ARMOR - Tamiya 1/16 Tiger 1 Group Build

I agree with Skrull, I doubt they will ever release another 1/16 Tiger version. If they had common sense they would release the kit that would sell the most besides the Tiger – a 1/16 Full option Panther! But it seems no-one can second guess their logic – it'll probably be an Abrams or WW1 Mark 1 and wont sell particularly well, and then they'll think there is no market anymore for RC tanks. I hope not.

Back to the kitties – some of you probably know this but since I don't think it has been posted here before (or elsewhere to my knowledge), I may as well do it. The rear tow hooks (extension of the hull sides at the rear) on the Tamiya kit are only correct for Tigers made after/at the end of Jan 1944. They did this at the same time as the front ones were re-shaped. The good news is it's easy to fix, just file the extra liitle pointy bit on the bottom off. In a lot of pics you cant see it because its generally obscured by the towing shackles. Here are some pics of the Bovington Tiger taken from "Armor Photogallery #3, PzKpfw V1 Tiger 1 Ausf.E Part 1 by Wojciech J. Gawrych" (try saying that when you've had a few)





Source for the Jan '44 date: "The Modellers Guide to the Tiger Tank" by MMIR also in a few other places (but can't remember where – lol!)

File away if you're early and mid!!!

Wlad

Nice tip on the hull extensions,something I'll remember on my
current Tiger build...BTW,if you look at the engineering on the
early Tiger kit ,blanked off holes to open,method for mounting
smoke dischargers,etc.,its kind of obvious to me that Tamiya
intended future re-release as a later model Tiger, possibly
when sales of the early model taper off...
Kind of nasty to invest in a"Big Dollar" major conversion to
a late model version & have them spring it on us as a
new release in a few months...
Another item I need to locate,Who makes a nice M.G.34 in
1:16? Resin,metal,or plastic isOK .
Roowalker

I have a question about the gear reduction mods for the Tiger 1, Type 1 gearbox.
I've read all 77 pages of this Build Group (great stuff by the way), but no one has brought up the question of changing just the pinion gear on the Mabuchi and/or Johnson motor. My type 1 gearbox has a Johnson motor (I assume they it made with the same specifications as the Mabuchi) with a 10-tooth pinion gear. If the 10-tooth pinion gives the gearbox a 60:1 ratio, wouldn't an 8-tooth pinion gear give you a 75:1 ratio? Would the torque loss and/or motor stall be a big issue? Willy has stated on his website that the ideal ratio is 85:1.
Thoughts anyone?

roowalker, in this german online shop you can find a MG34 and another stuff for the Tiger (note the real working headlights !!!)

http://www.rcpanzer-shop.de/shop/index.php?cPath=24&sort=3a&page=2

Thanks,Panzerpabst,this is what I was looking for.
Headlight conversion looks good,too.
Roowalker

Cheezz: Re: the gear ratio:

If it was a simple 1-to-1 relationship of pinion to spur, yes. But there are 5 or 6 ratios to be factored into that geardown. The other thing is finding an 8 tooth pinion...

As yet, Willy is the only one thats found set-screw mountable ones in small tooth counts, and he's not telling us where he gets 'em from.

To drop it sufficiently, you need to add a further spur & pinion... but when you order from Willy (or anyone else) make sure you tell them you have Type 1 gearboxes. All the boxes have different ratios, so need different units to achieve a set final ratio.

And lastly... be SURE Willy has confirmed your order. I've chatted with him, and a few orders that people think they placed were never confirmed...

Welcome Cheezz!

You survived our collective 77 pages of rantings and still joined! I must admit the maths of gear ratios does my head in... and I haven't a clue although I try. I'm glad WW answered!

Wlad

just wanted to place a picture to make it more intereresting for the guys who working through this 77 pages :)

a little description on my page www.boorad.de

Question ?????

People have been talking about installing the Groupner Speed 400 motors on the tiger, is this a good idea and what will I achieve….

Nick:

A Graupner Speed-400 is actually a Mabuchi RS-380SH-4045 relabeled for Graupner.

