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Trumpeter to release 'Blackwater' figs

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  • Member since
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  • From: Bridgeview, Illinois
Trumpeter to release 'Blackwater' figs
Posted by mg.mikael on Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:02 PM

Looks like Trumpeter will be releasing some new figs and another new armor piece all from the modern war in Iraq. But instead of the regular soliders, these figs are of the private military contractors(such as Blackwater.) Should make for some interesting dio possibilities, with the future release of kits such as "PMC in Iraq VIP Protection."

http://www.perthmilitarymodelling.com/newkitnews/trumpeter.htm

"A good plan executed now is better than a perfect plan next week." - George S. Patton

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  • Member since
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  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:07 PM
Blackwater is (was) only one of many Private Security Contractors in Iraq.  The figures could represent any of them.  They do look good and are very welcome though.  I hope they are high quality.

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
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  • From: Denver
Posted by tankboy51 on Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:08 PM
All I can say is that these sets won't be finding their way into my collection.  ( I can't paint a figure well anyway.)
  • Member since
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  • From: clinton twp, michigan
Posted by camo junkie on Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:16 PM
its only one figure but its resin and its made by new world miniatures, but it is a "blackwater" type guy. i have him and its nicely detailed! just thought i'd throught that out there if someone cares! Big Smile [:D]
"An idea is only as good as the person who thought of it...and only as brilliant as the person who makes it!!"
  • Member since
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  • From: East TX
Posted by modelchasm on Friday, August 7, 2009 10:08 AM

Look like those figures could be easily modded into an SF role as well. I second Heavy's thought of that I hope they are of decent molds.

I also like to the M1117 Guardian. Hope this one is nicely detailed as well.

"If you're not scratching, you're not trying!"  -Scott

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: clinton twp, michigan
Posted by camo junkie on Friday, August 7, 2009 2:31 PM
that's what i was thinking as well scott. i do hope they're better than anything they've produced to date figure wise. Ashamed [*^_^*]
"An idea is only as good as the person who thought of it...and only as brilliant as the person who makes it!!"
  • Member since
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  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Friday, August 7, 2009 11:11 PM
About time they did something like those guys...  The conversion possibilities are quite good..

  • Member since
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Posted by Grimmo on Saturday, August 8, 2009 7:04 AM
looks good. hope to get a couple of these kits! though i wasnt happy with their us marine set
  • Member since
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  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Saturday, August 8, 2009 8:17 AM
 modelchasm wrote:


I also like to the M1117 Guardian. Hope this one is nicely detailed as well.



Sign - Ditto [#ditto] I've been wondering how easy it would be to modify one of the older V100 Commandos but it would have involved elongating and widening the whole body, etc.

So I’ll definitely be purchasing that kit in the future, although I wouldn’t be surprised to find it missing parts that would have been cut off or deleted from any junkyard/export type Guardian, as Trumpeter has a tendency to lose things like wire cutters and MG mounts, mirrors and so on. I did their 1/35 LAV-25 and it was nice enough OOB.

But I agree, Trumpeter’s figure kits are only so-so. Their Marine kit came with the LAV and I’ve hacked it up and split it amongst other kits parts where I can. But most of the vests were no good and the legs/knee pads were questionable at best. They mold some heavy, deep folds and the tac gear on the people looks more like bad airsoft simulation Walmart gear than anything I’ve seen on a soldier. The weapons are decent enough. Thanks for the link  mg.mikael

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    June 2003
  • From: Caput Mundi
Posted by Avus on Monday, August 10, 2009 4:21 AM

 psstoff995 wrote:

But I agree, Trumpeter’s figure kits are only so-so. (...) looks more like bad airsoft simulation Walmart gear than anything I’ve seen on a soldier.

I like the way you put it, psstoff995!

Knowing Trumpeter's figures, I'm afraid we'll only get "Walmart Contractors"!

Klaus

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  • Member since
    December 2008
  • From: Northern Va
Posted by psstoff995's lbro on Monday, August 10, 2009 1:09 PM
From seeing the new vehicle sets they're putting out (from the website they look good at least) lets just hope they brought their figs up to par. Smile [:)] I'd  like to see those kits, so if anyone gets 'em when they come out post some pics please!
-Will young modeler Test fit master
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Monday, August 10, 2009 1:36 PM
 Avus wrote:

I'm afraid we'll only get "Walmart Contractors"!

Laugh [(-D] yeah... I hope not though. Maybe if the VIP figure is decent the other figures can be salvaged- the VIP concept is very cool diorama-wise. Glad you liked the comparison! Big Smile [:D]

Sign - Ditto [#ditto] on posting pictures/reviews of the kits as those begin to appear.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • From: University of Dayton
Posted by arkhunter2002 on Monday, August 10, 2009 2:12 PM

Not sure if it is right to post it here or not, but this is another Trumpeter release (or atleast a link of hope...)

