What I'd Like To See When I Open A Box

DC, this happens to me a lot, and no one is able to stop it,,,,,,so, it must be okay for me to do to you. After every post you make where you claim not to understand that different levels of product have different prices, I am going to be right there to "attempt to explain" to you, that things are that way because of a basic economic principle. It is not "snooty college stuff" as some people like to use to try and drag down the poster, but, is basic high school knowledge.

If you buy a product for a low retail price, you do NOT have the "right" to get a product equal to the higher priced, higher quality product that you CHOSE to walk right buy when you bought the cheap thing.

And your constant posts claiming the opposite make people wonder if you one of those insults thrown at people that think like that back during the Cold War against a whole nation of people that think like that.

You want it, you pay for it,,,,,,you don't pay for it, you don't get it.

This is so funny,,,,I know you think I am some "random hard-___",,,,,but, the truth is that if you wanted some kits and can't get them, I am one of the guys that would have just sent you a couple to help out. But, I of course, don't do that for people that enjoy butting heads over fake made up "principles" that really don't apply to "optional items" such as hobby kits.

Rex

Easy Marine, let not DC ruffle your fearthers, this is A HOBBY! I understand both points of view and my only comment to the subject is IT AIN'T A PERFECT WORLD! Get over it, 3 pages of dribble from one person who appears to not change thier stance is not woth the trouble NUTS now i'm involved, what say DC you save up your money, find a company that produces the kits you want, packaged the way you want and let the rest of us do our thing.

Fair enough, Mr Nut. I can tell from your post and the PM's that I probably should have just shut up about 2 pages ago. Anne mentioned it to me too. "What are you typing now, with your fingers banging at your keyboard?"

To answer them all in one place,,,,,no,,,,,I am not in danger of a heart attack or stroke. But, thanks for asking, guys.

Armornut, your Avatar looks just like the cat that walks across this keyboard now and then,,,,,,Anne got her for me, named the beast Fluffy, and her purring is supposed to be "good for the old Marine's heart". She doesn't play as much as Spectre did, but, she seems to look right at me a lot.

Rex, the Accidental CAG

('cause, you know, all Marines dream of having their very own cat named Fluffy,,,,,sheeesh)

Aren't you supposed to own a bulldog?

In a perfect world, I would have either a Bulldog or a Malamute.

I have Fluffy.

Haha, a Malamute named Fluffy would sure surprise the neighbors, though, eh?

Yeah it just might do that...

... And you could get him purebred for a dog pound mutt price....

;)

Running for the LZ and emergency extraction now!

What was that dog Patton had?

A bull terrier... Like Spuds McKenzie

Stik, you is worse than I is, you know that, right?

Wasn't Patton's dog and that dog of "Boyington's" in Baa Baa Black Sheep the same thing?

edit: Ack, I always promise myself not to mention that show, but, then I do,,,,,,,and it triggers that danged song in my head again. I wish the Knights or Aces would have had something catchy like da Sheep did.

"..........ohhh lordddddddd have mercyyyyyyyy on such as weeeeeeeeeeeeee, baaaaaaa, baaaaaaa, baaaaaaaaaaa.........." (thump, 18 Jarheads melons fall off)

Well, I have hit my head a little hard on landing a few times... ;)

Yes, the Baa Baa Blacksheep dog and Patton's dog Willy were both the same breed, bull terriers. I'm sure you can find more out there in the movies or on TV.

I was just thinking that they both had "short shot" noses. Poor QC, I guess.

I once had a dog that was a cross between a Basset and a Golden Retriever,,,,,,,he looked like a mini Golden, except for real short front legs.

Someone said that Teddy's legs were too short, and my Uncle was standing next to me. "Too short?, they all reach the ground don't they?" That was the first time I heard that line, I laughed so hard the dog barked at me. (I forget who Gunny Bob stole that joke from, now)

Rex,

    To set the record stright Harbor Frieght is NOT somewhere that I normaly shop.  I was there with a friend and they had the third hand tool on sale for $3.99.  I figured at that price I'd give it a try.  As I am well aware of the problems that you have listed with the tools that they have for sale.  The same applies to the other items that I had picked up there that day.

