Before They Were Aces-The First Aircraft of the Aces

Hans-please put me down for Don Blakeslee's Spitfire Vb that he flew when he was with 401 sq RCAF.  I will be using Tamiya's 1/48th kit.

Undecided as to my subject at this point Hans (need to check the stash), but I'm definitely in.

Question - What if the aircraft being considered happened to be that pilot's first mount and also the mount he became an ace in, but not necessarily the mount he was famous for. Would that qualify?

I know, you're talking about the "Ace in a Day"-type scenarios, like Jimmy Swett, Butch O'Hare, Bill Shomo, etc. who took off with no kills and got five-plus before they landed, or had a couple kills and scored enough on one mission to make them aces, like Cunningham & Driscoll's three-kill mission on 10 May 72 in "Showtime 100" right? 

Frankly, I'd like to avoid those scenarios...   The idea is show the Ace's aircraft as it appeared with no or few kills credited, like Yeager's first P-51 (The one he had shot out from under him), Preddy's P-40, Gabby's "Pearl Harbor" P-36, etc...  There's plenty of Aces to chose from who flew more than one aircraft-type.  If you just can't find "your" Ace, or he only flew ONE aircraft from the time he entered combat the first time until he became an Ace, then that will have to do, I guess.. I'm not gonna be anal about it, but at least try to dig up a little more background before you do...  

The Roster so far:

EDITED- Roster moved to initial post.

No sweat, Hans. I'll go grab a shovel and see who else I come up with (metaphorically speaking, of course  ).

Hans, count me in.  I'll take a stab at Don Gentile's Eagle Squadron Mount with a Tamiya Mk V Spitfire.

Ok... Here's the 'pit in progress.. I had already started this one last week for another project but have put it on hold untl the GB's Official start date...

I'm not detailing the gunbay (although I probably should, it begs for it) as the door will be on it.  I'm not sure about the rear armor glass though... The squadron was operational, but stateside and not assigned to defend US airspace... I can't find anything that says the armor (Some 230 pounds, all told) would be removed for ease of maintenance and to save fuel during training and to increase range for ferry flights, but have seen evidence of P-38s with the armor removed while stateside...

Now that it's on hold, I'm gonna dig around for some badge ideas... Anyone else with badge ideas, sound off- PLEASE!

Also, here's a couple shots of the real thing: Note the difference between what the Army Air Force allowed for "Nose Art", Stateside vs Deployed... The 363rd insignia is on the door, The "Old Crow" logo is a bit, shall we say, "subdued"...

Hans, I'm interested in this GB.  I'm looking to do a 1/48 P-51D done as Urban "Ben" Drew's bird from the 375th FS.  It's in this photograph:

It's E2*S.  I believe that after this photograph was taken, when he was an Lt, Drew would get his 6 victories.  Let me know.

Mike

Assuming we're not talking AT-6?(smartass icon)

Ooooh this is so tempting because it's such a great idea.  I've got a number of other GB's on the go at the moment but put me down as definite maybe for Capt Frances "Gabby" Gabreski's Spitfire Mk.IXc, PK-E, BS410, 315 Sqn (Polish), RAF.  Gabby scored no kills in this aircraft but it did fly 11 combat missions and a couple of SAR sweeps in this Spitfire.

The kit will be either ICM or Hasegawa 1/48 Spitfire Mk.IXc but I'll let you know for sure closer to the time.

Cheers

bondoman

Assuming we're not talking AT-6?(smartass icon)

That said, if you can find a LT-6 "Mosquito" pilot that went onto becoming an Ace in Korea after being a FAC, the Texan could work...

Mike, Darson, done deal.. Lemme know when you need the info edited..

Hans, the kit will be the 1/48 Tamiya P-51D 8th Air Force.  If you have any questions, let me know.  Thanks.

Mike

Hans Von Hammer I gotta get in on this build, what a great idea. I have a Tamiya F4U-1, Revells P-40B/C, and Revell's P-51D in the closet just have to decide which one and who was flying it. May I let you know that in a few weeks ?

