Longest Day GB

bitbite

Member since
July 2013
From: Talent, OR

Posted by bitbite on Friday, June 6, 2014 12:06 PM

Nice, Eagle. Now more dirt. Wink

Oh, and did I mention it's my birthday? Big Smile

"Resist the urge to greedily fondle the parts . . ." - Sheperd Paine "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" Page 5

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waynec

Member since
April 2006
From: Denver, Colorado

Posted by waynec on Friday, June 6, 2014 12:29 PM

Eagle90

Thank you sir!

LOL! I'm a little apprehensive about the tracked thingies myself! But there is one on the way!

The netting is Verlinden Camo Netting. Got it from a local guy who was selling off all his kits and it was inside one of the kit boxes....brand new! I didn't think about spraying the netting! Great idea. I think I will work on the netting a little to get it looking more "real". And you are the second person to mention the watered down white glue! I think that is going to be a given for me to try...maybe tonight!

As for tie downs, I had thought about grabbing some of the wife's sewing thread, but wasn't sure if that would be to scale or not. But the tape and/or foil idea is great too! I'm still getting great tips! Thank you so much!

Eagle90

don't start with an vehicle with independent tracks unless it has side skirts that hide the upper track run. it can get annoying as i am finding out with 81 track blocks per side. think it was easier to change real ones. just my opinion.

as for rope and "strap" width, take a figure, put the string you are thinking of using in his hand. you know how big the real rope would look in your hand so see if it looks close. unlike ship rigging i tend to leave so rope on past the knot since the troops would need something to hold onto to untie.

Никто не Забыт (No one is Forgotten)
Ничто не Забыто (Nothing is Forgotten)

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Bish

Member since
December 2002
From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England

Posted by Bish on Friday, June 6, 2014 2:33 PM

Like stik, I don't do ships, and I ain't silly enough to jump out of a perfectly good aircraft Wink , so I will be brining the armour to BB's birthday, I hope you have a large parking space.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

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Eagle90

Member since
November 2010
From: Florida-West Central

Posted by Eagle90 on Friday, June 6, 2014 2:39 PM

bitbite

Nice, Eagle. Now more dirt.

Oh, and did I mention it's my birthday?

First.....HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Second, Thank you so much! Yes, I agree....needs more dirt!

Eagle90

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Eagle90

Member since
November 2010
From: Florida-West Central

Posted by Eagle90 on Friday, June 6, 2014 2:41 PM

waynec

Eagle90

Thank you sir!

LOL! I'm a little apprehensive about the tracked thingies myself! But there is one on the way!

The netting is Verlinden Camo Netting. Got it from a local guy who was selling off all his kits and it was inside one of the kit boxes....brand new! I didn't think about spraying the netting! Great idea. I think I will work on the netting a little to get it looking more "real". And you are the second person to mention the watered down white glue! I think that is going to be a given for me to try...maybe tonight!

As for tie downs, I had thought about grabbing some of the wife's sewing thread, but wasn't sure if that would be to scale or not. But the tape and/or foil idea is great too! I'm still getting great tips! Thank you so much!

Eagle90

don't start with an vehicle with independent tracks unless it has side skirts that hide the upper track run. it can get annoying as i am finding out with 81 track blocks per side. think it was easier to change real ones. just my opinion.

as for rope and "strap" width, take a figure, put the string you are thinking of using in his hand. you know how big the real rope would look in your hand so see if it looks close. unlike ship rigging i tend to leave so rope on past the knot since the troops would need something to hold onto to untie.

LOL! I hear ya! I've got kits that have the individual links! Indifferent Oh my! Not even close to being ready for that!

Use a figure! That's one of those things that is so simple, but just doesn't cross my mind! Brilliant! Thanks so much!

Eagle90

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Bish

Member since
December 2002
From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England

Posted by Bish on Friday, June 6, 2014 2:50 PM

Eagle, great work on your first armour build(s). I don't think I can add any more to what the guys have said. The only thing I will add is that this site has some of the best armour builders I have seen, so your defiantly in the right place

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

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bitbite

Member since
July 2013
From: Talent, OR

Posted by bitbite on Friday, June 6, 2014 3:00 PM

Around midnight paratroopers started landing in my backyard, then a wave of bombers came overhead, followed by a naval bombardment, and an amphibious landing in my driveway even though there's no water nearby. Thanks for arranging all this for me! You guys rock! Toast

"Resist the urge to greedily fondle the parts . . ." - Sheperd Paine "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" Page 5

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stikpusher

Member since
July 2004
From: Sonora Desert

Posted by stikpusher on Friday, June 6, 2014 3:16 PM

Somebody said that there was cold beer and hot women to be had there...

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

- Plankton

LSM

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Gamera

Member since
November 2009
From: SW Virginia

Posted by Gamera on Friday, June 6, 2014 4:12 PM

Happy Birthday Bitbite!

