The Omni debarcle continues

Mike, I just did a search on the net for MM paints in Australia, and came back with nothing.

But all that means is that places with websites listed dont stock them, but maybe some small hs somewhere may have them, but that could take a while.

Ordering them from OS is an unlikely option, due to paints being flammable, it would have to come surface mail, 2-3 months.

In the mean time I have ordered another retarder brand, so I'll give it a go and see what happens.

Suffice to say, I have pretty much given myself up to the fact I will have to purchase another brush to do the finer detail I need.
Not a happy camper

Tweety1,

Do you have access to any Model Master enamels as I mentioned before?

Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by MusicCity That's most likely the case. When he said something about putting an o-ring on it the first thing that came to mind was that there isn't one there.

That is the case MusicCity.
At this point I'm willing to try anything possible to get this brush to work correctly.

MikeV, as far as retarders go, I posted a little earlier that I've tried 4 different types of retarder, and while the paint did take longer to dry on the test model, it didn't do alot for my brush.

That's most likely the case. When he said something about putting an o-ring on it the first thing that came to mind was that there isn't one there.

QUOTE: Originally posted by MusicCity QUOTE: Originally posted by tweety1 I'll try slipping an 'O' ring in the haed ass'y, to give me a little more play, and give that a go. Hang On!! Mike, shouldn't there already BE an o-ring on his Omni? My 3000 has an o-ring between the head and body assembly.

Yes there is. I think he meant putting an extra one on so that he could try and get a better seal.
The O-ring doesn't do a whole lot on the Omni's anyhow as you can sometimes see windex bubbling out of the head area when spraying out the airbrush. It is no big deal really.

Mike

I put the parts on my airbrushes finger tight + one snug more. Tell us how your test result goes, Salty.

hello guys, i back up after a lightning storm knocked out my modem saturday. my omni has an o-ring on the head assembly but i did airbrush for a while without it with no problems a while back. i just read the tightening or loosening the head thing so mike, i'll try that before i send to you. later.

My Omni 4000 and Vega have an O-ring between the head and body. I hope the others with Omni problems have the O-ring on their airbrushes. It would make an air leak (air pressure loss) problem without it.

QUOTE: Originally posted by tweety1 I'll try slipping an 'O' ring in the haed ass'y, to give me a little more play, and give that a go.

Hang On!! Mike, shouldn't there already BE an o-ring on his Omni? My 3000 has an o-ring between the head and body assembly.

I would buy a bottle of Model Master enamel and a can of their airbrush thinner and try that out just to see if the acrylics are your problem as they can be difficult at times. What I do is reverse that aircap on the end of the Omni 4000 so that the needle is exposed and then start painting your line. If the line skips then I will point the airbrush off into the air and blast a little paint with full trigger, then wipe the end of the needle clean with my fingernails as I blow air through the airbrush by pressing the trigger down only. Then try starting the line again.
You might want to see if you can find some acrylic retarder to slow down the acrylic drying time also as that seems to help a lot of people with bad tip dry problems.

Mike

Well, you can do the head up as far as the thread will let you, any further, and you no longer have a warranty!!!

I'll try slipping an 'O' ring in the haed ass'y, to give me a little more play, and give that a go.

QUOTE: Originally posted by kik36 Ahhh, well that explains why I don't have a clue what a "needle bearing"is, since I have the 5000. So Mike, do you think the needle bearing may be causing it to go askew? I checked mine again, and it is pretty smooth action, if it goes off center, it is so minimal as not be seen by human eyes.

No, the needle bearing wouldn't be causing this problem I don't think, but I could be wrong.

QUOTE: It must be good to have the inside track with the designer, eh Mike??!!

Actually he wasn't the designer but he along with a few other well-known T-shirt artists had some input on the design.

Mike

Ahhh, well that explains why I don't have a clue what a "needle bearing"is, since I have the 5000. So Mike, do you think the needle bearing may be causing it to go askew? I checked mine again, and it is pretty smooth action, if it goes off center, it is so minimal as not be seen by human eyes. It must be good to have the inside track with the designer, eh Mike??!! I hope that his suggestions help solve Tweety, and Saltydog's problems.....nothing like having a useless airbrush to ruin a modeling session.

QUOTE: Originally posted by tweety1 At first I would tighten it up finger tight, then with the supplied spanner, a quick nip up, and thats it. No more than 1 mm of movement from finger tight. Now I just do it up finger tight, cause I have the thing apart to clean so many times it's not funny.

