Italeri 1:12 FIAT Mefistofele

I didn't know about the re-issue by Italeri!  Is it recent?  I love that car and might go for it if I can find one.  What are they going for?

Released last December.  I don't know about availability in your neck of the woods but it's not yet for sale here.  I got mine from Italy for about €165 including postage.

This is the old 70's kit by Protar but it's all in PS rather than the original die-cast metal body, chassis and wheels.

Are you still looking for someone who is building this model. I bought one a few weeks ago. So far I am impressed with the kit, seems pretty sharply moulded. Made some progress on the chassis but its been a bit slow.

That looks pretty neat and tidy. Mine is not quite so photogenic at the moment. We are at more or less the same stage, I'm just in the process of buidling up the crazy damper units.  So many things to say so I'll back up a little.

Modellingwise I generally do cars, F1 cars that are a little newer than this but my productivity is low. Too much family and work-stuff. When I saw the kit I thought wow, mostly because everything was so visible and the engine looked fantastic. I'd been reading a lot of WIP logs for WWI biplanes. I thought this build might be a good place to try brass, copper and wood effects.

Goalswise, I thought I'd try to replicate the car as it is today, 100 years old but still shiny. Not sure how that is going to work out. Primarily a lack of skill the main concern.

So I took the plunge and started building. I'll put some pictures on it when I can work out how. Highlights so far are: ages spent recreating teh chord covering on the springs. Not difficult and looks convincing but very time consuming. Also filled quite a lot of sink marks and sanded all those mould lines off. Currently have a box lid full of bits that need painting. Hopefully this weekend.

No idea what colours to use. The chassis kind of a grungy gloss black. The chords on the springs are oily black brown and beige in all sorts of shades. So next step is finish dampers and then undercoat.

Interested that you added some much later bits to the chassis. Haven't done that but it looks like a good idea.

I build all kinds of models and when I saw this kit I pretty much took to it for the same reasons as yourself.  The mob in the club won't believe me but it's not because I recently bought a 1/1 FIAT!

I think I understand what you're doing with the springs, I can see they have some kind of covering in actual photos, but I shan't bother myself.  I tend to build pretty much straight out of box in any case.

Today I came across a close-up of the rear spring attachment that showed that there is yet another error in the instructions!  Whereas the kit shows the rear springs slung below the attachment points in fact they apparently should be above.  I notice that some photos of completed models on the 'Net show them incorrectly mounted so I'm not the first to get caught.  Unfortunately, while the rear drive components can be removed from my chassis the suspension parts are cemented now.  I think I can dismantle it and rebuild correctly but it'll take much time and patience...

I found some shrinkage on one of the rear springs but very little elsewhere.  You're right; I fitted the chassis braces much earlier than indicated because I want then on prior to painting.  It was a lot easier to get them on at this stage too.

Your 1:1 Fiat presumably has a slightly smaller engine. I couldn't believe how big the motor in this one was when I opened the box.

Thanks for the tip about the rear springs. I still have time to correct the error you highlighted.

Another thing, given the care taken with the rest of the model, I was surprised at how short the screws on the springs are. I was thinking I probably need to use rod but may be cyano will be strong enough.

I did finally manage to get some paint on it at the weekend. I'll post some pictures when I get a chance (though it's only likely to be springs!!!!). You were right about binding the springs being a faff. Painted they are beginning to look quite good, though I am not sure I have captured the actual colours.

I am not planning on going mad with detail but there are one or two things I want to fix.

I am not sure that I can live with the screw heads. Filling them might be even more of a pain than the springs. The model shop suggested stretched biro. Hopefully, it won't come to that.

The other bit, at the moment, is that the planks on the firewall need to be up and down not side to side! But let's deal with that another day.

You’re right; my FIAT has a two-cylinder 0.875 litre engine, a mere 1/25^th the size of Mefistofele’s.  On the other hand, due to the advances in technology it produces a quarter of the power.  It’s the same car as in FIAT’s Mefistofele video.

Those 8mm No.14 screws that hold the 7mm spring shackles don’t have nearly enough bite to secure them into the plastic bushes on the chassis, which is why I cemented the joints after assembly.  I have now managed to completely dismantle the rear suspension and dampers and re-assembled it correctly, but I’m not going to use the screws this time.  I’ve purchased some .060” rod and made some rivets and drilled all the holes out to the same.  They’re still not correct of course but no worse than the screws - and much more secure.  When it’s all painted up I don’t think many will pick it.  I’ll probably do the same at the front too.

