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Ship Trivia Quiz

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  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 1:28 PM

I haven't been taking part in this thread lately - mainly because I've run out of decent questions to ask.  (The last few I asked were pretty dumb, and easily answered.)  The subject of this old revenue cutter kit, though, caught my attention. 

We've discussed it several times here in the Forum.  It is in fact a reboxing of an old Pyro kit that originally appeared in the early '50s, with the name Roger B. Taney.  Pyro, in turn, got the design from the Model Shipways solid-hull wood kit, which had originally been released sometime in the late '40s.  (Pyro did that to several wood kits from Model Shipways and Marine Models.  Other MS kits that ended up as Pyro plastic kits are the Harriet Lane, the tug Dispatch No. 9, and the trawler Hildina.  The gents who used to run Model Shipways referred to Pyro as "Pirate Plastics.")  Pyro sold the kit for awhile under the name "Independence War Schooner"; we can't blame that one on Lindberg.

Here's a copy of a post I did about it last year:

"The story of the Roger B. Taney kit is actually a little more complicated.  Model Shipways introduced its kit sometime in the late 1940s, with that name.  The Taney is generally referred to as a member of the Morris class of revenue cutters, which dated from around 1845.  Howard I. Chapelle published a set of plans for the class in his book, The History of American Sailing Ships, which was first published in the thirties; the MS plans apparently were based on those drawings.  (Chapelle was a good friend of Model Shipways.  He provided the plans that were included in the original version of the MS Sultana kit.) 

"Unfortunately for MS's marketing, Chapelle was the type of researcher who never stopped digging.  A few years later he found, among the Coast Guard records in the National Archives (the records of the old Revenue Cutter Service were - and still are - notoriously sloppily organized) another contemporary drawing that had the name Roger B. Taney on it.  He published a redrawn version of that drawing in his next major book, The History of the American Sailing Navy (1949).  It makes it clear that, though the Taney was quite similar to the generic Morris-class plan on which Chapelle had based his original drawing (and MS had based its kit), she differed in some fairly conspicuous respects.  (I'd have to dig out the book to comment in detail, but as I remember the Taney's bow structure, for instance, was more elaborate.)  The MS and Pyro/Lindberg kits probably come closer to representing the Morris or the Alexander Hamilton - or perhaps some other member of the class.  Unfortunately the documentation on those early revenue cutters is pretty lousy - and the contemporary pictorial evidence about their appearance is worse.

"The most up-to-date tabular listing of them, Paul Silverstone's The Sailing Navy, 1774-1854, describes this batch of revenue cutters as the "Morris-Taney class."  The listing includes thirteen vessels.  Silverstone (who, I think, got his data from the Coast Guard Historian's Office) lists the basic dimensions of six of them; they're all different by a few feet (though all have the same registered tonnage:  112).  One of them, the Ingham, did serve briefly in the Texas War for Independence.  She was sold by the USRC in January, 1846, and purchased by the "Texas Navy," which named her Independence.  Three months later she got captured by the Mexicans and renamed Independencia.  So I guess it could be said that the Pyro/Lindberg kit is a model of that ship - though I must say that seems like a rather strange subject for a modeler to pick.

"The last time the IPMS Nationals were held in Virginia Beach, I got a look at a mixed-media Morris-class revenue cutter kit from a company called, aptly enough, Cottage Industry Models.  The kit - which had a cast resin hull, wood spars, and cast metal and resin fittings, impressed me; I wish I'd been able to afford it.  Here's a link:   http://www.squadron.com/ItemDetails.asp?item=CI96003 .   

"The old Pyro/Lindberg kit, though, is capable of providing the basis for a good serious scale model as well.  Just watch out for the raised lines representing the edges of the closed gunport lids (the lines on the insides and outsides of the bulwarks don't match), the small boat (whose thwarts don't reach the gunwales), and a few other 1950s-ish characteristics."

The evidence is sketchy enough that I guess the name Brutus would work just as well.  I don't think anybody could prove that either the Independence or the Brutus didn't look like that.

For what it's worth, here's a drawing of another member of the class, the Alexander Hamilton, that I did on commission from the Coast Guard Historian's Office - more years ago than I like to think about:  http://www.uscg.mil/history/plans/USRCAlexanderHamilton.jpg .

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: San Francisco, CA
Posted by telsono on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:09 PM

Dr. Tilley  - I always enjoy your comments, your knowledge is greatly appreciated by myself and I believe all other members of this forum.

