Spitfire GB

Excellent work, Doogs- love that engine!

Rob

DoogsATX

 

VanceCrozier:

 

 

DoogsATX:

 

 

 

I love the Dirty Merlin & would love to name a band after it!

 

 

Dirty Merlin and the Rotol Four?

I'd go to see them!

I  pity the flight line mechanic that would allow his kit to get that dirty. I would think the flight line Sargent Major would have had his guts for garters! The mechanics took a lot of pride in making sure that their pilots had the best there was to offer. They were often seen on the fight line waiting to make sure their pilot got home okay.

While I could see that type of weathering happening to armoured vechicles, I rather doubt that it would happen to front line aircraft. Just my worth.

MECHTECH

I  pity the flight line mechanic that would allow his kit to get that dirty. I would think the flight line Sargent Major would have had his guts for garters! The mechanics took a lot of pride in making sure that their pilots had the best there was to offer. They were often seen on the fight line waiting to make sure their pilot got home okay.

While I could see that type of weathering happening to armoured vechicles, I rather doubt that it would happen to front line aircraft. Just my worth.

Point taken...to a degree. After I finished up priming the main airframe this morning, I dialed the airbrush up to about 40 psi and blew a lot of the loose pigment out of the engine. Cleaner than above, but still not pristine.

In the weathering, I was operating off of one image and a few assumptions.

Assumption 1: the Rolls-Royce Merlin is of British manufacture, and thus leaks. If it's not leaking, it's probably out of fluids.

Assumption 2: Aircraft engines are built to higher tolerances than contemporary automotive engines. But the tolerances of, say, a mid-60s engine and the Merlin would probably be relatively close. Thus, see assumption 1...

Assumption 3: This aircraft flew extensive mixed-mission sorties and operated from at least a mainly concrete-less airfield (Castel Volturno, Italy). From pictures, it looks like there was likely a concrete runway, but the rest was earth. Lots of dust and crud flying around. Engine leaks + dust = crud buildup.

Assumption 4: At least for "Fargo Express" in particular, cleanliness was not close to godliness. The one really good pic I've got of her shows a very, very beaten ship, weathered and stained to a degree that most weathering skeptics, if they saw it represented in scale, would call implausible. Thus, I don't think surface crud in the engine area is out of the question.

Here's the pic I've been working off of:

Sadly the kit exhaust stacks don't have all the rich contours seen here, so the pigments can only go so far...but those were more my target. What the bay looked like beneath the cowl panels is anybody's guess, but based on my assumptions and on the photo evidence, I'm guessing it wasn't anywhere near showroom.

Doogs- Regardless ofthe historicl accuracy, the work and weathering you have done on your Merlin is certainly outstanding. You are to be commended on your efforts

                                  Joe

DoogsATX

 

Ahhhhh - look at that modeling mayhem in the background - I love it!!!  Do I see a slipper tank on your paint rack? I can't say I've ever seen them on models very often. I've got a Mk IX on my list for the fall that will be using the slipper tank as well.

Vance - that's nothin! You should see the other side of the bench.  I really need to sit down and get it cleared up. Figured with being laid off I'd have time, but not so much as I'd thought!

As for the other...yep, Tamiya actually gives you two different slipper tanks. Cool thing is they mount into poly bushings with these metal pins (same for the air filter or lower cowl to the engine), so you can put it on or remove it at your whim. 

Got so much else back there and offscreen as well. Hispano cannons, gun fairings, prop, prop cap, radiator covers, landing gear, gear doors, tires, stabilizers, cowl pieces, pitots and aerial masts and other fun stuff. 

Bit more progress overnight. Late start due to having to get a print job off to Kinkos so it'd be ready by this afternoon. Putting together a portfolio is a much bigger PITA for writers than for designers...

But anyway, got the prop tips and wings painted yellow (MM Deep Yellow...IMO a much better yellow than their Insignia Yellow), and the machine gun ports and prop cap pieces sprayed Insignia Red. Been awhile since I've sprayed that stuff, and I was a bit worried at first to see it come out all magenta, but it turned that deeper tomato red with successive coats, so all good!

Still have to figure out how I want to tackle the wing lines - paint before and mask, mask and paint after, or just be lazy and go with the decals. And whether I want to preshade. Decisions, decisions!

