B-36 Peacemaker Group Build

Andrew Magoo

 I have another question; where would a person find some good photos of some 28th BW Ellsworth AFB

It was an RB unit with ten aircraft, and only there for three years according to both Wiki and the kind of scattered info in Jenkins. My usual go-to for people to call, write etc. are the unit associations, and I can't find one for that wing. Probably didn't look hard enough.

bondoman

 

Where would anyone find any pictures at all? They would be classified then and not available now. There aren't any in Jenkins'. You notice in that great reference that almost every photo is from Carswell.

It was an RB unit with ten aircraft, and only there for three years according to both Wiki and the kind of scattered info in Jenkins. My usual go-to for people to call, write etc. are the unit associations, and I can't find one for that wing. Probably didn't look hard enough.

That`s because Jenkins and most of the others are either from North Texas, have ties here, and have ties to the old Convair establishment here in Ft Worth,

However, there is always Meyers K Jacobsen for the rest of the B-36 story

Some of his work ( and pictures )

If someone had put that in the front resource  post it might have been found.

lajntx

Ok Everyone,

It`s POP QUIZ  time. Everyone take everything off of their bench and get out a sheet of paper and put your name on it, and number it 1 to 10.

Question #1

Which B-36 currently on display was the last one to actually fly?

Question #2

Which B-36 ( also on display ) flew the last official SAC B-36 mission?

Question # 3

When was the last "attempted" flight of a B-36? And what did the Air Force do to prevent it?

Question # 4

In responce to the failed attempted try ( in question # 3 ). What did the Air Force do to the YB-36 that the National Museum of the Air Force in Dayton, Ohio had decided NOT to move to the new ( now current ) museum from the museum`s old outdoor location?

Question # 5

B-36 production was moved to Ft Worth from what city?

Question #6

Is the DAILY DOUBLE

In the picture below, this B-36 converted over for FICON duty has a 0 - added to the tail number. A.) What does this signify? B.) Why did the AIr Force discontinue this practice?

Question # 7

In the movie Strategic Air Command, Dutch Holland flew which bomber in WWII ?

Question # 8

Which branch of the US Military sought to have the B-36 program defunded & cancelled?

Question #9

Which US President had a flight of B-36`s fly over the Capital Building as part of his innauguration parade?

Question #10

In addition to the 4 on display in museums, and the remnants of the YB on the late Walter Soplata`s estate. You can also find  the remains of wrecked B-36`s in which of the following places.

A. Goose Bay, Labrador, Canada

B. British Columbia

C. Lake Worth, Texas

D. Submerged just off the San Diego, California, coastline

E. All of the above.

 

Lots of participation and widly wrong guesses there.

Answers:

1. The B-36 on display at The National Museum of the Air Force in Dayton, Ohio.  It was pulled from the boneyard at Davis-Monthan, returned to flying condition, and flew out on April, 30, 1959.

2.  The B-36 on display at PIMA ( The last Peacemaker built ) 52-2827 was flown from Biggs AFB to Amon Carter Field in Ft Worth, Texas on Feb. 12, 1959 as the last official SAC mission on Operation Sayonara.

3. 1971. The B-36 then on display at Amon Carter Field in Ft Worth. Amon Carter Field ( GSW ) was slated to be closed and the land redevoloped due to the opening of the new DFW International Airport ( DFW ). The idea was to "fly" the plane to nearby Meacham Field and further restore into a "Flying Museum".  Worked progressed to the point that all 6 piston engines were restarted to ensure they would work. At that point the Air Force ordered all attempts at flying the plane to cease due to " a threat to national security". To ensure this plane would not fly ( and fall into the wrong hands ) The Air Force siezed 5 of the 6 Pratt & Whitneys. 

4. It was cut up in a manner that would prevent a return to airworthiness and the pieces were sold to Walter Soplata for "scrap".

5. San Diego

6. Adding a " 0- " prefix to a tailcode indicated that the craft was 10 years old and therefore "Obsolete". This practice was disconintued after many B-52`s were flying well past the 10 year mark, and it was begining to look like they would see the unlikely mark of 20 years worth of service. The idea of having planes with "00-" tailcodes did not seem feasible. One comment I saw in an old article even make the comment that if somehow the planes managed to stay usefull and not " fall apart" why would anyone want to fly in a plane that had tail code of "000- "? Its not like the B-52 would ever see years 40 or 50!

