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M48 Patton FINISHED! Page 16

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  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Monday, October 18, 2010 8:59 PM

If you have it layin' around somewhere, IIRC, the Italeri "US Equipment Set" has a couple of the "WATER" decals...

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Monday, October 18, 2010 9:56 PM

Thanks, Mike and Hans--again, good info that I can definitely use. I may put off painting until I can get up to the LHS; won't be able to do that until at least Thursday.

Gotta find some of those cans too. AlI have here is WWII stuff, or purely modern stuff. Hans, where'd you get those cans?

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Kincheloe Michigan
Posted by Mikeym_us on Monday, October 18, 2010 10:10 PM

On the workbench: Dragon 1/350 scale Ticonderoga class USS BunkerHill 1/720 scale Italeri USS Harry S. Truman 1/72 scale Encore Yak-6

The 71st Tactical Fighter Squadron the only Squadron to get an Air to Air kill and an Air to Ground kill in the same week with only a F-15   http://photobucket.com/albums/v332/Mikeym_us/

  • Member since
    May 2009
  • From: Poland
Posted by Pawel on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 5:12 AM

Doog, I needed a water can myself, some time ago, and I decided to do them myself. Here's a link to the thread and little foto for you:

/forums/t/120369.aspx?PageIndex=3

1:35 Vietnam Quad 50 loader by Pawel Mroczkowski

By the way, I got my "WATER" lettering from a Tamiya M48 decal sheet, so please take a look, you might already have it.

Good luck with your project and have a nice day

Paweł

All comments and critique welcomed. Thanks for your honest opinions!

www.vietnam.net.pl

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 1:40 PM

Hans, where'd you get those cans?

I honestly dunno Doog.. I buy sets like that everywhere I go, whether I need 'em or not, and been totin' parts-boxes around the world and cross-country for 30 years with the remnants of a thousand or so models-worth of "fiddly bits" and accessories... And yeah, that reminds me, I did see the "Water" decals on the Tamiya M-48 decal sheet too..  The Italeri equipment set I think I found on Ebay a couple years ago... I bought a bunch of those kinda sets, along with the Testor's Diorama Accessory Sets in a lot...

Another avenue you might take is the model railroad department of the LHS and the dry transfer letters used for rolling stock... Lotsa letters & numbers on those in various sizes and styles, both black and white, and the yellow ones will yield up some stuff you can use for Vietnam-era USMC stencils.. Granted, it's easier if you have a decal that reads, "WATER", "MOGAS", or "DIESEL in one piece, but doing one letter at a time ain't all that bad, and the result is worth it, IMHO..

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 1:51 PM

Mike, thanks for those links! I already have the "Patton stowage" and guess what? The darned jerry cans have the more modern tops on them! AARGH!

Pawel, nice can--wow, was the lettering really that big? I'm sure I can find something to replicate that--heck, I can even paint that if I really need to. It remains to be seen if I use a water can...

Hans--well, no problem; I actually searched last night for over an hour for those types of can--I even dragged out the old bins with OLD parts trees and parts. Searched the parts box--nuthin. I wound up getting so frustrated that I'm now making the can tops from scratch. I WILL have my 'Nam cans, by Charlie! lol

I'm cooking with gas now---just got back from the LHS, and I'll be hopefully getting something done before my students get here...

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 2:05 PM

wow, was the lettering really that big?

Sometimes that big, sometimes smaller, sometimes they were vertical... There really isn't a "standard", since the stencils are whatever size are laying around the unit supply room or motor pool...  They don't come with the stencils pre-painted.  Just whatever the guy doing the painting can find...

  • Member since
    September 2006
  • From: Dripping Springs, TX, USA
Posted by RBaer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 2:06 PM

Still watchin'......

Apprentice rivet counter.

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 3:59 PM

Good stuff to know, Hans--that'll make things easier on me!

RBaer--here's some food for your hungry eyes! Wink

FINALLY, I have a base coat. I had to re-fill some seams and whatnot...

Then, I used Model Master Marine Green with about a 50/50 shot of MM Gloss for a semi-gloss sheen, and shot a coat covering almost all of the Black-Green base, leaving only some pre-shade in the deeper creases.

Then I added a touch of Radome Tan and a smidge of Yellow, and highlighted the center areas.

I'm pretty pleased with the result so far. I may add a little more "green" to the mix, to get more of a "Marine" green? What say my brothers of styrene?

  • Member since
    October 2008
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by oddmanrush on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 4:10 PM

I like it. Don't know about you but when it comes time to put paint on plastic I get a little excited...like the project is finally becoming what I intended it to become. Looks good so far.

Jon

My Blog: The Combat Workshop 

  • Member since
    September 2006
  • From: Dripping Springs, TX, USA
Posted by RBaer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 6:29 PM

Green is good!

Apprentice rivet counter.

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 6:54 PM

Thanks guys--I get a little excited too when the paint is on--now comes the fun part! Making it look like it just came through the jungle!

Stay tuned!

