Tamiya Panzer II Ausf B - COMPLETE! (19.09.12)

Ben i have been doing some checking useing the vallejo paint guide and the numbers given on the site i found don't seem to correspond with the vellejo RAL colours, so i am not 100% certain.

Bill, is the Schokoladenbraun you use the same you would use for a 3 colour scheme. Origionally that was the colour i was thinking of.

Bish,

Testors designates its Schokoladenbraun as being part of the '43 Panzer scheme (the three tone) but I find it to be much too dark for rotbraun and mix my own lighter color. It is, however, a virtually perfect match when I hold it up against the color chip for Dunkelbraun in the '38 scheme. Go figure! HTH!

Maybe i will try my xtracolour Schokoladenbraun and darken it slightly. I have the PT 1-2 now, finally, so i can do some comparisons with that.

Hi guys,

Still slow progress due to my workload plus we have soooo many people off sick with a stomach Flu I'm having to work 2pm-10pm today so the day on which I'd wanted to get the German Grey basecoat on I'm restricted to assembling Friuls. In theory manning the emergeny work phone from home on Saturday is notoriously quiet there's always the risk of being stuck on a 60 minute phonecall with someone - a call that will no doubt come when my airbrush is fully loaded and in use - not good!

On the plus side it's double time now so the offer of this shift was not to be sniffed at

Like I say I'll be doing Friul assembly during work time today now and I'll start painting tomorrow.

I have just had a delivery of two brown colours and have just taken a sheet of plasticard which I can wipe down later with Cellulose so it's not wasted

The below photo:

In the centre is a quick squirt of TS-4 Tamiya German Grey rattlecan spray that I had and around it is a cemi-circle of some browns that I have, you can see their names and colours quite well.

After looking at Bills website link to his Pz II here (I hope you don't mind me doing this Bill) http://www.bpmodels.net/Model/Album/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=38 

Scroll about halfway down to see the painting stages on the link.

I think the Vallejo Chocolate Brown is ideal and I'm sold on it BUT would like you chaps to look and see what you think - the colours go from very dark browns to light browns (there are several photos):

I'm not going to start mixing colours - close enough is fine as it's going to very dusty.

I like the Vallejo Chocolate Brown? You?

Cheers fellas,

Ben

I don't know myself, that tank brown looks darker. I have a bottle of that, un used so far, and its darker than i expected, looks to dark for the late war tri colour scheme to me.

Hi Bish,

The Tank Brown is a useful colour but isn't ideal. Imo the Chocolate Brown looks A-OK!

Tank and Chocolate Brown seems to be the general favourites.

It's definately not a shade that would be suitable for a late war Tri-scheme but for the early war grey/brown needed for my Panzer II either will do. I've looked at the colour cards posted on here and it's not far off perfect - definately a very close match. Under the weathering and dust it will look fine.

It's good that you're "thinking ahead" to how the weathering will impact the final color. Pick the one that you think will give the best pallette to work from and go with it.

Cheers Bill and everyone else for looking in,

I've tried my hand at most basic Cammo schemes but am yet to try this one - being a BIG fan of these early war machines I thought it be best to get this colour spot on (or as near as dammit anyway)!

Bill, as-ever your own site continues to aid in my work. We obviously share a taste for similar builds! Hopefully one day we'll share similar talent too Your work of late has been truly impressive!

I've really struggled for build time in the last couple of months due to work, work, work and oh, more work! People off sick, no-one to cover shifts and as a result I'm shattered at the weekends (when I'm not working and have build time I find it hard to get really motivated to build as I'm so shattered)  >:( AAGGHHH!

I'm not meaning to sound ungrateful in any way as I know there are so many people that need work but it's the sheer number of hours and the build time that is eluding me that is really getting me down at the minute. Ho hum! This bloody hot weather doesn't help as I HATE it!

