Dragon 1:35 UH-1H Huey WIP

Gene- Thanks!  I think my friend will be one happy man next month.  It is great that you flew Cobra too.  I always thought those was real cool looking helicopter when I was young.  

I agree with you... I am not fan of clean builds.  I love them dirty or weatherized.  Here's my last two builds in case you haven't seen my work before.  I am into armors so this is my first serious helicopter WIP.  Really appreciate help from you guys!

M24 Chafee

Panzer IV Ausf H

I will just weatherize the Huey a bit... 

Gino- Thanks man!  Glad you like my process so far... still long way to go.   Yes very nice resin set from Cobra company... no question about that.  I hope I will not screw up... so many parts each sides.  I didn't realize how tiny M60 gun was... at first I thought 'oh no they sent me the wrong scale but it was in 1:35.'

Mel- Thanks for the great drawing of the rotor.  My kit part is all blank on both sides so it looks like I need to add some details using leftover brass PE if possible.  Congrats about your first grandchild!!!

Attached a drawing of the UH-1B main rotor head and pylon assy.  Only difference is the counter weights on grips. 

This is a shot pf a UH-1C rotor head but the only difference besides the hub and blades is the damper arms attach on the opposite side of the stab bar on the UH-1H.

I planned on robbing the pylon assy and stab bar from the MRC UH-1C kit and using the M/R hub from Cobra Co. backdate to a B set. when I build my "H" model.

Sorry this info is late, I haven't been on FSM as much as I used to.   First grand child arrived last month! 

Looking good so far.  The Cobra Company sets are pretty nice, aren't they.  Keep up the good work. 

Andy;

Your right that it won't need any real "weathering", but it also shouldn't be "gloss" either. If you look closely at the pictures of my Cobra that Joe built, you will notice that the front edge of the rotor blades and tail rotor show "wear" where the paint is missing. This was the case on all Hueys I flew unless the blades were brand new. I don't know if you want to try to do that on yours, but it does make it look much more real. I'll post pictures if you need them.
  The M-60 is mounted on a standard weapons mount that attaches to the aircraft below the track forthe door. That way you can still close the door even with the gun mounted, but it leaves the gun outside so that was rarely ever done!
  The rotor looks great! the inside of the stabilizer bar included the attachments for the control rods and then the attachments to the rotors. It was somewhat complex and at this scale the models just don't show all the parts that well. In case your interested, the stabilizer bar actually controlled the the movement of the rotorhead. The inputs from the controls were applied 90 degrees before . That is to tilt it forward, it applied the force on the right side. gyroscopic precession then took over and the movements actually took place in the correct direction. I know it sounds crazy, but try it with a gyroscope, that's how it works!
  Yes I also flew Cobras. The model is of my favorite aircraft, and it actually is the same aircraft that appears on the back cover of Squadron's "Gunslingers In Action" book, but the date on that book is wrong. It got teh name "Pandora's Box" in 1970, not 72. I flew that one on "special OTB missons" in 71.
  Keep up the good work, your friend is going to be really happy with the finished model!

Gene

Guys- Update on my Huey... doing the masks on windows make me grateful that armors don't have many windows!!!    I had the interior primed... used rattle can this time.  Normally I use airbrush but just for a small part it would be pain in butt to clean up the AB afterward.  I will use Mr Surfacer as primer on the exterior when it is ready.  

Better picture of the rotor... hope it looks OK.  Hope I am not missing something especially on the stabilizer part.

Guess what has arrived yesterday... the package from Cobra Company.  M60 gun sets...

Looking at it made me realize the rod holding the gun isn't inside but attached to the exterior part of the helicopter!  Always learning something... 

Carl- Dig your expanded banner at the bottom of your signature!  

Gene- Joe did nice jobs on the helicopters.  You flew Cobra too?  I am like you... I like to weatherize my builds and I don't think I will do much for this build because helicopters were usually kept in clean good condition especially in West German where he was based.  Hope I am correct?   