    And yes, I am more than willing to save up and purchase quality tools and kits.  It's just that sadly as we've all have noted, the number of LHS' has dropped over the years.  And because of bad personal expereinces with making purchases online (yes, I know that thousands of people make purchases online every year) I do not like to make purchases online.  I prefer to make my purchases at "brick and mortar" stores.  And if I do have to make a purchase online I prefer to deal with the manufacturer if at all possible.  Or the online version of a "brick and mortar" store.

    Again, I feel the "you get what you paid for" is a cop out that relieves the manufacturer of making a quality product.

    And at the risk of further ruffeling feathers, I am sorry but I do not actually find "Fine Scale Modeler" magazine to be very useful.  I do however find it's sister publication "Scale Auto" to be more useful, and I would spend more time at it's site if it was as active as this one.  But sadly, it doesn't seem to attract the traffic that this "side of the house" does.

    Oh, and thank you VERY much for keeping the stereotype of Marines being the low brow relations in the military alive and well.  As I know plenty of Marines, Sailors, Airmen, and Soldiers who would more than cringe at your at your statements.  And yes it is copping out to say that you "get what you pay for."

    And as I have said repeatedly, no matter how much or how little money one has to spend anyone who is willing to plunk down their hard earned money has the right to expect a quality product for their money.  And yes, I fully understand that not everything is going to be of equal value, but that doesn't mean a person who only has X amount of dollars to spend vs Y amount of dollars isn't right to expect a quality product.

    Also while I may not have been activly building plastic, I have been keeping abreast of the hobby, and acquiring kits for when I had the time to do some building.  And not that it is really any of your business but a big part of the reason that I haven't been around until recently is that I haven't been able to afford Internet access at home.  And if I wasn't using my cell phone as a mobile WiFi hotspot, I wouldn't be able to get online now.  And also that I have been volunteering at the local VA in the craft center helping Vet's learn how to do ceramics.

You are very welcome for "me keeping the stereotype of Marines alive and well"

Just go back and count how many times you had to make stupid posts before I "blew my stack at you" for not understanding a very basic fact of life. And guess what? Your holding that stereotype in your mind is just a bit worse than what that stereotype actually entails. (and silly you, for skipping your research before spouting off,,,,what do you think that State Policeman that agrees with me used to do before becoming an officer?,,,,,,,go look at his avatar pic, and no, he wasn't a Marine)

I will try it your way though,,,,,and not expect to "get what I pay for",,,,Anne and I are going to Wendy's tonight,,,,,,I will pay for a Baconator and insist that I have the right to get Filet Mignon served by a waitress to my table. I'll just tell them that I have been extremely well educated in the principle by a guy on the internet,,,,,,,,that should make it okay.

and for just one more time,,,,,,,the difference in price is what separates the products, their quality, their packaging, heck, it even can affect where that product is sold

Since you are incapable of having it explained to you,,,,,,,,by multiple people,,,,,,might I politely suggest that it is a problem of your's alone, and not anyone else's?

The rest of us know that we either have to save up to buy the good stuff, or buy something not as good at a lower price. There is also the third choice,,,,,scrimping on some other leisure activity to pay for things in the one we want to get better products in. You could afford better models by not paying an internet bill, just sayin'.

Ok I will attempt to bring this thread back on track , ready .  When I open up a 1/72 armor kit I look for separately molded tools ,accessories and good quality treads, link and length preferably.  Everything else for the most part I can deal with. 

Rex,

    The thing that I really find "funny" in all of this is that I simply stated my PERSONAL OPINION.  And you for whatever bloody reason felt that I needed a lesson in economics.  And PLEASE go back and re-read what I have posted.  I have NEVER not ONCE said a damned thing about receiving a "higher" quality item.  What I have said is that anyone regardless of how much or how little they have to spend has the right to receive a QUALITY product for their money.

    Again, I said a QUALITY product, NOT a higher quality product.

