DML Grille H Smart Kit WIP *COMPLETE Pics p.9* 05-03-09

Well DMLs kits seem to have many major and minor flaws that would have been just as easy to get right when designed as to get them wrong. Is it because builders are becoming more knowlegeable of their subjects or is it that the model companies are just getting by with thinking they can pull the wool down over our eyes?

Bills Grille still looks really nice to me and i'm sure to many other average modellers like myself.     We being the core group of sales are the bread and butter to these companies and I guess they figure the hard cases will fix the mistakes that are intentional or otherwise.

Thanks Bill for taking the time                                                                                          Tony the Mutt

Looking great, Bill.  I second the comment about the tools, they just look real to me.  I was just painting the Princes Jagdtiger tools, using tips frmo your build logs, and let me tell you, your detail work is amazing.

Bill 

Aaron, thanks for the comments!

DM-Steve, thanks as well, you're right in that there are quite a few Steves running around. It's a conspiracy! I tried something a little bit different this time around in terms of my base "wood" color...instead of using my normal mystery-mix (which has started to get thick with age), I played around with similar colors I alread had available and was happy with the outcome.

Terry, appreciate you stopping by and yes the 38t stable is definitely well populated. To date I've completed 5 (this one will be #6) kits in the family and have another 6 in the stash, so this one's the tipping point so-to-speak. Hope your reference arrives soon so you can get to work on yours.

Bill the camo is looking brilliant at the moment. the  pioneer tools look great, the whole thing is comming together really nicely right now.

Terry.

P.s the 38t stable must be getting pretty crowded right now. I sent offf for the book on thhe Sig33 but it has not arrived yet.

Looking real good Bill. Those tools are just outta sight and the camo is sure to be a winner....

Oh yeah, I'm a Steve too.

Lotta Steves here. 

Getting much closer to the finish line now and the latest round of effort focused in on the details for the exterior. The astute observer from the previous post will have noticed that I only painted 7 of the 8 road wheels...a fact I discovered when I went to test fit them in today's efforts and came up 1 short. Fortunately I found the wheel out in the garage where I do my painting and disaster was averted. I painted the wheel and also went back over the camo pattern and removed the green over spray to make the dunkelgelb color a little more dominant than it was before.

I also stated in on the tools and other equipment for the fenders. Starting on the left side, I already knew that the kit suggested positioning of the shovel and pick axe weren't going to work. The diagram wants you to install the shovel flat against the vertical side of the engine access hatch but you can't do that due to the interference from the curved rear brace of the fighting compartment side. The diagram suggestion is how these were configured on the 38t gun-tank and is a hold-over from their 38t G instruction diagrams. The solution is to position the shovel flat on the fender and have the pick axe sit on top of it. In order to be able to handle this as one piece instead of two, I used some liquid glue and glued the handles of the shovel and pick together in position and let it dry. I also test fit the location of the long pry bar to be sure it too would go in the right spot.

With that out of the way, I painted up all the tools for installation with the exception of the wire cutters, more on them in a bit. All of the wood portions were painted with an 80/20 mix of Afrika Grunbraun and Light Gray and then given a light wash of Leather. The metallic portions were painted with non-buffing Metalizer Gunmetal and then lightly dry-brushed with Steel. I added the PE retaining straps to the axe and pick/shovel as well as the pry bar but left it off the sledge hammer since it won't be visible once installed and would've caused clearance problems with the superstructure when sliding it into place.

I'm not too impressed with the DML PE in this department...all of the straps provided are the same and fairly plain and lacking in detail. They also don't have any bend lines to help guide you in sizing them so you have to do it all by trial and error and even then they are too short for some of the things the instructions call for them to do. For example, they are too short to tie the shovel and pick together and also too short to adequately go around the wire cutters. This means you have to cheat a bit and position the gaps so that they are on the inside and away from view.

I installed the tools on the left hand side once they had dried and the wire cutters required special attention. The clearance at the front of the superstructure is insufficient to allow the inside handle to clear it properly. Since it's hidden from view anyway, I carefully trimmed it down to only that portion that would be visible and still allow it to fit. The road wheels and return rollers were also installed in anticipation of the tracks getting fitted tomorrow.

