B-36 Peacemaker Group Build

Thanks for all the help la.

Hi Reasoned,

Doors opened or closed is your choice, However I will warn you that the stock doors are VERY difficult to build closed and leave a God Awful gap that is very hard to fill.Click2Detail does offer a closed door peice at a reasonable price.  However, if you want an empty bomb rack with the doors open... then that is your choice, but I`m sure your son will ask " Where are the bombs daddy?" lol

http://click2detail.com/products-details.php?pro_id=54

The ordinance carried in the fwd bay was the flash bombs in the kit... You`ll find painting them far easier than trying to make those doors close and look halfway respectable if you dont want to purcahase that aftermarket part.

You are building an RB-36, and it is important to know what went where:

Aluminum on the fuselage compartments that were pressurized for the crew to work in, and magnesium where it wasnt.. For the wings, follow the warbirds suggestion as well as the pictures below... Dont forget the shiney aluminun sheet on the center of the vertical stablizer as well

This is a cutaway view of an RB:

That caption talks about the ECM room being removed, If I remember right the specific RB you are building didnt undergo that conversion.... You will have to research that if you want a definative answer

Some RB pics & video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXPdpfujT2c&feature=related

Okay guys, finished up the Val for the Jap GB, ready to start the PM.

la: So I'm going to do the: RB-36H, 28th Strategic Reconnaissance Wing, Ellsworth AFB, Weaver South Dakota - The Triangle S build,

 1) I'm going to model it wheels down (for display flexibility) 2) doors open or closed? Since this is a recon bird, did it carry any ordnance?  I REALLY don't feel like messing with all those bombs, so if it's doors closed, need I do them? 3) I also see some question as to the NMF, it it polished aluminum on some panels, buffed aluminum on others and magnesium on still others?

This sheet differs (just a little) from the scheme in the kit instructions:

Hi Everyone,

I wanted to pass this info along. A seller on ebay is selling the Hobby Craft 1/144 GRB36 Ficon USAF Bomber kit combo. The listing says the seller has more than 10 kits available. Buy it now price is $44 ( which is reasonable ), but the shipping is  $26.70 ( a bit excessive ). However, it is a disconintued product and spending $12-$15 more on shipping in the grand scheme of things for a rare item isnt much to get excited about. Here it is for those that have been wanting this particular kit:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hobby-Craft-1-144-GRB36-Ficon-USAF-Bomber-New-1273-/330693176385?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cfed96c41

Andrew Magoo

Howdy,

              Question and answer number 3 is the most absurd thing I have ever heard! Whom did the USAF think was going to load a B-36 with hundreds of gallon of expensive high octane aviation fuel plus jet fuel and then what, a thermal nuclear bomb? After the fill up where would anyone go and buy a H-Bomb? If memory serves me correctly in Squadron’s B-36 book it shows a 21 ton H-Bomb that the B-36 could carry two of. But in Squadron’s B-52 book it shows some airmen getting ready to load a bomb cradle of 4 H-Bombs and the size of the bombs in a few short years had reduced significantly.

The size of the newer bombs would almost make me believe you could carry them on a B-25. Besides with today’s fighters with sophisticated avionics to lock onto a target and can be fired beyond visual range and that was possible even in 1971 seems very strange to take that position; seems like petty jealousy. The USAF did the same thing to the Northup B-35/B-49 flying wings. I think a couple of those should have gone into museums. Politics can be a viscous bed-fellow. Magoo

 

 

Hi Magoo,

The reason the AF was being thatr anal was because after WWII as you may recall B-17`s, B-25`s, etc were sold off to private individuals ( and private companies ) at bargain prices withthe understanding that all combat related componets were removed and the buyer would never "re-arm" the bomber to be used for military purposes.

Think back to your history from 1945-70 and all the small banana republic wars, revolutions, etc. In many cases the planes used by the rebellion factions/non sanctioned US allies were planes purchased from private citizens ( groups ) that were converted back into military planes. The most infamous was the Israeli Air Force using B-17`s in their 1948 war for independence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Boeing_B-17_Flying_Fortress_operators