Someone posted Trumpeter's October update on the ARC, and this was amongst them.  It is serial number 00502 and named "AR-15/M-16/M-4 Family M-16A2".  The 00501 is the M-16A1.  Maybe they will release their M-4's that everyone seems to like as a seperate set...

http://www.trumpeter-china.com/war513/products/en_message.asp?id=761

 

Thoughts?

  • Member since
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  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Monday, August 10, 2009 4:47 PM

Eh. I'm not a huuge fan of their M16 set that came with their Marines. They have a decent ACOG but the forgrip and the laser mount are totally a waste. Just plastic nubs. If they redo a brand new one and fix that, that'd be great, but the solid stock M16 with the carry handle is hardly "modern" IMO. Even if they try and add a forgrip and a laser mount- the M4 6 position stock would look nice, but Dragon's always been ahead of Trump in the plastic weapons department.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    March 2004
Posted by Grimmo on Monday, August 10, 2009 8:44 PM

I'll be buying these fig sets! I've always wanted to make a diorama of airsoft players!

 

  • Member since
    March 2008
  • From: East TX
Posted by modelchasm on Monday, August 10, 2009 9:00 PM
 arkhunter2002 wrote:

Not sure if it is right to post it here or not, but this is another Trumpeter release (or atleast a link of hope...)

Someone posted Trumpeter's October update on the ARC, and this was amongst them.  It is serial number 00502 and named "AR-15/M-16/M-4 Family M-16A2".  The 00501 is the M-16A1.  Maybe they will release their M-4's that everyone seems to like as a seperate set...

http://www.trumpeter-china.com/war513/products/en_message.asp?id=761

 

Thoughts?

.... for the dear love!?! .... See!, This is what I was talking about ... This "new" M-16 family kit that Trump seems to be coming out w/ is about as '80s as Cindy Lauper!

 

"If you're not scratching, you're not trying!"  -Scott

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: clinton twp, michigan
Posted by camo junkie on Monday, August 10, 2009 9:17 PM
 modelchasm wrote:
 arkhunter2002 wrote:

Not sure if it is right to post it here or not, but this is another Trumpeter release (or atleast a link of hope...)

Someone posted Trumpeter's October update on the ARC, and this was amongst them.  It is serial number 00502 and named "AR-15/M-16/M-4 Family M-16A2".  The 00501 is the M-16A1.  Maybe they will release their M-4's that everyone seems to like as a seperate set...

http://www.trumpeter-china.com/war513/products/en_message.asp?id=761

 

 

 

Thoughts?

.... for the dear love!?! .... See!, This is what I was talking about ... This "new" M-16 family kit that Trump seems to be coming out w/ is about as '80s as Cindy Lauper!

 

Laugh [(-D] now that's 80's!!!! and yeah grimmo, i know what your saying as i always wanted to make a paintball diorama!!! that's still on my to-do list of one day it'll happen!

"An idea is only as good as the person who thought of it...and only as brilliant as the person who makes it!!"
  • Member since
    October 2008
Posted by calvin_ng on Tuesday, August 11, 2009 2:46 PM

we really need more modern figs of any country,i personally would love to see someone do a modern m4 carbine set for OIF and OEF time frames, but hopefully i would love to sse a m416 AR relased sooner or later.

LOL at the walmart contractors

  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Tuesday, August 11, 2009 3:36 PM

Is that the H&K 416 you're talking about? That sounded like a nice replacement for the aging M16/M4 family; does anyone know how it's actually working out in the field or how many units/individuals got a hold of one?

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    October 2008
Posted by calvin_ng on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 6:31 AM
 psstoff995 wrote:

Is that the H&K 416 you're talking about? That sounded like a nice replacement for the aging M16/M4 family; does anyone know how it's actually working out in the field or how many units/individuals got a hold of one?

hey psstoff i heard some kind of U.S SF units or seals got em, check on wikipedia they got all the users. ive seen the 416 in norway as well as other NATO countries.

its a good replacement for the m16, but i personally think the m4 can still be used. except for the stoppages it has

  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 2:11 PM

Thanks for the info- yeah when the M4 works, it's a great carbine, the problem is the failure to fire that they experience, probably because they're contracted out to Colt instead of a more expensive/precision armory like a Rock River... the HK apparently has a much better gas system that could better handle the harsh environment of the desert- the M4 system's been around since the 60s and wasn't even great in Vietnam. Although on that wiki page- it looks like the XM8 is a much better system. I don't like the aesthetics of that one, but I'd trust it to feed the round properly and maintain fire better than the M4/HK416 and I guess that's what counts in the field.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 4:00 PM

Don't know where you are getting your info that the M4 is not a good weapon.  If it is properly maintained and cleaned, it will fire just fine every time.  I have not had a problem with it in combat or on the range. 

