ARMOR - Pz IV Group Build

Petbat,man i wish i could fix it, but it is on there pretty good. I tried a little to fix it but it was hopelesss. I could use the un-cure debonder, but last time i used it, it melted the plastic.

THe yellow tracks are plastic. It was part of a detail set by tamiya for the PZ IV. It is not very good though, most of the details on the D are better than the set.

Thanks for the comments guys, just wish it was comming along better.

P.S. I have gotten a lot more done since the pics.

Hey guys, I have a Pnzer IV related question, and was directed in this direction. Does anyone know where I can get a set of tracks for a Flackpnzer IV Wirbelwind. Lets just say that I managed to completly destroy the ones from Tamiya. I was thinking of trying some of those individual link tracks for the first time on this one, but as I said before, I'm basiculy clueless on that. Thanks in advance!

OK this is one GB i'd love to join i only have a Panver 1V Flakpanzer from Academy.
This will only be my 2nd Tank the first being the Tamiya Panzer 11.
I'm normally a A/C modeler But you never know i may just come over to the "DARKSIDE"
Just one ? is there any official finish date.
Edog if you accept my Flakpanzer 1V for this GB can you please add my username to the list as a definatly.
Thanks J.S.

My Fellow Build-Along Compatriots,

As I looked back through these posts - all the way to Page 2!!! - I discovered that my original post, announcing my modifications to the individual track links in my Dragon Ausf G "Kursk" kit, was made on 15 June...15 June!!! Ok, who's been editing the dates on the posts?

I can't believe it's been almost 2 weeks, but I guess with everything I've been doing, it's possible.

I can now report that every track link has been drilled out, shaped, all flash removed, seam lines cleaned up, and then categorized by condition. Happily, I did not ruin ANY of the links through my efforts and only 8 of them are what I would term "iffy" for use.

I actually finished up yesterday, but needed to take a day off and let my eyes refocus.

Additional updates on my OTB build should be forthcoming quickly. I really like what I've seen from the other builds, but to be honest, I'm glad I'm not letting my AMS syndrome take over completely on this one.

Take care and enjoy your modeling,

I'm watching your posts very intently Robert. I have that kit and will be working on it this fall, and will be very interested in any info you impart on the build.

I'm, anxious to see the work on the tracks you've done.

Very helpful illustration edog. By chance do you (ar anyone) have a clean picture of the damper? I'm spending alot of time trying to build these and its like I'm missing something. They just aren't looking right. A photo would help me immensly.

Thanks.

renarts, as far as the damper, I think you have hit the nail on the head. I never realized it until you described it, but yah, I think that is a sleeve that goes around the outside of the rubber damper with just a little of the rubber protruding from the bottom. Great build by the way. It really looks like it is coming along nicely. Oh, let me see if I can come up with a pic for the dampers. I am also having a hard time finding a clear pic of them.

rebelreenactor, the build looks great so far. Keep us up to date.

Kennethc, I have built the Italeri H kit and it was a great build. The Italeri H is actually quite accurate. Yah, its and Italeri kit which means a lot of cleaning up flashing, getting out the putty and fiddling with the pieces before they fit, but it was a great build. The only thing that the kit could really benefit from is the Tamiya vehicle part kit, and some replacement shruzen. The brackets that fit onto the fender were molded right onto the shruzen and that bugged me, but other than that, no complaints about the kit. Oh, if you want to get anal, the tracks can go too.

feldgrau, I looked and have not found any mention of any Pz IV As, Bs, or Cs in Africa. I am starting to think that trying to make new dampers might be the best option or I could send you the dampers off one of my kits. That way I will be forced to fabricate new ones.

Richard James, I think I have a set of the Pz IV tracks that came with the old Tamiya kit. If you are just looking for some replacements and live in the continental US, I could send them to you. Otherwise, I would go with Friulmodel tracks. They are quite accurate, and you wont spend years putting them together.

j.s.harrison, sure, hop in the build if you want. I will add you to the list

Foster, you are a mad man!! I am surprised you have any vision left to complete the build. I cant wait to see this OOTB build, lol!!

All, concerning the dampers, does anyone live near a Pz IV and not mind taking some pics for us? I was thinking, perhaps we could have a bit of a consortium on making the dampers. I have access to an electronics lab and could probably photo etch parts to make the damper. I could also try to pump out a diagram on autocad, but I need someone who has a VERY precise printer to print up a mask for me. Once we get one master made, perhaps we could approach Tiger Model Designs to cast it and make some copies for us, or try ourselves. Of course I have no idea how much that would cost, but it was a thought.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but I am on this lest posting, more building kick. I am pretty far behind here and need to get some kits finished.