WhiteWolf:

Thanks for your comments on my gearbox ratio question.
As for the 8-tooth pinion for the 2.3mm shaft (Mabuchi RS-380/Graupner Speed-400),
you can get them at DreamHobbies.com under "Catalog #1384, 8T Pinion Zoom/Shogun 2.3mm" for US$4.99, but you'll also need a pinion puller. Guess what, they have that too. "Catalog #1403, GWS Gear Puller, Standard" for US$11.99.
Hobby People has the same puller, but charge US$15.00.
I ask the dealer there about gear ratios. I was correct. A 60:1 ratio gearbox with a 10T pinion is equivalent to a 600-tooth spur gear. (600T/10T=60:1). Therefore, a 600T/8T=75:1 with increased torque.

Per my previous posting, a word of caution. DreamHobbies 8T pinion for a 2.3mm shaft has an outside diameter of only 5mm. Tamiya's 10T pinion is 7mm O.D.

found this in the gallery of our german forum. it shows the usage of the Jamara gear reduction unit but with the old tamiya gears.
http://www.rcpanzer.de/photos/photos.php?TopicID=guido

should work with the new ons too

"HELP" having some problems with my tamiya tiger full option kit.. When moving forward the tank turns ok to the right making a graceful turn, "But" when I try the same thing on the left the tanks does not respond the same way instead of a gracefully turning it has minor vibrations and not much response for turning until it make a hard pivot left because now I went to far with the control stick.

It stoped turning left only hard pivots..... Maybe i need to upgrde to a FUTABA attack 4VWD Trasmitter.

Cheezz:

One thing you are forgetting... its not a 1-to-1 relationship we're discussing, as there are about 5 other gears in the box. That first 'spur' gear has a center-piece 'pinion' that in turn drives the spur of the next one, etc... and you have to factor ALL those ratio's in together.

And that 8-tooth pinion... is it 0.6 pitch? If it isn't, it won't mesh properly with the rest, and only chew up your spur so that you cannot go back short of replacing the spur. Remember that Tamiya does not sell just gears for these boxes... you're looking at replacing a $50 dollar box.

A lot of thought has gone into other gearbox reductions... just to be shot down by incompatible pitches, rediculous prices (the HPC sets ran about $50 a pop for a ~pair~ of gears) or Tamiya changing the box design and making the previous 'kit' incompatible.

That said... use an untested mod at your own risk.

Thanks for your comments, WhiteWolf.
You are correct on the 8T, 2.3mm dia. pinion. It is only a 0.50 pitch and TOO small.
And like you said, it would eat up Tamiya's nylon gear for breakfast.

Nick,
It is unlikely to be your radio transmitter itself, more likely to be something isn't quite right with the set-up of either the transmitter, dmd, gearbox, etc. Check everything over and start from scratch. Try swapping things about and everything else you can think of to narrow down the problem. It would be a shame to spend the money, get new radio gear and find the problem remains.

Hope it helps.

Wlad

Panzerpabst,

Has there been any testing of the Jamara units to see what scale speeds result from the different gear ratios? Have many people installed them and what do they think? It would be good to hear what most of our Deutsche friends do for gear reductions.

Wlad

Nick :

Possible problems/solutions:

When you 'programmed' the DMD/MF setup, were your trims set dead-center neutral? They need to be set dead-center during the programming phase. Also make sure that any ratchet-center sticks start and return to center during this phase.

When you run the beast, did it not run true (ie with a centered steering stick the tank still turns at speed) You do NOT correct with the trims, as this will interfere with the programming. You need to adjust the 'neutral' pot on the DMD. Its the balance of power for the left & right motors.

Check for anything that may cause the gearboxes to bind. If you pulled the motors for upgrading or reduction installation, make sure they spin freely and with equal ease. You may have one pinion set closer to a spur, and this would cause the motor to need more force/power to run, and cause the turn. Also someone noticed that some reductions a pinion projects too much, and a spur grinds on the pinion.

Lastly, check your track tension... is it equal on both sides? This, like the gearbox movement, would cause the tank to pull to one side.

Wlad, I used to open a thread in our forum to get some information about gear reductions. One have the Jamara 2.5 : 1 in his Tiger and it seems to be a good combination of scale speed, accurate control and power. One other guy did the same but he says it's to noisy - the first guy wonder about this because the gear has ball bearings and is very good quality. If you want to use this gear you'll have to increase the 3 mm hole of the little pinion to 4 mm to fit at the shaft of this gear. This is because this gear is made for propellers of planes.
Hope this will help a little bit.

