit above

 

dupes

Just about done with assembly on the Scimitar! Will be sure to snap a pre-paint pic for you guys. Question about uniforms - want to add a fig (or 3) to the build, but have NO idea how to paint them. Anyone have a decent reference for period uniforms?

  First of all, thanks Bish for your endorsement--means alot!!  Dupes, do you want a book to use or will a website be sufficient?  If you only need to see the pattern used, you can google 'DPM camoflague' and will get several useful articles; wikipedia had a good overall history of DPM camo ( a few mistakes in it) and a few good colour photos of the pattern.  Since I see you live in the U.S., you can check with a store called the Sportsman's Guide; they usually have DPM jackets on sale at very cheap prices that are of the colouration suitable for the Falklands era--I even managed to get an early 68 pattern from them (they didn't know it!).  As far as books go, I would highly recommend Osprey's Men-At-Arms Series #133 Battle for the Falklands (1) Land Forces.  It gives an excellent rundown on the uniform items used in the campaign on both sides, but especially the British.  It has some excellent photos (although in B&W) and some of Mike Chappell's best plates on British uniforms I have seen.  This book is usually on E-Bay-- I bought an extra one just to keep on my workbench.  The colours I use for DPM are close to those used for the 3-colours used for late WWII German Armour, though DPM has black added to it and the base sand colour could be toned down a bit .  The DPM colours have had different tints in them over the years, and the early polyester jungle uniforms had some really strange colours in them, especially the brown, but there is almost no variation between fabrics today.  Another cheap but accurate source for photos is from a surplus store in London called Silverman's; I believe it is www.Military.co.uk; will have to check.  They usually have colour pictures of available DPM uniforms, often including original Falklands era parkas.  Do you have figures already picked out?  If not, let me know I can make some suggestions.  Most on market are in current uniforms/headgear; helmets in Falklands era much different than today's.  Long answer, hope some of it useful.         

SPOOKS, am i right in thinking that the pattern most commonly seen in 82 is the same as the standard 3 colour pattern we use now. We still get parkas on occasion, and these look old enough to be from back then. Combat 95 replaced the old uniform i started out with, and i would have thought that had been in use more than 13 years.

Saw some earlier posts regarding Maj. Tombas experiences.  Would like to pass on the following which may be of interest:  In 1990 while I was TDY at Goodfellow AFB, I was given the opportunity, along with several other officers, to meet with an Argentinian pilot that, we were told, was a Pucara pilot that was shot down and captured by the British during the campaign.  We were also cautioned to use the term "Malvinas" and not "Falklands" in order not to insult him!  I did not get or remember his name (a bit of drinking going on at the time!), but the only pilot that fits those criteria would be Teniente Cruzado, who was shot down by groundfire on 28 May.  The thing that I most remember is that he told that after his capture, he was not guarded closely by the British.  He stated he was a bit indignant over this and asked why he was not being treated as a potential threat.  The reply he got was, to me, typically British.  The soldier he asked looked around in a 360 circle at the bleak Falkland's landscape and said, "Where are you going to go, mate?"  At that, the downed pilot looked around and had to agree and waited to be repatriated.  I wish I could remember more and hadn't got so drunk, but he was a very friendly fellow and an honour to have met--even if I cannot remember his name!   If I have misidentified the pilot and someone may know who it really may have been, please post something; I really would like to know for sure who he was!            

Great story Spook. And i can just picture it. Theres not exactly alot of places to hide down there. Thats made me chuckle.

Not exactly the sort of place you want to be on the run is it

Bish

SPOOKS, am i right in thinking that the pattern most commonly seen in 82 is the same as the standard 3 colour pattern we use now. We still get parkas on occasion, and these look old enough to be from back then. Combat 95 replaced the old uniform i started out with, and i would have thought that had been in use more than 13 years.