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 6:57 PM

As far as the color

Nice touch with the highlight. Now the other thing you will need is MIG VN Earth pigment....

Remember the extreams...during the rainy season lots of red mud.....during the dry times....red dust everywhere!!

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: S.W. Missouri
Posted by Pvt Mutt on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 7:37 PM

I'm right near yellin WOWSurprise

Tony LeeSmile

Shoot Low Boys They're Ridin Ponys

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 10:29 PM

the doog

 

 

My student had a blast watching me airbrush and learning some tricks--cute kid, honestly, and asks a million questions...lol

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u244/heydoog/M48%20Patton/100_1156.jpg

How is your young apprentice getting along? Did you light any fires in his soul to become a modeler?

 

 

 

 

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Tuesday, October 19, 2010 10:41 PM

redleg12

 

Nice touch with the highlight. Now the other thing you will need is MIG VN Earth pigment....

Remember the extreams...during the rainy season lots of red mud.....during the dry times....red dust everywhere!!

That depends on where the unit was though, right? I'm no expert on Vietnamese geography but wasn't the red clay peculiar to the Central Highlands and along the DMZ, Khe Sahn, and along the Mekong and that AO? 

 

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Connecticut, USA
Posted by Nachtflieger on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 3:46 AM

Nice paint work Karl, I really like the lightened effect in the center panels......gotta try that next time I build something green.Big Smile

Nate

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 6:12 AM

It came out pretty good.  I think it may need a little more Marine Green in the mix. It appears pretty OD to me.  Also, I don't really go for the whole pre-shade and panel highlighting technique, but I know you will make it look good in the end.  Good job so far.

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 8:32 AM

This is such a tease!

I love M48's.

I'm looking forward to the finished product.

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 11:03 AM

Thanks, Mike! I do have some of that "Vietnam Earth" from MIG!

Tony--thanks for looking in!

Lee--Solomon has been bitten by the modeling bug. He really wants to do a rusty car like my Nomad-that's what inspired him--but I'm first showing him some airbrushing basics. He went out and got a basic single-action airbrush, and I'm helping him learn how to use it and to make better models! It's nice to see a young'un developing a love for the hobby! There's not enough of them out there!

Nate--glad you like the look. I use the shading technique because when I do heavy weathering, it helps to maintain a sense of depth to the weathered model. If you go for a "clean" look, it may appear too garish, so be careful how much you lighten the highlights, and plan ahead!

HeavyArty

It came out pretty good.  I think it may need a little more Marine Green in the mix. It appears pretty OD to me.  Also, I don't really go for the whole pre-shade and panel highlighting technique, but I know you will make it look good in the end.  Good job so far.

Gino, it's funny how close you and I are on this opinion--I sat up looking at those photos last night thinking the same thing--"Hmm, it looks awfully olive drabby!" I didn't put any decals on it until I could look at it in the natural light, Here's two photos I just took outside and inside in the natural light. You can see that the shading really isn't that severe--the flash really brings that aspect out--but alas; it's still really "drabbish"--more so in the latter "inside" photo.

Weird, huh? So I think it's time for a "Simple Green" bath. I'm going to strip it and try again.I could just repaint it, but I don't want all that thick paint on my model.

Interestingly, I wasn't too awfully crazy about the actual "ModelMaster Marine Green" shade either. It just didn't look "green" enough either. I think I may go for the "J.A. Green" instead, and work from there?

Just as a reference point--do you, or anyone here know, if the "Marine" green was any more, or less, "green" than the "Army" green?

Thanks too, for weighing in, TD!

At least I can work on my figures until the paint strips...

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Kincheloe Michigan
Posted by Mikeym_us on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 12:04 PM

why don't you use some faded Olive Drab or even white with Marine corps green next time.

On the workbench: Dragon 1/350 scale Ticonderoga class USS BunkerHill 1/720 scale Italeri USS Harry S. Truman 1/72 scale Encore Yak-6

The 71st Tactical Fighter Squadron the only Squadron to get an Air to Air kill and an Air to Ground kill in the same week with only a F-15   http://photobucket.com/albums/v332/Mikeym_us/

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 1:05 PM

Doog -- That is funny how we think alike.  For USMC green, I prefer Testors Model Master Medium Green.  The USMC green is lighter and brighter green than the dark green that the US Army used.  You can see the color pretty well on these restored USMC CH-34s. 

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 6:16 PM

Mike, thanks for the idea, but I think I want to get AWAY from OD shades on this one?

HeavyArty

Doog -- That is funny how we think alike.  For USMC green, I prefer Testors Model Master Medium Green.  The USMC green is lighter and brighter green than the dark green that the US Army used.  You can see the color pretty well on these restored USMC CH-34s. 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/53/CH-34_HMM-362.jpg

Gino,

Roger that, thanks for the photo--I've stripped the tank and already base-coated it in Tamiya Dark Green. It seems to be a good base for a "greener" green. I'll be putting a color coat on it tomorrow when I can see it in the natural light; trying to do it here by fluorescent light doesn't give me a good read on it.