When Israel achieved statehood in 1948, the Israeli Air Force had to be assembled quickly to defend the new nation from the war it found itself almost immediately embroiled in. Among the first aircraft acquired by the Israeli Air Force were three surplus American B-17s, smuggled via South America and Czechoslovakia to avoid an arms trading ban imposed by the United States. A fourth plane was abandoned due to malfunctions and confiscated by American officials. On their delivery flight from Europe, in retaliation for Egyptian bombing raids on Tel-Aviv, the aircraft were ordered to bomb King Farouk's Royal Palace in Cairo before continuing to Israel. They performed the mission (despite some of the crew fainting due to defective oxygen equipment), but caused little damage. The B-17s were generally unsuitable for the needs of the Israeli Air Force, and the nature of the conflict in which long-range bombing raids on large area targets were relatively unimportant—although the psychological impact of the raids was not lost on the enemy. The aircraft were mainly used in the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, flown by 69 Squadron; they were withdrawn in 1958 after seeing minor action in the 1956 Suez Crisis.^[5][6]

^{In 1971, the last B-36 ever produced was about to fall into the hands of a "private entity" whom was determined to make the ship airworthy again. Who was not to say that at some point in the future the group would go defunct or sell the plane to a foreign entity that would illegally take it out of the country and give another country an intercontinental bomber. The Air Force acting on events of 1946-70 of what DID happen to quite a few sold surplus WWII bombers was not willing to take that risk and ensured that B-36 would not fly and made sure the plane would never be controlled by a private entity. Those actions combined with the high costs of restoring and maintaining the plane for display eventually led to the National Museum to repossess the bomber from Ft Worth and move it to PIMA in 2005.}

^{A year later in 1972, when the Air Force Museum was closing down their old location and moving to their current location, it was decided that transporting the old YB-26 which had fallen into disrepair sitting outside from 1957-72 was cost ineffective to move. Thus when it was cut up for scrap, it was mandated that it be cut up in a fashion that would render any attempt of reassembly impossible.}

Bondoman and Lajntx, thanks for the information and pictures. I was born and grew up in Newcastle, Wyoming. Newcastle is about, by air, 56 miles almost due west from Rapid City, South Dakota. The 36’s out of Ellsworth would occasionally fly over Newcastle. Later in life so would the B-52s and B-1Bs. That is the reason for my interest in the 28^th Bomb Wing bombers I will hopefully have a model of the three bombers that operated out of Ellsworth AFB, a RB-36, B-52# not sure which variant and a B-1B. And now for a question who makes the best R-4360 radial engines in 1/72 scale? Magoo

Howdy,

              Question and answer number 3 is the most absurd thing I have ever heard! Whom did the USAF think was going to load a B-36 with hundreds of gallon of expensive high octane aviation fuel plus jet fuel and then what, a thermal nuclear bomb? After the fill up where would anyone go and buy a H-Bomb? If memory serves me correctly in Squadron’s B-36 book it shows a 21 ton H-Bomb that the B-36 could carry two of. But in Squadron’s B-52 book it shows some airmen getting ready to load a bomb cradle of 4 H-Bombs and the size of the bombs in a few short years had reduced significantly.

The size of the newer bombs would almost make me believe you could carry them on a B-25. Besides with today’s fighters with sophisticated avionics to lock onto a target and can be fired beyond visual range and that was possible even in 1971 seems very strange to take that position; seems like petty jealousy. The USAF did the same thing to the Northup B-35/B-49 flying wings. I think a couple of those should have gone into museums. Politics can be a viscous bed-fellow. Magoo

lajntx

Ok Everyone,

It`s POP QUIZ  time. Everyone take everything off of their bench and get out a sheet of paper and put your name on it, and number it 1 to 10.

Question #1

Which B-36 currently on display was the last one to actually fly?

Question #2

Which B-36 ( also on display ) flew the last official SAC B-36 mission?

Question # 3

When was the last "attempted" flight of a B-36? And what did the Air Force do to prevent it?

Question # 4

In responce to the failed attempted try ( in question # 3 ). What did the Air Force do to the YB-36 that the National Museum of the Air Force in Dayton, Ohio had decided NOT to move to the new ( now current ) museum from the museum`s old outdoor location?

Question # 5

B-36 production was moved to Ft Worth from what city?

Question #6

Is the DAILY DOUBLE

In the picture below, this B-36 converted over for FICON duty has a 0 - added to the tail number. A.) What does this signify? B.) Why did the AIr Force discontinue this practice?

Question # 7

In the movie Strategic Air Command, Dutch Holland flew which bomber in WWII ?

Question # 8

Which branch of the US Military sought to have the B-36 program defunded & cancelled?

Question #9

Which US President had a flight of B-36`s fly over the Capital Building as part of his innauguration parade?

Question #10

In addition to the 4 on display in museums, and the remnants of the YB on the late Walter Soplata`s estate. You can also find  the remains of wrecked B-36`s in which of the following places.

A. Goose Bay, Labrador, Canada

B. British Columbia

C. Lake Worth, Texas

D. Submerged just off the San Diego, California, coastline

E. All of the above.

 

Lots of participation and widly wrong guesses there.

