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1944 Group Build

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  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: MOAB, UTAH
Posted by JOE RIX on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 8:27 PM

Ho Boy! There is definitely some sweet action going on here from you all.

Bish: That is some masterful PE work. Very clean and sharp. Your radio is definitely impressive.

CMK: Your masking efforts continue to amaze me. It just looks great and it will be awesome when you get all the sub assemblies put on. Fantastic work.

Eric: WOW! Your DD Hobson is really astounding. You have some really excellent skills when it comes to ship modeling. I am very impressed. I especially like your weathering. It is really nicely done and quite convincing. I also want to thank you for the detailed history. I personally enjoy reading it. I thank you very much for sharing your exceptional skills and talents with us. Like Bish, I too am itching to get around to trying my hands at a ship model and you and Checkmate are certainly getting me there rather quickly.

Thanks everyone for all the posts and updates. I hope to have some progress pics up soon myself.

"Not only do I not know what's going on, I wouldn't know what to do about it if I did". George Carlin

  • Member since
    January 2014
  • From: Toronto
Posted by Rob S. on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 7:31 PM

CMK..I love the 'modular' build you have going. I'm going to employ that technique on my next ship.

______________________________________________________________________________

 

On the Bench: Nothing on the go ATM

  • Member since
    August 2013
Posted by Jsmyth on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 4:47 PM

Eric

That ship came out awesome! I can't wait to start my Indy for another GB

Bish

Your 251 is looking good. I need to get cracking on my Panther

CMK

You have done some great work on that build thus far. I can't wait to see the finished product

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 3:47 PM

Shame on you check for missing that bit out. I am really impressed with the way your able to mask and paint that.

I have started fitting the interior items to the 251 and wiring the radio. I am taking pics as I go and will do another update at the weekend.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 2:52 PM

Looking back over the postings and I saw I didn't post the forward superstructure assembly I mentioned, so here it is:

I plan to get some more work done tonight on the secondary batteries and other smaller parts.  After today, the rest of the week, I have to work late, and probably won't accomplish anything till the weekend.

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 2:47 PM

Great looking ship, Eric.  You packed a lot of detail into it.  The paint and weathering are outstanding.  Nice work!

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 7:23 AM

Thanks Doug. I would have no idea where to start on one of those ship builds, but one of these days I must get round to building one.

Nice progress there check.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 7:21 AM

Great work there Eric. I really like the look of that. Thanks for brining it to the GB.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    February 2010
  • From: Berkeley CA/St. Paul MN
Posted by EBergerud on Tuesday, November 11, 2014 4:55 AM

Looks like we've got some more good things inbound.

As for me, I've finished Hobson. I tempted to lose my common sense and make a water-base for the model, something I've never tried. If it works, I'll do a full build log and put it in the ship section.

It's been a while since I've posted concerning this model so let me bring you up to date. I'm building the 1/350 Cyber-Hobby (Dragon) USS Buchanan 1945 Tokyo Bay. I wanted to do an Atlantic Fleet DD and USS Hobson had a configuration very close to that of the model. And I also had good photos. The only real modification I had to make was to alter the number a little to turn "484" into "464." Here's the the original kit, Hobson, and a couple of pics showing where we ended up.

At the last post I had finished the ship minus tidying up, railing, rigging and weathering. Tidying up proved to be a little more than I had in mind. I scratch built the main mast from brass and found out it wasn't anchored quite well enough for rigging. So, off goes the rigging and the mast is installed with cast iron and concrete. And back goes the rigging.

As earlier noted this edition of Buchanan came with a bonus PE set which was good news and bad. The bad news is that it isn't as delicate as WEM or Tom's and the railings ended up a little clunky. The problem that I haven't solved is to get a decent paint job over PE (which does take some paint) and yet keep the paint off the PE because it inevitably coarsens the effect. Next time I'll use some very good burnishing compound and paint the PE with more coats of thinner paint. The SC radar comes from WEM. The frame, which looked tricky, assembled very well. However, the piece had twelve dipoles each requiring CA and paint. The parts in question have a very delicate look in photos. I did see an Empire version of the same radar and it dispensed with the dipoles altogether - that would have been a much better idea. The problem with WEM PE, however, is that once a card is laid, it's pretty much played. If I had tried to remove all the small parts, I'm sure the frames would have been wrecked. So it too looks clunky. It is, however, much better than the strangely bad plastic radar provided by DML. Some of the detail on this kit is amazing, but the radar provided reminded of something out of Eastern Europe in the 1980s.