Bish  Do not mean to quibble, but DPM has 4-colours: green, brown, tan or sand base colour, and black.  The colours in the 95 combats are very close to the same as issued in '82.  I would not be surprised if your "current" issued parkas were leftovers from that era.  Have you checked the tags inside for a manufacturing date on the garments' sizing label?  Some of the very early issued items from the late 60s through sometime in the 70s had a green that turned to an aquamarine-type colour, especially as it faded; our early BDUs in the US (early 80s) had a brown that faded to an almost purple!  Some of these early garments (I have a smock and trousers of this period) had blurred edges on the patterns almost the same as Waffen SS camo smocks had--comes from the pattern rollers not being properly aligned if I understand it correctly.  Anyway, the colours in a set of current 95 combats are "close enough for government work" to use for the Falklands period.  Of the various era DPM jackets I have, the 90 pattern, with only a front zip and no buttons (as like a para smock) had a yellowish tan base colour unlike any others I have seen.  Most others are pretty close in basic colour.  Today's uniforms seem to have more 'intense' colours and do not seem to fade as badly--though I am sure some squaddies can show some pretty faded articles to the contrary!   

Good, well done, you spotted my deliberate mistake

Shows how much time i spend in uniform doesn't it. Those combats with the yellowish tan are quite common, especially on the Jungle combats. The new 95 stuff, especially the trousers, don't last as long as the older ones, they are alot thinner. And before Combat 85 we had plain green working dress that we wore in barracks and the combats that were worn in the field. These were thicker and in my view harder wearing. Thats why i think you don't often see the 85 stuff worn and faded. It wears through the crotch and needs replacing before it fades.

Bish, Now you know why I was a "Spook"--I believe they are called "Green Slime" in British Army,or at least in the Royal Marines!  Anyway, I have read that 85 pattern stuff was not very well liked.  I have also noticed in pictures that solid green trousers (lightweights?) were often worn in garrison and camo trousers only worn in the field or in actual combat.  Even in Northern Ireland troops seemed to wear lightweights more than camo trousers (except if threat of petrol bombs high, which caused lightweights to melt); also, in Falklands, it appears as if troops switched to solid green trousers shortly after surrender, especially the Paras.  I imagine their camos were pretty well soiled by this time and maybe just a measure to clean up a bit?  Are solid green lightweights still issued today?  Something else has caught my eye:   I have seen at least three Royal Marines (well, 2 RMs, 1 attached RN photographer) carrying M16s with early 3-prong flash suppressors.  And no, they are not SAS:  they have on RM or RN berets.  Who was issued these and how widespread were they?  Were they from the Mountain and Arctic Warfare Cadre?  How would they be supplied with .223 ammo; no other weapon in British arsenal at the time used such ammo? Just curious!  

Yep, its Green Slime in the Army as well. As for Northern Ireland, do you know i can't recall if we wore lightweights or combats on the streets. I know we wore light weights when on guard duty. We may have worn them when on patrol, but honestly can't remember, it was nearly 20 years ago. Will have to try and find some photos. As far as i am aware, light weights ain't issued any more, they certainly ain't worn. I think i still have my 3 sets somewhere. The M16's is an interesting one. I have no idea. As you know, our main rifle at the time was the SLR, 7.62mm. You could be right about the mountain warfare cadre. where these the standard long M16, or the shorter carbine version as they would make sense if they were carried while climbing.