    No, the "funny thing" is that you read a post by a person expresiong their PERSONAL OPINION, and deciding that that person for whatever reason "needed" a lesson in economics.  And again, PLEASE show me where I ever said that a person spending X was entitled to a "higher quality" product.  I NEVER ever said that, what I have said is that a person regardless of how much or how little they had to spend had the right to receive a QUALITY product for their money.

    YOU choose to read more into it, and for whatever reason have also apparently taken it as your "personal mission" to give me some sort of economic lesson.  A lesson that I did NOT want nor need.  As yes, I fully understand that a person only being able to spend X amount of money isn't going to get the same quality item as a person who is able to spend Y amount of money.

    I never said that the two people should get the same quality item.  What I have said time-and-time again is that regardless of how much or how little a person has to spend that they ALL have the right to expect to recieve a QUALITY item for their money.  That is VERY different from saying that they both have the right to receive the same quality item.

    So please go back and re-read what I said, and you will NOT find that I ever said anything about a person getting a "higher quality" item.  I just said that they had the right to receive a QUALITY item for their money.

    WHY is that so bloody hard for you to understand?

    Once again, I NEVER said that they should get a "higher quality" item, I just said that they had the right to receive a quality item for their money.

WOW!! Is it getting hot in here, or is it just me?

Rex,

    Please go back and see where I was just stating my personal opinion BEFORE you choose to decide to give me a lesson in economics.  And again, being as you have obviously have missed it.  I have NEVER EVER said that a person who only has X amount of dollars to spend should expect to get the same quality as someone who has Y amount of dollars.

    What I HAVE said time-and-time again is that regardless of how much money a person has to spend that they have the right to expect to get a QUALITY product for their money.  WHY is that so hard for you to get?

    Once again, I NEVER EVER said anything about a person getting a quality product that was higher quality then they could afford, what I have said and why I haven't changed my opinion is that they have the right to excpet to get a QUALITY product.  NOT a "higher" quality product.  Just simply a QUALITY product for their money.

    So please why is that so hard for you to understand?

    I stated my personal opinion and YOU choose to give me a lesson in economics.  Once again, a lesson I never asked for nor needed.

    As I have NEVER said what you are now accusing me of having said.  So please go back and tell me where I have EVER said what you are claiming that I have said.

Gotta get over there and open the window to let some of this here snow in.............. Seems the heater is on full blast in here......

Devil Dawg

Gotta get over there and open the window to let some of this here snow in.............. Seems the heater is on full blast in here......

Yeah, kinda warm...  and stormy too.

229 degrees perhaps?

DD,

    Is it?  I just find it interesting that Rex is accusing me of having said things that I have never said.  And I challenge him to prove that I have said what he is claiming that I said.

    All I have done is to state my personal opinion, and he for whatever reason saw that as my needing some sort of economics lesson.

Digital Cowboy wrote:

"I prefer to make my purchases at "brick and mortar" stores.  And if I do have to make a purchase online I prefer to deal with the manufacturer if at all possible.  Or the online version of a "brick and mortar" store."

What difference does it make where you buy the kit be it a "brick and mortar" store, online version of "brick and mortar" store or directly through the manufacturer? Or even through an online store like Squadron or Sprue Brothers. It's still the same kit ain't it?

Okay, then.

How about a basic ENGLISH lesson? When you say over and over again, that you expect a person to get a "QUALITY" product in such and such a "QUALITY" packaging,,,,aren't you saying that you paid your money and didn't get that "QUALITY"?

Then right after your first post, I laid out what you get in a "QUALITY" kit, that you have to pay a higher price for. Surprise, that kit had all of the items you insist you should have got when you bought a lower priced model.

Now, here is the hard part, so read slowly before you jump on MY lack of ability to "have it 'splained to me"

When a company advertises their product with the line " a quality product at a quality price",,,,,they mean that they think their product is a "higher QUALITY" than the lower priced competition. Plain and simple, and in plain English.

And now YOU go back and look at the flow of events here,,,,,,,,,I didn't say a single angry word until you got off on that tangent of attacking my use of the expression "you get what you pay for",,,,,,and in at least two instances that you have posted on this very site, you have gotten exactly that.