The reason I asked is because I emailed my buddy and told him about the problem that you and Saltydog are both having, and he sent me the following email:

QUOTE: OK, all Omni 4000s that have the needle bearing come stock with a teflon unit. They are all solvent proof. It sounds like the head assembly is either too tight or too loose. Either condition will cause line skipping or a pulsating effect. In most cases, Omnis and Vegas like to have the head assy set finger tight only. Needle centering has nothing to do with the problem. The person in Alabama is probably having the same problem. The Omni 5000 does not ever come with a needle bearing, the 4000 is the only one, and not all of them have it. Tell both of these folks to try loosening the head a bit, and if that doesn't work, tighten it until the problem stops. Anthems are prone to the same thing.

I don't know if this helps or not but this is what he said and he helped design the Omni and Vega line.

Mike

I don't think it's the paint as I spray both Gunze & Tamiya without any issues what so ever from my 4000..

Come to think of it, I even spray Lifecolor, which contains coarser pigments than either of the other two brands without a problem.

Hope you get it sorted soon.

Karl

QUOTE: Originally posted by MikeV Tweety and Saltydog, How are you tightening the head on your Omni's? Are you using a wrench? Mike

At first I would tighten it up finger tight, then with the supplied spanner, a quick nip up, and thats it. No more than 1 mm of movement from finger tight.

Now I just do it up finger tight, cause I have the thing apart to clean so many times it's not funny.

Hrmm... does this problem happen with the Badger Anthem too?

My Omni 4000 works like an airbrush should. No problems. Even with a straight needle I didn't have a problem. If I bent the needle I can spray around corners with ease.
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Just kidding. My Omni works perfectly.

Tweety and Saltydog,

How are you tightening the head on your Omni's?
Are you using a wrench?

Mike

Moving to a better climate would definately be an option, but trying to convince the missuss to do that so I can ab might be a tad difficult

I would like to try other paints, but seeing as I have close to 100 pots of Tamiya and Gunze, if I bought 1 more paint pot, I would definately have time to model, as the missuss would leave me

I am 100% positive it is not paint clogging issues, or damage to parts of the brush, as I have tried different needle and nozzle combinations with the spares I ordered.

I have also tried 4 different types of retarder, and still no joy.

As for the ice cream man, he comes round here every Sunday, and we can eat our ice cream no problem, providing we eat it between the ice cream van and the front door, otherwise we end up with soup inside 5 minutes.

The air supply is fine, I added an external tank to keep the pressure up and continuous, and I have a filter and 2 water traps in line, so it rules that out.
The second trap was a good idea, as the we have an evaporative air con, and after I added the second trap, I was surprised to see how much moisture actually gets passed the first trap.

Saltydogs idea sounds pretty good to me, and hopefully Mike will be able to come up with a theory as to what the ? is going on.

If there is no joy, then I will have no option but to use the Omni for general coverage, and purchase an IWATA HP-BS for finer detail.

Today is a nice ice cream eating day in CA. I couldn't resist, it is so nice today and the ice cream truck came down the street conveniently stopping in front of my house...OK, I waved him down. I'm sure MikeV will do the same.

OK, serious now, and fast before the ice cream melts. If the problems isn't in the paint area then how about in the air supply. Any clogs in the air valve or the air passage to the paint?

I'm going to try my Omni 4000 and see if I have a problem.

QUOTE: Originally posted by kik36 Perhaps I'm blind, as Mike says that they should all do that?!

Actually they shouldn't do that but most do to a degree.

Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by saltydog rooster, i thought the same thing about my omni 5000. the only paint that i ever found that would spray well through the omni was tamiya acrylics. when i tried enamels, it would either spider or morse code if i tried the fine line. then, after about 3 weeks of not using the omni, i picked it up to do a little practicing with it and couldn't get the fine line i was accustom to with the tamiya or anything else. as you know, the omni is not complicated to breakdown and clean. i did a thourough clean making sure there was no debree anywhere, reassembled it and had the same result. then, i changed the needle and tip thinking that something may have been damaged, and i got the same results. i have no clue whats wrong with it but i'm thinking that tweety and i may have the same problem. later.