I hadn’t noticed that the lay of the firewall planks was incorrect – thanks for picking that.  I was planning to re-scribe the planks because the current lines are raised but I wanted to retain the moulded screw-heads.  Now I’m looking at covering the plastic with 0.5mm planking for model ships.

Michael

Another week gone and little time spent on the model. My next step is still spring painting. I fear they will not be as impressive as the amount of time or hype might suggest.

After your last post I had a think about how the rear springs would work. I was therefore pleased to see that they did at least assemble. I think my main concern was how the rear axle went through the bodywork. Have you had a chance to look at that yet. IF I manage to finish painting the springs I'll build the rear suspension the way you have to check it all lines up OK.

I think I will join you and replace some of the screws with rod. I went looking for hex rod. Our local model shop suggested biros stretched over heat so I may have a play with that.

I'll also try to take some pictures, though I mine is not neat and my bench is a dingy mess!

Oh the other thing I noticed on the pictures is that the long chassis rails at the front are C-shaped but the gap appears to be filled. Yet another reason not to make progress assembling the chassis and getting the painting done.

Nick

My workbench isn't too photogenic either - that's why I use the kitchen bench for photos.  Better lighting too.

Looking at some of the pictures I've downloaded from the 'Net I can see what you mean about the front chassis rails but I won't worry about it myself - as I've said I prefer to build pretty much out of box.  This is partly because if I start to get too involved in mods I lose momentum and get bogged down, all too often getting distracted by something else and 'shelving' the kit.  I'll be interested to see how you go with making hexagonal bolt heads however.

My concern about changing the orientation of the rear springs was that it might make the model sit tail-low so, to answer both your concerns and mine, I've mocked up the assembly of the body parts and fitted the wheels temporarily.  As you can see from the pics below the rear axle doesn't pass through the body and the chassis is level so I'm quite happy with the new arrangement.  If the rear springs were fitted as per the instructions it would sit about 10-12mm higher at the back.

Michael

Wow, it looks good when you get it on its wheels. 12 mm sounds a lot.

So I have now painted a spring! One fo the front ones. I will post a picture. I personify getting bogged down!

I've cut out the inserts for the frame.

One question if you don't mind me asking, how did you do the curved ends when you replaced the screws on the suspension?

Still thinking about hex heads. Trying to convince myself that painting the heads black will be good enough.

Very cool.  I just ordered this a few weeks ago.  Luckily I know the owner of the hobby store and he gave me 45% off!  :D    Otherwise I doubt I would have shelled out the $ for it at full retail. Then again I may have.  I love old Grand Prix cars.

 Crazy nice kit!  At least looks to be so far by the way yours is turning out!  Super work!

Hi Cody;

Yeah, it's an impressive kit alright, but it's showing its age.

For progress on another build see;

http://www.passionea300allora.it/forum/topic/45196-fiat-mefistofele-112-italieri/

I'd like to communicate with Maurillo but unfortunately it's all in Italian.  The photos are good - I'm not sure I'd follow his example in everything but it's interesting to compare his ideas with our builds.  Note his build has the rear springs mounted according to instructions so we can see how that pans out.

PS:  Here's another (from Germany I think).  Might have to cut and paste it - the link doesn't seem to work;

http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=55952

Hi folks!

A newbee from the UK here with my first post!

Great to see this thread - all the ones on the Mefistofele I've seen so far are either in Italian, German or French.

I bought this kit recently on UK Ebay for a good price and have been waiting to start my build.

Be warned, I'm a very slow builder (who likes a bit of scratch-building) but I do promise not to go silly with this one.

My first plan though is to rewire the wheels and extend the hubs outwards by a mm (or two). I will be extending the fins on the engine block and removing the moulded in chassis mounts. I will also try to build the radiator surround from solid brass...wish me luck and look forward to seeing progress on here!

John

Here's a comparison of how the model looks with the rear springs mounted as per the instructions and as I think it should be.  As you can see the tail is noticeably higher and the chassis no longer level in the second picture.

I think this confirms that the instructions are incorrect and that the springs should be mounted in the higher position.

I hope there aren't too many other such discrepancies.

Nick;

As you can see above, 12mm is a lot, though not quite as dramatic as I expected - perhpas because the chassis is so long.

I'm looking forward to seeing how your springs look.

Do you mean the 'domed' heads on the rivets?  If so, what I did was gently heat the end of the rod by holding it close to the flame on the gas hob and when it started to form a ball quickly pressed it onto a cold metal surface, forming a flat disc like a nail head.  Then I cut it off about 10-12mm back from this and put each one into the chuck of my motor-tool and shaped them on a sanding block.  I made the heads of those on the dampers somewhat smaller.

