Completed Hasegawa 1/72 J2M3 Raiden Jack Type 21 Plus Friends

I wasn't asking you to explain it to me, Toshi. LOL!

I was just thinking about it, that's all. lolOLOLOLOL.

M. Brindos

Interesting....

If it were Iron Oxide however, it would turn brown over time. Just as the the iron in our blood does when exposed to oxygen. So it's obviously not an Iron Oxide coating. So I'm really trying to figure out if they used a red paint or if it was an orange paint of some type. Obviously the red pigment was dominate if it turned pink, but the descriptive word "Salmon" suggests a possibly orange color that faded to pink. Since our aircraft industry was quite fond of using orange paints to draw attention to important things, this doesn't seem overly out of place. Its just weird that no one had ever heard of it before they dredged up that plane. And why paint an entire tail wheel bay in such a manner?

This is really a curiosity to me.

 

Toshi

Interesting....

If it were Iron Oxide however, it would turn brown over time. Just as the the iron in our blood does when exposed to oxygen. So it's obviously not an Iron Oxide coating. So I'm really trying to figure out if they used a red paint or if it was an orange paint of some type. Obviously the red pigment was dominate if it turned pink, but the descriptive word "Salmon" suggests a possibly orange color that faded to pink. Since our aircraft industry was quite fond of using orange paints to draw attention to important things, this doesn't seem overly out of place. Its just weird that no one had ever heard of it before they dredged up that plane. And why paint an entire tail wheel bay in such a manner?

This is really a curiosity to me.

So this is what I have.  The cockpit color is:

XF-5 : 2 (Flat Green)

+XF-8 : 1 (Flat Blue)

Which looks to me like a bluish green zinc chromate.

The tail end is:

X-17 : 5 (Pink)

+X-21 : 2 (Flat Base)

+XF-9 : 1 (Hull Red)

So your statement of the red being corroded over time makes sense in that it turned pink.

Toshi

M. Brindos

Salmon Pink?? That must have been some weird faded Red Oxide of some sort. I've never heard of them using that color in a cockpit before.

Makes me think about just how much we really know about such highly documented subjects. ???

 

Toshi

Salmon Pink?? That must have been some weird faded Red Oxide of some sort. I've never heard of them using that color in a cockpit before.

Makes me think about just how much we really know about such highly documented subjects. ???

M. Brindos

Just like the debates over Luftwaffe colors, it seems the IJN color debates will lend itself to some "interpretation" and artistic lisence.

To me, that means there is a bit of freedom when working with my builds.  :D

These conversations do make for some very interesting reads. Can't help that I like these types of topics lol.

:)  waiting to see what comes up next!

 

1) Interpretation

2) Artistic license 

This reminds me of the Corsair brought up in one of the Great Lakes.  All of a sudden, the section of the Corsairs interior is now salmon pink.  I don't know about how other forum members feel about salmon pink but, green zinc chromate just happens to be the color I choose to utilize.  Why?  Because most importantly more than anything else, I'm having fun!  LOL!  I mean no disrespect for those that build for accuracy.

Toshi

Just like the debates over Luftwaffe colors, it seems the IJN color debates will lend itself to some "interpretation" and artistic lisence.

To me, that means there is a bit of freedom when working with my builds.  :D

These conversations do make for some very interesting reads. Can't help that I like these types of topics lol.

:)  waiting to see what comes up next!

JOE RIX

Very nice progress Toshi. It would appear to me that you have some healthy gaps along the upper wing to fuselage joint you might want to address. My experience is that you can encounter some fit issues with these older Hasegawa kits. On the 1/72 FW 190 F-8 I built a while back I had to some healthy work on the lower fuselage where the wings attached on both the forward and rear areas.

I addressed your question concerning my Tamiya 1/72 Corsair on my my WIP thread if that's OK.

I can atest to the mind boggling debate concerning Aotake colors/use. Research on my IJN aircraft was certainly filled with debate and speculation. I think it is second only to the debate on correct Luftwaffe colors in opinions.

 

Thank you for addressing my inquiries in regards to your Tamiya 1/72 Corsair build.  I will definately be on that thread reading your reply to my questions.  

Boy, between the IJN and the RLM Luftwaffe colors, this makes an interesting build as well as a conversation.  Thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedule in accommodating my simple questions, I so value our conversations!

Toshi

Very nice progress Toshi. It would appear to me that you have some healthy gaps along the upper wing to fuselage joint you might want to address. My experience is that you can encounter some fit issues with these older Hasegawa kits. On the 1/72 FW 190 F-8 I built a while back I had to some healthy work on the lower fuselage where the wings attached on both the forward and rear areas.

I addressed your question concerning my Tamiya 1/72 Corsair on my my WIP thread if that's OK.

I can atest to the mind boggling debate concerning Aotake colors/use. Research on my IJN aircraft was certainly filled with debate and speculation. I think it is second only to the debate on correct Luftwaffe colors in opinions.

Tanker - Builder

Ah ! Toshi San !

   This is welcome to me .The Jack is one of my favorites ! I will be following you very close on this one . And they're small enough to fit on my overcrowded shelves ! .  T.B.

 

Thank you Tanker - Builder for following my build(s).  I highly appreciate this.  

Toshi

Ah ! Toshi San !

   This is welcome to me .The Jack is one of my favorites ! I will be following you very close on this one . And they're small enough to fit on my overcrowded shelves ! .  T.B.

Phil_H

 

 

M. Brindos

Really? I thought they were all in the same green/blue anodized color. ???