This is truly an odd case, as my Omni 5000 is spoiled, and eats MM enamels for breakfast. And I'm too good to her to make her eat Acry. I haven't had the spidering effects when I do a fine line, unless I accidentally pull the trigger back too far, and then it's a paint explosion!!! LOL I didn't notice my tip going slightly off center when I pulled it back though. Perhaps I'm blind, as Mike says that they should all do that?! I can honestly say without embarassment that this goes well beyond my knowledge and understanding. The Omni is a pretty simple break down, so you would think that it would be easy to trace.

roosterfish,

I think they just need to come out here to CA where the weather is perfect for painting.

Mike

rooster, i thought the same thing about my omni 5000. the only paint that i ever found that would spray well through the omni was tamiya acrylics. when i tried enamels, it would either spider or morse code if i tried the fine line. then, after about 3 weeks of not using the omni, i picked it up to do a little practicing with it and couldn't get the fine line i was accustom to with the tamiya or anything else. as you know, the omni is not complicated to breakdown and clean. i did a thourough clean making sure there was no debree anywhere, reassembled it and had the same result. then, i changed the needle and tip thinking that something may have been damaged, and i got the same results. i have no clue whats wrong with it but i'm thinking that tweety and i may have the same problem. later.

Maybe the pigments in the paint are too large for the airbrush? Or at some time a large pigment got stuck in the brush at some point and is still lodged in the nozzle to build up and cause a dry tip problem.

Sorry, I'm still thinking along the clog angle.

QUOTE: Originally posted by tweety1 Mike, I use both Tamiya and Gunze acrylics. I have gone through around 5 pots of each brand while testing this brush, and have used thinner ratios from 50/50 to both sides of the scale.ie more paint/less thinner, less paint/more thinner. While trying the above, the air pressure has been increased and decreased from 50 psi down to 5 psi at 2 psi intervals.

I wonder if it is just because of the nature of acrylics along with that warm weather you have down under? Can you try enamels such as Model Master and see how they react?

QUOTE: The needle has scuff marks on 1/3 of it's circumferance, and these sit roughly where the needle bearing is situated in the brush body.

My Omni 4000 has the same marks on it's needle and it is normal.
If the needle did not have scuff marks on it then the bearing would not be sealing tight enough to do it's intended job.

Mike

tweety, my needle is off centered when i draw the trigger back and like mike said, it is so with my 2 iwatas as well. it doesnt effect my 2 iwatas spray pattern though so i dont think that has anything to do with our problem.

mike, email me your mailing address and i'll send you my omni 5000 and let you play with it and see what gives. mine is doing the exact same thing as tweety's it seems and i've put 3 or 4 brand new tips and needles in, varying psi and thinning ratios with no luck. maybe you can find the problem with mine then help tweety with his. the only difference between a 5000 and 4000 is the size of the cup. let me know if your interested and i'll ship it to you along with some money to return it with. let me emphasize the word "RETURN". later.

Mike, I use both Tamiya and Gunze acrylics.
I have gone through around 5 pots of each brand while testing this brush, and have used thinner ratios from 50/50 to both sides of the scale.ie more paint/less thinner, less paint/more thinner.

While trying the above, the air pressure has been increased and decreased from 50 psi down to 5 psi at 2 psi intervals.

The needle has scuff marks on 1/3 of it's circumferance, and these sit roughly where the needle bearing is situated in the brush body.

A picture would be alot easier, but I have no idea how to place a picture in your post, let alone getting a decent enough image to show exactly whats happening.

Sean

QUOTE: A needle bearing is designed to keep paint in the front part of the airbrush and not allow paint to reach the air valve assembly. It is also used to align the needle with the bore of the body of the airbrush. The Omni 3000 has what is called a "Line-bore" design in which it does not use a needle bearing. I am not sure of the advantages or disadvantages of this design but I can find out for you if you are interested.

Thanks, Mike. I would be interested in knowing. If there are advantages to it I might try to add one from another Omni model or fabricate something that would work. I'm very content with my Omni, and have no desire to get anything different, but I'm not opposed to a little "Hot Rodding" either

QUOTE: Maybe I'm acting a tad foolish on this, but something tells me this isn't right for an airbrush carrying such a heavy reputation

I don't think you are being foolish at all. If it isn't working right you should try and get it right. Not being able to paint more than an inch or two without havint the tip dry out is not right. I don't know if it's the paint or the airbrush, but Badger is a first-rate company and I think they'll do what they can to help.