Damn it , last days I spend more time on my 1:1 nitro car than on my Tiger :(

Whoo-Eee:

Looks like Tamiya is thinking WW2 again! Perth Military Modelling site released the May list for the June releases... and guess what we are getting?

#36310 (World Figure Series) is a DAK Tiger crewman! I expect its the T1 static DAK commander beefed to full figure proportions. Would be nice if they did it the same way as the did the Bundeswehr fig, giving us the original partial plus a new full-fig.

Anyone seeing this up, let me know. I WANNA SEE!

( - finally has an Estes V-2 rocket inbound )

Tank Related: Asian Bearing ALERT!

Did any of you get bearings from Asia via eBay? Yes, I know the Tiger doesn't get any, but its two Allied Attackers and the later German kitty did...

If you found any leakage in the container that the bearings came in, pull the bearings now, if you aint glued the wheels!

It seems a few of the tankers have suffered styrene contamination/fracture, probably due to contamination by a non-styrene safe lube. I bought off WalaWala, and my supposedly 'sealed-rubber' ones leaked, and upon opening my roadwheels 90 days later, there is noticable leakage on the styrene.

Don't hold your breath... you probably won't get any refund or replacement, let alone compensation for damage. I HAVE written to eBay Trust & Safety about it, and best we can get is his eBay bearing ads pulled.

OH, he changed his ID on the 18th of April, Walawala = Joaquimassis now.

Hi All,

I bought a KT Full option kit a couple of months ago and found this Forum while doing research for my build. I've got to say that this is great, I've gotten so many ideas from reading this.

WhiteWolf,

I may have found a replacement for the Carr's Solder Paste @ Radio Shack (and it's way less expensive). I haven't tried it out so I don't know if it's water soluble. The melting point listed in the Material Safety Data Sheet is 130 degrees F.

http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F011%5F009%5F007%5F001&product%5Fid=64%2D029

Also, are you still making the Belly Plates?

Cheers,

Ken

KEN:

Nice detective work... but I may have two problems:

- One, thats Radio Shack US, I need Radio Shack Canada. The numbers do not corelate. Again, unless someone wants to ship it, I'm SOL.

- Two, Radio Shack Canada was bought out by Circuit City, and all Radio Shacks will be come "The Source by Circuit City' stores. I checked their online catalog, no solder listings at all.


On the plates...

Yea, thought the Sherman plate has changed radically, and is now designed to be used in conjunction with Daryl Turner's gearbox-brace-block (to replace the 6 brass stand-offs)

Still make the Tiger and King Tiger plates, no changes there.

You want one, mail me.

I just found this thread and was wondering if anyone else was working on a 1/16 Tiger atm.

NGT:

I'm still slowly plugging away at mine... as well as three others (KT, M4 & M26)

Still trying to find a supplier of that damned paste solder... anyone wanna ship me some 'quietly' in a candy-box?

WhiteWolf

My build is on hold at the moment, awaiting parts from Germany. Am too lazy to build my own S-mine launchers so things are delayed heh

To those CARR's solder users out there...

Which version do you use? Low-temp strip-solder (C100?), one of the creams (C1016 or C1017) or the solder paint (C10409)

I ask as I'm debating either ordering direct, or having someone quietly 'slip' me some on the mail. I know a few used the paste/paint, how much did you use? (seeing as its in 35cc syringes or 30ml bottles - 1cc = 1ml)

WWolf,
From what i've read, you seem to favor the carr solder, but as i said before, the regular solder and a cheap radio shack iron worked well for me. You just need a "clean pointy" tip. I've finished the tiger I PE set using this cheap setup. Give it a try.

To ensure that all the PEs stay on the tank, i drilled holes on the PE piece and soldered a brass wire pin, then i drilled the hole for the pin on the tank. I first tried the 5 minutes epoxy, but this did not seem to work well. It break off when the plastic hull is bent., i.e. trying to remove the top place, etc... CA works better for me in this case.

The only thing that i could not use from the set set are the cables, large and small. I replaced the plastic hangers on the cable with the PE hangers.

This PE set seems to take forever to finish. It took me since September 04 till today. I'll start the fun stuff next week, painting

I'm using the solder paint and am happy with it. The one bottle (no measurement on it) should easily do you for the full Aber set.

Having said that if I had a choice now I would try one of the creams - liitle or no clean-up!!!

Regards,

Wlad.