Unless you were going to put up a load of signal flags, the ship required a pretty spare rigging arrangement. Finding the right line for this job has vexed me since I first rigged a ship. I'm very pleased with what I tried this time. It's 12/0 Veevus fly tying line. The line is polyester so it doesn't have the incredible fineness of 20 Denier Uni Caenis. Caenis is made of nylon which is inherently thinner than the polyester thread of the Veevus. It is also, for me, a nightmare to work with. And the stuff is so thin that five feet away it's hard to see the rigging. The Veevus (a fine Danish company: be surprised how many fly fishermen are in Europe) sports a .047mm diameter and that's fine. But polyester is much easier to hold on tweezers and it's easier to see. The one disadvantage it has is that using burning incense to tighten the line (which works with nylon, sprue or waxed tying line) doesn't work. Of course at that diameter, it doesn't take much incense to fry your rigging. Instead I found that with a solid base (there are 15 lines coming out of the mast alone) it was very easy to simply tie taught knots. I think it worked out very well. I've bought some 16/0 Veevus for my next ship project (1/700 Derfflinger - a WWI German Battlecruiser from Flyhawk) which will be thinner yet. Stretched sprue has fans but I can't get the stuff to hold on brass with plastic cement. ( My next project will be a Morane Saulnier a WWI monoplane which requires rigging also - but most people use 2 lb fishing line - that'll feel like using a chain compared to my ship lines.)

The weathering worked out about the way I wanted - so blame my eye if you don't think it worked. What I was looking for was a well used ship which I think would show fading, wear and general untidiness as opposed to chipping rust etc. (I decided not to use rust at all - I might put on just a bit if I get a proper base.) The illustrator for Dave McComb's nice Osprey book on prewar class US DDs must have been thinking along the same lines. Here's a linedrawing for Landsdowne which best shows the effect.

As noted earlier the weathering process began at the outset when I used a variety of shades of acrylics and employed Mike Rinaldi's "reverse dry brushing" technique to create dark blotches. As I always do when weathering, I'm very interested in breaking the visual plane. Although I'm at best a grade B- ship builder, I think builders in this genre are usually too light on weathering. Maybe their kits, which take a long time to make, are too pretty to mess with. I want to make the eye work for its living and avoid a "clean" look to a warship coming back from extended operations. Others may think differently.

I used my Iwata Com.Art for panel washes - I absolutely love the stuff. It's a snap to remove and the grainy texture it leaves is really good for indistinct wear. I also put on some filters with oils and applied some streaking with AK Interactive enamel "streaking grime" for gray ships. I tip my hat to whatever admiral decided to use Measure 22 on Atlantic warships. It is much my favorite scheme, having more visual interest than 22 and more graceful than the ultra-camo favored by the RN and some USN PTO warships. Also saved a lot of time.

Would like to plug the history on this kit. Understandably people equate the Pacific War with the USN in WWII. The DDs in the Atlantic, however, earned their supper in a very different way. They never faced the nightmare suffered by the USN off Guadalcanal and later off Okinawa. That said, the stakes in the ETO were immensely high and the USN played a crucial role there. Obviously there were the U-boats, not a role our DDs really excelled (DEs were far better) unless put into the lethal "hunter killer groups" in cooperation with CVEs and a small fleet. Hobson was attached to one voyage with "U-boat killer in chief" USS Bogue in early 44 and helped sink a sub forced to the surface with gunfire. Earlier Hobson and CV4 Ranger had joined a little known but daring RN (including BBs Anson, and Duke of York) for a raid on German merchant shipping in central Norway. All things considered, the raid was very well done and the Ranger's SBDs, Wildcats and Avengers did some serious damage at the cost of three Wildcats lost to flak. As I understand it, heads were rolling in KM HQ after that operation.

