Vallejo Paints

BlackTulip109;

The only thing I would say about thinning with water is that it dries based more on humidity than anything else.  If you add water to the paint and it is dry inside your build area, it will still dry fast on you.  The retarder is "usually" some form of glycerine type stuff that slows the drying of the water in the paint.  That is why the retarder looks a lot like a clear gel.  I have never used a retarder while airbrushing, just a flo-aid.  I think some of the thinners have retarders in them but I am not sure.

For brush painting, I use a wet palette if I am going to be doing a long session with a brush and fine detail.  You can search the web on the wet palette, but I made one with the sponge, distilled water, and parchment paper.  It keeps the paint wet on the paper for over a week when sealed properly in a container.

For airbrush thinning, there are three things to keep in mind from my experience:

1.  Air pressure

2.  Paint viscosity

3. Atmospheric conditions

The recommendations for thinning ratios are very good to start with, but a hot dry climate will tip dry your work much quicker than a cold damp one.  Heavy black paints will need more thinning than thin white pigments.  You can spray molasses if you use a big needle and 50psi.  If you want to do some fine detail lines, you will need very thin paint and low pressure.  Practice is the only real way to get comfortable with it.  When you find the right combo that works for you, it opens the doors to a lot of fun.

Good luck and enjoy the process.

John

Thanks PilotJohn!!!

It's a bunch of new info to keep in mind but I look forward to the challenge.

Right now now with 10ish degree temperatures the house is more on the dry side on the inside, humidity about 25%

What psi's do you recommend?

Thanks again!!

First, let me say I should have said that for brush painting, I use the retarder medium.  They make a fluid retarder which is more like water which I think would be better for airbrushing.

This is a tough question as there are folks on here who produce some really awesome work who are much better than I am, but what I look at when I am getting ready to paint is what is my end result that I am after?  For general coverage of say a fuselage or a wing with one color, I use a mixture thinned to spray nicely at about 18 psi and 4 to 6 inches from the surface.  If I am mottling a Bf-109, I would use a much thinner paint and about 10 psi and about an inch or less from the surface.

What I did was get a piece of sheet styrene, prime it up and then start mixing paints and additives (like thinners, mediums, flo-aid, etc) and then trying different settings and spraying away.  I found at one point that I reached a happy center not so much around how many drops of this vs that but rather the consistency of my paint to what I wanted to accomplish.  Thin paint and low pressure for fine close work.  Thicker paint and higher pressure for more general coverage.  A lot of the threads take about getting your paint about like 2& milk and go from there.  I would agree.  I don't think that there is a universal formula that works all the time for all makes and brands of products.  Currently I add the medium for thinning, then add the paint, stir it up in the color cup of the airbrush, check the sides of the cup to see about the 2% milk consistency and when I am happy, add a couple drops of the flo-aid and then start spraying.  I adjust the paint and/or pressure then as needed for my desired result.  Keep a notebook with what you used and what you find and you will settle to a recipe that works for you.

John

Thanks again for this information John, I plan to put it to use.

As this saga continues I happened into a different Hobby Lobby yesterday and found a few more paints at $1.79 to pick up BUT one of the fellas in the Framing dept a graduate Art Student ponytail, beard and in jeans was very informative and helpful about the paints. He let me know there has been a technological revolution in acrylic paints!!! How the pigments are made mixed etc, the various mediums and retarders to use

AND

As most have said on this thread it is best to use the thinners, mediums, retarders etc of that manufacturer especially Vallejo as well as others. There are a host of new ones coming out shortly as others want to cash in on this revolution. Lots of folks like the ease of using these acrylics and clean up with soap and water, no smells or toxicities.

In the next couple days I should have the mediums and retarders I orderd and I'll put them to use and post what I find.

My daughter said she will work with me so perhaps I can post pictures

Thank you to everyone you all have been most helpful

Well

I received my SPrue Brothers order and wouldn't you know it they forgot the "Thinner" I ordered-innocent mistake I am sure they'll make good on it.

When I e-mailed them back i asked if they could throe in a RLM #65 Luftwaffe.

Couldn't paint this weekend as we had some family issues come up and had to travel and my son Joey had "Pine Wood" derby Saturday.

Since I started this thread I sure have learned a great deal and want to thank you ALL again. I am excited to start using these paints.