 

 

It seems the cockpit was green (Tamiya XF-71 works well for this) but other areas like the gear bays were lacquered with "aotake".

http://www.aviationofjapan.com/2010/02/aotake-part-one.html

 

Toshi

tigerman

Love Japanese A/C. This should be fun to watch.

 

Toshi

I'm done for this evening.  Tomorrow, I need to clean up a few things, then I can primer with the intention of applying the first coat of the Raiden!

So far at this point, I have had no fit issues at all and very little sanding of the seams. As for any putty, it is at best, non-existence.  Hasegawa has done nicely in respect to this kit even for it's age!

Toshi

Love Japanese A/C. This should be fun to watch.

M. Brindos

Yep.

 

 

Toshi

Yep.

M. Brindos

You weren't reading my old, forgotten, and incomplete Apache thread were you??

LOL. If you can find it, look for the teddy bear. 

 

Toshi

feldgrau23

 

 

Toshi

 

 

M. Brindos

Wow. There really is a ton of space in that pit for scratch building stuff. That pit is huge.

 

 

 

 

Yes, there is especially for someone like you.  Knowing you, you would trick this cockpit out!  

 

Toshi

 

 

 

 

Some how Toshi when you say this I can picture Mike hanging fuzzy dice around the gun sight and a hulu dancer in front of the gun sight!! LOL

 

The Raiden is coming along nicely my friend!!! Excellent work!!

 

You weren't reading my old, forgotten, and incomplete Apache thread were you??

LOL. If you can find it, look for the teddy bear. 

Toshi

 

 

M. Brindos

Wow. There really is a ton of space in that pit for scratch building stuff. That pit is huge.

 

 

 

 

Yes, there is especially for someone like you.  Knowing you, you would trick this cockpit out!  

 

Toshi

 

Some how Toshi when you say this I can picture Mike hanging fuzzy dice around the gun sight and a hulu dancer in front of the gun sight!! LOL

The Raiden is coming along nicely my friend!!! Excellent work!!

M. Brindos

Wow. There really is a ton of space in that pit for scratch building stuff. That pit is huge.

 

Toshi

Wow. There really is a ton of space in that pit for scratch building stuff. That pit is huge.

Here is what's been done for this evening.  There's so much controversy in regards to Aotake.  Boy, my people can be a PITA sometimes!  LOL!  LOL!  I want to personally thank all of you forum members that have contributed to this thread especially in regards to the colorization of the cockpit.  It brings us together and enlighten us all in new or old information.  The world can learn so much in the unity that we have here!

Toshi

Ashley

 

 

M. Brindos

Really? I thought they were all in the same green/blue anodized color. ???

Shows how much I know.

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, this aotake thing is a puzzlement, and there are as many ideas about it as there are historians. Some say it was a corrosion preventative, still others maintain it was a layout aid, like dykem, and everybody has a different idea what color it was. Plus, it seemed to change colors with exposure! I painted all my Japanese interiors with it until I got the original Japanese Interiors books, the thin little softcover ones, and almost jumped off a bridge when I saw the Raiden was green. Green for pete's sake! Now I got a shelf of models that have to be trashed, or at least cleverly hidden. I think at the end of the day, though, unless you are striving to be an "authority", build what please you. We can get away with stuff we'd never let Bob Mikesh off the hook for!

Also, Toshi, thank you for sharing your modeling with us. I giggle like a schoolgirl when I see a new post from you, and each build gets more polished and professional. It is the people what make this hobby the pleasure it is!

 

You are too kind with your words of praise.  I completely agree with your statement in that it's the individuals that makes this hobby a pleasure and exciting as well!  Thank you so much for your support, read, and replies.  I hold our conversations with the greatest of importance and communication!

Toshi

Ashley

 

Also, Toshi, thank you for sharing your modeling with us. I giggle like a schoolgirl when I see a new post from you, and each build gets more polished and professional. It is the people what make this hobby the pleasure it is!

 

LOL! Yeah, me too sometimes. I've learned a lot since I first signed up here. Still don't consider myself an expert on anything, but I'm pretty good at a lot of stuff lol.

M. Brindos

Really? I thought they were all in the same green/blue anodized color. ???

Shows how much I know.

 

Yeah, this aotake thing is a puzzlement, and there are as many ideas about it as there are historians. Some say it was a corrosion preventative, still others maintain it was a layout aid, like dykem, and everybody has a different idea what color it was. Plus, it seemed to change colors with exposure! I painted all my Japanese interiors with it until I got the original Japanese Interiors books, the thin little softcover ones, and almost jumped off a bridge when I saw the Raiden was green. Green for pete's sake! Now I got a shelf of models that have to be trashed, or at least cleverly hidden. I think at the end of the day, though, unless you are striving to be an "authority", build what please you. We can get away with stuff we'd never let Bob Mikesh off the hook for!

Also, Toshi, thank you for sharing your modeling with us. I giggle like a schoolgirl when I see a new post from you, and each build gets more polished and professional. It is the people what make this hobby the pleasure it is!

Thanks Phil. That article was quite helpful.

So for the wheel wells, using what I know Toshi could source from the HL Vallejo selection,

I'd want to mix 10 parts clear with 4 parts blue, and 2 parts yellow sprayed over silver. I think that would be close. ...maybe.

But the pit color is close as-is.

I need a Japanese plane now.  lol

M. Brindos

Really? I thought they were all in the same green/blue anodized color. ???

It seems the cockpit was green (Tamiya XF-71 works well for this) but other areas like the gear bays were lacquered with "aotake".

http://www.aviationofjapan.com/2010/02/aotake-part-one.html