7. B-29

8. The US Navy... see " Revolt of the Admirals" for more of this story

9. Harry S Truman`s innauguration in 1949

10.  E. All of the above.

Howdy,

              Question and answer number 3 is the most absurd thing I have ever heard! Whom did the USAF think was going to load a B-36 with hundreds of gallon of expensive high octane aviation fuel plus jet fuel and then what, a thermal nuclear bomb? After the fill up where would anyone go and buy a H-Bomb? If memory serves me correctly in Squadron’s B-36 book it shows a 21 ton H-Bomb that the B-36 could carry two of. But in Squadron’s B-52 book it shows some airmen getting ready to load a bomb cradle of 4 H-Bombs and the size of the bombs in a few short years had reduced significantly.

The size of the newer bombs would almost make me believe you could carry them on a B-25. Besides with today’s fighters with sophisticated avionics to lock onto a target and can be fired beyond visual range and that was possible even in 1971 seems very strange to take that position; seems like petty jealousy. The USAF did the same thing to the Northup B-35/B-49 flying wings. I think a couple of those should have gone into museums. Politics can be a viscous bed-fellow. Magoo

Bondoman and Lajntx, thanks for the information and pictures. I was born and grew up in Newcastle, Wyoming. Newcastle is about, by air, 56 miles almost due west from Rapid City, South Dakota. The 36’s out of Ellsworth would occasionally fly over Newcastle. Later in life so would the B-52s and B-1Bs. That is the reason for my interest in the 28^th Bomb Wing bombers I will hopefully have a model of the three bombers that operated out of Ellsworth AFB, a RB-36, B-52# not sure which variant and a B-1B. And now for a question who makes the best R-4360 radial engines in 1/72 scale? Magoo

Andrew Magoo

Howdy,

              Question and answer number 3 is the most absurd thing I have ever heard! Whom did the USAF think was going to load a B-36 with hundreds of gallon of expensive high octane aviation fuel plus jet fuel and then what, a thermal nuclear bomb? After the fill up where would anyone go and buy a H-Bomb? If memory serves me correctly in Squadron’s B-36 book it shows a 21 ton H-Bomb that the B-36 could carry two of. But in Squadron’s B-52 book it shows some airmen getting ready to load a bomb cradle of 4 H-Bombs and the size of the bombs in a few short years had reduced significantly.

The size of the newer bombs would almost make me believe you could carry them on a B-25. Besides with today’s fighters with sophisticated avionics to lock onto a target and can be fired beyond visual range and that was possible even in 1971 seems very strange to take that position; seems like petty jealousy. The USAF did the same thing to the Northup B-35/B-49 flying wings. I think a couple of those should have gone into museums. Politics can be a viscous bed-fellow. Magoo

 

 

Hi Magoo,

The reason the AF was being thatr anal was because after WWII as you may recall B-17`s, B-25`s, etc were sold off to private individuals ( and private companies ) at bargain prices withthe understanding that all combat related componets were removed and the buyer would never "re-arm" the bomber to be used for military purposes.

Think back to your history from 1945-70 and all the small banana republic wars, revolutions, etc. In many cases the planes used by the rebellion factions/non sanctioned US allies were planes purchased from private citizens ( groups ) that were converted back into military planes. The most infamous was the Israeli Air Force using B-17`s in their 1948 war for independence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Boeing_B-17_Flying_Fortress_operators

When Israel achieved statehood in 1948, the Israeli Air Force had to be assembled quickly to defend the new nation from the war it found itself almost immediately embroiled in. Among the first aircraft acquired by the Israeli Air Force were three surplus American B-17s, smuggled via South America and Czechoslovakia to avoid an arms trading ban imposed by the United States. A fourth plane was abandoned due to malfunctions and confiscated by American officials. On their delivery flight from Europe, in retaliation for Egyptian bombing raids on Tel-Aviv, the aircraft were ordered to bomb King Farouk's Royal Palace in Cairo before continuing to Israel. They performed the mission (despite some of the crew fainting due to defective oxygen equipment), but caused little damage. The B-17s were generally unsuitable for the needs of the Israeli Air Force, and the nature of the conflict in which long-range bombing raids on large area targets were relatively unimportant—although the psychological impact of the raids was not lost on the enemy. The aircraft were mainly used in the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, flown by 69 Squadron; they were withdrawn in 1958 after seeing minor action in the 1956 Suez Crisis.^[5][6]

^{In 1971, the last B-36 ever produced was about to fall into the hands of a "private entity" whom was determined to make the ship airworthy again. Who was not to say that at some point in the future the group would go defunct or sell the plane to a foreign entity that would illegally take it out of the country and give another country an intercontinental bomber. The Air Force acting on events of 1946-70 of what DID happen to quite a few sold surplus WWII bombers was not willing to take that risk and ensured that B-36 would not fly and made sure the plane would never be controlled by a private entity. Those actions combined with the high costs of restoring and maintaining the plane for display eventually led to the National Museum to repossess the bomber from Ft Worth and move it to PIMA in 2005.}

