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12.8 cm Waffentrager--FINISHED PICS

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  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Saturday, February 11, 2012 9:09 AM

Hehe.... Bill said 'ergo'.... Geeked

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, February 12, 2012 12:38 PM

Thanks, guys---sorry it's taken a while to get back here--I've been a bit busy with these damned tracks! Angry

Ben--remember the advice I gave you--don't limit yourself to any one kind of paint; I use enamels as well for things like washes, details, metallic colors, etc--don't get stuck in a "one paint rut". I'm glad that you got some ideas for your Tiger wheels--I"m going to bop over to your thread after this and offer some advice....

Eric and Jon--I hope that you find something to help you improve your modeling as well here in this WIP. If I can offer any one-on-one advice, don't be afraid to PM me! Thanks for looking in!

Boyd-- You asked about the filters: "I am curious if you gave any time to dry between the layers or did you lay them on in pretty rapid succession?" --a great question, and one that deserves an answer.

When I do this kind of finish, I almost always mix the color either "on the brush" or "on the model". In other words, I just keep adding colors constantly, in rapid succession, not worrying too much about "bleed" or contamination of other colors. That aids in the blending of the colors. If one color tints or occludes another too much, I"ll just add in a little more of the original color until it looks right. At SOME point I"ll step back, let the whole thing dry and have a look at it the next day, and then add what I think needs more attention. I'm at this phase now--and you'll see in the next update what Ive done to bring out the divisions and delineations of individual hatches and panels. Smile

Bill -- Bill, I have to say that I thank you sincerely for your in-depth and encyclopedic-knowledge upon which I can always rely to give a clear and thorough answer to the most obscure and trivial questions regarding armor specifications and peculiarities! In this case, regarding the barrel/muzzle brake painting conundrum, I have to tend to agree with your point of view as far as the historical accuracy and the probability that the muzzle brake was indeed painted in dark grey lacquer to match the barrel. I've seen a picture or two which seems to back this up, and I think that it's probably the way that it should be portrayed.

However...Whistling

I've done a lot of thinking, and went back-n-forth on the question, and even the painting itself, and I think that for purely artistic reasons, I'm going to go with the PLAIN DY coat. I've often said that I choose "artistic" over "dead-on accurate" for .....uh, "artistic" (D'uh?!) reasons Embarrassed and perhaps in any other case I would not be moved in that direction with this piece but for the fact that I could theorize that the shortage of metal and possible chaotic conditions in the spring of '45 would have made it possible to have them re-use the muzzle brake because of supply shortage problems?

In any case, I did a "mock up" of the gun with the dark Grey painting, and it seemed to lack the visual interest of the DY coat. But in any case, the information you provided is great stuff to have in the thread for others' future reference, and was helpful in sorting through my mental processes (which, believe me, is hard enough as it is! Propeller) to make a decision! Thanks again for taking the time to add to this thread's body of knowledge, and to further enlighten me! Big Smile

Steve--thanks, too, buddy! Hey, you got any snow over there in the mountains? Indifferent

Update on the tracks and weathering coming later today!

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Building models on my kitchen counter top~somewhere in North Carolina
Posted by disastermaster on Sunday, February 12, 2012 3:54 PM

Yeah doog, in the mountains....... http://th717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Winter/th_1lg090yodel.gif

........meanwhile, 35° here.

All we get here is http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz200/pepper2010_bucket/rainy_cloud.gif in Randolph county and crazy weather every other day.

On the kitchen counter somewhere in North Carolina

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Sunday, February 12, 2012 6:47 PM

Karl - You are back and better than ever with your toots. From the US side...the muzzle brake is a separate part which screws into the barrel.

It is nice to have you back.

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Sunday, February 12, 2012 7:56 PM

My pleasure Karl, glad to be of assistance. Beer

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, February 12, 2012 8:39 PM

disastermaster

Yeah doog, in the mountains....... http://th717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Winter/th_1lg090yodel.gif

........meanwhile, 35° here.

All we get here is http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz200/pepper2010_bucket/rainy_cloud.gif in Randolph county and crazy weather every other day.

UGH! BOOOOOO!!!

I shouldn't complain--I have to go up to NY next week, and I"m dreading going back to the slush and the mush and the snow and the cold!

I hope I can get this baby done by then! Big Smile

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, February 12, 2012 8:41 PM

redleg12

Karl - You are back and better than ever with your toots. From the US side...the muzzle brake is a separate part which screws into the barrel.

It is nice to have you back.

Rounds Complete!!

Thanks, Mike! Good to be back! Thanks for the info on US Armor, too! You'd be the man to know about that here--especially US Artillery!

Big Smile

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, February 12, 2012 9:02 PM

OK, here's the next update...

I started adding in the next layer of weathering; pigments. I used "concrete" for the most part, laying the pigments down and then rubbing them in with a brush.

