Thinning Tamaya

No, it's the black space on the map…

(updated) 

That someone who told you not to reduce Tamiya (or anything else) with Windex was probably me. You are a braver man than I , Gunga Din.

I would worry about long term stability of the Tamiya reduced with Windex. OTOH, some latex paints do use ammonia compounds as co-solvents. It is possible that Tamiya is a latex modified acrylic, or (less likely) an acrylic modified latex. The former would explain it's tendency for tip-dry and its odd reaction to retarder under the wrong circumstances. (Don't ask. Here there be dragons.) 

Bgrigg wrote:

Typically I use 2 or 3 parts paint to 1 part thinner, but Tamiya's XF line can endure even thinner than that. I've heard of people using 1 to 1 or even 1 part paint to 2 parts thinner! What I really look for is the consistancy of 2% milk.

I'm going by the 2% milk rule and it seems to work great...It is true that you can get Tamiya very thin. I accidently squeezed to much thinner in once, and it was almost a below-watery consistency, but it still airbrushed ok. I remember someone telling me not to do this, but I thin with Windex sometimes. I get horrible tip dry if I thin MM Acryls with Windex, but Tamiya does fine for some reason.

PhilH,

Yipe! Well, if it works for you, great! As with almost everything airbrush: YMMV.

Typically I use 2 or 3 parts paint to 1 part thinner, but Tamiya's XF line can endure even thinner than that. I've heard of people using 1 to 1 or even 1 part paint to 2 parts thinner!

What I really look for is the consistancy of 2% milk.

For the second part the correct answer is "depends"!  Both ways are typical, and depends on the ability to paint all sides of the part when they are glued in place.

Hi can someone please help ? What ratios of paint and thinners do you use ?

I have been using 4 or 5 paint to 1 thinners. I have used 1 and a half xf59 on a tank alreday and i have only done the bottom half  

Also, should i glue the shovels and guns etc on the tank paint it all xf59 ( yellow) and repaint them after it has time to dry, or paint them before and then glue them on after the hull colour

Thank you

Here in Aus, IPA seems to sell at about $10.00 (Aus) for 250ml and seems difficult to get hold of. On the other hand, methylated spirits (ethanol) is about $3.50 per litre at the supermarket. I'd like to try IPA if it were more readily available.

I haven't encountered any compatibility problems when using ethanol as a thinner. None that I've noticed anyway.

It does tend to "flash dry" very quickly, but perhaps my higher than "normal" thinning ratio and the addition of retarder helps in this regard. It also helps that I am spraying from no more than 4 inches max, though thats more because thats how I've come to do it rather than any sort of allowance for the medium.

It's worked ok for me so far.

Add one small drop of acrylic retarder and kiss tip-dry adieu. Golden, Createx, Liquitex, whatever. A bottle will cost you less than $ and last a lifetime.

Isopropyl 90% is what, $3.00 a bottle for 12-16 oz? Just do the math. 

ben1227 wrote:

You said methylated spirits is ok to use for thinning Tamiya's...Here in America I think they label it as Denatured Alcohol, which is mainly ethanol denatured with methanol. Does it thin any differently than normal isopropyl alcohol? Iso has either 30% (if you buy 70% alcohol) or 9% (if you buy 91% alchol) water content, not pure alcohol.

Yes, denatured alcohol will behave differently with Tamiya paints, and is marginally incompatible with some of them. It also evaporates much faster than isopropyl of either concentration.

Use 90% isopropyl. If you want faster evaporation, add a little denatured or methyl alcohol. If you want slower evaporation, add a little distilled or deionized water.

Don't use the 70% isopropyl, as you never know what is in the water used to dilute it. Most 70 % stuff is shipped as 90% or higher, then diluted locally with tap water. Some of the things in tap water that are perfectly fine to drink will play hob with paint. 

Phil_H wrote:

Water tends to break down the adhesive properties of Tamiya paint. It also increases its tendency to bead rather than flow, and thats definitely something you don't want. As previously suggested by hkshooter, use Tamiya thinner for best results. Alternately, IPA. I have used methylated spirits, which (in Australia) is 95-98% ethyl alcohol and add a drop or two of acrylic retarder to the mix. I have found that Tamiya paints, particularly the flat colours,  can be thinned far more than what most people suggest. It's not unusual for me to go 4:1 thinner to paint for base colours, or 1:1 when I need denser coverage. As far as water goes, I only use it for cleaning up afterwards. I'll go a little further to add that thinning ratios are only a guide, they are not set in stone. Viscosity can vary from one colour to another and from one production batch to another. Even if you buy two jars of the same colour, if you leave one on the shelf unopened and use the other to brush paint for an hour or so, evaporation of thinner out of the open jar will mean that the used jar is "thicker" than the new one. So thinning ratios can be a rough guide, but in the end, thin it to the consistency that works for what you are doing.

You said methylated spirits is ok to use for thinning Tamiya's...Here in America I think they label it as Denatured Alcohol, which is mainly ethanol denatured with methanol. Does it thin any differently than normal isopropyl alcohol? Iso has either 30% (if you buy 70% alcohol) or 9% (if you buy 91% alchol) water content, not pure alcohol.

Hi Guys!!!

Thanks for the great responses!

 I think i will try some of the other ideas such as the Metholated spirits rather than going out and paying for the thinner.

Thanks again!

There are two options for thinning Tamiya acrylics.

Tamiya's proprietary thinner, which I have been told is 90% alcohol with a retarder added, although I have not checked the MSDS.

Isopropyl alcohol, 90+%. This is much cheaper than the Tamiya thinner. However, if you use it to reduce (commonly, thin) Tamiya for spraying, you should also add a tiny drop of acrylic retarder, such as those made by Golden, Liquitex, etc. available from any place that sells artist's supplies. This is by far (about 500%, IIRC) the more economical route. It also has the advantage that you have the retarder handy for brush painting. (Do not add retarder, alone, directly to the paint. Mix it with isopropyl first or it may cause the paint to do funny things.)

For brush painting, add a tiny drop of retarder to a small amount of isopropyl, dip your brush in that before you dip it in the paint, and each time you load the brush. Never brush paint directly from the jar.

I also use Tamiya thinner (X-20A) and have always had good luck.  I have also found that isopropyl alcohol works well, but add a drop of acrylic retarder or you may have big tip dry problems because the alcohol speeds drying times. 

There are cheaper alternatives that may yield great results.

My friend Greg (Plasticmod992) told me he prefers Ethyl Alcohol 70% with Tamiya paints and it has worked great for me so far.  

Water tends to break down the adhesive properties of Tamiya paint. It also increases its tendency to bead rather than flow, and thats definitely something you don't want.

As previously suggested by hkshooter, use Tamiya thinner for best results. Alternately, IPA. I have used methylated spirits, which (in Australia) is 95-98% ethyl alcohol and add a drop or two of acrylic retarder to the mix.

I have found that Tamiya paints, particularly the flat colours,  can be thinned far more than what most people suggest. It's not unusual for me to go 4:1 thinner to paint for base colours, or 1:1 when I need denser coverage.

As far as water goes, I only use it for cleaning up afterwards.

I'll go a little further to add that thinning ratios are only a guide, they are not set in stone. Viscosity can vary from one colour to another and from one production batch to another. Even if you buy two jars of the same colour, if you leave one on the shelf unopened and use the other to brush paint for an hour or so, evaporation of thinner out of the open jar will mean that the used jar is "thicker" than the new one. So thinning ratios can be a rough guide, but in the end, thin it to the consistency that works for what you are doing.