^{A year later in 1972, when the Air Force Museum was closing down their old location and moving to their current location, it was decided that transporting the old YB-26 which had fallen into disrepair sitting outside from 1957-72 was cost ineffective to move. Thus when it was cut up for scrap, it was mandated that it be cut up in a fashion that would render any attempt of reassembly impossible.}

Hi Everyone,

I wanted to pass this info along. A seller on ebay is selling the Hobby Craft 1/144 GRB36 Ficon USAF Bomber kit combo. The listing says the seller has more than 10 kits available. Buy it now price is $44 ( which is reasonable ), but the shipping is  $26.70 ( a bit excessive ). However, it is a disconintued product and spending $12-$15 more on shipping in the grand scheme of things for a rare item isnt much to get excited about. Here it is for those that have been wanting this particular kit:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hobby-Craft-1-144-GRB36-Ficon-USAF-Bomber-New-1273-/330693176385?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cfed96c41

Okay guys, finished up the Val for the Jap GB, ready to start the PM.

la: So I'm going to do the: RB-36H, 28th Strategic Reconnaissance Wing, Ellsworth AFB, Weaver South Dakota - The Triangle S build,

 1) I'm going to model it wheels down (for display flexibility) 2) doors open or closed? Since this is a recon bird, did it carry any ordnance?  I REALLY don't feel like messing with all those bombs, so if it's doors closed, need I do them? 3) I also see some question as to the NMF, it it polished aluminum on some panels, buffed aluminum on others and magnesium on still others?

This sheet differs (just a little) from the scheme in the kit instructions:

Hi Reasoned,

Doors opened or closed is your choice, However I will warn you that the stock doors are VERY difficult to build closed and leave a God Awful gap that is very hard to fill.Click2Detail does offer a closed door peice at a reasonable price.  However, if you want an empty bomb rack with the doors open... then that is your choice, but I`m sure your son will ask " Where are the bombs daddy?" lol

http://click2detail.com/products-details.php?pro_id=54

The ordinance carried in the fwd bay was the flash bombs in the kit... You`ll find painting them far easier than trying to make those doors close and look halfway respectable if you dont want to purcahase that aftermarket part.

You are building an RB-36, and it is important to know what went where:

Aluminum on the fuselage compartments that were pressurized for the crew to work in, and magnesium where it wasnt.. For the wings, follow the warbirds suggestion as well as the pictures below... Dont forget the shiney aluminun sheet on the center of the vertical stablizer as well

This is a cutaway view of an RB:

That caption talks about the ECM room being removed, If I remember right the specific RB you are building didnt undergo that conversion.... You will have to research that if you want a definative answer

Some RB pics & video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXPdpfujT2c&feature=related

Thanks for all the help la.

Hi lajntx,

Have you got a lot of resource material on the B-36? I have two books and as you pointed out should get two more. The reason I ask is I don’t have any good pictures of the remote controlled turrets. I thought that if it isn’t to complicated I would build mu RB-36 with the turret doors open and turrets pivoted up and locked into firing position. By the way I about got my model room back to modeling. Magoo

HI Magoo

If I remember correctly about 10 years ago or so someone out there was producing a resin set of turrets, but I have yet to date see anything pop up about that. The few builds I have seen with them ( I havent done it myself )  the builders typically hand carved them from scratch with a soft material and then used that to cast a resin mold to make theirs.

If you are insistent on doing this, then B-36 Peacemaker by Wayne Wachsmuth is a must. Dont try to find it in your book stores as it will be expensive. Ebay & Amazon for a used copy is best. Got mine off ebay for $15 + ship. New is going to run around $60. Just keep any eye on these two sites for a book that fits your price range.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=See-All-Categories&_from=R40&_kw=B-36+Peacemaker+In+Detail+Scale

http://www.amazon.com/B-36-Peacemaker-detail-scale-Vol/dp/B000KXJD9Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333029673&sr=8-1

Also, watch this newsreel from 1957 of the B-36 fleet being stripped down of resuable parts at Davis Monthan

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kx9HNAM1eKQ&feature=related

I would save the turret pics here to my PC, and have them printed at Walgreens ( or other place that will allow you to send them pictures to be printed from online )

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v20/jinxx1/B-36/#!cpZZ10QQtppZZ24

Also, contact Lucien. He is on here and the Arc forum. He is the B-36 model master