Anyway, on a positive note. It won't last long and overtime will be down to two extra shifts a month. The Friuls are nigh on complete and next weekend is totally free (and we have a UK Monday Bank Holiday on the 27th August) so I'm hoping to make an impact next weekend.

One question regarding the additional armour (bolted on plates around the drivers visor). I've seen some models with the tiny gaps between the plates all filled. Should I really be filling these gaps in or leving a little visual gap between each plate. Surely WWII tanks with bolted on armour would not have perfectly interlocking plates like the woodwork of a master craftsman?

It's no problem to fill the gaps but I'd like to read your thoughts on this subject? Pictures from the time are 'difficult' to read!

Many thanks,

Ben  :)

I echo Bill's comments. The weathering really can affect the colors.

No worries Ben, I've been accused of influencing other builder's stash acquisitions in the past, so it's no surprise to see you're suffering from similar effects! Appreciate the kind words, don't sell your own abilities short...you've come a long way in a short space of time yourself!

Yes, Bill is very guilty of influencing others to buy kits.  I lost count how many kits I had to buy after watching his builds.  I think he works for Dragon as an undercover agent.  But I still always forgive him but I don't think my wife does.

I brought same bottle from AK but I haven't tried it yet.  Can't wait to see you try it on your build.  Looking forward to your update!

Ben, i just checked the photos in my PT 2-1 and there are a couple that show the extra armour nicely. And they are very tight fitting. They even appear to have welded where one piece of extra armour joins another and where it joins the hull. The pics are from the front and side, none from above. But it seems they did a proper job.

I know what you mean about work getting in the way of building. I am curently on 2 and a half months leave before i am out, so hopeing i can make the most of it with some decent bench time for once.

Cheers guys!

Hi guys,

If you recall last week I reported on struggling to be able to get much build time of late so with things slowing down at work for a bit now and being on the eve of the start of Tigerman's GB this weekend, which is all mine as well as the Monday which is a UK Bank Holiday, now is the time to really get things moving!

UPDATE:

So, last weekend the basic assembly was complete and all ready to go (tools to be painted and fitted following the completed cammo scheme - stowage near the end).

Keeping it brief, I primed the entire build yesterday afternoon with airbrushed Vallejo grey primer and painted the main grey basecoat this morning. I decided to not bother with an attempt at a pre-shade as I'll be trying my hand at some post-highlighting etc. and my pre-shade attempts usually fail miserably anyway!

I basecoated the build with Tamiya German Grey with a dash of Medium Blue and the added some Tamiya 'Neutral Grey' to my basecoat mix and applied some highlights. Unfortunately my Camera batteries had been pinched by Dad so I had to use the camera on my phone. The basecoat grey came out lovely but the colour looks washed out in a few of the pictures but it honestly looks really nice. The highlights look great but the phone photos let them down. You'll see them better tomorrow when I apply the chocolate brown to complete the scheme. The barrels were painted with Vallejo Model Color Gunmetal .

Tomorrow I'll apply the brown and the decals and carry on with the fiddly Friuls.

Photos:

Everything after last week:

Photos taken outside that looked waay too bright! You get the idea though!

Photo taken indoors which is a little bit better:

The turret  (the paint blocked up all the holes in the muzzle brake so they had to be cleared)!

I picked up some AK stuff to help with the Panzer Grey scheme

As you can see she's coming along nicely now. I'll get the Chocolate Brown part of the scheme done tomorrow followed by the decals. Then onto the tools once the Friuls are finished.

I'll get some decent photos taken tomorrow for you too!

Cheers guys,

Ben

Quick update lads:

I've actually just sprayed it again - the basecolour was a bit off and too light and the brown would have looked wrong.

I used Vallejo Model air German Grey with a couple of drops of Vallejo Gloss Varnish to help harden the paint up - I'm liking that paint. I've never used Model Air before.

The brown I have is also model air and is called tank brown - a perfect match, near enough!

I'll do the brown tomorrow.

Ben

Hiya Ben.  How the heck did I miss this?  Looks good.  How do you like the AK products?  i know there are so many out there but I do like them a lot.