With the information you have given here I may indeed revise my plans and build the kit as the Hamilton.

Thank you for your input to the question.

Mike T.

Beware the hobby that eats.  - Ben Franklin

Do not fear mistakes. You will know failure. Continue to reach out. - Ben Franklin

The U.S. Constitution  doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. - Ben Franklin

  • Member since
    September 2009
  • From: Miami, FL
Posted by Felix C. on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:16 PM

Amati does a 1/60 resin hull Roger B. Taney

http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/amati_roger_taney.html

  • Member since
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  • From: Warrington PA
Posted by oceano75 on Friday, February 12, 2010 7:32 PM

Ok, a non-Coast Guard question...

In what is considered to be the shortest war in recorded history (it lasted either 38 or 45 minutes depending on whose stop watch you believe), a British squadron of five ships quelched a coup in this nation and demolished the nations Navy (which consisted of one ship),  What was the nation and what was the name of it's only ship?

Bonus: What were the 5 British ships?

  • Member since
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  • From: USS Big Nasty, Norfolk, Va
Posted by navypitsnipe on Friday, February 12, 2010 7:52 PM

DITTO on what telsono said

40,000 Tons of Diplomacy + 2,200 Marines = Toughest fighting team in the world Sis pacis instruo pro bellum
  • Member since
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  • From: Warrington PA
Posted by oceano75 on Tuesday, February 16, 2010 5:18 PM

Time for hints?

Think Africa in the very late 1800s.

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Posted by ddp59 on Tuesday, February 16, 2010 10:23 PM

The Anglo-Zanzibar War was fought between the United Kingdom and Zanzibar on 27 August 1896. With a duration of only 38 minutes, it holds the record of being the shortest war in recorded history.

HMS Philomel, HMS Thrush, HMS Sparrow, HMS Racoon, HMS St. George

Armed Yacht Glasgow

  • Member since
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  • From: Warrington PA
Posted by oceano75 on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 6:18 AM

Bingo

The next question is yours...

  • Member since
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Posted by ddp59 on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 8:43 PM

what ship had the most number of main gun turrets?

  • Member since
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  • From: USS Big Nasty, Norfolk, Va
Posted by navypitsnipe on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 9:07 PM

IJN Hyuga 6 twin 14" turrets

40,000 Tons of Diplomacy + 2,200 Marines = Toughest fighting team in the world Sis pacis instruo pro bellum
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Posted by alumni72 on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 9:41 PM

Or the Ise, Fuso or Yamashiro ...

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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 10:54 PM

HMS Agincourt had 7 main gun turrets.

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  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Thursday, February 18, 2010 12:11 AM

USS Atlanta and her sisters had eight twin 5" turrets. They were their main armanent.

 

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
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Posted by ddp59 on Thursday, February 18, 2010 12:18 PM

both surface line  & subfixer are right tho i was thinking more of battleship & forgot about atlanta class even tho collecting info on that class for a somewhat scratch build. either 1 of you 2 can go ahead & post next question.

  • Member since
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Posted by Neptune48 on Thursday, February 18, 2010 1:32 PM

Small clarification...In USN boot camp (1967) they made a point that twin 5"-38's are not turrets.  They are gun mounts.  They don't have armored barbettes that go to the keel and hold the magazines.  They said that 6" cruiser guns were the smallest turrets in the Navy.

"You can't have everything--where would you put it?"
  • Member since
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  • From: USS Big Nasty, Norfolk, Va
Posted by navypitsnipe on Thursday, February 18, 2010 7:37 PM

5"/54's aren't mounts nowadays though, they are in turrets, i think you're looking into the question a little too much. i'm sure he was looking at a turret as a full enclosure for the gun rather than the full ammo system which would include the armored barbettes

40,000 Tons of Diplomacy + 2,200 Marines = Toughest fighting team in the world Sis pacis instruo pro bellum
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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Thursday, February 18, 2010 9:35 PM

Boot camp doesn't train the way it used to, does it, Neptune?

Rick

RTC San Diego '73

  • Member since
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  • From: USS Big Nasty, Norfolk, Va
Posted by navypitsnipe on Thursday, February 18, 2010 10:39 PM

Navy ain't the same as it used to be either.