I did lightly spray coat a primer using the Rust-O-Leum for plastic paint from a spray can. (Just a a small amount smelled up the model room in the basement)

When it dried I hand painted the top of Joey's 1/72nd Yak-1  using the Vallejo and when that stuff dried you could not tell it was hand painted!!! I used the paint right out of the bottle. Can't wait to try it in the airbrush but I'll wait to get the thinner from Sprue Bros first.

Until next time have a great week everyone.

My daughter comes home from school soon for Spring Break then I'll try to post pictures!!

Coming home from a job i found a HobbyTownUSA shop and they had the Tamiya Acrylic  paints some of you have mentioned.

he didn't have too many as he is awaiting a shipment to renew his stock. He mentioned one can thin them using de-natured alcohol when airbrushing. i bought the RLM65 I am looking for and thought I would experiment with that one.

Anyone use denatured alcohol? Is it OK for Vallejo?

Let me know

Thanks

Denatured alcohol is ok for the Tamiya Acrylics, as is Isopropyl alcohol.

However, attempting to use it with Vallejo will turn the paint into a sticky ball of goo. It's not compatible.

BlackTulip,

I just read back at some of your post, and like John, when working up close I work thin and around 10 or 12 psi.  When I'm going for large coverage, I usually work at around 20 psi.  As for thinning, with light colours I thin about one third thinner two thirds paint, and dark colours two thirds thinner one third paint.  You'll find darker colours drop out of the Vallejo bottle 'thicker'.  How I know I've got my consistency right is to stir with a toothpick, and wipe up the side of the airbrush cup with it.  If I the paint does not run back down, too thick, if it runs back down and leaves almost no colour, too thin.  If it leaves a good colour stain, but still runs back down, I shoot with that mixture.  Not to discount the 2% milk idea, but it's hard to visualize when you're mixing the paint.  Again, just my technique.  

Thank you Andrew and Phil for your input !!

The owner at Hobby Town told me to thin the Tamiya Acrylic with denatured Alcohol. I bought one bottle of the RLM 65 as most of the other stock was sold out.

I am more focused on the Vallejo and when SprueBrothers sends the thinner I will proceed to try it out.

I dug out my airbrush and I have a double action Pasche !!

Years ago I used it to spray the British paints of Accuscale and Compucolour which in my opinion were AWESOME enamel paints, very realistic!!!

BUT

I had to use Acrylic Lacquer Thinner which is awesome thinner BUT does smell and is toxic. I used to either spray outside or I had had a homemade exhaust booth I had made using a bathroom exhaust fan set up which worked really well.

Anyway keep comments and suggestions coming I continue to learn alot about this new acrylic technology and really welcome it.

Good news SPRUE BROTHERS came through with the Vallejo Air Brush Thinner that was missing from my order

SO

When I have a chance I will put it to use and post my progress!!

Did some initial painting with the .Vallejo paints.

Got to say on first impression it goes down very nicely, dries fairly quickly and evenly.

Clean up is great. I ran water followed by denatured alcohol to clean up the airbrush.

No spitting or bubbling

I also hand painted some and was very happy to see no brush marks.

I am liking these paints more and more.

Best of all no smell or chemicals on my hands!!!

I occasionally use 91% isopropyl alcohol to thin my acrylics(Tamiya and Model Master Acryl), and a drop or two of window cleaner if it appears to be drying too fast.

Also,Vallejo's Air line white is the most opaque white I have ever seen. A good friend of mine used it over a RLM 66, one and a half coats of the Vallejo white,no bleed through.

Thanks Allen I'll pick up some Air line white !!

I would be a bit wary of using window cleaner in the airbrush.  Those are ammonia based and many folks use them to clean out the airbrush.  I am not familiar with them being used to slow tip drying.

John

Oh,I didn't mean in the airbrush. I add it to the bottle.

Haven 't had any negative effects after running said bottle through my airbrush later.

Vallejo seems to have ALL the bases covered.

I have now used the Air Brush Thinner and the Retarder in my Air Brush(AB) cup and it appears to be working well here in Indiana with very cold conditions outside and humidity at 30% inside the house.

This may all change when we start into the Late Spring Summer months.

There is a place in England called E-Models they have Vallejo, Hataka(from Poland) and a third brand and their prices are OK but the shipping is not bad plus when they subtract the VAT to us Yanks here in the states it's an attractive price.