Answers:

1. The B-36 on display at The National Museum of the Air Force in Dayton, Ohio.  It was pulled from the boneyard at Davis-Monthan, returned to flying condition, and flew out on April, 30, 1959.

2.  The B-36 on display at PIMA ( The last Peacemaker built ) 52-2827 was flown from Biggs AFB to Amon Carter Field in Ft Worth, Texas on Feb. 12, 1959 as the last official SAC mission on Operation Sayonara.

3. 1971. The B-36 then on display at Amon Carter Field in Ft Worth. Amon Carter Field ( GSW ) was slated to be closed and the land redevoloped due to the opening of the new DFW International Airport ( DFW ). The idea was to "fly" the plane to nearby Meacham Field and further restore into a "Flying Museum".  Worked progressed to the point that all 6 piston engines were restarted to ensure they would work. At that point the Air Force ordered all attempts at flying the plane to cease due to " a threat to national security". To ensure this plane would not fly ( and fall into the wrong hands ) The Air Force siezed 5 of the 6 Pratt & Whitneys. 

4. It was cut up in a manner that would prevent a return to airworthiness and the pieces were sold to Walter Soplata for "scrap".

5. San Diego

6. Adding a " 0- " prefix to a tailcode indicated that the craft was 10 years old and therefore "Obsolete". This practice was disconintued after many B-52`s were flying well past the 10 year mark, and it was begining to look like they would see the unlikely mark of 20 years worth of service. The idea of having planes with "00-" tailcodes did not seem feasible. One comment I saw in an old article even make the comment that if somehow the planes managed to stay usefull and not " fall apart" why would anyone want to fly in a plane that had tail code of "000- "? Its not like the B-52 would ever see years 40 or 50!

7. B-29

8. The US Navy... see " Revolt of the Admirals" for more of this story

9. Harry S Truman`s innauguration in 1949

10.  E. All of the above.

bondoman

 

Where would anyone find any pictures at all? They would be classified then and not available now. There aren't any in Jenkins'. You notice in that great reference that almost every photo is from Carswell.

It was an RB unit with ten aircraft, and only there for three years according to both Wiki and the kind of scattered info in Jenkins. My usual go-to for people to call, write etc. are the unit associations, and I can't find one for that wing. Probably didn't look hard enough.

That`s because Jenkins and most of the others are either from North Texas, have ties here, and have ties to the old Convair establishment here in Ft Worth,

However, there is always Meyers K Jacobsen for the rest of the B-36 story

Some of his work ( and pictures )

If someone had put that in the front resource  post it might have been found.

Andrew Magoo

 I have another question; where would a person find some good photos of some 28th BW Ellsworth AFB

It was an RB unit with ten aircraft, and only there for three years according to both Wiki and the kind of scattered info in Jenkins. My usual go-to for people to call, write etc. are the unit associations, and I can't find one for that wing. Probably didn't look hard enough.

Andrew Magoo

Howdy, eight canopies and bombadier nose pieces is a little bit daunting. Are you taping them or metal foil? I have another question; where would a person find some good photos of some 28th BW Ellsworth AFB

No, I have 8 OPENED kits, thats not counting the other 5 that remain sealed or are still in transit too me to support my very own 1/72 scale Aerospace Maintenance and Regeneration Group ( AMARG - Boneyard )

I have no idea where someone would find some good photos at the 28th BW at Rapid City/Ellsworth AFB. If someone had only put a few free videos and a couple free online reference books at the begining then anyone could have looked that info up.

Howdy, eight canopies and bombadier nose pieces is a little bit daunting. Are you taping them or metal foil? I have another question; where would a person find some good photos of some 28th BW Ellsworth AFB

Reasoned

I actually LIKE sweet peas, although I prefer frozen.

GOOD! since you like canopies... you can do mine. Here you go!

When you get done with those, Ive got 5 more B-36 Canopies in unopened kits.

Bon Appétit !

I actually LIKE sweet peas, although I prefer frozen.

Reasoned

 

That would figure, man I hate canopies. 

You`ll eat what you are given and like it!

lajntx

Reasoned:

Just looking over the kit (with the Val greenhouse fresh in my mind), how much/where for a set of masks?

 

You`re SOL there, that part is no longer offered. In the last year Ive seen it listed twice on ebay.. Once as a stand alone listing and the second as part of a kit listing.... Both went for $$$$.

That would figure, man I hate canopies.  Time to do another P-51D or P-47 bubble top!