I also worked on the rear hull details. The muffler was base coated with non-buffing Metalizer Gunmetal and given a wash of Rust and the spare track run added to the rear superstructure plate. The lenses of the Notek were picked out with Tamiya Clear Green and the four small leather straps added to the rear crew doors. I also added the 3 retaining PE straps for the tow cable and noticed on sprue A that two cable ends were included in the kit as parts A27. These aren't called out anywhere in the instructions and the front diagrams don't have them marked as not for use so they are a sort of "Easter egg" for you to find if you're vigilant I guess. I created the cable using a 10cm length of crochet rope that I first dipped into Future and hung to air dry. This accomplishes two things...it insures the rope won't fray and get "hairy" when painted and also stiffens it up a bit but not too much that it still can't be shaped into the proper position. The cable was painted up with the same metalizer Gunmetal and then installed into position and the leather straps glued into place to hold it down. In hindsight I could have benefited from having the thread just a few mm longer but had to kind of wing it in terms of overall length since no guidance is provided in the instructions.

The right side received its share of attention as well. The jack block was installed along with the two spare track runs at the front and rear of the fender. The sledge was glued into place and the head can be seen poking out towards the rear but that's it, the rest is hidden from view. The axe does a similar disappearing act at the front of the fender.

Last but not least, the spare track run of 7 links was added to the glacis and its retainer bar glued into place. I didn't notice until this pic that I hadn't painted the leather straps on the jack, will take care of that with tomorrow's activity.

Next up will be weathering the lower hull and getting the tracks on!

Total Session Time: 6.5 hours

Total Time to Date: 56.5 hours

wbill76 wrote:

Steve, appreciate the comments...but really, I have to ask, did you read my previous posts? I know you're on dial-up so may have skipped over some things, but sheesh you guys are hounding me needlessly (said with tongue firmly in cheek!)!  I said twice now and will say it a third time <sigh> because it's a Saturday...the interior isn't done and I'm going to weather it before installation...

Bill: I'm not on dial-up, but I don't have the internet at home (and probably never will be able to get a signal).  I use my local library and the signal is great!  My time is limited though because it's only open during business hours.  Therefore, it hard to read threads such as yours that get such huge responses in their entirety, like I would at night if I was at home.  My apologies for you having to repeat yourself.

the doog wrote:

WOW!---WAAAAAAAAAAY COOL paint, Bill! I love it! It's like a fishnet stocking......on a tank.......... My blood pressure just shot through the roof!

Down doog! Down boy! Thanks for the comments...as soon as I saw this one in the finishing guide options I knew it was going to be the "one". Just about got carpal tunnel though because of all the trigger action required to get it on...helps that it's a nice square surface for the most part.

WOW!---WAAAAAAAAAAY COOL paint, Bill!

I love it!

It's like a fishnet stocking......on a tank..........

My blood pressure just shot through the roof!

I had the day off today as part of an extended Easter weekend so decided to make the most of it. I added the missing details to the superstructure in the form of the antenna mount and base as well as the lower PE loops for the foul weather gear. The PE fret includes almost 2 full sets of loops so there's plenty of extras in case you lose some along the way. I added the loops using the reference photos in MBI since the kit instructions are somewhat vague on their actual placement. The loops were installed using a combination of CA gel applied to the PE parts as well as a small amount of liquid glue to the superstructure panel to insure a good solid join and also provide some flexibility/work-time although not much. I opted to leave the molded on top rectangular loops though as the PE items were too fragile and easily damaged when trying to remove them from the fret.

With that out of the way, I masked off the interior with blue painter's tape and it was off to the garage for some time with the airbrush.

I repeated the previous painting process for the interior, laying down a primer coat of Italian Dark Brown followed by a 50-50 base coat of Dunkelgelb/Light Gray. I decided to apply the camo pattern for a LAH vehicle at Kursk '43 and used Khaki for the olivegrun pattern. I sprayed the cross-hatched/web pattern free hand, starting on the left hand side and working my way around the superstructure, deliberately leaving the fenders out of the pattern. A light mist coat of the base coat mix was then sprayed back over it to tie everything together and provide a foundation for the weathering process.

The road wheels and return rollers were also detailed, their rubber portions were sprayed using Gunmetal and the hubs sprayed with the base coat mix using a circle template.

Total Session Time: 4.5 hours

Total Time to Date: 50.0 hours

Karl, thanks for the comments, I had a lot of fun working with the interior details, one of the advantages (or disadvantages depending on your outlook!) of working with an open-topped vehicle I suppose! I was puzzled as to why DML didn't include a decal for the firing table...usually they are pretty good about that sort of thing.