I'm calling Spitfire #2 done.  Spitfire Mk Vc HL AA as flown by the 31st FG XO, Lt Col R A Ames in the Spring of 1943.

I finished this one the same as the other one, MM enamels and both oil and acrylic washes, with pastels to finish.  I'm not too happy with the weathering job, though.  The gloss cote was the Alcad clear gloss lacquer. I used a burnt umber oil wash diluted in mineral spirits.  The spirits ate right through the gloss cote.  So I had little piles of gloss all over the wings like lint.  Ended up sanding it off mostly.  It never really recovered after that.  The kit decals have some silvering issues when viewed at high oblique angles.  Then when I went to tighten the aerial sprue with a hot knife, the antennae came loose, hence the appearance of the wire.

It won't hold up to close scrutiny but it looks ok on my shelf.

Thanks,

Satch

quote user="DoogsATX"]

Assumption 1: the Rolls-Royce Merlin is of British manufacture, and thus leaks. If it's not leaking, it's probably out of fluids.

Assumption 2: Aircraft engines are built to higher tolerances than contemporary automotive engines. But the tolerances of, say, a mid-60s engine and the Merlin would probably be relatively close. Thus, see assumption 1...

[/quote]

LOL, never a truer word has been spoken ad if you've you can see from this photo

When it come to painting or decaling the wing stripes I would definitely go with the paint before and mask option which is what I do for invasion stripes as well.

Cheers

Satch I don't know what you are worried about sh looks fantastic from where I'm sitting.  Congrats on a fine looking Spitfire.

Satch - looks pretty good from here! For what it's worth, the reason the mineral spirits ate through the Alclad gloss is because Alclad's clear coats are mineral spirit based, not lacquer (surprised me, but it's right there on the bottle).

I'd recommend picking up some Mona Lisa Odorless Paint Thinner - they sell it at Hobby Lobby. Excellent for oil washes, and I've applied it right over enamel with no problems. Super gentle stuff.

Also, a big fat word of warning to anybody thinking about picking up Gunze colors for their Spits...went to paint the underside tonight, cracked open the Azure Blue, and GAH! It's friggin' purple! Not close AT ALL to any azure blue I've seen anywhere, not on Tamiya's fancy color profile, not from other paint makers, and certainly not on the reference pics. I tried mixing in some yellow to cut the red tones down a bit, but that just made it this sad, blue-gray looking color. Guess I'll be picking up some MM Azure Blue tomorrow...

OTOH, Middlestone and Dark Earth look sweet.

Satch, I'd be pretty happy with that.  Don't be too hard on yourself, mate.

Doogs, great Merlin!  Indeed, the entire Spit is coming together well.

Noted, with a little dismay, I had offered up a build for this GB.  I think I need to get my act together.

Satch, I would be more than happy with that weathering.  Love the color scheme too.  Very nice job.

Mike

Thanks for the kind words fellas.  In the photos it doesn't look too bad but up close you can see the flaws.  I really need to get a paint booth because painting and gloss/dull coats in the garage results in a lot of dust and lint on the surface.

Doogs, maybe I should have read the bottle.  It says lacquer on the label so I assumed it was a lacquer.  On the first spit I used the last bit of my paint thinner.  For this I opened up a new can of MS.  Lesson learned.  I'll pick up some of that stuff you recommended.  

The MM enamel is what's on this spit.  The colors look pretty good.  The Azure Blue looks a little purple in the bottle at first but after you mix it up well and spray it on it's a nice deep blue.  Might be kinda dark but I'm no color Nazi. 

Come to San Antonio to the local IPMS meeting tonight and you can see them in person.

Satch

DoogsATX

Vance - that's nothin! You should see the other side of the bench.  I really need to sit down and get it cleared up. Figured with being laid off I'd have time, but not so much as I'd thought!

As for the other...yep, Tamiya actually gives you two different slipper tanks. Cool thing is they mount into poly bushings with these metal pins (same for the air filter or lower cowl to the engine), so you can put it on or remove it at your whim. 

Got so much else back there and offscreen as well. Hispano cannons, gun fairings, prop, prop cap, radiator covers, landing gear, gear doors, tires, stabilizers, cowl pieces, pitots and aerial masts and other fun stuff. 