Hi guys,

Wingnut - I love the AK stuff. I know a lot of it like filters etc can be made using your own oils and thinners but the streaking colours are superb and so much easier to work with than trying to make streaks from dots of oils.

A quick update:

Having brushed myself down from the setback of losing the boxes and the Jack I'm on the go once more. I'm hoping to get the two replacement sprues that I need from the UK distributor of Tamiya, Hobby co., and have already sent them an Email. It's Bank holiday today so I'll phone them tomorrow.

I went over the basecoat from Saturday which, in the end, I did think was too light, with Vallejo Model Air German Grey. Today I added the Brown parts of the scheme using Model Air Tank Brown - I love that paint, it's the first time I've used it and my God does it airbrush well. I had heard that it can set a little soft so I added a few drops of Vallejo Gloss Varnish into the cup for good measure.

The wheels are sprayed, mostly grey hubs but a few are brown. I need to paint the wheels yet.

The decals are on and looking ok. The one at the back of the turret that sits over the vision slit doesn't want to sit down so I'm treating that with more Micro-Sol. Some carrier film is slightly visible on the Turret left hand side but that will be fine too.

The model will be left to set properly this week and next week I'll start the tools and when they are on it's weathering time. The Friuls are still a wip but I'll get them done - no rush.

Photos - remember any dodgy decals have been sorted and due to the decaling it's as glossy as my Dad's bald head at the minute so ignore that. It's had a final light coat of gloss varnish to seal it up:

Stowage - I've got this nice Resin box with clasp, Jerry cans, a 'K' Ration box that can be painted, a Pz III toolbox and this Marder III M ammo crate to help plug the gaps left by the lost items. I've tried everywhere but can I find anyone with a spare Panzer II Jack? NO! I have a Dragon 38T Jack, could that, in theory, be used? I was going to also make some small sandbags?

I hope you like her so far guys. I didn't feel like carrying on with this after losing all that stuff but I'm glad I did - she's turning out really nicely now.

I've just checked and that decal at the back of the turret has sat down PERFECTLY on that vision slit.

Now let's hope I can get these parts replaced!

Take care fellas,

Ben

Thats looking great Ben, really glad you stuck with it.

I have a question about the AK stuff. I am planning on getting some myself soon, those streaking crimes look really useful, but i am in two minds about the filters. As you say these can be done with oil's, but i still like the idea of specific ones. Would you still recomend them.

Heh!

Streaking CRIMES Bish? Have you been going to Cricket matches again! LOL! Did you steal a policemans helmet?

As for Streaking GRIMES I had three different ones up until I bought the 'Streaking Grime for Panzer Grey Streaking' one the other day - I can't comment on that yet as it's unopened.

The three I use are Streaking Grime (mud colour), Winter Streaking Grime (Dark mucky colour that is very effective and finally, the best of all - Streaking Rust! Now that stuff is brilliant!

I also use MIG's Grease Stain and thin that down to apply around engine gatches. It's too gloopy from the bottle for making streaks - it makes a great pinwash too, they all do.

Buy the winter and Rust ones and the odourless thinner and give it a go. It takes a while to master the 'art' as you paint the lines on thickly then using a brush humidifies with the thinner you have to thin the lines down to make faint streak marks. If you buy the first AK DVD or look on you tube you'll find a guide.

The filters are ok but ones made yourself are just as good. Again, buy a bottle of the colour that you think will help you most and see.

I hope this helps matey,

Note: I do not work for AK and am not on commission either - more's the pity!

Ben

Thanks Ben, remember, i'm just a GRUNT, spelling isn't my strong suit lol.

Thanks for the tips, i have been eyeing up the winter and Pz Grey Grimes and the Pz Grey washes, just as a starter. I will give those a go and see how they compare.

That wasn't spelling-that was a typo!

Like you say, try them out and see. I'd love to hear what you think buddy?