I then used MIG's "Thinner for Washes", dropping it over the whole area. I used "T.f.W" because I wanted to have the pigments be still movable, for modifications' sake.

The problem then, as I saw it, was that the pigments left the whole hull rather ..... dull? Too much dust and not enough distinction on the hatches, lines, etc. So I first took some straight Black oils, and added some judicious pin washes in the lines...then, I got my "three grades of Primer Red" here, and ....

..and I started defining the hatches and adding different shades of red to define the hatches...I"d add the paint with one brush...

...and then use another larger brush to blend it in and disperse the degree of color...

Note the subtle shaded differences here on the hull now. You can see the pin washes in the creases, and the different tones of red. I'll have to lighten up that one small hatch...

After I add a little more pigments, the look should be complete.

Now the second issue........Angry..........the tracks....Devil

I have to be honest--I don't care for the MK-style tracks. They're just too much work, and I can't see any appreciable advantage to having "workable" tracks. It's not like I"m going to play with the model?! I looked at wbill's tips on making the sections on the supplied jig, but I just though that it took so freakin' long, and I wasn't convinced that the tracks would be strong enough to go through what I knew I was going to put them through with finished.

So, the heck with it--I laid 'em down and glued em in the "normal way" that I do them--WITHOUT those darned track pins! (I'll add them later!)

I gave them a half-hour to set, and put them on the model, adding in "sag" with some tissue paper balls.

Eventually I added in the track pins with regular glue--what you see are those little "bullets" Whistling that are attached to the track pins. They just get cut off in a moment.....this seems to have strengthened the tracks pretty well. They're off the model right now and ready fr painting tomorrow...

That's it for now! We're almost in the home stretch! I still have to detail the gun ,and do some chipping and whatnot. And paint the figures...

Comments always welcomed, once again! Thanks for looking in, and following, guys! Big Smile

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Sunday, February 12, 2012 9:11 PM

Karl - I have almost given up on plastic indy tracks myself....love the metal but even still they are a PITA. Now I do like the tampon sag method....definitely different. 

I see you are pinned so I will let you go  Wink

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Building models on my kitchen counter top~somewhere in North Carolina
Posted by disastermaster on Monday, February 13, 2012 12:57 AM

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u244/heydoog/w10.jpg

HEh, HE,

http://www.emofaces.com/en/emoticons/c/cut-shaving-emoticon.gif  Looks like 'ya been shavin'.........

In a good way of course.

On the kitchen counter somewhere in North Carolina

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Monday, February 13, 2012 5:21 AM

disastermaster

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u244/heydoog/w10.jpg

I take the road wheels are loose as the third and second from last are outside the guide horns?

Looks good Doog, a bit heavy on the weathering and effects for my taste yet your 'artistic merit' in painting hits the Reich Mark at the finish.

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 13, 2012 7:20 AM

the doog

 I'm going to go with the PLAIN DY coat. I've often said that I choose "artistic" over "dead-on accurate" for .....uh, "artistic" (D'uh?!) reasons Embarrassed. ..

Aha!  That's where I was trying to get you in the first place....looks absolutely stunning!!!

  • Member since
    April 2009
  • From: Carmel, IN
Posted by deafpanzer on Monday, February 13, 2012 9:39 AM

I am really digging step-by-step thread... thank you for doing this.  I smell a great article in future FSM issue.  

Everything looks great! Yes  May be too much for some but for me I think its perfect... Third Reich is near its end and those white rags will come very handily for surrendering. 

Andy

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Monday, February 13, 2012 9:42 AM

great work,and great tutorial,very easy to follow your processes,thanks Karl

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Building models on my kitchen counter top~somewhere in North Carolina
Posted by disastermaster on Monday, February 13, 2012 1:59 PM

deafpanzer

Third Reich is near its end and those white rags will come very handily for surrendering. 

1hi5Laugh1http://th1046.photobucket.com/albums/b461/timetraveller1992/Smiley/th_LMAO.gif

Aw man, that was good..........

On the kitchen counter somewhere in North Carolina

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Monday, February 13, 2012 4:27 PM

Looking good Karl! Definitely like the varied look that the additional pin washes and such achieved.

Sorry to hear the tracks defeated you in terms of making them workable...but you found the "Plan B" option that's always there with styrene workables. Big Smile

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Friday, February 17, 2012 7:54 PM

Thanks guys--I'm sorry I haven't replied, but I've been trying to get the last of this build done, and to document it all before I have to head north to NY on Monday. I'm happy to say that I've got 'er done now, and will present the final pics shortly!

Thanks, Mike, Steve, and SuppressionFire for comments! And SF--a good eye! I didn't notice the road wheels outside the guide horns on that photo, but yes, the wheels were loose, and came off the tracks when I was moving it around for photos. Mike--the "tampon method"--LMAO!

Manny--I appreciate your perspective on this build. I'm happy where it wound up with the gun barrel and brake!