Ace-  Thanks!  Happy to have you tagging along.  You didn't miss much my actual WIP started a week ago or two.  Before that I was just gathering information to buy and build a right kit... those guys have been so helpful.  

Nice work going on there Andy   !  Not sure how I missed you starting this thread but I'll be watching it closely.  My first helo ride was in one of these and I've been hooked ever since.  Just remember panzer grey or dark yellow isn't the appropriate paint scheme for one of these "winged" creatures!

deafpanzer

Gene- That's nice looking Huey!!!   Where can I find your thread if you have posted a WIP here?  If not, maybe photo bucket website?  According to the instructions it showed more details on the stabilizer but on the actual styrene part it was just all plain.  I know how bad Dragon is with its instruction so I thought I'd check with you guys.  I can take a better picture of the stabilizer when I have the chance... 

 

 That ones not something I did. It's another one done by Joe Kline, the aviation artist. I'm just trying to get back to building a little now after a very long break. I've got severe COPD and most of the fumes really get to me. I'm trying to do only acrylics, extra ventilation, etc to work on a Liberty ship model right now, but it's going slow. Anyway, the model Joe built for me several years ago is one of the UH-1Cs I flew in Nam. Here's a link to some pictures:

http://238awc.org/joe2/joe3.html

 Only thing Joe is a little slack on is weathering, it looks a bit too clean! He also did my Cobra:
http://238awc.org/joe2/joe1.html

 He did them for me back before I retired and got the idea to try to start building some myself again.

Gene

Naw , i wouldnt give you a complement just to get you to take a beer  off of the IOU list Andy ......................why , would that work ?

Carl- Thanks man!  Oh wait a minute, you are trying to milk from me.  I am not falling for that... LOL Nah, only kidding... trust me I am happy you are tagging along.  

Gene- That's nice looking Huey!!!   Where can I find your thread if you have posted a WIP here?  If not, maybe photo bucket website?  According to the instructions it showed more details on the stabilizer but on the actual styrene part it was just all plain.  I know how bad Dragon is with its instruction so I thought I'd check with you guys.  I can take a better picture of the stabilizer when I have the chance... 

Andy;  I'm not sure what you mean by the center part missing. The stabilizer bar had the bars on each side with weights on the ends, but the center section was frames on each side but the middle was open. Here's a photo of a model I have:

Does that answer your question?

Gene

Note: this is a UH-1C so there are slight differences in the rotor. Also these kits may not have all the detail that was actually there. 

Nice details Andy .

Gene- THANKS!  Believe it or not the kit part wasn't even molded with details... so I used the PE.  I think it is missing details in the center.  

Guys- Update on my Huey... safe to say most of assemble part is over.  I will add exterior details once the main body is glued together.  I plan to prime the interior tonight so I can start painting the interior.  

Have to say this part nearly drove me nuts.  I cut and sanded a piece to fit inside and hold the circle part and it helped!  

Take a good look at the top part of rotor (right now it is at the bottom in the picture below)... I think the center part is missing details.  I will look at PE sheets to see if Dragon forgot to include something in the instructions.  It happened before...

That was probably the easiest part...

It is how my Huey look right now... 

Again, thanks for looking and your support.  It has been fun so far! 

  The "C30" part is the "stabilizer bar" that goes on top of the rotor system. It's on all Hueys except the Cobra which had electronic stabilizer system. The parts shown are cover plates over the attachment points for the actual bars. Don't worry about the picture, it isn't a complete picture of the bar, but that's what it is anyway. It looks like you could just leave the molded detail if you want and not use the PE part, up to you.

Gene

Carl- Thanks buddy! Happy to have you tagging along...

Gino- Really appreciate your feedback.  I can always build another helicopter if Bob (the guy who flew) wants another one and is willing to pay more than his wife has paid so far.    Thanks for the tip about using CA... I will do just to the wipers only.  Planning to glue the wipers before I have the windshield attached to the helicopter body so it will not affect others... 