Hex heads would certainly look better but I honestly don't think the effort will be repaid once it's all painted black.  I'll be happy to be proved wrong however.

Hi John;

Welcome to the discussion.  This kit certainly inspires people to make that extra effort (all but me it seems) and I hope we'll see your build here soon.

One of my main concerns is getting the brass finish right but I certainly never considered using real brass - that should be interesting!  it's a pity Bare-Metal never did a brass foil - perhaps they decided it would tarnish in the packet and not sell.

I also meant to add some info about the light grey sprue in the kit...Michael, I see you've found the sink marks on the leaf springs already! On my kit the sink marks are also present around the cylinder sides, which is not apparent until they are cut from the sprue frame! Not a huge issue to fix, but given the kit price it's not very good. Tempted to ask Italeri for a replacement!

Cheers Michael!

Love the ride height pics...I was about to mock mine up after seeing your pointer on the hangers! Looks good.

My plan for the rad is to make the top in square brass and solder on a thin section for the surround. Hopefully if I get a solder line it will be in the same place as the on original car...although I think it may be a repair!!! :)

A pointer on the light grey (gray?) sprue. You've found the sink marks on the leaf springs, they are also on the sides of the cylinders. Not a big deal, but annoying and you don't notice them whilst attached to the sprue tree.

Keep up the good work!

John

Ta-dah!

So these are the front springs, obviously. I have tried to represent the somewhat rusty ancient look of the springs in the pictures. They seem to have been repaired at some point hence the bands of different colours. Colour down the sides (which you can;t) darker to represent dirt and at the back oil pickup. All paints are Tamiya acrylic: chord (brown, yellow and a touch of red); Iron (semi-gloss black). All is brush painted though using several very thinned layers. I'll try and get a better shot that shows the sides and the rear springs. Next step is to paint the axle auto grey undercoat and semi-gloss top coat. Probably sprayed.

On the rear ride height issue, I found the attached. The model has a very similar stance

Finally I promised a picture of my workspace.

My last post would have made more sense if the pictures I had attached had uploaded! There were supposed to be 3. Maybe that is too many. Course it could just be finger trouble.

 Front springs. Need to practice lighting I feel. Description on earlier post

Not having much luck with the pictures, Nick.

What method are you using?  I upload mine on Photobucket, then copy a [IMG]  link into here.  I have to edit it but eventually get it right.

The 'preview' tab will show you if it's going to work if you hit that before posting.

Springs side smallzpsdqx1xpis.jpg.html

Springs (I Hope)

small workbenchzpsaf6uz1ty.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1

Workbench

OK so that is a bit of progress. As you can see I haven't quite go the hang of this.

Car's going slowly too.

Maybe tidying my workbench would be a good idea!

Great Nick;

Good work on the springs, looks quite convincing.  What is the material you've used to cover the springs?  I'm not that au fait with old cars and I haven't seen springs covered like that - why do they do it?

As for the work-bench, I've seen many of the club member's work areas and yours is pretty normal.  I actually don't have a dedicated work area right now and much construction is done on a small table in front of the TV.  I have a shed out the back in which I'm going to build my modelling room - if I ever get started that is...  Got all the material, even insulation, just lack motivation.

Haven't touched my Mefistofele for a few days and I've got to get a newsletter produced by the end of the weekend so it'll have to wait a bit longer.

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the comments. I think the idea was that the binding protected the springs from water and dirt ingress and stopped them wearing out. Some of the comments I have seen suggest this may be a apocryphal. I guess that's why it's not common these days. I used black polyester thread stolen from my wife. Not hairy. Painted up nicely. I used cyano to anchor the thread while I bound it and then more to glue it all in place. Too much probably. Took absolutely ages and used massive amounts of thread. Crazy really.

So in about 2 months I have 4 springs to show for it. It's going to take a long time I fear!

A while since anyone posted on this. For me, progress has been slow and other things have had to have the attention.

The observation I wanted to make was about the engineering of the model. Sink marks aside, I have been impressed by the fineness of the moulding, particularly as I have not yet broken and of the really fine parts. The bit that's drivining me nuts are the screws. There are places where the components are screwed on in such a way that location is not guaranteed. A simple lug would do. Instead we have shiney non-scale screw-heads that need gluing anyway. I could understand if there was a strength consideration but this is not the case usually.

This more than anything else slows me down, as I try to find a satisfactory alternative that does not cost a fortune.

I just picked this kit up in Florence and have dragged it thru Italy, southern France, and now Paris. Probably should have waited and ordered it at home but really wanted it as a souvenir of this trip. Totally irrational but it has been fun and I'm really enjoying seeing the various builds of this kit. It really feels "international"