Hope you have a BLAST!!!

PS: Be careful- those little crunchy bits are Strontium 90, your urine may glow in the dark for a few days after ingesting one but it will clear up as it migrates into your bone marrow...

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

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checkmateking02

Member since
September 2003
From: AandF in the Badger State

Posted by checkmateking02 on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:13 PM

Nice work, stik!

And happy birthday, bitbite! Many more!

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checkmateking02

Member since
September 2003
From: AandF in the Badger State

Posted by checkmateking02 on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:16 PM

Very nice results on the AFV's, Eagle!

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bitbite

Member since
July 2013
From: Talent, OR

Posted by bitbite on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:25 PM

It's sad that "cold beer and hot women" doesn't work the other way around. It would save us a lot of money on electricity for refrigeration of the beer and cash for "heating costs" for the women . . . dinner, movies, etc. Wink

Anyway, thanks all. Keep up the outstanding building. Hope to be up and building with you again soon! Toast

"Resist the urge to greedily fondle the parts . . ." - Sheperd Paine "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" Page 5

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bitbite

Member since
July 2013
From: Talent, OR

Posted by bitbite on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:26 PM

Awesome cake, Gamera.

"Resist the urge to greedily fondle the parts . . ." - Sheperd Paine "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" Page 5

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68GT

Member since
February 2010
From: New Jersey

Posted by 68GT on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:51 PM

I know there are a few still building but great job Bish!

Excellent work to all those that participated whether you completed something or not.

And to all those that experienced the real great endeavor.........

A moment of silence for those no longer with us and to those few that are still with us......I can not express how much you have done for this world.

On Ed's bench, ???

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Bish

Member since
December 2002
From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England

Posted by Bish on Friday, June 6, 2014 5:57 PM

greentracker98

checkmateking02

Progress looks good, stik. You're not the only one who won't be finishing by 6 June. The longest day just got longer.

I'm glad to come accross your post Check. I thought maybe I was the lone one who wasn't going to be finished. As it turns out, I think I will finish the P 47 in a week or so. I have the landing gear ordered from SAC, and the undercarriage covers ordered from my LHS. I should have both Saturday

Look forward to seeing the Jug wrapped up. And don't worry, your not alone.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

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Bish

Member since
December 2002
From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England

Posted by Bish on Friday, June 6, 2014 6:02 PM

Ok guys, I am officially calling this GB closed. Thank you all for taking part and making this such fun GB and for all the builds. And as always, there's been tons of info shared and passed around to help each other. Its a shame HvH has not yet returned to duty, but hopefully he will be back soon.

I look forward to seeing the final builds come together in the next few days and weeks, and of course seeing more of you bunch around the forums.

Thank you all.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

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stikpusher

Member since
July 2004
From: Sonora Desert

Posted by stikpusher on Friday, June 6, 2014 6:12 PM

bitbite

It's sad that "cold beer and hot women" doesn't work the other way around. It would save us a lot of money on electricity for refrigeration of the beer and cash for "heating costs" for the women . . . dinner, movies, etc.

Anyway, thanks all. Keep up the outstanding building. Hope to be up and building with you again soon!

Cold women and hot beer is not very much fun... Angry

I'll get some progress photos up in a bit... been doing a lot of airbrushing in the past few hours. One more color to do and then I am calling it done for today at the work bench... gotta watch my D-Day movies on DVD...

Happy Birthday to your Frau Bitbite Wink Whistling

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

- Plankton

LSM

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stikpusher

Member since
July 2004
From: Sonora Desert

Posted by stikpusher on Friday, June 6, 2014 8:16 PM

BTW, it's still June 6 here in California for another 5 hours or so...

Today I spent several hours doing airbrushing of the interior and some exterior colors (since some overlapped) Plus that is an easy way to get around the window areas and makes masking the little ones a bit easier.
Last night after I got the photos posted on here, I went back and did one final bit of work. I added the insulation padding to fuselage sidewalls in the radio compartment using tissue cut to size, folded, and soaked in white glue. This is how it looked this morning once dry

Then I had to repait the tail fun ammo chute that had broken teh other day. I put a thin stip of bras in the center and then super glued it in place
Now you see it

Now you dont (not really anyways)

Then it was time for interior painting. I used Tamiya colors. All colors used are based off of research of photos of Flak Bait as she is preserved at Smithsonian. Aluminum for the basic interior color. Black for floorboards and cockpit sidewalls above the base of the canopy level. Olive Drab for the top turret and tail gunners armor plate, and Neutral Gray in the bomb bay. For the radio compartment insulation padding I used Khaki and Khaki Drab.
fuselage side exteriors

interiors

top turret

tail gun area parts

radio compartment

cockpit parts

all the fuselage parts

engine cowlings and scoops

engine nacelle wheel wells

engines

horizontal stabilizers

wings & horizontal stabilizers

if I do anything else tonite, it will be to give the clear parts their Future dip...