Man, I gotta say--if you need to strip acrylic paint, this "Simple Green" stuff kicks butt! This is from a 1/2 hour bath in it--paint gone! 

More of an update tomorrow!

 

  • Member since
    May 2009
  • From: Poland
Posted by Pawel on Thursday, October 21, 2010 1:58 AM

Well now that was a radical move doog - I don't think I'd do this. I'd probably paint over - I heard American vehicles can have A LOT of paint layers on them, as they are frequently repainted. Once I had a similar problem - if I pose two M48's side by side, one of them is Army and the other is Marine, could I tell them apart only looking at the color? And what would it look like? I asked Doug Kibbey and he forwarded my question to his friends, and the answer was Marine green was greener and lighter than Army OD, and it tended to fade to an almost pea-green shade. I was told this was often accelerated by the soldiers washing their equipment with fuel mixed with green paint - this "renovated" the paint at first, but then it faded...

I say the choice of preshading color will be critical here. Army OD should be almost not green at all from what I heard, whereas Marines color should definitely be green. So probably dark grey, maybe with a little blue additive would do the trick? For the centers of panels I'd go with a light shade of green. I'm not quite sure about the "scale effect" but could be it kicks in here. Plus we expect the paint to be faded right?

Another option to consider, if you're going for that "red dust" effect would be to preshade in red/brown right away. The red dust would deposit in the crevices first, so it works - the recessed parts ot the machine are covered with red dust, the centers of the panels are somewhat cleaner/greener, dusted off by crew walking, plants rubbing and the eventual wind. On the other hand there are many fotos of Marines moving along sandy beaches - in such case the weathering should be rather sandy sand than red.

Hope it helps and good luck with your project

Paweł

All comments and critique welcomed. Thanks for your honest opinions!

www.vietnam.net.pl

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Thursday, October 21, 2010 1:54 PM

Pawel

Well now that was a radical move doog - I don't think I'd do this. I'd probably paint over - I heard American vehicles can have A LOT of paint layers on them, as they are frequently repainted. Once I had a similar problem - if I pose two M48's side by side, one of them is Army and the other is Marine, could I tell them apart only looking at the color? And what would it look like? I asked Doug Kibbey and he forwarded my question to his friends, and the answer was Marine green was greener and lighter than Army OD, and it tended to fade to an almost pea-green shade. I was told this was often accelerated by the soldiers washing their equipment with fuel mixed with green paint - this "renovated" the paint at first, but then it faded...

I say the choice of preshading color will be critical here. Army OD should be almost not green at all from what I heard, whereas Marines color should definitely be green. So probably dark grey, maybe with a little blue additive would do the trick? For the centers of panels I'd go with a light shade of green. I'm not quite sure about the "scale effect" but could be it kicks in here. Plus we expect the paint to be faded right?

Another option to consider, if you're going for that "red dust" effect would be to preshade in red/brown right away. The red dust would deposit in the crevices first, so it works - the recessed parts ot the machine are covered with red dust, the centers of the panels are somewhat cleaner/greener, dusted off by crew walking, plants rubbing and the eventual wind. On the other hand there are many fotos of Marines moving along sandy beaches - in such case the weathering should be rather sandy sand than red.

Hope it helps and good luck with your project

Paweł

Pawel, thanks--that's also really a good perspective and great info to consider. Ironically, that kinda jibes with what I was instinctively feeling before I striped the tank--I really want to see "green" in the color. Here's what I have so far this afternoon...

I think these were taken with a flash, so it may look a bit brighter than it looks without one. It has a bit of a semi-gloss in it too.

Definitely more in the ball park of what I see as "Marine Green" from some photos I've seen. It still will get a lot of modulation with filters and washes too. I don't think I'll post-fade it any more than it is now though; I kinda like where it is now.

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: S.W. Missouri
Posted by Pvt Mutt on Thursday, October 21, 2010 3:09 PM

"REPAINT"!

Yep that Super Green does a number pronto on paint. "REPAINT"!

Tony LeeSmile

Shoot Low Boys They're Ridin Ponys

  • Member since
    October 2004
  • From: Northern Virginia
Posted by ygmodeler4 on Thursday, October 21, 2010 3:16 PM

I like this current paint better than the previous one, nice job

-Josiah

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, October 21, 2010 3:19 PM

Very cool--I think you made the right move.  When I clicked back into this thread the first thing I saw was the tank in the original color and I thought to myself: "Too light...". 

That was before I read that anyoen else had thought the same thing or saw that you had a "re-do"...

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Thursday, October 21, 2010 8:13 PM

After a nice bath, thing look much greener!!....Keep it coming

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Thursday, October 21, 2010 8:25 PM

Thanks, Tony, Josiah, Manny and Mike--I'm relieved to hear that it's passing muster.

One thing I didn't expect---the SImple Green paint strip took my casting numbers off! Bang Head Another re-do on the docket tonight...lol.

Live and learn....Sad

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