RTC Great Lakes '03

40,000 Tons of Diplomacy + 2,200 Marines = Toughest fighting team in the world Sis pacis instruo pro bellum
  • Member since
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Posted by Neptune48 on Thursday, February 18, 2010 11:34 PM

My boot camp's gone altogether (NTC San Diego).  From what I've heard, I'd hardly recognize the Navy at all nowadays.

"You can't have everything--where would you put it?"
  • Member since
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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Friday, February 19, 2010 12:42 AM

USS Recruit (TDE-1) is still there.  Sort of a park thing now.  But before they pulled NTC out, they converted her from an old DE to an FFG-looking thing, and now she is marked TFFG-1 or something like that.

But otherwise, if you didn't know where you were driving around, you'd never know what had been there, and never guess how many sailors marched over that bridge from Camp Nimitz to the "main side".  As if all those ceremonies for us, week by week, meant something nowadays.

  • Member since
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  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Friday, February 19, 2010 1:40 AM

The bridge from Worm Island where you had to change to "route step" to avoid collapsing the bridge. Yeah, I remember it and the Springfields we carried, too.

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Friday, February 19, 2010 9:13 AM

We couldn't call it "Worm Island" - we could hardly say the work "worm" in those days, and they wouldn't tell us why.  There must have been some kind of a legal action or a scandal with recruit abuse in about the summer of 73 that had all the staff terrified of getting tarred with the same brush.

And this certainly qualifies as trivia, doesn't it?

  • Member since
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Posted by Neptune48 on Friday, February 19, 2010 2:18 PM

I never heard the term "Worm Island."  It was always Camp Nimitz to us.

Yes, I've seen USS Recruit still there on Google Earth.  Apparently the chapel is still there, too, with the stained glass window depicting a sailor.  The model for that work was said to have been a recruit named Henry Fonda, who was even more famous for some work he did in Hollywood. 

When I attended "BEEP" school, and later Radioman school at NTC, we used to attend the Navy band concerts during the lunch periods on Wednesdays in that plaza near the HQ building.   It was the same band that played every Friday for basic graduation.

Apparently I just missed being in RM school with that traitor, Chief John Walker ("Johnny Walker Red"), the guy who sold all our crypto secrets to the Soviets--not for ideology, mind you, just for cash.  It's a strange feeling knowing one's entire enlistment was for naught on account of that guy and his cohorts.  I wonder if Worm Island was named after him, though that would be a slight against worms.

Sorry to veer so far off topic.  Back to the game...

"You can't have everything--where would you put it?"
  • Member since
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Posted by Neptune48 on Monday, February 22, 2010 9:13 AM

I HATE it when I kill a thread! 

Hey, subfixer or surface_line...one of you gets the next question.

"You can't have everything--where would you put it?"
  • Member since
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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Monday, February 22, 2010 9:47 AM

subfixer provides an answer with a greater number of turret-looking things.

Go ahead, please.

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Wednesday, February 24, 2010 7:19 AM

Sorry it has taken so long to get back to this, we've been giving a submarine a nuclear enema.

Okay,  here is one that should be quick and easy:

What is the deal with the windmill on this ship?

File:Discoveryboat.jpg

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    August 2005
  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Wednesday, February 24, 2010 9:59 AM

In Robert Scott and Ernest Shackleton's trip to the Antarctic in 1901-1904 aboard HMS Discovery, one of their achievements while stuck in the ice was to build a windmill to provide electricity.

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  • From: Warrington PA
Posted by oceano75 on Wednesday, February 24, 2010 9:59 PM

Nansen did the same thing when he took Fram into the ice in  1893 - 1896.  Just as an aside.

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  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Wednesday, February 24, 2010 10:15 PM

The floor is yours, Mister Line....

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
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  • From: Seattle, WA
Posted by Surface_Line on Thursday, February 25, 2010 9:59 AM

Normal 0 false false false EN-US X-NONE X-NONE

There is a common thread between these:

-          A young American officer who was a proponent of improving naval gunnery and later became the Navy’s Inspector of Target Practice prior to WWI.

-          A cook who received the Navy Cross for his service with 50 caliber machine guns.

-          A boatswain’s mate who eventually received two Medals of Honor – one in the Boxer Rebellion and one at Vera Cruz.

-          A Destroyer Squadron commander who regularly pushed his ships to their absolute design limit, and was given a nickname for the reduced speed to which they were limited while one had a boiler casualty.

Each of these individuals had ships named after them, and another item of recognition in common.  Who are they and what is the common thread?

 

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