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

- Plankton

LSM

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bitbite

Member since
July 2013
From: Talent, OR

Posted by bitbite on Friday, June 6, 2014 8:42 PM

Sweeeeeeeet.

"Resist the urge to greedily fondle the parts . . ." - Sheperd Paine "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" Page 5

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Gamera

Member since
November 2009
From: SW Virginia

Posted by Gamera on Friday, June 6, 2014 10:04 PM

Hey Bish, thanks again for a great GB!!!

SP: Very nice work there on the interior. Gee, I was going to just paint the inside of mine interior green, glad I didn't start on her yet!

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

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stikpusher

Member since
July 2004
From: Sonora Desert

Posted by stikpusher on Friday, June 6, 2014 10:58 PM

Yes Bish, thank you for hosting this GB. At least I got the S-Boot done on time. The Marauder will take a little longer than today at midnite.

BB & Gamera, I'm glad that you're liking this build.

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

- Plankton

LSM

Reply

GAF

Member since
June 2012
From: Anniston, AL

Posted by GAF on Friday, June 6, 2014 11:23 PM

Stik,

Nice work on the B-26. She'll be a beauty once finished.

On my end, my break from modelling seems to have been very short. After sleeping on it, I realized that the best way to do the decals I need was to print them out on "white" decal paper and then trim them very closely. This only works for the larger letters, but that's all I need. I think I've scrounged up some yellow tail codes I can make work. Maybe tomorrow (June 7th) will see this C-47 finished after all, which is by coincidence the anniversary of Operation Hackensack in which this particular C-47 participated. That is if the decals work out...

Wish me luck!

Gary

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stikpusher

Member since
July 2004
From: Sonora Desert

Posted by stikpusher on Saturday, June 7, 2014 1:01 AM

Hackensack was one of the Neptune airlifts IIRC. Each airlift had a different name the initial drops were Albany & Boston, the first glider train Cicago & Detroit, the evening glider train Elmira & Keokuk, etc. More than likely, your subject choice participated in several of the airlifts, due to an overall shortage on transports.

Thanks for the kind words on my Marauder. I think that it will look pretty sharp when finished. Tonite I dipped teh clear parts in Future and they are drying in a nice protected spot right now. I am looking forward to your C-47.

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

- Plankton

LSM

Reply

EBergerud

Member since
February 2010
From: Berkeley CA/St. Paul MN

Posted by EBergerud on Saturday, June 7, 2014 1:24 AM

Heller 1/50 Piper L-4

Paints: Tamiya, Vallejo and Golden Acrylics

Weathering: Iwata Com.Art acrylics

This is really under the wire but in St. Paul it's still June 6, so we'll declare the Piper L-4 done.

This is a pretty meager effort compared to other work on this GB, but the real world was unforgiving and I really wanted to get an American kit in to go with my Polish P-51 and Brit Cromwell. We did, after all, have something to do with the outcome of one of history's most important militrary campaigns.

If you can find a Heller L-4 I wouldn't buy it - I didn't know that at a swap meet a couple of years back when I saw the $5 price tag. So it's sole advantage for me was that it was there. I'm not sure how old the thing is but I"d guess it dates from the 60's before the standarization of sizes was complete. The kit was original and the instructions and decals were seriously yellowed. Indeed, the decals are a collection of this and that from other kits with only two national insinias on the side original. Maybe not accurate, but it looks American. The kit was not warped, but nothing really fit well either. I've built old kits before and wasn't amazed. What I hadn't anticipated was that this kit has a whole lot of glass (that was the point of the L-4 Cub: it was given a much larger greenhouse to assist the observer to find targets). The clear parts (there are only three) were cloudy and one had several hairline cracks. To make matters worse I decided to mask the thing myself. It took a long time but I did a fair job of it. The problem was that masking usually leaves some kind of residue from the tape (especially here because the mask had to stay on throughout painting). That's a small problem if you have good access to the clear parts, but here the wing attached to the fuselage through the clear parts and the struts were needed for genuine support. That meant that fine sanding with multiple grits was extremely clumsy. There was some comfort knowing that the canopy wasn't going to make the hall of fame regardless, but I should have hand painting the frame and covered the clear with artist low-tack tape. Live and learn. The plane did have an engine and considering the lack of visual interest I'll leave the cowl off even though it fits pretty well.