I am only going to post this once, because I don't feel the need to upload it twice, as you do.

And as long as you keep throwing your empty posts up here, I can respond to them,,,,,,,and if you NEVER understand them,,,,that is on your teachers, not mine.

Yes, I know, I used "that thar fancy word" when I said Economics,,,,,but, you are so behind on understanding that word that you really don't know what happens when you add a dollar in the "labor and materials" phase of manufacturing. Once you add that dollar, it gets increased by everyone that touches the product until the end consumer pays for it, because each step adds their own markup as a percentage. To prove your point and "win" this stupid argument would cost every person that buys lower priced model kits $4-5 right out of their pocket for each kit they buy happily now, and I am sure they will be quick to thank you for that manufacturing change, right? (you would pay $15 for what you get for $10 now, but, you would be a winner)

Actually, I typed something that isn't true,,,,,,I am not going to waste any more of my time on this drivel, caused by someone that doesn't understand why things have different prices. I have to set up the stops on a trip to meet even more modelers that I only know online as of now, and maybe hook up with a couple of the guys that I already did meet from online.

Rex

BlackSheep TwoOneFour,

    It's not WHAT I am buying online, it is making online purchases in GENERAL.  Or did you not read where I had said that because of personal experiences that I do NOT make online purchases.

    Several years ago, despite doing business with a "well known, and reputable" online business.  My banking information had gotten ripped off, and I was charged for all sorts of items that I had never purchased.  Therefore I prefer to go INTO a "brick and mortar" store and make my purchases.  Or IF I have to buy online I prefer to deal with the manufacturer, or the online version of a business that I've already done business with in the "real world."

Rex,

    For whatever reason, you are apparently STILL assuming that when I say a "quality product" that I am somehow meaning/saying a "higher qaulity product."  I have not EVER said that.  So maybe YOU are the one who needs to brush up on their basic English skills.

     I've talked with non-modelers offline, and they've all agreed with me that when a person plunks down their hard earned cash that they have the right to expect a quality product for their money.  NOTHING said about getting a higher quality product, JUST a QUALITY product.

    WHY is that so bloody hard for you to undertand?

    Or, given that you like to harp on economics.  Let's look at this way:  "Acme Model Company" produces a good quality kit, but they skimp on the packaging.  Resulting in over HALF of their products being returned because of damaged and/or missing parts.  It is NOT going to take long before word gets around that kits from "Acme Model Company" are not worth the aggravation of having to request replacement parts.  So that in the long run from an economical standpoint it makes sense to invest at least as much in packaging as it does the product that is going in the packaging.

    Otherwise because of having to replace parts time-and-time again the overall cost of their doing business is probably going to go up more then IF they had packaged the product properly in the first place.

    And I have to say that at this point, "my friend" that I wish that the software that Kalmbach used had an ignore function, cause I'd use it to send you to my bit bucket.  Because it is clear to me that for whatever reason it is YOU who is not understanding what I have said.

Hey Rex, your the better man, the cat in the avitar is named Jessie, she has had a lazy fat kitty life with her sister , adopted sister, and a few different dogs her latest "dog" is a yellow lab, he definitely  OBEYS the fat one. Fluffy BAAHAAHAA HAAhee hee  your secret for what it is is safe with me TEEHEE  GIGGLEGIGGLE marine with a Fluffy kitty. I'm a former sailor (aridale no less),marines need us to keep ya'll from tearing the world apart, glad we have a paratrooper to drop in and keep us from tearing each other apart LOL. Rx7850, all due respect for your input and attempt to right this wayard thread, it is always good to try, however feeding the original post accomplishes nothing at this point,perhaps letting humor and commrodary win the day is the better end. My respects to ALL now lets talk about fat itties and our latest models.

I give up...

Mods, please lock the thread.

Proverbs 23:9.

Nope. This ends now. Your points have been made. Let it rest. If I see this crop up in another thread, the primary offenders will be moderated indefinitely.

I apologize to the rest of the FSM Forum for letting this get as far as it has. I've been busy with another project for KPC and haven't been spending as much time on the Forum as I had prior to October. However, that tour has ended.