Bit more progress overnight. Late start due to having to get a print job off to Kinkos so it'd be ready by this afternoon. Putting together a portfolio is a much bigger PITA for writers than for designers...

But anyway, got the prop tips and wings painted yellow (MM Deep Yellow...IMO a much better yellow than their Insignia Yellow), and the machine gun ports and prop cap pieces sprayed Insignia Red. Been awhile since I've sprayed that stuff, and I was a bit worried at first to see it come out all magenta, but it turned that deeper tomato red with successive coats, so all good!

Still have to figure out how I want to tackle the wing lines - paint before and mask, mask and paint after, or just be lazy and go with the decals. And whether I want to preshade. Decisions, decisions!

Poly caps on the slipper tanks? Brilliant! For those yellow stripes, I think I've tried a; options now & I'm with darson - the most convincing to my eye is painting first & masking, especially at the larger scales.

Kinkos? PRINTS!?!? I thought everyone wanted electronic files these days!

Satch - I personally admire the work you've done on your Spit. Nice crisp camo and the weatheing is quite well done. The overall quality of work you have done there far outways any minor mishaps. Thank You very much for sharing.

                                                                                     Joe

satch_ip

Doogs, maybe I should have read the bottle.  It says lacquer on the label so I assumed it was a lacquer.  On the first spit I used the last bit of my paint thinner.  For this I opened up a new can of MS.  Lesson learned.  I'll pick up some of that stuff you recommended.  

The MM enamel is what's on this spit.  The colors look pretty good.  The Azure Blue looks a little purple in the bottle at first but after you mix it up well and spray it on it's a nice deep blue.  Might be kinda dark but I'm no color Nazi. 

Satch

If you were using the clear base, yeah that's got a nasty cocktail of MEK, MIK, butanol and toluene.

But the "klear koat" line is straight mineral spirits:

Also picked up a bottle of MM Azure today and WORLD OF DIFFERENCE. It actually looks like the color I've got on my reference photo. Also picked up the topside colors, since MM enamels don't seem to have the same dusting problem I've been having with Tamiya and Gunze in this heat. Looking so forward to throwing paint tonight!

Here's what I was talking about. Two RAF Azure Blues. 

I'm not a color nazi by any means, but COME ON! 

Just a slight difference there.

Well I dont see any Mk VIIs. Against my common sense I think I will request permission to join with a 1/48 ICM Mk VII.

stikpusher

Well I dont see any Mk VIIs. Against my common sense I think I will request permission to join with a 1/48 ICM Mk VII.

Trying to make a bad joke about being under pressure with that build and just failing...

You planning the light gray over dark gray scheme? If I ever build more than like three Spits I'm going to have start exploring options. Identical disruptive camo is awesome on one aircraft, just flat boring across multiples...

No jokes... just finished up another  build tonite, and another a couple weeks ago, so I have a bit more room on the "to do" shelves. Yes I was planning on doing the two tone high altitiude scheme the Mk VIIs wore. Sea Grey Medium over Azure Blue.

Against my common sense meant jumping in on another GB when I really shouldnt, but this Spit has been calling to me over the past week...

Welcome aboard Stik, I'm looking forward to seeing some shots of your Mk.VII. 

Just watch out for those ICM decals, every set I have ever tried to use ends in the result, disintegration followed by AM decals being ordered.

Cheers

Thanks for the welcome and the heads up. I have some micro scale decal film I can apply to prevent the shattering. I know what c an happen with ICM decals.

stikpusher

No jokes... just finished up another  build tonite, and another a couple weeks ago, so I have a bit more room on the "to do" shelves. Yes I was planning on doing the two tone high altitiude scheme the Mk VIIs wore. Sea Grey Medium over Azure Blue.

Against my common sense meant jumping in on another GB when I really shouldnt, but this Spit has been calling to me over the past week...

Yeah, I meant jokes about pressure as in...it's pressurized...

Here's the one I was thinking of that's the two-tone gray. Unless that's the darkest azure I've ever seen...

http://www.hyperscale.com/2010/galleries/spitfirevii32tamiyars_1.htm

In other news, armed with non-purple Azure Blue, I got a solid start on the underside tonight. Decided not to preshade, and instead use the layer blend technique. Here's the base coat:

and the lightening work. Had to add a lot more white than I'd anticipated to make a noticeable difference. Also, my hand is now cramped like you wouldn't believe!