USAFSPOOK

Dupes, do you want a book to use or will a website be sufficient?  If you only need to see the pattern used, you can google 'DPM camoflague' and will get several useful articles; wikipedia had a good overall history of DPM camo ( a few mistakes in it) and a few good colour photos of the pattern.  Since I see you live in the U.S., you can check with a store called the Sportsman's Guide; they usually have DPM jackets on sale at very cheap prices that are of the colouration suitable for the Falklands era--I even managed to get an early 68 pattern from them (they didn't know it!).  As far as books go, I would highly recommend Osprey's Men-At-Arms Series #133 Battle for the Falklands (1) Land Forces.  It gives an excellent rundown on the uniform items used in the campaign on both sides, but especially the British.  It has some excellent photos (although in B&W) and some of Mike Chappell's best plates on British uniforms I have seen.  This book is usually on E-Bay-- I bought an extra one just to keep on my workbench.  The colours I use for DPM are close to those used for the 3-colours used for late WWII German Armour, though DPM has black added to it and the base sand colour could be toned down a bit .  The DPM colours have had different tints in them over the years, and the early polyester jungle uniforms had some really strange colours in them, especially the brown, but there is almost no variation between fabrics today.  Another cheap but accurate source for photos is from a surplus store in London called Silverman's; I believe it is www.Military.co.uk; will have to check.  They usually have colour pictures of available DPM uniforms, often including original Falklands era parkas.  Do you have figures already picked out?  If not, let me know I can make some suggestions.  Most on market are in current uniforms/headgear; helmets in Falklands era much different than today's.  Long answer, hope some of it useful.         

 

Spectacular! If this doesn't get me a decent pic to work off of, nothing will!

As far as figs - I'm planning on using some Cromwell chaps...looks like it's set CF-12 (handwritten), which says "Gulf CVR Crew" (also handwritten). Was hoping that 1991 wasn't too far after to have incorporated too many uniform changes.

Re: Goodfellow AFB - I was there in 1994, not too long after you! I was Army, not Air Force, so infer what you will about me being a "USARMYSPOOK". Heh.

Bish

Yep, its Green Slime in the Army as well. As for Northern Ireland, do you know i can't recall if we wore lightweights or combats on the streets. I know we wore light weights when on guard duty. We may have worn them when on patrol, but honestly can't remember, it was nearly 20 years ago. Will have to try and find some photos. As far as i am aware, light weights ain't issued any more, they certainly ain't worn. I think i still have my 3 sets somewhere. The M16's is an interesting one. I have no idea. As you know, our main rifle at the time was the SLR, 7.62mm. You could be right about the mountain warfare cadre. where these the standard long M16, or the shorter carbine version as they would make sense if they were carried while climbing.

M16s were standard length, not short ones, though I have seen current photos (well, during 90s) of RMs using short length, collapsible stock version.  Also seemed to have 20 round mags, not 30 round.  Have thought of doing a 1/35 RM figure by Kirin carrying M16 for "something completely different".  

dupes, i found those figures, but the site doesn't have any photos. the only concern i would have is that they would be in desert combats. The troops in the Gulf would have been issued warm weather gear for night time i would imagine, do they look like thats what they are wearing. The Falklands in April/may is coming into winter, and its pretty damn cold with extremly strong cold winds.

Hmmmm. I'll have to take a closer look. Also was unable to find a pic of them online (did Cromwell fold up? or just never have their own website?).

dupes

USAFSPOOK:

Dupes, do you want a book to use or will a website be sufficient?  If you only need to see the pattern used, you can google 'DPM camoflague' and will get several useful articles; wikipedia had a good overall history of DPM camo ( a few mistakes in it) and a few good colour photos of the pattern.  Since I see you live in the U.S., you can check with a store called the Sportsman's Guide; they usually have DPM jackets on sale at very cheap prices that are of the colouration suitable for the Falklands era--I even managed to get an early 68 pattern from them (they didn't know it!).  As far as books go, I would highly recommend Osprey's Men-At-Arms Series #133 Battle for the Falklands (1) Land Forces.  It gives an excellent rundown on the uniform items used in the campaign on both sides, but especially the British.  It has some excellent photos (although in B&W) and some of Mike Chappell's best plates on British uniforms I have seen.  This book is usually on E-Bay-- I bought an extra one just to keep on my workbench.  The colours I use for DPM are close to those used for the 3-colours used for late WWII German Armour, though DPM has black added to it and the base sand colour could be toned down a bit .  The DPM colours have had different tints in them over the years, and the early polyester jungle uniforms had some really strange colours in them, especially the brown, but there is almost no variation between fabrics today.  Another cheap but accurate source for photos is from a surplus store in London called Silverman's; I believe it is www.Military.co.uk; will have to check.  They usually have colour pictures of available DPM uniforms, often including original Falklands era parkas.  Do you have figures already picked out?  If not, let me know I can make some suggestions.  Most on market are in current uniforms/headgear; helmets in Falklands era much different than today's.  Long answer, hope some of it useful.         