But where Hobson and other US DDs saw history was in artillery support of the great landings in the Med and at Normandy. Despite the awesome power of the USN in the Pacific by 1944 it faced a very frustrating task of trying to blow out Japanese island defenses with simple firepower. It was always better than nothing, but there was a limit to what could be done as long the Japanese kept their heads down. Landing support in the Med and at Normandy was a very different kettle of fish and arguably played a more important role in history's greatest war. Allied warships naturally blew the devil out of the areas around the various beachheads. However, unlike the Japanese that fought with fanatical courage and little else, the Wehrmacht was a very sharp and nimble sword led by good officers that understood firepower, mobility and the counterattack. At Salerno and Anzio it is very likely that the allied landings would have failed had the RN and the USN not had their superb gunfire at the ready. Let's not forget that even a small naval gun, say a 5"-38, would have been a big gun on the ground. In any case furious German counter attacks in Italy were thwarted by naval gunfire far more than by airpower. And it was dangerous duty. The Luftwaffe was losing their war, but in mid43-mid44 still had some excellent units including some trained for anti-shipping attack. It says much about the two theaters that Japanese air power after the November 43 Rabaul raids provided completely ineffective against USN shipping - until the Kamikazes arrived. The Luftwaffe, however, was a very dangerous foe for ships and planes alike.

Naval preparation at Normandy was - in the consideration of some good historians - mostly botched in the initial stages, as were the first air attacks. But German resistance existed on every Normandy beachhead and as the day went on allied warships were doing serious damage: the one German armored counterattack on D-Day was stopped by naval gunfire. And until breakout there were countless targets for allied capital ships. Even the 5" guns had value for the first couple of weeks.

And then there was Omaha. During the afternoon of June 6 Bradley commented "thank God for the US Navy." Because of an inherently difficult objective and errors too numerous to quickly count, US assault forces did, briefly, stare at doom at Omaha. It was at this time that US DDs came up to the shoreline and began an all-out assault over open sights (including 20mm and 40mm flak) against German positions of all kinds behind the beach wall. So many defensive points were obliterated that when the US forces pierced the German lines, by day's end it was the powerful Wehrmacht 352d Division that faced envelopment and destruction.

Hobson was at Utah. They bombarded German positions and, unfortunately, spent much time rescuing the survivors of the USS Cory that had been sunk. Further bombardment followed on June 8. A couple of weeks later Hobson supported the USN in that not always glorious but ultimately effective bombardment of Cherbourg and helping win a battle crucial for the allied offensive in France.

Rest of the war was quiet for Hobson and it missed calamity when sent to the Pacific. But just to prove that sailors are always in harm's way, Hobson collided with the USS Wasp in 1952 and lost half of its crew. A sad ending to a fine career.

Anyway, my kit is a wrap. Pics Below:

Eric

 

A model boat is much cheaper than a real one and won't sink with you in it.

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Saturday, November 8, 2014 6:58 PM

A few more photos I took tonight.

The 20mm's; I airbrushed the bases, which are supposed to be the same color as the surrounding camouflage, then I hand-painted the guns themselves with black acrylic.  

Next up are some of the black-painted pieces, with parts for some of the 40mm's.

Then some of the painted-up superstructure parts.

Last up, a look at the forward superstructure.  I was test-fitting the parts, so the layers aren't permanently glued down yet.  Should have put that penny on the right closer in, for scaling.

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Saturday, November 8, 2014 6:26 PM

What trouble are you having with the masking, Doug?  Is it trying to determine what parts should be what color--or the masking itself?  Both can be a headache! Sad

Since the camouflage specifics aren't always clear on photos of the real ship, I googled some BB-55's built by other modelers (mostly in 1/350), and that helped; although no two modelers seem to interpret the camouflage the same way in places. Surprise

As for masking, I found I had to use a combination of masking tape, sometimes sliced into pretty thin strips--as well as filling in the blanks with poster tack.  It looks like a mess, but it's usually been working.

Here are a couple of photos of a particularly complicated piece--it belongs on the top of the aft island.

The wall and the pedestal on the left of the part will be painted 5-0 Ocean Gray;

Then this side will get painted black after the other side sets up.

After that, all the vertical parts will have to be masked, so the deck can be painted.

Keep plugging away, Nomad, and it will start to fall into place! Yes

I've got some more parts to finish up painting, and will post more photos later, but I think I'm beginning to visualize getting this thing completed.