Terry, the Osprey book is pretty helpful in terms of showing the photos of what Gary did for his build. He produced a hybrid using a lot of different sources in styrene, PE, resin, etc. to produce his but it's still a great reference for details. Since it covers the Bison I, Bison II, the Pz III based sIG 33B, the Grille H, and Grille M it's a handy item to have around. Thanks for posting the detektorweb link, that's pretty cool!

Bill, thanks for the comments as well...lived in but not abused was what I was after. This one's going to be finished in a Kursk '43 scheme so wouldn't have been around too long at that point in time unlike, say, a Normandy vehicle.

Wow, Bill, that interior is really amazing, very lifelike  Edit: lived in, but not abused.  I guess it can't be lifelike) .  Nice save, or improvisation, or whatever to call it, with the ammo racks!

I like this one, too.

Bill 

Clickety... click......Bill

http://www.detektorweb.cz/index.4me?s=show&lang=1&i=3135&mm=2&xb=2&vd=1

Terry.

Well Bill it's obvious that you had a good session at the bench. Everything so far looks good. I'm interested in what you said about the Osprey by Gary Edmundson, think I'll order a copy in the morning.

As for the vehicle found in the river, I think I seen it on a Polish website called Deketorweb, a site dedicated to stuff found with metal detectors. The site has a large section on WWII stuff found including the now famous German T34.

Keep up the good work.

Terry.

Excellent, Bill!

That interior is looking pretty spiffy, and that's a GREAT piece of "inside information" about those two extra ammo racks there! The rest of it--all the wiring on the radios and all--looks great.

Don't you love adding firing table details? I put one in my Hummel, and it's just the coolest little detail!

Today was a very productive Easter Sunday although I will admit that some of the work in this update was actually accomplished yesterday!

In looking into the problem with the gun mount and the equilibrators, I came across a detail that Gary Edmundson had included in his build in the Osprey "Modelling the German 15cm Bison and Grille". That detail is the inclusion of two additional round racks in the floor area ahead of the rifle racks. This item doesn't show up in any of the interior photos in MBI and Spielberger because of angles but Gary mentions he used photos of a Grille recovered in Austria from the river Enns so I'm guessing that's where he got it from. It's not something mentioned in the DML instructions but additional ammo racks are available on the sprues, so I painted 2 up and stuck them into position. It makes sense to me that this space would be used for this since there's no radio operator and it's just dead space otherwise.

Returning to the left side, I installed the missing MP40 after test fits with the lower hull to get it in the correct position. The gunner's seat was also added and I scrounged a firing table decal from an unused set from the Bronco Marder I that I trimmed down to size and applied with Solvaset. Some weathering was added in the form of some Burnt Umber stippled in place for some scuff marks and then counter-stippled with the base coat color to break it up and provide some randomness. A pin wash of Raw Umber was also applied and then the base coat dry brushed over that to blend it back in where needed. A spray coat of Testors Lusterless Flat was applied to seal it all in prior to installation.

The same process was also applied to the right side.

I also assembled and installed the radio operator's chair and began the assembly of the fighting compartment. First up was the installation of the front plate. In order to achieve that, the gun travel lock needed to be installed and mated up with the latch on the interior through the little key-hole opening in the front plate. Once that had dried, I glued the front plate down with liquid glue and let it set up. I finally figured out what the pre-bent piece of steel wire that was provided as part MC-2 was for...it's supposed to represent the wiring conduit for the Notek light. I wrestled with it for a while trying to get it to fit into the proper position and finally gave up. Reference photos show it's supposed to hug the joint between the glacis and the superstructure front plate but the wire's too big for that to actually happen, so I left it off.

Now came the moment of truth, time to add the superstructure sides and the rear doors and central panel to create the fighting compartment. After much thought, I decided to mount the tools later as I'm worried that there's not enough clearance at the front for example to mount the wire cutters and sledge hammer as called for in the instructions. Rather than have them possibly interfere with the compartment sides, it was more important that they fit properly first and I'll worry about the tools later. Due to the way the end curved brace has to fit under the engine access hatches, it has to be slid into position first since it fits sort of like in a groove and then the sides slid into position. Can't do that if the tools or gear on the rear portions of the fenders are installed, so that too will come later. I added the left hand side first with regular glue for the joins along the sides and once that had started to set I used liquid glue and finger pressure for the joint with the front plate. The same process was then repeated with the right side and when both sides were solid, I added the hinge points and installed the rear doors and center panel. A very small amount of putty was needed at the join on the front right side near the base but otherwise everything went together smoothly.