/themes/fsm/forums/thread.aspx?ThreadID=43242&PostID=454611&PermaPostID=454611

This was discussed about a year ago on here

/themes/fsm/forums/thread.aspx?ThreadID=139681&PostID=1462343&PermaPostID=1462343

Hate to keep picking away la..... BUT, in looking over the paint schemes for the plane I plan to build, So it's "shiney aluminum" on the pressurized compartments (includes tail section, minus stabilzers[other than strip on verticle stab]), a matte aluminum on the bomb bay & turret bay between cockpit-camera rm, most of wings (except walkways & top of part of fuselage which are "magnesium")? If I use the below reference "Metalic Steel" (would be "Matte Aluminum"), "Metallic Silver" (would be "Shiney Aluminum") & "Metallic Aluminum" (would be "Magnesium)???   Also, if I plan to use Alcad lacquers what would be the corresponding colors?  One last thing, the cushsions for the seats are labled "olive drab" in the directions, however in the link you provided of another builders plane he did them in red, but all the pics of cockpit show most everything zinc chromate.  As always thanks

[quote user="Reasoned"]

Hate to keep picking away la..... BUT, in looking over the paint schemes for the plane I plan to build, So it's "shiney aluminum" on the pressurized compartments (includes tail section, minus stabilzers[other than strip on verticle stab]), a matte aluminum on the bomb bay & turret bay between cockpit-camera rm, most of wings (except walkways & top of part of fuselage which are "magnesium")? If I use the below reference "Metalic Steel" (would be "Matte Aluminum"), "Metallic Silver" (would be "Shiney Aluminum") & "Metallic Aluminum" (would be "Magnesium)???   Also, if I plan to use Alcad lacquers what would be the corresponding colors?  One last thing, the cushsions for the seats are labled "olive drab" in the directions, however in the link you provided of another builders plane he did them in red, but all the pics of cockpit show most everything zinc chromate.  As always thanks  [ quote ]

You are confusing yourself. lol

Simple rule: Aluminum = Shiney, Magnesium/the rest  = Dull

Think of it this way... pull a sheet of aluminum foil. The shiney side is what your pressurized compartments should resemble. The other side is somewhat dull... the rest need to be that color. As far as what partiicular Alcads should be used... I couldnt tell you as I have never used them.

For the cockpit remeber this -

Think of the cockpit before anything is installed, all you have is the floor and the fuselage pannels and frames for the seats.... Those need to be the zinc chromate/olive drab. Anything control pannel, wall cover, instrument box, or something that is not part of a  base wall or floor = black. Seat cushion color is really a choice of your own. Ive seen pictures of the real thing in green, black, brown, and red. I choose to use red because it is a set off color that adds to what little you can actually see inside the greenhouse canopies.

If you really are insistent on punishing yourself on getting all the different metallic shades correct. Then read about this build and do what he does:

http://airfixtributeforum.myfastforum.org/archive/revell-1-72-convair-b-36h-rb-36f-peacemaker-04632__o_t__t_5076.html

Hey Everyone,

I just got in a couple more new photos I purchased from an archive liquidating old press release photos. The first is from 1949 showing the XC-99 in flight trial tests in Ft Worth with a then new B36-B bomber flying behind it. The second is from 1953 showing the difference in sizes of the Nuclear Bombers the Air Force had it`s disposal ( B-47, B-36, and nuclear armed F-84G) note: The F-84H would be the swept back version with the upgraded F-84K being used a couple years later in the FICON project a few here have expressed interest in constructing

I`ll enjoy them for a couple of weeks and show them off to a few friends that have aviation history insterests. Then ( like all other B-36 historical pictures I aquire ) will be donated to the B-36 Peacemaker Museum in Ft Worth, Texas, and entered in the archives so others will have access to them should they need to research the Peacemaker or are looking for unique photos for illustration.

http://www.b-36peacemakermuseum.org/

If anyone is remotely near Ft Worth, or passing through, I recommend stopping in for a visit.  If you can plan the trip at the right time, enjoy one of the lectures held each month:

http://www.b-36peacemakermuseum.org/Lectures/tabid/799/Default.aspx

Also, the museum is currently doing a fund raiser with a flight for 2 in a B-26 Bomber as the prize. Raffle Tickets are $10 each and drawing will be held June 12.  You need not be present to win. Please contact the museum at the above link for info on how to purchase a ticket(s)

I almost forgot. Don Pyeatt ( The historian at Peacemaker Museum ) and co-author and illustrator of many of the B-36 books on the market scanned and sent back to me an old slide I aquired on ebay a few months ago of the YB-36 on outside display  at the old AF Museum in Dayton, OH. This is just a few years before it was cut up and sold to Walter Soplata for scrap. You can see how a lack of maintence and being kept outside has really run the plane down.