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    May 2014
Posted by Nomad53 on Saturday, November 8, 2014 2:50 PM

Awesome job going on there Bish. I am still trying to figure the masking out on the Missouri. LOL. I am waiting on Revell to send me some new engine pieces for the P-61 that I am working on. The one that came with the kit were in real bad shape. A lot of the detail was lost in the making of them. More flash than I wanted to deal with.

Trying to redo my work desk to make it better. Need more space for the paints and tools. Bigger job than I realized.

Keep up the great work. My time with PE is coming soon.

Doug

Nomad53


 

  • Member since
    February 2014
  • From: Michigan
Posted by silentbob33 on Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:59 AM

Looks great Bish, I can't wait to see those radios installed with the wiring

On my bench: Academy 1/35 UH-60L Black Hawk

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:48 AM

Thanks check. Still got a bit more detailing to do on those and I will leave the wiring until they are fitted as I have to work out what goes where. Looking at some pics its a real rats nest.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Saturday, November 8, 2014 10:23 AM

Outstanding work, Bish--particularly the detail painting on the radios.  Looking good!

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Saturday, November 8, 2014 8:12 AM

Thanks Ken.

Well, time for another update. I finished off the lower hull by adding the fire extinguishers and the brackets and fitted the back plate to the hull.

I then moved onto the top section, not an awful lot to add here.

 

I replaced the kit rails with scratch built ones as I was not keen on those in the kit.

I also got to work on the interior fittings, these included the radio mounts, seat backs and the rear doors.

I was then able to get to the painting.  Everything got a coat of primer then a coat of DY using Vallejo Model Air.

 

I was than able to get straight to the weathering with a raw Umber oil wash all over to give it a grubby look.

 

Next up, this will all be sealed with a future. Flat base mix. Then I will be doing some dot filtering and a pin wash. I have also been working on the other interior parts which include the most important in this variant, the radio's. After painting, I added the power connectors using a small piece of bras rod and the connectors for the other cables with a piece of styrene rod.

More to follow son. 

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    October 2009
  • From: Oil City, PA
Posted by greentracker98 on Tuesday, November 4, 2014 8:24 PM

Looks like a great start Bish.

I'll be watching your progress on the 251

A.K.A. Ken                Making Modeling Great Again

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, November 4, 2014 3:52 PM

Thanks buddy, I have been taking some lessons from some of the other guys.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    April 2013
Posted by SchattenSpartan on Tuesday, November 4, 2014 3:28 PM

Bish, that 251 looks awesome so far! I really like your improvements to the updates (trying to do the same as well).

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Monday, November 3, 2014 3:52 PM

Ahoy, Nomad!

I know exactly what you mean!  The small parts are a major effort and Trumpeter's version has plenty of them.  Plus the fact that I can get something painted, and then find a photo that indicates it was a little different than I thought; and that sends me back to masking and painting and re-painting and touch-up, etc., etc., etc.  Happened just last night.

Then, I also had trouble with the airbrush, so I ordered a new compressor--thinking the old one was running out of power to move the paint; it was only 1/10 HP to begin with--and some replacement parts for the airbrush.  Discovered that two out of my three tips were cracked and split.  Things are going better now, but I'm still looking at lots of parts to paint:  20mm's and 40mm's and secondary guns and a lot of add-on's that I don't even know what they are.  

But, to get back to your question:  in principle I started with 5-L Light Gray (unless the part didn't have any); then masked over that for any other colors.  Mostly, if a part had two or more colors, I applied the lightest one first.  Doesn't always work, so you kind of have to go by guess and by gosh sometimes.

Fair winds, when you get back to things!

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Monday, November 3, 2014 12:05 PM

Thanks a lot guys. I have almost done the inside to the point where I should be able to get the primer on tonight. I should have some more pics tonight or tomorrow.

I have been using PE for many years now. One of the most important things to learn is when not to use it. Not every part in a PE set is better than the kit part or something you can scratch build.

Eagle, o believe me this is nothing. One PE set with two smallish frets.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    May 2014
Posted by Nomad53 on Monday, November 3, 2014 6:25 AM

That 251 is looking great Bish.

One of these days I am gonna get a good kit and all the extras that goes with it and try my hand at PE and all the other things.