 

 

Spectacular! If this doesn't get me a decent pic to work off of, nothing will!

As far as figs - I'm planning on using some Cromwell chaps...looks like it's set CF-12 (handwritten), which says "Gulf CVR Crew" (also handwritten). Was hoping that 1991 wasn't too far after to have incorporated too many uniform changes.

Re: Goodfellow AFB - I was there in 1994, not too long after you! I was Army, not Air Force, so infer what you will about me being a "USARMYSPOOK". Heh.

Dupes, Where are you getting Cromwell figures from?  I have been trying to get in contact with Gordon Brown for several months with no luck(please, no cromwell bashing on this site, please) to answer a message he sent me.  I have not seen those figures, but helmets had pretty much changed over by 91; the earlier British CVC helmets were much like our helmets that we had during Vietnam and during early 80s; actually saw one of these British helmets for sale on E-Bay;  they look like the old 30s era football helmets to me!  I cannot think of any sets that have proper helmets; many did wear berets with headphones, though probably not in combat.   Will keep looking though.  Have another Goodfellow AFB story--Army related; when I was there, I used to get up and jog around the track at the same time (0 dark thirty) that the Army enlisted detatchment did.  One morning an NCO started yelling at me for running the wrong way, etc., etc.;  had to convince him I was actually an AF O-3 actually working out on my own!!   Started carrying my ID card all the time after that!  Glad to have contacted you!!  

Dupes  UPDATE:  Accurate Armour does have a set specifically for the CVR in the proper helmets and in CW hats!!  Set is FS 03 and are 1/2 figures.  Should be exactly what you need!!  

SPOOKS, sorry, missed your second post on the M16's. I have no idea why those guys would be carrying them. Would make an interesting scene. And good point you made about the helmits, i had forgotten about those.

The only place i found Cromwell figures was here.

http://www.tsahal-miniature.com/cromwell.liste.prix.html

Its a bit odd because it seems to be an Israli site but the prices are in £sterling and the address is in the UK. And tehres an address at the bottom for Cromwell Model productions. But no photos.

Bish, Strange site indeed!  Came up in French!  Have been trying to find a listing of those models; had no idea they were so much (especially when translating to our weak dollar!), though the quality from what I have seen and read is excellent.

Re: Cromwell figs - got them in with the Scimitar I purchased at a show! They're great figs, but obviously the wrong time frame. I ALSO got some Castoff Resin guys with it - I may have to dig them out to see what they're about. So is Cromwell out of business?

Re: Accurate Armour - well lookee there! I've been meaning to get some stuff from them anyway (some of it for this Scimitar!) so this may push me over the edge. Don't know what that's going to do to my completion date, but it's a long GB, right?

Re: Goodfellow - I can TOTALLY see that happening! Man, can't believe it was 17 years ago I was stationed there. Wow. So long, in fact, I don't remember the name of the bar outside of post we used to go play darts at. Hmmmmm.

 

 

OK, colour question - I no longer have the benefit of a hobby shop across the road. Considering the "scale effect", do you think RLM 75 grau-violett is close enough to RN Dark Sea Gray?? Or should I be mixing up a special formula? ( I suppose a dark wash afterwards would help as well - I may be alright with supplies on-hand...)

I am not 100% certain, but i think i have some Xtracolour Dark Sea grey. When i get to camp tomorrow, IF i have it, i will compare it to the RLM 75.