I should have taken more build shots I suppose. There are three coats of olive drab. (Tamiya a base and two shades of Vallejo). The one complement I could pay Heller is that the fabric texture is out of scale but really not bad. This made it a good candidate for a technique pioneered by armor guru Mike Rinaldi (his Tank Art books are very good). Rinaldi calls it reverse dry brushing. I was very pleased with its effect on the Cromnwell. Here it worked nicely on a fabric wing. How does one shadow the spar? Should it be lighter or darker? (World War I biplane uber-guru Des Delatorre has a splendid website http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com and he gives his view of the matter at length.) I used Rinaldi's technique and thought it worked very well. After a Vallejo primer, the plane was given a base coat of Tamiya Olive Drab. It was then covered by two lighter shades of Model Air. When dry, I wet a paint brush (barely damp) with Tamiya lacquer thinner (I wouldn't consider this with hardware store products) and rub the lighter shades slowly off. You end up with something that's darker but also indistinct in line - like a shadow. Below is a detail of the wing and you can see the effect and also the result of three filters done with Iawa Com.Art acrylics. The stripes were hand painted after masking with Vallejo Model Air and Golden Fluids.

That's it about the kit. It showed its considerable age and It wasn't my finest hour.

But it is an interesting subject. (Those interested in any of the following should refer to Michael Doubler's splendid "Closing with the Enemy" which explains the development of tactics via theory and practice in one of history's most demanding courses at the University of Mars - Western Europe in 1944-45.) I guess it makes sense that a humble weapon like the L-4 (ironically most famous for knocking out a couple of AFVs with wing-mounted bazookas in the Ardennes) would be forgotten. Soldiers on both sides would not have. The L-4 actually played a very important role in the arcane crafts of reconnaissance and target acquisition.

As Double points out the US Army learned a lot from Rommel and Kesselring in 1942-43, but still had some serious lose ends that needed to be met for Normandy. Nobody had to tell Ike that allied armies needed air recon, close air support and a heavy dose of artillery to grease the wheels. What wasn't clear was chemistry or balance between them particularly in the (surprisingly) unexpected terrain found in the bocage. (Allied forces were learning more in Italy by mid-44 but that theater had become something the Americans wanted to forget.)

Here was the problem. American doctrine had originally expected too much from direct artillery support when on the attack. They found (like WWI generals had) that displacing a well defended area unless you knew exactly where to put your shells was very hard. You could solve the problem briefly by throwing a few zillion rounds at a given zone, but despite some accounts US forces had limited resources in 1944 so “blowing a hole” was a rare delicacy and didn't reliably work then. (Defensive artillery was entirely different and the US mastery of “registered” indirect fire when under one of the many Germany counter attacks made attacking US forces a very dangerous proposition. The Ardennes illustrated this perfectly.) Therefore, US gunners when supporting an attack would try to isolate the immediate battlefield and try to prevent enemy reinforcement and resupply – any targets hit were a welcome plus. The converse meant that ground attacks were needed to find the bad guys – a process that required taking the first blow. (By the end of the bocage US infantry was beginning to see the huge advantage of using tanks for direct fire support – almost exactly the opposite of what the Army had originally believed armor should serve considering the “lessons” of May 1940.) So even though the US had excellent communications, line officers quickly learned (and the Germans never lost a chance to make he point) that mortars were invaluable because they could be used on a discovered target faster than anything other than direct fire. Aircraft were brutally efficient at some levels but were not considered weapons for close air support the way they became. They were supposed to sweep the LOCs and attack anything that could move. The Germans hated US “jabos” but it was not often hat a GI actually saw their impact. There was also highly justified fear of friendly fire from aircraft. So a great weapon, no doubt, but not the ideal thing to use on a machine gun nest discovered thirty seconds ago.

Hence the importance of the “grasshoppers” the generic name given to several civilian light planes used by ground forces. We had already learned in Italy that going “low and slow” could reveal targets for deadly naval artillery. (L-4s were used in this role at Normandy also, and there was no way to have a day ruined more quickly than a well aimed barrage of naval caliber artillery if you were in a German tank or foxhole.) They widened their value greatly in the bocage although it took a few weeks to figure things out. Grasshoppers were controlled by division HQ and could be delegated to regiment or even battalion commanders if an attack was important – perhaps not as important as P-38 or Spitfire recon bird in the grand scheme, but they were available within minutes. Soon artillery officers were flying as observers and, if lucky, would acquire a visual target and bring in howitzer fire. (It didn't take the Germans long to learn not to fire at L-4s even though they must have made tempting targets.) Soon enough USAAF officers were flying in the back seat, often in direct communication with a pair or flight of P-47s fully dressed for the dance. In either case this meant that artillery or air support could be brought into much closer contact with the vicious fire fights that characterized the last year of war in the ETO. And naturally this was very bad news for the Germans, particularly when allied armies were on the lose grinding up 30 miles a day.

The L-4 story hardly ended at V-E day. Grasshoppers stayed in service for several years. More to the point, billions of dollars have been spent to create “smart” L-4s. We know live in a world (I see problems frankly) where drone aircraft can kill instantly at long distance with no risk to life. I'm sure Patton would have wanted a Predator, but the L-4 played some of the role.

Pics below

Eric