Good luck all!!

Edog,,, I live near Aberdeen and I know they have a Early IV there or they did and I can stop there on my way back from N.Y. this weekend and take a couple pics and post them. Hopefully they are the right ones. As far as sending me Dampers goes,, if you are going to make a boat load of them then sure but for experience purposes I kinda wanna make them myself.

My idea for trying to duplicate the rubber at the bottom of the damper was to get a hollow tube and slide a solid tube thru it. that would also make the top smooth as well and then just require a bolt on the top. I went out this weekend and picked up all the styrene I would need to do the job so as soon as I get one made I will post pics.

I think you are right about the A Bor C version in Africa and it being easier to make the dampers. I really do have my heart set on doing that Africa Korps version.

Thanks Edog... I'm make an list of todo's... Hopefully I can get rollin on this this week sometime... I'm still miffed about BOTH gun parts being damaged.... BUUUUUUT anyway enough whimpering....

Hey Guys,

I thought I would post an update with a few of the "little things" you should be aware of when building the Dragon Ausf G kit 9020.

Let me start by saying that with the obvious exception of the individual track links, there is very little clean-up required on any of the parts and they nearly fall together. The fit is really that good.

There are a couple errors in the instructions, but nothing you shouldn't notice and correct rather quickly. Also be aware that there are sprues that are the SAME letter. If you're not ready for it, searching for a part on the wrong sprue can be a bit disconcerting at first.

Here are a few assembly points you should also pay attention to:



Point A:
The instruction sheet is not very clear on the positioning of this part. It does not accurately show that there are two flat sides on the part's base. These two flat sides should be oriented left (against the fuel tank support bracket) and down (against the horizortal support flange). Also, you should wait until it's properly attached before putting on the small cap at the tip so that it can be properly oriented.

Point B:
The instructions have you attach the lifting hooks early in the lower hull assembly (Step 3). However, there are no guide marks or moon-shaped attachment lugs to ensure you get the perfect downward angle on the hooks. As you can see, the upper hull flange will slip between the lifting hook and the side hull plate, but the upper edge of the hook is precariously close to the top of the side hull. The fenders protrude straight out from here and if the hooks are angled down too far, they will prevent the upper hull from properly "seating" down onto the lower hull. I would hold off on attaching these parts until you are ready to dry-fit the upper and lower hulls together.

Point C:
The lower hull is covered with raised areas to assist with locating parts properly. Some of them are not used on the Ausf G and will need to be sanded down. The areas that are used are not perfect in size and are a bit "over-raised". Although I have hit them with a couple passes of a sanding stick, you can still see them in this close-up pic. However, since most of these areas will be heavily weathered, I don't think they will pose too much of a problem. Some modelers will want to take them down a bit more than I did.

That's it for now...more later,

Good work Robert... Don't you just love Dragon kits....

Can't wait to see it done...

If fieldgrau can get some good photos of the dampers, I can do up a tech illustration for it. Once done I'll e-mail it to any and all interested. If you can bring a ruler with you and rest it on the top of the damper for scale reference.

I'm thinking we need a side, front, top, and any details you want to include. We'll want to show the thickness of the mounting plates, the flanges, sleeve and its position on the hull.

Will do Mike,,, Will try to put the ruler in my car Friday nite. As requested I will get top bottom, left and right side and straight on. Mike do you want me to email them to you directly or do you want me to just post them here?? Let me know.

You can e-mail them to me.
Sent you an e-mail.
Thanks

Thanks Kenneth,

Anything I can do to help out. That's my motto.

Yes, I do love this kit. This has several "firsts" for me. First indi tracks, first Dragon kit, and first kit with schurzen.

Until next time...

Good motto to have! I dearly wish I had a Dragon IV on my self. Next time I buy kits I'm gonna get a dozen of them to make sure I have one.

The indi links aren't bad. On the PZ IV/III kits I built myself a jig of two long strips of wood glued to another board parallel to one another with a gap between that the guide tooth will fit in (not tight) I just lay the links in I need then go back and flow glue into the joints. Then set back and wait till the glue sets up enough to where you can pick the run of tracks up without them comming apart. Wrap the around the chassis and viola ...let it dry the rest of the way then finnish painting...! I would suggest haveing the chassis at lease basecoated and the rubber rims (if applicable) painted...

Good luck pal

QUOTE: Originally posted by Kennethc I would suggest haveing the chassis at lease basecoated and the rubber rims (if applicable) painted...

Thanks, but I'm a step ahead of you...