Completing the effort for today, I detailed the gun breech using enamel Silver for the interior of the breech and the sliding block. The activation handle was painted with non-buffing metalizer Gunmetal and then dry brushed with steel as were the elevation wheels. The gun sight was also detailed and the eye piece drilled out with a pin vise. The interior portions of the gun were given a wash of Raw Umber and then dry brushed with the base coat. The contact rails for the recoil sled were painted with Steel for their bare metal look to round things out. The rest of the gun will be weathered along with the exterior when the time comes after it's been installed.

Total Session Time: 7.25 hours

Total Time to Date: 45.5 hours

Mike, I'm not quite sure why, but the MM enamel Russian Armor Green tends to have a slight sheen to it when it's brush painted. That will disappear when everything gets flat coated after weathering, so you're not seeing things there!

In regards to the equilibrator issue, it may be a case of some light at the end of the tunnel after all but for others, not necessarily for me. After some discussion on another forum it would appear that the parts that are on sprue C that are marked as "not for use"(C8 and C11 for the mount sides and C18 and C19 for the equilibrators) appear to be from the sIG 33 used on the Bision I kit. It would seem that those parts do have the right angle for the H-style mount or at least are a much closer approximation vs. the M-style mount. I can't validate this though as it's too late for me to tear things apart and try to use them given how far along I am at this point in the build and the damage that would likely result due to all the other small parts that would also have to be relocated. I can't say for sure if they'd still properly clear the rear bulkhead or not if used in place of the called for F46 and F47 parts, but it's a possible alternative for those to try who would like to add the missing platform.

wbill76 wrote:

redleg12 wrote: Bill - I love the wiring. I must admit, the rounds look a but "funky" in that color green. Good job with the copper color on the rotating band. Mike, appreciate the comments but something might be up with your monitor settings? The band you're seeing is actually the leather retaining straps and are a dark brown,  not copper, color.

Hummmm....thats what I get for looking at it without enough coffee. I did go back and (on a different monitor) look....the rounds are a bit shiny (could be the camera light) and the straps...still look like rotating bands (you know us artillery types, hard headed)...maybe dirty copper

As far as the equilibrator issue.... .

I know how you feel. Run into some of the same type on my current build. And like you I am stuck. It may not be a rivit counters dream but I'm sure you will make it a work of art.

If anyone goes near it with a ruler just grab it and break it....fun is the bottom line!!

Rounds Complete!! 

MR, Plan B is to install it as is and let it go...there's nothing I can do to correct it without a total replacement of the mount.

Terry, I recall the same thing...I had the original Kirin kit in the stash and sold it off when this new one was announced. In the package was an Eduard PE set (which includes the missing tread plate pieces) as well as a TMD resin sIG 33 and mount which would've addressed my problem there too...how ironic eh? Looking back over the instructions there's no other way DML could have done this with the parts they had available...so they in essence cheated. They reused the Grille M parts for the mount and turned a blind eye to the tread plate and the storage boxes that are supposed to be underneath it...because if those had been included in the design, the Grille M mount parts wouldn't work.

Eweee........

Bill I 'm going to get the instructions out as soon as I go upstairs. I'm only half grasping this problem. I can guess that you have thought through your options.

I guess its easier to understand with the kit at hand. Hope you sort something out.

I'm hearing what your saying in respect of the parts transplanted from the M chassis.

(Just trying to think back to the early nineties when the first issue of this subject was kitted by Dragon, what problems were abound at that time. I do remember that a lot of etch was produced at the time.)

Good luck.

Terry.

Pvt Mutt wrote:

Bill, I don't know how the gun and mount all goes together but could you file the bottom of the floor mount, more off the front tapered to the rear? That would kick up the rear and give you some more clearance for those cylinders.

Tony,

Unfortunately no. Doing that will alter the platform angle on which the actual gun mates up to the platform portion of the mount and then the gun won't sit level as a result. The difference in where the equilibrator ends should be vs. where they actually are is huge...about 1/4 inch or so. Short of having an actual all-new mount such as the one made by TMD (which I sold about a month ago! ), there's no solution using the DML parts to this problem.

panzerguy wrote:

Bill the radio set up looks great. Looking forward to seeing the interior weathered up.   Just one question, are you sure the fuses were silver and not more of a brass color?      Once again I'm a little (okay a lot) disappointed that DML couldn't take the time to produce the correct parts for the gun mount. Shame on them.