The problems with the M16/CAR15 (it was not called the M4 at that time) in Vietnam had nothing to do with the gun either.  They were mainly due to inferior powder in the rounds and lack of maintenance becuase it was billed as a self-cleaning weapon.  Once Soldiers were instructed how to properly clean them and new powder was used, there were few issues. 

It is better to get your facts straight or to actually have some experience with the weapons before you make uninformed statements on them.

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
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  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:50 PM

Ouch. I never claimed to have experience with the weapon or said anything I thought wasn't accurate. The problems that I was referring to had nothing to do with the powder issues and self cleaning label the gun was given in Vietnam- I know the DoD never even issued cleaning kits at the rifles introduction due to their perception of the aircraft grade parts, gas system, and the higher quality powders used during the testing period. I was talking more about the maintenance in itself. The M16's number one rival- the AK-47, requires little to none.

I realize that proper maintenance is essential, but that being said- if the 416 or the XM8 or whatever else can last longer without maintenance- be that during periods of little use or periods of extended fire, I feel like that's an improvement looking into. My friend shoots a Rock River Arms AR-15 and the only malfunction he's had in the years he's shot it have been due to poor homemade reloads. The RRA AR is a much tighter system from what I understand, and long periods of little to no use don't require cleaning in between. He's explained to me, his words not mine so I don't know their accuracy, that the upper and lower halves of Colt and Armalite don't have a perfect fit allowing outside debris. The difference in cost of course is absurd. A few hundred for an Armalite vs. a thousand plus for an RRA- I don't expect the US Government to contract their M16/M4s out to people who take longer to crank them out and charge twice as much. That being said, you must admit that the basic elements of the rifle are almost 50 years old.

While cleaning the firearm every chance one gets might be fine if one has the time, I feel like the need for a more modernized weapon system that can sustain fire with minimal maintenance for a long period of time is essential. Especially when our enemies don't care if they hide their AK in the dirt and mud, pull back the bolt when they need it and go to town. You're right that I've never handled the weapon, but that doesn't mean my opinion should be considered undervalued or plain wrong. I'm sure that, if at it's peak condition, the M4 is great- but I think there are better systems out there that work just as well, if not better, during imperfect conditions. Our troops on the front line don't have the pleasure of failure to fire that my friend does on the range- and if it's a pain for him, I can only imagine. I don't see anything wrong with top of the line equipment in the hands of our soldiers, cost aside. In my own inexperienced opinion, I just think the M16/M4 family has been forced to play too much catch up for too long a time period. I don't think the 416 or the XM8 is a godsend perfect fix system, but I think it's about time our military shifts gears to a more future thinking kit- I didn't mean anything more than that.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 8:14 PM

My point is that playing with a rifle on a range and depending on one in combat are two different things.  Yes, the AK can fire when dirty and not maintained.  Can it fire accurately and well, no.  The M16/M4 series is one of the best engineered in the world.   It may be almost 50 years old, but it is still effective and a good weapon.  When a vastly superior weapon comes along, I'm sure the switch to it will be made.  It doesn't take much maintenance to keep it going either.  Any weapon that is tightly machined like the M16 series, as opposed to the cheaply stamped AK, will require cleaning and maintenance.  I'm sure the 416 and XM8 will require just as much maintenance.   

When you depend on a rifle for your survival, you take the few minutes needed to clean it and maintain it.  I guess its just the difference of perspective between civilians and military.  I have used them and know they are reliable. 

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
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  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 9:27 PM
 I understand that playing with a rifle and depending on one in combat are two different things. That was my point when I stated that for a misfire on the range to be frustrating, a misfire in combat could be devastating. I know maintenance is important, and I never meant to bash the M4, it's had a great service life and is indeed much more accurate and consistent than an AK, not that it helps when the enemy shoots from the hip or around a corner. I didn't mean to interject a civilian opinion for the sake of disagreeing with those from a military background.

Please don’t think I don’t respect you guys and I’m sorry if I’ve ever acted like I know what I’m talking about and think I’ve got it all right just because I’ve watched a TV show or read up on Wikipedia. That being said, telling me politely that I’m misinformed and explaining to me why that’s the case is a lot nicer than giving me the ultimatum of either getting my facts straight or joining up and seeing combat with one so I know what I’m talking about.