Now I REALLY NEED your help!  I am pretty familiar dealing with Dragon instructions... I believe it is my fourth Dragon kit.  BUT this time I am really at loss... I have no idea what those are for. 

I think they are for the center top part of the rotor? 'C30' in the diagram doesn't even look like the actual part itself... 

Andy ...................

But wasn't the "tolet bowl" replaced by the IR strobe device by the 80s?

No, they were used together to defeat heat seaking/IR missiles.  The ALQ-144 "Disco Ball" protects against infrared homing missiles by creating multiple apparent sources of heat radiation.  The toilet bowl dissipates the hot exhaust by blowing it up into the rotor wash.

The toilet bowl is coming back into vogue on Blackhawks and Apaches, now called the more politically correct "sugar scoop" exhaust.

UH-60M

AH-64D

The reason you didn't see the scoop much in the late '80s and '90s is because we weren't in any shooting wars and hi-tech was being used over the good old tried and true low tech scoops.  We get into a shooting war in Iraq and A'stan and the low tech scoops are coming back.  Go figure.

Will it be very obvious that the helicopter isn't 'H' if I don't get that upgrade set? 

None of the ASE are specifically H features.  They are just later, '80s features used on H models to make them more survivable and were lessons learned from late in Vietnam and the Russian experience in A'stan in the '80s where their helos were brought down easily by US Stinger IR missiles.

The wire strike kits pieces are in the kit as both plastic and PE part.  The other parts in the ASE set look good, but are not necessarily "must haves" for an '80s UH-1H.  Its up to you. 

 For gluing the clear parts, I do use superglue.  Just use it very sparingly and go easy with it and yo should be good.

Gene- I think my kit comes with PE wire cutter. I will take a picture and post it here so you can verify if it is the correct one. 

Gino- I almost ordered that upgrade set when I ordered the M60 set but it was asking for $26.  I'd hate to ask the wife to cough up more money but I will see what I can do.  Will it be very obvious that the helicopter isn't 'H' if I don't get that upgrade set? 

Now I am leaning toward to dark green.  I almost bought that bottle of MM Helo drab when I was at the shop today... it looked very dark.  I am sure that he flew those dark green too.  Sorry my mistake... it was Interior not International.  Good catch there! 

I have been working on the Huey today... I haven't dealt with clear plastic that much because I have been building armors since my return.  There are brass wipers to be attached to the windsheild.  I am aware you can not use CA glue or it will fog it up.  What do you use? 

Here's my set of glues... best shot would be Testor Clear Cement I used for the windows on the Huey.  But is it strong enough to hold the wipers too?

 Again thank you for your help.  I lost count how many beer I owe you guys...

HeavyArty

For a '80s-'90s bird as your friend flew, I would go with the helo drab green with black cockpit and wire cutters, toilet bowl exhaust, heat shields, etc., as shown above.  You can get the Fireball Modelworks ASE (Aircraft Survivability Equipment) set that includes all the extra parts an '80s - '90s bird most likely had on it.  The 1/32 set fits on the Dragon 1/35 kit just fine.  I used it on my WSMR SAR bird. 

I brought this paint... Model Master Aircraft International Black. 

As to the paint you bought, are you sure it isn't Aircraft Interior Black?  It is used on cockpit interiors in concert with flat black and saitn black to give some definition between flat panels and black plastic gauges and such.  It is less black than flat black and slightly more satin than flat.

 As usual, great info there Gino! But wasn't the "tolet bowl" replaced by the IR strobe device by the 80s? Since I was long gone by that time, I can't remember. Your probably right about the friends aircraft in Germany being the dark OD and not really black. The one actual black one I knew of was in S.E. Asia over 40 years ago, but that's another story.

Gene

Oh, well I wasnt surprised I was wrong. I don't know much about heli 's

the real red baron

Is this a Huey or a blackhawk? 

 

getasset.aspx?ItemID=26217

Your picture link is a of a UH-60A Blackhawk.