Tomorrow I'll add the thinned base color back on top to blend it all together, then it'll probably get to cure for a few days before I move on to the top. 

DoogsATX

 

Yeah, I meant jokes about pressure as in...it's pressurized...

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh..the Mk VII....

 

Here's the one I was thinking of that's the two-tone gray. Unless that's the darkest azure I've ever seen...

http://www.hyperscale.com/2010/galleries/spitfirevii32tamiyars_1.htm

I suspect that the dark appearance of the Azure there has something to do with the pure white background....

 

BTW, that is some very intricate work on the lower surface.... no wonder your hand was cramping...

Here's the one I was thinking of that's the two-tone gray. Unless that's the darkest azure I've ever seen...

http://www.hyperscale.com/2010/galleries/spitfirevii32tamiyars_1.htm

Doogs,

The High Altitude Scheme is actually Medium Sea Grey over PRU Blue.  That's why the lower surface blue is so dark.

While I too work with what "looks right" in the final color scheme, I try to start out with an accurate color.  Azure actually has a purple cast to it, so should look purple-ish blue.  And it was a bit dark.  One reason Sky Blue was not finally sanctioned in the desert (although used on some aircraft) was because it wasn't ark enough.  An extensive discussion over on BritModeller if you're curious, focused on finding an accurate Azure Blue out of the bottle is here.

Don't skewer me -- it's your model and if looks right to you, it IS right.

Tim

Thanks Tim! I can actually see a darker color working in the desert - that kind of environment does weird things with light.

Regarding the Gunze...it's really hard to capture exact color qualities across three different color spaces (my camera, my computer, your computer), but it has a very violet, almost lavender color to it. The chip in that thread you posted...

actually doesn't seem very far off from where the MM enamel lands when it's sprayed. Almost a "cornflower blue". 

And the one reference pic I've got of Molland's plane shows a distinctly bluer and lighter shade than the Gunze paint. Accounting for the harsh lighting and no doubt not 100% accurate color processing, I think choosing between the two I'd go with the MM.

On the high altitude, I'm curious. Is it possible that that particular Spit is 1) inaccurate or 2) representing a craft that didn't use the PRU blue? I've always thought PRU was much lighter...

And other VII profiles tend to bear that out. 

Doogs,

Profiles are tough as references.  I've lost skin because I was too faithful...so I always caveat and focus more on what's close to the "standards" -- paint chips matched to the original.  If the tech manuals say it was MSG/PRU then I find a paint close to those two colors in my chip set.

Old photos are good as references, but as you say, too many variables when shared across the net.  Plus, depending on distance and lighting there is that bane of my modelling called "scale effect".  I know it exists but have never mastered achieving it.  The one of Mollard's plane also appears to have had a yellow filter on the camera.  I base that solely on my own experience with filters and how the photo ends up looking, not on any formal training. 

PRU Blue is darkish, but it lightens up (scale effect) quite readily.  As a blue, my opinion, it's also susceptable to fading.  RAF/FAA blues tended to fade, but with simple water and a gentle wipe down darkened back up to the original.  Because the paints were supposed to be smooth (Type S) one indicator, just that, is the "flatness" the finish appears to have in the photo.  I wouldn't be dogmatic about it though.  If you want to match how a subject looks in a photo I say that's an outstanding objective.

My Azure chip at home is about the same shade as MM, but I can defintely see some purple.  I actually added a few drops of deep red (Testors square bottle) to it until it matched the chip.  It darkened slightly and had that slight purple cast.  The purple cast is subtle and the experts over on BritModeller with access to real panels in original paint were the guys debating the pros/cons of individual paints, MM didn't make the cut as too light and too blue, IIRC one thread made it seem closer to Deep Sky Blue which is darker than Sky Blue (according to some Sky Blue is actually nearly white with a slight blue cast).  So I feel (very subjective) I now have an Azure that close enough to my eye.

Fascinating stuff, esoteric and ultimately what matters is what "looks right" to the modeller.  Your mileage may vary as they say.

Tim

Well this past few posts has been most enlightening! So Medium Sea Grey over PRU Blue and not Azure Blue for the Mk VII. No worries from me. The instructions specified Azure Blue, but PRU actually makes more sense to me.