My buddy that plays on the range is going to join up with the Army and is scared to death of the rifle they’ll give him. While you say the AK is stamped out- his competition AR was built to much higher specifications than the one’s the Army gets from the lowest bidder- in his mind that makes them just as stamped out. It means something to him, and he’s been shooting more than half his life. One can depend on a gun in a competition too- a life might not be on the line, but when a round blows in half in the chamber and doesn’t damage a single part- he tends to put more faith in that kind of construction then the Armalite he ended up selling after complaining to the manufacture that even with every part upgraded to their tightest, competition part- the gun still underwent significant feed problems and stovepipe failures.

I’m not saying you’re wrong in thinking that our opinions differ- I don’t disagree with that at all, I simply didn’t feel like you respected my opinion at all simply because I was a civilian who’s never fired a rifle, and that’s what upset me a bit. Show me why I’m wrong as opposed to just telling me off- that’s all.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Thursday, August 13, 2009 6:02 AM

I got it.  I also thought I gave a pretty good explanation as to why you were incorrect.  Again though, the experience of your buddy on the range has no real credence to the actual use of a rifle in combat.  If you can show me facts from theatre or from actual Army documents that there are so many problems with the weapon then you will change my mind. 

No one told you to go join up (not a bad idea though).  It just pisses me off when people who are basing their knowledge on TV, the internet, and what their equally uniformed buddies tell them come across as if they are the experts on military affairs. 

Tell your buddy to rest assured, the Army will give him a good M4 and good amunition for it, along with the proper training on it and he will be fine.  Also let him know not to worry about the enemy spraying their inaccurate AKs from the hip.  If you look at the facts, most casualties are not caused by gunshot wounds anyways.  They usually miss when they spray or fire "aimed" shots.  He'll be just fine.

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

  • Member since
    March 2008
  • From: East TX
Posted by modelchasm on Thursday, August 13, 2009 7:48 AM

No matter what weapon system they come out w/ that claims that it can fire through mud and grit and doesn't need to be cleaned is a waste of time.

A clean weapon will fire every time. During my last OIF vacation, our tempo became so busy that I ended up cleaning (breaking down, chipping carbon, lubing, etc) about once a week. However, I did use a dust brush everyday.

All weapons companies are trying to do the same thing .... they're trying to compensate for Soldiers who don't clean their weapons .... however, they will NEVER be able to compete with a disciplined Joe w/ a cleaning brush.

Lastly ... a collection of thoughts and opinions from people all over the world!?! HOW can wikipedia be wrong????

"If you're not scratching, you're not trying!"  -Scott

  • Member since
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  • From: Colorado
Posted by psstoff995 on Thursday, August 13, 2009 10:08 AM
Haha again, I never climbed to be an expert at military affairs, I was just speaking very broadly about the weapons service history and why my friend will only fire one if it's a very expensive, well tuned version. I'm sorry that your pre-conceived views of civilians as uninformed tv/internet/military wanna-bes allowed you to reread too much into it. I never stated the M4 wasn’t a good gun. But every gun has problems and shortcomings. That’s all I brought up. As much as I love ya HeavyArty, this isn’t the first time this has happened though which is probably why I’ve made such a big deal out of it. Plain and simple, you’ve said so yourself in as many words- if your not in the military, you don’t care to hear it. I don’t particularly care for that attitude, and while I’m not in the military, I am in the Emergency Services business, and their people within agencies, some I know personally, who treat civilians the same way. If they don’t know what a combi-tube is, their stupid. I’m starting to think that personality type can be found in any line of work. There’s just different ways to approach things. That’s all.

No please don’t get me wrong. When I joined this forum back in 03, you were one of the first people to come to my aid and I appreciated it then and I still appreciate it now, I’ve come to your defense a few times on what many modelers would call a clean, factory fresh build, as I know you’ve been there and you’ve seen them every day and if you tell us- listen, this is what it looks like. I believe that and I respect that. I think you’re an amazing modeler, and I just wish you’d be more open about military/civilian communication instead of lumping us all into one ignorant group.

-Chris

US Army Infantryman

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: clinton twp, michigan
Posted by camo junkie on Thursday, August 13, 2009 10:19 AM
chris....lol...u and your spelling. Wink [;)] it's you never "claimed" not "climbed"....2 totally different things!! ya need to get out of northern virginia buddy! Big Smile [:D]
"An idea is only as good as the person who thought of it...and only as brilliant as the person who makes it!!"
  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Valrico, FL
Posted by HeavyArty on Thursday, August 13, 2009 10:21 AM
You can feel how you like, but it is true,  if you haven't been there, you don't know.  Sorry, thats just the way it is.

Gino P. Quintiliani - Field Artillery - The KING of BATTLE!!!

Check out my Gallery: https://app.photobucket.com/u/HeavyArty

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell

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