Andrew Magoo

Howdy, thanks for the cartoon, it has been quite a few years since I've seen Mr. Magoo in action. Now for the questions you asked about the B-36 history. What are the answers? Also do you know or have any information on where the recons (RB-36s) went? Did they fly into China with the FICON units? I've got a couple of books and one infers that RB-36s Flying at 60,000 feet did do incursions into hostile territory but no details. Magoo

 

Nobody has attempted to answer them..... Plus it`s a good quiz for those on giving them practice looking up B-36 info on the net. 

As for your recon questions.... I`ve spent some time over at the B-36.net message board which has quite a few B-36 vets on it. The common concensus is that most people from that era ( the 1950`s ) did as they were told and when they were told "that their country`s safety depended on them doing their jobs to the best of their ability, safely, and to not talk about it -- ever, they did that. Even  today some 6 decades later most wont talk about their secret clandestine recon runs.

However on condition of not naming names, this has been brought up numerous over there:

1. B-36`s while not a part of the actual fighting in Korea flew recon runs over China to find staging areas, air bases, supply depots, etc to gain their location and to take photos to determine strength and movement.

2. Nobody has ever admited over flying the Soviet Union ( on purpose mind you ), but several have agreed that they did happen in the early 1950`s before Soviet jet interceptor and SAM technology improved to the point they could bring down a B-36 at 40K+ feet. Also remember the Soviets did shoot down a B-47 once that they claimed was loitering too close to the Siberian coast

The FICON units were all test units, and none ever saw actual deployment -  or being adopted into an actual AF program. More or less they were one and done because the Jet age had come which meant the 36 was being retired in favor of the B-52 in both bomber & recon roles. The U-2 had replaced the RB-36 for penetrating Soviet/East Bloc airspace for info. Also, spy satellites were begining to be put into orbit in the late 1950`s. Combined all of that with the fact the ICBM was rapidly becoming the cheaper more prefered method of going on one trip sorties to deliver a payload inside the USSR and for obvious reasons would not need a fighter escort or protection

Howdy, thanks for the cartoon, it has been quite a few years since I've seen Mr. Magoo in action. Now for the questions you asked about the B-36 history. What are the answers? Also do you know or have any information on where the recons (RB-36s) went? Did they fly into China with the FICON units? I've got a couple of books and one infers that RB-36s Flying at 60,000 feet did do incursions into hostile territory but no details. Magoo

Andrew Magoo

Hi, well I had good intentions of getting something done last weekend but I’ve got some work I have to finish, none model related, on my big table. This weekend I have my youngest son visiting from out of state Friday and Saturday and have other people coming over Sunday afternoon. So I may not get much accomplished this week. I do have intensions of trying to get something done but the DO LIST may get in the road; I’m sure that none in the forum have ever experienced such events. Magoo  

Yes, last week was quite eventful for you... Someone got it on video.

When Magoo Flew

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7o5zipU6r7o  

 

 

Reasoned

Just looking over the kit (with the Val greenhouse fresh in my mind), how much/where for a set of masks?

You`re SOL there, that part is no longer offered. In the last year Ive seen it listed twice on ebay.. Once as a stand alone listing and the second as part of a kit listing.... Both went for $$$$.

If you are game for finding the proverbial lost needle in a haystack, what you are looking for is the Black Magic canopy mask for a 1/72 B-36 by meteor productions. I believe they ceased operations in 2008.

Ive seen the suggestion to take some bare metal foil and rig a cutting mechanism with some xacto blades to make some adhesive strips cut to size...... Sounds expensive and VERY time consuming to me

Best advice I can give you is get some high end masking tape and follow the instructions on that build from Lafayette Modelers I posted. Or with that same roll of high end masking tape paint mask it to paint your vertical lines, then remask it later to paint your horizontal line.... The round circular lines on the bottom..... Your on your own to figure how to do those.

Just looking over the kit (with the Val greenhouse fresh in my mind), how much/where for a set of masks?

Hi, well I had good intentions of getting something done last weekend but I’ve got some work I have to finish, none model related, on my big table. This weekend I have my youngest son visiting from out of state Friday and Saturday and have other people coming over Sunday afternoon. So I may not get much accomplished this week. I do have intensions of trying to get something done but the DO LIST may get in the road; I’m sure that none in the forum have ever experienced such events. Magoo    

Howdy, thanks for the instructions; I will see if tomorrow I can get some photos taken and posted. Magoo

Andrew Magoo

Hi, If I can figure out Photo Bucket I'll post some pictures of what I've got and the one I builrt. Thanks for the links. Magooo

It`s simple really

1. Go to photobucket.com and set up an account

2. click upload, and select files saved on your computer & upload them to the selected album