Hans,

    What about an ace who didn't change planes?  How about Neel Kearby who flew a P-47D Razorback over PNG in the PTO.  A bit unusual to see a P-47 ace in the Pacific or a P-47 with Japanese kill insignias. Was thinking of doing the Tamiya 1/48 Razorback as "Fiery Ginger", the plane Kearby flew in Sept/early Oct 1943 with either 2 or 3 kills; this was only a week or two before the day in which he downed 7 Japanese planes (6 confirmed; 1 probable) to become an ace.  Too similar to the "ace in a day" scenario discussed above? 

Don

Sign me up Hans, Hasegawa 1/48 P-47D with resin conversion (Cutting Edge/Meteor) to backdate to P-47C to make Robert Johnson's "Half Pint" mount of June '43. Decals by Superscale.

Heres a link that has some artwork and reference

http://www.aviationartstore.com/robert_johnson_2.htm

pordoi

Hans,

    What about an ace who didn't change planes?  How about Neel Kearby who flew a P-47D Razorback over PNG in the PTO.  

Don

 

Colonel Kearby was shot down in "Fiery Ginger IV", so I'm inclined to think he flew at least three other "Gingers", Don... I know that he was a P-39 pilot in Panama prior to PNG and getting transistioned to Jugs, so perhaps you could look in that direction?

However, if you're dead-set on Neel Kearby's Jug, you could adjust the kills accordingly, but I think it kinda goes against the "Spirit of the Build"...  But like I said, I'm not gonna be anal about it...

stikpusher

Sign me up Hans, Hasegawa 1/48 P-47D with resin conversion (Cutting Edge/Meteor) to backdate to P-47C to make Robert Johnson's "Half Pint" mount of June '43.

Done, Stik...  That painting doesn't do the story justice...  Johnson thought that the FW pilot was about to let him go when he pulled up along side his Jug and saluted him...

But the German was just saying, "auf Wiedersehen" before shooting him down... The FW then pulled back into trail and proceeded to finish him off.  All Johnson could do was hunker down behind the armor plate and wait for the end... Luckily for Johnson, the FW ran out of ammo first...

Hans von Hammer

Done, Stik...  That painting doesn't do the story justice...  Johnson thought that the FW pilot was about to let him go when he pulled up along side his Jug and saluted him...

But the German was just saying, "auf Wiedersehen" before shooting him down... The FW then pulled back into trail and proceeded to finish him off.  All Johnson could do was hunker down behind the armor plate and wait for the end... Luckily for Johnson, the FW ran out of ammo first...

That is a heck of a story...  I was not familiar with that...

Hans, I have kind of sworn off GBs for the new year (other than dupes' Winter Warriors), but this one is pretty intriguing.  I think I'd like to tentatively jump into it.  I'd do Pappy Boyington's P-40 from his Flying Tiger days...  Let me do some research first, and get back to you before I really commit, but at this point I'd say I'm about 90%...

Hey Hans,

Did you specifically mean American or Allied aces, or can it be any nation? 

bbrowniii

Hey Hans,

Did you specifically mean American or Allied aces, or can it be any nation? 

I think it can be anyone, so long as it's verifiable.  Of course it's not my call.  P-40 goodness is definitely welcome though.

Mike

Yeah, Johnson got pretty lucky, Brownie... He'd been in trouble from leaving formation  and jumping enemy planes on his own a couple times before this mission.  This time he swore he wouldn't leave the formation.  He saw a flight of FWs closing in oon his flight, called them out to the rest of the flight ,but no one answered or reacted and then all of a sudden his Jug was getting hammered by cannon and machine gun fire... His aircraft went into a spin, out of control and fell right through the box of bombers they were escorting. On fire and partially blind from hydraulic fluid, he lost gobs of altitude before regaining control and started to limp back to England alone...  He'd actually tried to bail out before that encounter with the final FW, but as you can see from the photo, the canopy was jammed shut and, alive or dead, Johnson was gonna be in that cockpit until the end... Once on the ground, they counted 21 holes in his Thunderbolt from the 20mm cannons and quit counting machine gun holes after 200..