I put the base coat of Sandgelb RLM79 on the lower hull sides last night.

I'll spend today working on upper hull details and will probably get to all the rubber parts tomorrow. I don't even want to touch the indi tracks again for at least 3 or 4 days!

Until next time,

QUOTE: QUOTE: Originally posted by Kennethc I would suggest haveing the chassis at lease basecoated and the rubber rims (if applicable) painted... Thanks, but I'm a step ahead of you...

Most everyone is... But it never hurts....

Looking forward to pics of your build...

a technical question...Where were the Division markings on the Jagdpanzer IV??... on the chassis slope, or the main body slope..The tamiya kit im working has the box art in one spot, but the directions on a other.....

Thanks

QUOTE: Originally posted by gcbob a technical question...Where were the Division markings on the Jagdpanzer IV??... on the chassis slope, or the main body slope..The tamiya kit im working has the box art in one spot, but the directions on a other.....

Which Panzer Division are you representing with your build? and when?

Divisional marking will vary from PD to PD and even between vehicle types within the PD. They will also vary depending on the time during the war. If you have the Division and the timeframe, I can look it up in my references.

Mike (Renarts): Re Dampers. These Help?

Alright, I need your help again.

I built the late version of the D. The decals for the late version are for the Balkans front. But on the box there is a late version for the Battle of France but on the directions say that the battle of france D was the early version. What one is Right?
Both??

P.S. Most of the reference pics i could get showed that the hatches were White, or they were dark yellow, the same color as the vehicle but it was hard to tell.

I'm new to armour modelling and I just happened to buy an Academy Panzer IV.

Count me in for this group build and who knows, I might learn something along the way.

Cheers,
Gabe

I forgot to ask - Is there an icon for this Group Build? If there is, how do we put it onto the bottom of our reply box.

Just asking..

Cheers,
Gabe

Gabe, Welcome to the forum and the Darkside...

Can't speak 100% but most of the time the icon isn't issued until a person finnishes their project... Its more of a trophy than an identity....does that make sense...

Good luck with your project and keep well...


ALL, I finnaly got started on my project... Got the major hull pieces glued together and half the wheels sanded.... Thats about it...

Edog, could you put me on the list?

also, will there be a GB patch for this build? just wondering.

Oh, and I think that i am going to paint my hatches white, it was all i could fined, but if somebody has a book on it or something that says otherwise please let me know. Thanks.
P.S. Please also answer my Question in the above reply.

Thank you

I went shopping for a Panzer 4 today, most are running around $40 but I found an Academy Panzer 4 H for $18. I have never built anything by academy, the photos on the side of the box looked decent, but the academy Stuart is like $25 which kind of concerns me. So anyone know if this kit is worthwhile, most of my armor experience is with Tamiya so you could use that as a reference point.

Thanks

Its like this.... The old Academy kits are mostly bad copies of crappy Tamiya kits from the 70's Academys new stuff..ie the stuart isn't even comparable, they are new molds that i suppose they created, and are excellent kits.

I realize the Academy kit has an attractive price but to me it isn't worth the headache of building one to save a buck. You can get a great DML ausf J or not much more than that and get indi links too. Or if your feeling froggy hop into the (newer) Tamiya kits that almost put themselves together. By newer I mean the Pz's tooled in the early 90's or later.

Good luck with your choice...

photos taken from the afv interiors website

As you can see in these pics, it seems that some hatches were painted with the interior white, while others were painted the exterior vehicle color. Even in the black & white photos you can can clearly see the lighter color painted on the hatch interior and the exterior color painted on the hatch.

Here is a link to an article specifcally dealing with interior panzer colors.
http://byrden.com/panzers/Colours/index.html

Petbat Thanks. These are certainly good reference photos and the best I've seen so far of the dampers. feldgrau will be getting some more detailed photos and that will give us a very accurate representation of the damper. In my book there can never be too many photos of a subject.

Rebel, interior of hatches were painted the same as the exterior-never white. White was too easy to see and made a nice aiming point - although a little to one side and the round may have gone in one open hatch and out the other This is also why the Germans changed the Balkenkreutz after France.

Production of the Ausf D ran for about a year from Sept '39. The only real change to a 'late' D was the spaced armour to the front plate. As time went on existing 'D's' were upgraded in the field, but these changes were not huge (fitting later 40cm wide tracks, suspension improvements, etc). I do not have the Tamiya D, but it would be safe to say a 'late' would have been present during the Battle of France. ( 'Squadron Signals PzKpfW IV In Action' actually has a pic of several D's and E's with the comment 'in France after the campaign of 1940'.)