Here is how it originally look in April 1958 ( Was sent to the Museum in Oct `57 )

And an undated photo from around the same time frame in the late 1950`s

I dig the Ju 88 in the foreground too!

Reasoned

I dig the Ju 88 in the foreground too!

Hi Reasoned, wasnt it you that posted the link to the Freeman Field Airshow over in the Aircraft Forum last fall?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=1723870789084

You might have to copy and paste the link in your browser to get it to play

That Ju 88 is prominent in that film from Sept `45

The static display of it begins at the 6:39 mark

 It was also flown during the air show, you can see the approach & landing at the 8:09 mark

 The Freeman Field Recovery project ( excavating the scrapped planes there ) also had a color photo of it from that Sept `45  as well:

Nope, not me but the more I model and learn about these subjects (any a/c), the more respect I have for the men/women who designed, made and flew them.  It also saddens me that many of these planes are either now endangered or extinct, given maned-flight has only been around about a century.

Reasoned

Nope, not me but the more I model and learn about these subjects (any a/c), the more respect I have for the men/women who designed, made and flew them.  It also saddens me that many of these planes are either now endangered or extinct, given maned-flight has only been around about a century.

You`ll like this story written by Walley Soplata - The late Walter Soplata`s son about growing up collecting old airplanes.

http://www.airspacemag.com/history-of-flight/soplata.html?c=y&page=1

It was the weekend your family had waited weeks for....

It finally came, and you loaded everyone, the picnic basket, and dog  into the the `47 Chevy............

The beach looked great, the water was blue,  and all was rather peacefully quiet

That is UNTIL you looked up and saw it coming straight at you...........................

Now THAT'S a fly-over!  Got the cockpit done over the WE, decided to do a piloted version (figured I hadn't done one for a long time) forgot how difficult painting figures to look realistic was, especially in 1/72!  I'll post pics soon of my "progress".

Has anyone begun construction on their kit yet?  I just read the last two pages of the thread and didn`t see anyone`s work...just wonderin`....

Len

We`ve taken the shrink wrap off the boxes does that count?

I start a new job next monday that offers a great benefit my current job quit offering called: "a day off". It`s going to seem weird to only work 40 hours over 5 days as opposed to 70-75 over 6.5 to 7 days.  My model building should go from 0-60 very quickly soon there after. The only downside is the hours: 6am-3pm

Ask and you shall receive.  As stated above, I've taken the unusual step of painting the figures (just seemed a shame to have them go to waste) and put them in the pit.  It's rough (and yeah, I took some liberties with the colors, even though I went for the Strategic Air movie look) but figured it would be tough to see through that monstorous greenhouse bubble.  I have some Alclad on order so hope to get after the NMF next week.  I think I'm going to paint this thing in sections (i.e., the wings unattached, fuselage w/o wings etc.) then put it together.

As I look at this, I really wish they would have had the figures a little more...... dynamic.

Hi All, Don’t give up on me yet, my model room clean out has been a whole lot more intense than I was expecting. I have also been having problems posting comments to the site. I can start typing and then things just freeze up. I have even got tired waiting g and just shut the computer off and went and did something else. Good news is I found my RF-84F Thunderflash model after unloading the front half of three shelves to get to the back half.  Of course it was the last shelf I unloaded that was the key shelf with the RF-84F. So all I can say is I have made some progress but not in model building but I can get started. I did find my two pictures of the modified F-84F with the nose latch and fuselage pins that resided at the Wright/Patterson USAF Museum in Dayton, OH. Magoo

Hi everybody, in an earlier post I thought I saw where someone said that the B-36 had hard points on the wings for attaching ordinance. Did I read that correctly and if so are there any pictures of such a load? Magoo

Andrew Magoo

Hi everybody, in an earlier post I thought I saw where someone said that the B-36 had hard points on the wings for attaching ordinance. Did I read that correctly and if so are there any pictures of such a load? Magoo

Uhmmmmm..... Nope. Would you attach ordinance to a wing that housed the fuel tanks and was prone to have fuel leaks?

Even with that, you have the issue of interference with the props to contend with as well.

You are probably thinking of a B-52 which did carry some ordinance that way

Reasoned

As I look at this, I really wish they would have had the figures a little more...... dynamic.

Nah. Just look at those flight engineers doing the Hokie Pokie!

You put your right arm in..... You take your right arm out....