Only one question I need to ask this time... I am learning so much about this Huey I swear.  By any chance you have good pictures of Huey in 'BLACK'?  I googled and looked everywhere... no luck! 

I have never seen a black Huey.  There were dark gloss green Hueys from the early '60s with yellow/white full color stencils.  But they were not black.  That is really just conspiracy theory B.S.

For the later Hueys from the mid-late '60s through the late '70s to early '80s the Huey's were in a light OD Green color.  Testors Model Master OD Green is a good match for it.  The interiors were all medium gray at this time too.  Markings were mostly black.

In the late '70s to early '80s, as helos went through rebuild, they were repainted Helo Drab Green (also from Testors Model Master), which is a dark green that is still on current US Army helos.  Also, at the same time, the cockpit was painted flat black for NVG compatability.  The markings are still mostly in black.

For a '80s-'90s bird as your friend flew, I would go with the helo drab green with black cockpit and wire cutters, toilet bowl exhaust, heat shields, etc., as shown above.  You can get the Fireball Modelworks ASE (Aircraft Survivability Equipment) set that includes all the extra parts an '80s - '90s bird most likely had on it.  The 1/32 set fits on the Dragon 1/35 kit just fine.  I used it on my WSMR SAR bird. 

I brought this paint... Model Master Aircraft International Black. 

As to the paint you bought, are you sure it isn't Aircraft Interior Black?  It is used on cockpit interiors in concert with flat black and saitn black to give some definition between flat panels and black plastic gauges and such.  It is less black than flat black and slightly more satin than flat.

  Sorry, no pictures of the "black" hueys. Black helicopters have become almost legend with conspiracy theorists, but his wasn't what they talk about. All I can really say is that from what I once saw, they were flat black overall with, maybe, U.S. ARMY no the tail boom also in black (simi gloss), and tail numbers in either yellow or subdued white, and little or nothing else. But again, remember that my information is often well before your friend flew his. I'll also remind you that you need to scratch build the wire cutters, since those would have been on his aircraft for sure. Hope this helps.

Gene

 PS the international black may be about right for the color, it wasn't a real deep black like regular MM flat balck.

Is this a Huey or a blackhawk? 

getasset.aspx?ItemID=26217

Gino- Thank you for the info about the leather pads!   I thought they were oversized but I guess not.  I figured it is best not to attach the rotor permanently or it will increase the chance of breaking.  I looked at your earlier builds again... it really helps too.

Gene- Thanks again!  I thought about using a metal rod like I did for my earlier helicopter build for my son when I first returned to modeling after 25+ years of break.  But I am afraid I don't have much time and it will be strictly out of box build except for the M 60 upgrades and aftermarket decals.  In my future helicopter builds I will definitely do that...

Guys- Only one question I need to ask this time... I am learning so much about this Huey I swear.  By any chance you have good pictures of Huey in 'BLACK'?  I googled and looked everywhere... no luck! 

I was at hobby shop and I brought this paint... Model Master Aircraft International Black.  It seems to be less black than MM Flat Black.  I usually do pre-shading job and I doubt it will work so I will have to use the post-shading method this time. 

Again, thank you guys for your support.  I am starting to have fun with this Huey.  I hope to finish all of the build by tomorrow so I can have them primed soon.

HeavyArty

I am trying to figure what are those tan/brown planks.  Are they wood or leather?  Instructions show they will be attached under one side of the seatbelts. 

It is a leather pad that goes under the latch om the seatbelt to keep it from cutting into the wearer.

I always leave the rotors loose/removable by leaving the little cap off the bottom of the mast.  It makes transport easy as you say.

Looking good so far, keep it up.  You won't be disappointed by the decals.

 I agree totally! It's really starting to look good. The leather pads on the seat belts also helped spread the weight of the armor "chicken plate" for guys like me who wouldn't wear the hot cumbersome carrier meant to hold it.