I first read that story in a book called "Great American Fighter Pilots of WW2".. If you ever find it, it's worth a read... I first read it back about 1969 or so... Come to think of it, Neel Kearby's in that book as well.. Also, Johnson's own book, "Thunderbolt!" is a great one too..

As for the Ace's planes, Yeah, any nation, any conflict..

Hans von Hammer

Colonel Kearby was shot down in "Fiery Ginger IV", so I'm inclined to think he flew at least three other "Gingers", Don... I know that he was a P-39 pilot in Panama prior to PNG and getting transistioned to Jugs, so perhaps you could look in that direction?

However, if you're dead-set on Neel Kearby's Jug, you could adjust the kills accordingly, but I think it kinda goes against the "Spirit of the Build"...  But like I said, I'm not gonna be anal about it...

Yes, you are correct that there were previous Fiery Gingers.  I was thinking of modeling his first, primarily because I have the Tamiya kit available and I've been wanting to build it.  But if that's not what you want for this GB, that's fine with me.  I'll do some more digging and see what else interests me that may be a better fit.

Don

I think I'm up for a Hurricane I flown by Albert Lewis coded AK A.  He scored his 3rd thru 7th victories in this airplane, so I'll have to do it at the start of the day, is that OK, Hans?  I don't know if I can find an actual photo of AK A, so I'll have to give it a May 10, 1940 scheme with 85 Squadron in France.  Still OK?

jeaton01

I think I'm up for a Hurricane I flown by Albert Lewis coded AK A.  He scored his 3rd thru 7th victories in this airplane, so I'll have to do it at the start of the day, is that OK, Hans?  I don't know if I can find an actual photo of AK A, so I'll have to give it a May 10, 1940 scheme with 85 Squadron in France.  Still OK?

What was he flying for kills 1 &  2?

I was thinking of modeling his first, primarily because I have the Tamiya kit available and I've been wanting to build it. 

Nothin' wrong with the first, Don..

Here is a nice link for Lewis:

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http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol016dt.html

VY D and VY E are documented there as airplanes flown before AK A.  So far I don't know the s/n's on any of these a/c, still looking.

More 85 Squadron s/n's:

L1604; L1632; L1634; L1637; L1639; L1644; L1648; L1651; L1653; L1656; L1765; L1773; L1775; L1778; L1779; L1833; L1834

It may be unlikely to be able to tie the s/n to the codes, since not many records came back from France.  Who knows.

bbrowniii

Hans von Hammer:

Done, Stik...  That painting doesn't do the story justice...  Johnson thought that the FW pilot was about to let him go when he pulled up along side his Jug and saluted him...

But the German was just saying, "auf Wiedersehen" before shooting him down... The FW then pulled back into trail and proceeded to finish him off.  All Johnson could do was hunker down behind the armor plate and wait for the end... Luckily for Johnson, the FW ran out of ammo first...

 

That is a heck of a story...  I was not familiar with that...

Hans, I have kind of sworn off GBs for the new year (other than dupes' Winter Warriors), but this one is pretty intriguing.  I think I'd like to tentatively jump into it.  I'd do Pappy Boyington's P-40 from his Flying Tiger days...  Let me do some research first, and get back to you before I really commit, but at this point I'd say I'm about 90%...

Here's an online version of the Johnson encounter with the FW.

http://home.att.net/~historyzone/Seversky-Republic5.html

According to this, it took three passes at Johnson's P-47 before running out of ammo.  And Johnson actually got a few rounds off himself at the FW. 

Don

Hans von Hammer

I was thinking of modeling his first, primarily because I have the Tamiya kit available and I've been wanting to build it. 

Nothin' wrong with the first, Don..

Alright then.  Sign me up for Neel Kearby's original Fiery Ginger, to be modeled after his first successful encounter with a Betty and escorting zekes, downing 2. 

Don