Nomad53


 

  • Member since
    May 2014
Posted by Nomad53 on Monday, November 3, 2014 6:22 AM

Awesome job Check.

I need to get back on my USS Missouri and get it done. Been real busy with real life things lately. I just can't seem to get the masking down on the superstructures. What color did you start with?.  It is giving me fits trying to get all the small parts masked plus I am having trouble with my airbrush not wanting to spray the paint right.

I have tried everything that  know but to no avail. I will get it figured out soon.

Nomad53


 

  • Member since
    October 2009
  • From: Oil City, PA
Posted by greentracker98 on Sunday, November 2, 2014 6:23 PM

SchattenSpartan

The V-1 is looking quite lovely, Ken! What pic do you want me to post on the front page?

SS - What goes? Are you no longer posting pics on the front page?

A.K.A. Ken                Making Modeling Great Again

  • Member since
    November 2010
  • From: Florida-West Central
Posted by Eagle90 on Sunday, November 2, 2014 4:40 PM

Great start on the 251 Bish!  Man, that's a lot of PE!  This coming from someone who has NEVER done any PE yet!  Embarrassed

Great work mate!

Eagle90

 

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Sunday, November 2, 2014 1:31 PM

That's looking really great, Bish!

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Sunday, November 2, 2014 7:22 AM

Thanks Joe. I am a big fan of the 251, in fact its my favourite military vehicle, like the Stuka is my favourite aircraft. This is only the second one I have built, the other being a Dragon /17, but I have another 25 in the stash and there is a lot of potential with these, I have worked out there are 63 versions taking into account body types and different roles. So I still have a lt to get to.

I am trying to improve my updates, I have been looking at the posts of Wbill and others, so hopefully they will be more helpful. I have even made a pop up clear background for my pics to do away with the clutter. But if there's anything that's not clear or any ideas for making the posts better, please let me know.

I have just been trying to sort out some figures, I have most of them covered, but I want a sitting radio man, and I think I may have found one that works, though he might need a bit of re modelling.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: MOAB, UTAH
Posted by JOE RIX on Sunday, November 2, 2014 7:09 AM

What an excellent start Bish. Very sweet PE set and your work with it is quite impressive. I must say, I'm rather excited to watch your build of the 251 halftrack. I really like halftracks and I have yet to see anyone build a 251. So watching you apply your masterful skills to one is going to be nothing short of awesome. Also, I'm rather curious about the quality of an AFV Club kit. It really is great to have you in here getting busy now.

"Not only do I not know what's going on, I wouldn't know what to do about it if I did". George Carlin

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Sunday, November 2, 2014 3:37 AM

Finally made a start on the 251. This is the first AFV club kit I have built, despite have quite a few in the stash. So far, my views are mixed. The kit goes together nicely and there's some nice detail. But there are a lot of pour stubs that have to be removed. Some are not in view but are so bit they get in the way of fitting. But its nothing a little sanding doesn't sort out.

This is the kit, the Sdk.fz 251/3 Ausf D. The real thing came with a range of radio fits depending on its role. While the kit does include extra radio's, the instructions only show one fit, without seeing the inside of the real thing, its hard to tell what each vehicle carried. I will be sticking with the instructions which show the fit for a /3 II which I think is correct for the vehicle I am doing, but of course its largely a guess.

I am also using an Eduard PE set, Fruil tracks and Quick wheel wheels.

I have started with the lower half of the interior. There will be quite a few bits painted before assembly, and this includes the top and lower half which will have the insides painted before they are put together. After fitting the lower hull sides to the floor I decided to start at the front and work backwards.

 And here you can see another part of the kit that has to dealt with. The raised lines indicate the fitting of various parts. However, they include the areas for other versions where items are not used in this one, so these have to be sanded away.

I have also part assembled the seats and have the IP  drivers bulkhead ready for painting.

I then carried on along the lower hull without any major issues with the kit parts or the PE.

Next up will be the rear and the inside of the upper hull piece. 

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: AandF in the Badger State
Posted by checkmateking02 on Saturday, November 1, 2014 3:28 PM

Thanks, Bish!

It's keeping me busy, painting tiny pieces now.

 

 

 

 

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