I am going to put an order in later this week and I'll report back

Thanks everyone.

I'll be doing some more AB'ing over the weekend!!

I am starting to get spoiled using these acrylics.

As I mentioned previously I gave my son a large number of assorted kits to  build and learn on. He built them without painting them.

SO we now are painting and using this opportunity for learning how to brush and airbrush.

What I really enjoy about the Vallejo and perhaps the others is the very quick set up time, somewhat easy application BUT big help is they easy clean up!! We can do a little work about a half hour before he has to go to bed. This has served as a motivation for him to get his studies done.

In addition, while waiting for the acrylics to arrive I tried the RUST-O-LEUM spray can paint that can be used on plastc. The nozzle technology is really advanced compared to spray cans years ago.

If you are careful to "dust" it on the finish is awesome. Some of the colours they have come very close.

Since I like slightly "combat" aged or faded looks these seem to really fit the bill!!

Some of the SMER Italian a/c Joey built we used the spray cans for desert camo and dabbed on the "splotches" with some pieces of real sponge we found when we were in florida last December and it looks really nice.

MOST importantly Joey's confidence is growing and he is excited to build more kits at some point I'll let him do some painting on his own.

Once again I am so grateful for all of you on this FORUM years ago it would have taken a long time to get information and help. I still remember as a kid trying to match colours with "box art" L.O.L.!!!(laugh out loud). This is a lot of fun and great mental health after a long day at work.

My wife likes it because Joey's not playing with her I-Pad!!

Later everyone!!

Curious why you are buying Vallejo from overseas if you are in Indiana, or did I miss something?

Hey Greg

Sorry for delay I was out of town

Locally we do not have the specific Vallejo colours.

I know Sprue Bros carries them but when I came across e-models there were a couple other company's paints I wanted to try and shilling was not bad plus with the VAT subtracted it made and attractve price

My son and I have now painted about 9 of his models. These are an assortment of 1/72nd Russian and Italian WW2 a/c kits from a few manufacturers(Supermodel, Airfix, Heller) and a few 1/48 Monogram and SMER kits.

I am trying to keep it  easy so he has fun and builds confidence, plus I want to get comfortable using an airbrush again and work these paints.

So far it's going OK it's a lot easier than enamels

BlackTulip109

Hey Greg

Sorry for delay I was out of town

Locally we do not have the specific Vallejo colours.

I know Sprue Bros carries them but when I came across e-models there were a couple other company's paints I wanted to try and shilling was not bad plus with the VAT subtracted it made and attractve price

Ahh, I see what you were getting at now. Thanks for taking the time to explain.

I agree we northern Hoosiers don't have Vallejo available locally, and FWIW I'm a heavy user of them.

Last night I prepared one of Joey's SMER 1/50 RE_2000 models for painting. We had to sand it down quite a bit.

As I stated earlier I wanted to give Joey some experience putting kits together and he did fine job under the circumstances of the quality of those SMER kits.

As a reward he really wanted a Revell Germany 1/72 JU-88 and HE-115 and I found both on e-bay for a great price. They came in yesterday's mail and we were checking them out at breakfast this morning.

So he's going to do the JU-88 first lets see how this works out

Sorry to drag up this old post but it seems to tie into what I am looking for.  My models are cast meatal, and I am going to experiment with Vallejo acrylics.  I'll be using their Model Air primer and their top coats with an airbrush.  I have heard that when they dry, they are fragile and will scrath easily.  I am concerned about that, so I am curious if a professional automotive acrylic would go over the top of the Vallejo paints ? 

I am old school and would like to get that deep gloss finish over my decals.  So it would be nice to mount the decals on top of the Vallejo colors.  Then seal them with the autobody acrylic clears (which I believe are lacquer based).  Once I get rolling with the clears, I know I can put on a lot of coats.  Then polish them out.

Is this realistic or should I try the Vallejo clear gloss urethanes?  Will these give me that deep clearcoat gloss look? 

BlackTulip109

Coming home from a job i found a HobbyTownUSA shop and they had the Tamiya Acrylic paints some of you have mentioned.

Is that the one in Granger? Just curious.

At Hobby Lobby there is a good degree of variability from store to store on merchandice. One near me has lots of vallajo, while a different store I know of doesn't carry it. If it sells at one location and not another, the one it doesn't sell at will discontinue while the other will continue to stock it.