To post a picture here

1. Go to the picture in your photobucket album

2. Put cursor on the picture or click to open it

3. Look for the box that labled " direct link", place cursor over it and left click with mouse which will copy it

4. In finescale post look above for the strip of film icon  thats "insert media" & left click it

5  In box labled :Enter the URL for the media that you would like to use. .. left click w/mouse to start the flashing cursor

6 On keyboard press the "Ctrl" & " V" buttons simulaneously and the copied link from photobucket should paste in

7. Select "INSERT" if you dont want to change the dimensions

8. Picture will display in post

Hint -- It will place the picture where the flashing cursor last was... so ensure that you have the cursor in the place you want it before posting a picture

Hi, If I can figure out Photo Bucket I'll post some pictures of what I've got and the one I builrt. Thanks for the links. Magooo

Hi everyone, here is a reasonably priced already started 1/72 1980 kit for those either looking for a spare parts kit, or would like to buy one to build one. Looks like it would require some repainting work if you didnt want to build a late 1950`s version with the white anti thermal painted under belly

It ends tonight, and has a buy now option.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290679864825?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

Andrew Magoo

Hi, Thanks for the information. I had been wondering what happened to Lucien. Looks like he is pulling out all the stops. I'm not sure I'm ever going that extensive on  B-36, I'm too slow at building any model. I do too much fitting and messing with masking tape for painting. For all that it's worth I'd be at it for 3 years . Magoo

I`m about the same way... Ive got 4 builds on hold and a stash of 10 B-36 Kits to build. LOL

But back to your earlier question I missed. The FICON with the F-84 didnt have clearance issues with the landing gear. It was when a B-36 carried a B-58 airframe to Wright Patterson for structural testing in 1957 in which the flight was completed with both inboard props removed and the landing gear left down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pxrwpur_Op8&feature=related

It`s also a build of mine that is on hold:

/forums/t/141612.aspx

Hi, Thanks for the information. I had been wondering what happened to Lucien. Looks like he is pulling out all the stops. I'm not sure I'm ever going that extensive on  B-36, I'm too slow at building any model. I do too much fitting and messing with masking tape for painting. For all that it's worth I'd be at it for 3 years . Magoo

Andrew Magoo

With that said I still want to find someone who is an electronics whiz; because of their size in 1/72 I'd like to stick lights and motors in the prop jobs. The kicker is I want the motors to turn slow like the big R-4360s would when starting (one at a time) let them run like they are Idling during warm up then all speed up to full power. The problem is to pulse-width the current to the motors so they will accomplish that feat. The electric motors would have to be geared down because i think I remember reading that the R-4360s rev-limit was 2,000 rpm; I’m going to guess that would translate to propeller rpm as well. Any ideas? Magoo

 

You need to look this guy up on the ARC Forums. He`s on here too, but he seems to be more active over there. Here is his XB-36 conversion build with working props and lights, this should point you in the right direction. Plus you can also contact the original FICON builder there too.

http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=212625&hl=b-36&st=0

Ok Everyone,

It`s POP QUIZ  time. Everyone take everything off of their bench and get out a sheet of paper and put your name on it, and number it 1 to 10.

Question #1

Which B-36 currently on display was the last one to actually fly?

Question #2

Which B-36 ( also on display ) flew the last official SAC B-36 mission?

Question # 3

When was the last "attempted" flight of a B-36? And what did the Air Force do to prevent it?

Question # 4

In responce to the failed attempted try ( in question # 3 ). What did the Air Force do to the YB-36 that the National Museum of the Air Force in Dayton, Ohio had decided NOT to move to the new ( now current ) museum from the museum`s old outdoor location?

Question # 5

B-36 production was moved to Ft Worth from what city?

Question #6

Is the DAILY DOUBLE

In the picture below, this B-36 converted over for FICON duty has a 0 - added to the tail number. A.) What does this signify? B.) Why did the AIr Force discontinue this practice?

Question # 7

In the movie Strategic Air Command, Dutch Holland flew which bomber in WWII ?

Question # 8

Which branch of the US Military sought to have the B-36 program defunded & cancelled?

Question #9

Which US President had a flight of B-36`s fly over the Capital Building as part of his innauguration parade?

Question #10

In addition to the 4 on display in museums, and the remnants of the YB on the late Walter Soplata`s estate. You can also find  the remains of wrecked B-36`s in which of the following places.

A. Goose Bay, Labrador, Canada

B. British Columbia

C. Lake Worth, Texas

D. Submerged just off the San Diego, California, coastline

E. All of the above.