Steve, thanks for the comments! So far as I know, all German HE rounds were fused with steel caps and not brass but I could be wrong. All the artillery and AA rounds that I've seen at any rate had steel caps, so that's what I went with. I too am really disappointed at the short-cut DML took with the gun mount and instead chose to just reuse the M mounts. It doesn't stop the kit from being buildable but considering how highly anticipated this, of all the new 38t family was, it was one area they could've, and should've, taken the time to get right IMHO.

     Bill the radio set up looks great. Looking forward to seeing the interior weathered up.

  Just one question, are you sure the fuses were silver and not more of a brass color?

     Once again I'm a little (okay a lot) disappointed that DML couldn't take the time to produce the correct parts for the gun mount. Shame on them.

Bill, I don't know how the gun and mount all goes together but could you file the bottom of the floor mount, more off the front tapered to the rear? That would kick up the rear and give you some more clearance for those cylinders.

Just a thought                                                                                                              Tony the Mutt

I had finally decided after looking at reference photos that I was going to add the missing tread plate that the gun crew would've used as a platform. The tread plate can be clearly seen in both the MBI and Spielberger photos.

MBI: 

Spielberger:

In both photos you can see that the tread plate sits fairly high inside the lower hull, roughly flush with the curve over the bulkhead to the engine compartment on the MBI photo and about level with the drive shaft in the Speilberger photo. The Spielberger photo seems to have the simplified I-beam style of mount vs. the stepped style mount in the MBI photo, hence DML's option of mount types. I had used the stepped style so, in preparation for adding the tread plate, I did a dry fit of the gun mount and gun to see how things would line up using some poster blue tack to hold things in place.

I immediately noticed that something was wrong...the bases of the equilibrators were much lower than shown in either the
MBI or Spielberger photos. I compared the angles in the H mount vs. those in the M and it would appear that DML copied the angles from their earlier released M kit and didn't bother changing them for the H style mount which has a shallower angle configuration. This, to me, explains why there's no raised tread plate platform...if DML had included it, they would've had to change the angles on the equilibrators which would've required a totally new gun mount sprue. Instead, they stuck with the M style and omitted the plate. It also means that my plan to add the missing tread plate is now scrapped as it's impossible to change the angle on the equilibrators without completely replacing them due to the way they are integrated into the sides of the gun mount. That means I can't locate the plate at the correct height/level and throws everything off from an accuracy perspective and represents a substantial error on the interior IMHO.

redleg12 wrote:

Bill - I love the wiring. I must admit, the rounds look a but "funky" in that color green. Good job with the copper color on the rotating band.

Mike, appreciate the comments but something might be up with your monitor settings? The band you're seeing is actually the leather retaining straps and are a dark brown,  not copper, color.

Marc, I wish DML had provided the option for more of the racks to be posed empty...they only allow for a maximum of 4 straps in the PE set so you can leave one side or the other empty but not both. The horizontal rack is the best candidate for being empty...that one would've been even more of a nightmare to paint!

SMJmodeler wrote:

Bill: The devil's always in the details...YEP!!!  But definately well worth it in this case, exceptional work!  I'll third the motion on it being a bit clean, you could eat off that interior.  Seriously though, I know we differ in this departmnt, but she's even a bit clean for you.  Fantastic work Bill (William)...

Steve, appreciate the comments...but really, I have to ask, did you read my previous posts? I know you're on dial-up so may have skipped over some things, but sheesh you guys are hounding me needlessly (said with tongue firmly in cheek!)!  I said twice now and will say it a third time <sigh> because it's a Saturday...the interior isn't done and I'm going to weather it before installation...in fact, that's what is on the agenda for today, have no fear! I'm actually debating whether or not to add in the missing treadplate for the interior, it's starting to aggravate me to no end the more I look at the interior reference photos that DML didn't provide for this. Even though I said this one was going to be straight OOB, I think I'll head down to my LHS and pick up some patterned sheet styrene and start messing around with it to see if I can make it work...that would be a "scratch built" item and still within the spirit of not using any AM on this one I think.