Ben

Good for you Ben in terms of sticking with it and overcoming the dilemma! Nice job on the camo pattern and markings.

Cheers Bill,

The basecoat was kept simple. If you look back on this thread you'll see my original basecoat made up from Tamiya paints which turned out ok but it was no good for this scheme. If I were going with a basic Panzer Grey I'd have stuck with it as it would have weathered up nicely but I felt it needed to be a much darker grey to allow the scheme to work - hence my using of the basic Model Air German Grey colour, as you can see the Model Air Tank Brown looks really good on the Dark Grey base.

I'll start laying down some filters and washes to start knitting the two colours together.

I haven't overcome the dilemma yet but seeing as the problem is only missing items it means I can continue with the build as normal. I'm hoping to at least source the sprue with the boxes on from the UK distributors of Tamiya which apparently is pretty easy, particularly with the newer kits? Hopefully someone will have a Pz II Jack going spare too!

A couple of questions:

• The Jack - can I use a 38T Jack in it's place? I have a Dragon one and it's still on the sprue?
• My friend from the 'UK' forum ,John Pridgent, has said that all vehicles involved in the Westward assault on France had a white air recognition sguare or rectangle painted on the engine hatch at the rear. Should I do this, in your opinion anyway?

Cheers Bill,

Ben  

I'm not sure about the 38(t) jack, but i think you said you had a Pz III. From what i could tell, the Pz III jacks look the same as those on the Pz II.

Many vehicle carried an Air recigntion flag, and there are a few photos of vehicles which have what looks like a white patch on the back, but its hard to tell. And it does not seem to have been confined to the campaign in the west. And many vehicles carried a lot of equipment on the rear decks, so this patch would be covered up anyway.

The Pz III Jack is a bit different in shape - a bit longer too (I have a spare here).

The 38T Jack is perfect but I'm assuming some 'artistic license' is required?

Cheers Bish!

Ben

Looks good Ben,the stowage will look good on it

Ben,

The Pz II jack isn't the same as the 38t or Pz III jack for the A/B/C variants. Now, having said that, there's nothing to say that an enterprising vehicle crew that had their jack lost/stolen/broken wouldn't have commandeered an available jack (so long as it was rated for the vehicle's weight) from another vehicle or unit type if one was handy as an expedient solution. Having "a" jack on the vehicle is better than "no" jack IMHO.

As to the question on the air recognition flag/emblem, it's hard to get top-down shots showing it but they were used. I don't know that I would say they were used on "all" vehicles as there's also a lot of photo evidence of red cloth Nazi flags being used for the same purpose. I did find a color photo that shows, at an angle, the presence of such a white panel, from Panzerwaffe Vol 2: The Campaigns in the West 1940 by Mark Healy (posted for discussion purposes only).

Good point about the jack bill, and ye, any jack, as long as it can take the weight, is better than no jack.

I have seen that photo and i few others but i wsn't sure. I thought maybe it could have been a trick of the light due to the angle of that part of the vehcile. But your pic is a lot clearer than the one i have and shows it clearer than any otehrs.

Cheers guys - great photo Bill

Good news - Hobby Co. are sending me the new 'H' Sprue with the entire Jack assembly on it and the barrel changing kit box/spare barrel tube too. Only £5.50 inc. post.

I've got something else that will do just as good for the small tool box so I'm not buying an entire other sprue just to get that!

The Pz II is back on track!

Ben

Hinksy

• My friend from the 'UK' forum ,John Pridgent, has said that all vehicles involved in the Westward assault on France had a white air recognition sguare or rectangle painted on the engine hatch at the rear. Should I do this, in your opinion anyway?

Cheers Bill,

Ben

Ben in the decal sheet from the lovely people at Bison Decals they definitely show an air recognition on the engine hatch on the rear deck.  You can see what I mean here click me

Also from the pics that I have, the PzKpfw II didn't seem to carry a heck of a lot of stowage in Poland or France

Loving this thread by the way, it's a really interesting read.