 The only reason I see to mount the rotor permanently is if you want to mount it on a rod like my brothers is. To do that you have to mount the metal "tube" the rod goes into on the bottom of the transmission, and it has to be a very solid mount. On my brother’s model, the same tube also replaces the rotor mast as well.

 Seats are another issue. The rearward facing seats were often removed, but that was sometimes on an "as needed" basis so it's your call. The armored pilot seats are also not really correct if you want to be accurate. They probably were used in some aircraft he flew, what I mean is that the outside armor panels, nearest the door on each side, was not part of the rear panel. It was movable for easier entry/exit. Take a look at this thread for some really good pictures of the armored seats:
/forums/t/143140.aspx?PageIndex=2
They also show the colors for the seats can vary quite a bit, but still get classified as OD.

The unit he was with in Germany was one of the few that had "tactical nuclear" weapons which is most likely the reason for the black markings. They were also very high on the Soviet target list!

Gene

I am trying to figure what are those tan/brown planks.  Are they wood or leather?  Instructions show they will be attached under one side of the seatbelts. 

It is a leather pad that goes under the latch om the seatbelt to keep it from cutting into the wearer.

I always leave the rotors loose/removable by leaving the little cap off the bottom of the mast.  It makes transport easy as you say.

Looking good so far, keep it up.  You won't be disappointed by the decals.

Gene- I don't think the foot petals are visible once they are inside.  I went ahead and put them on.  Again, thanks for letting me know. 

Gino- Thanks!  OK I will go ahead and order the decals set.  Who knows I will build another helicopter?  I always wanted to build one from Vietnam War with 1st Air Cavalry decal which the set has and a figure from Apocalypse Now... one with the cowboy hat. 

Guys- Another update...

Most of the interior is complete except for the seat belts which I will add after they all are painted.  I have ordered M60 upgrade set from Cobra Company and I hope it arrives soon...

Pilot seats... sawed off the molded box and replaced with PE box.

My first error... I cut the holes before I glued the seats in.  The holes are too far inside so the seatbelts may not go thru.    Another reason why Dragon should come up with second set of seats for those who want to use PE instead.

I am trying to figure what are those tan/brown planks.  Are they wood or leather?  Instructions show they will be attached under one side of the seatbelts. 

Below- That cap is supposed to be glued at the bottom of the rod to hold the rotor.  BUT I think I will leave it off so that way the blades & rotor can be removed for travel purpose.  Is that a bad idea?  I'd rather for it to fall off than snap off breaking it... what you guys usually do?

Again, thanks for looking and helping!

It is coming along well. 

I highly recommend the Fireball Modelworks decals.  I think the $15 is very reasonable and cheaper than most decal sets.  They are really nice and look great when applied.  You won't find any better.

Gene- Thank you so much for the information about the foot pedals.  Jeez, Dragon never gets everything right.  I wonder how visible will they be?  If so, then I will try to sand down two pedals to remove 'Bell'. 

Good news, I was able to order an insignia via eBay for less than $5 including shipping.  I will post when I get it... Hobby Lobby and Michael's sell many displayment cases so maybe one fits.  I know there is a football case but it may be too small.  I have to see if the wife is willing to cough more money.  I think she will...

I have been looking for 1:35 decals... there are not many choices.  Liked a set from Fireball but they want $15!  I only need few decals not the whole set representing six different units.  Do you have a suggestion where I can find good decals at reasonable prices? 

deafpanzer

 

Gene, thanks for the link!  I overlooked last time I was here.  I loved the displayment case.  This is something I can look into and get a copy of his unit insignia too.  What a great idea!  Thanks again!

Andy;

 The display case was hand made by my brother himself after I gave him the model. He does woodworking in his garage. He made me one too  What kind of copy of the insignia do you need? There are several places that can do those, but it could get expensive. You could do a decal of it yourself if that's what you want. Anyway, let me know. Almost forgot, the foot pedals are slightly wrong. One should say BELL as they have, but the other should say HUEY. Left pedal BELL right HUEY.

Gene