Eric--yeah, I'll probably be writing this up for an article. Heck, it's such a new kit that I hope that FSM will bite on it!

Thanks, too, Tojo!!

Bill--I have to say, I give you credit for your skill with those tracks! I guess I"m just used to my "usual" method, but then, aren't we all? Smile Thanks for mentioning the varied panels--you ought to try it too on a future build; it's nice how it breaks up the monotony of the one color hull.

And now----the last installment of the WIP tutorial, and then the finished pics!  Stick out tongue

The tracks were first primed with Tamiya grey primer, and then a light overspray of brown added. I then ised a brown mix of oils--raw umber, MIG Gray, and Black in varying amounts--to coat the tracks in oil paint.

Now, I used MIG's 039 Industrial City Dirt to coat the still-wet tracks.

As soon as I was finished coating the tracks, I used my finger to scrape off the pigments from the tops of the track bars, and set them aside to dry. When they had dried, I drybrushed the bare tops of the tracks with metallic grey and then even more lightly in silver. The hull then got the same trearment with the same pigments. I added some MIG Dry Mud to both the completed tracks and the hull bottom, for variety of color tone.

Somebody was asking me how to get metallic chips and "lowlights"--Hinsky? Anyhoo, here's what I use--Testor's enamel "Rubber", plus Silver, plus some oils--ram umber, Black, etc. Mix them up on a flat brush, and then dab most of it off on a paper card...

Here I"m chipping the gun trunions and assembly. (I DID clean up that recoil absorber tube...Wink)

I use the flat side of the brush to "drybrush" the sides and tops of the model. Just drop and drag the flat part of the brush against the edges.

The rest of the build was in small detail painting--adding dirt pigments to the rear spades, touching up some oil stains and some "wet effects" in the rear fighting compartment, rusting the front spare tracks with pigments and oils, painting tools...

And now, the finished build.... 12.8 cm Waffentrager!

You can see some of the "Wet effects" here in the rear...I didn't put in the shells yet, which would have been stowed under the gun base. I'll put them in when I finally get the figures painted.

And some close-ups.

I imagined the spare tracks rack to have been a field mod, ergo, rusty.

The tools were painted black, with careful drybrushing of silver. The handles were painted craft store acrylic tan+white, and washed with gray oil and then some raw sienna.

The muffler was rusted using pigments and oils.

The wheels have some MIG "Grease and Oil" mix on the hubs of some of the wheels. Note too that te guide horns are silvered, as they would contact the inside of the idlers.

And that's it, guys. Smile

Thanks to everyone who has followed this build, and taken the time to comment, critique, or send a kind compliment! I appreciate each and every comment, and in many cases, you've helped me in this build with information or suggestions that have only helped to improve the end results. I hope you've enjoyed the WIP and got some inspiration to try something different in your own modeling!  Big Smile

Karl the doog.



 

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Friday, February 17, 2012 8:12 PM

'August 1945, the last days of the third Reich'

'This 12.8cm Waffentrager survived against all odds and fell into Russian hands after the last 128mm shell had been fired. After almost four months the battle of Berlin is finally over. This prototype weapon is the ultimate example of German engineering keeping pace to meet practical military needs utilizing existing designs. Obsolete at the start of the war the Czechoslovakian 38(t)  was the base of various weapons and transport vehicles, although hard to recognize under the massive cannon this represents its final configuration.'

Dig it Doog!Yes

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    August 2008
  • From: S.W. Missouri
Posted by Pvt Mutt on Friday, February 17, 2012 10:17 PM

Karl that is one of if not the best you've done since i've known you.

I am thunder struck at the effects you created with this.

Just Outstanding SirYesStarStarStarStarStar

Tony lee

Shoot Low Boys They're Ridin Ponys

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Building models on my kitchen counter top~somewhere in North Carolina
Posted by disastermaster on Saturday, February 18, 2012 12:46 AM

 Another build blessed by the hand of the ultimate

spruefinger......

                     http://multiply.com/mu/tompremo/image/10/photos/35/1200x120/299/Smiley-Football.gif?et=EBMqeGrtSrQdFvfiPc4b5A&nmid=65449655

http://multiply.com/mu/tompremo/image/4/photos/35/1200x120/240/drunk.gif?et=uVtzJSpHVUKDCet8Jy%2BLug&nmid=65449655

In my opinion, it is just faultless.

  Looks like doog has cornered another one there.....                                    http://th07.deviantart.net/fs71/150/i/2011/272/1/d/drooling_over_by_bullpoopsniperrifle-d4b9ldw.jpg

On the kitchen counter somewhere in North Carolina

  • Member since
    September 2009
  • From: Rugby, England
Posted by Hinksy on Saturday, February 18, 2012 6:38 AM

Hey Karl,

Superb work my friend. The effects are just mind-blowing and what an amazing machine! I love that huge 'pepperpot' muzzle brake.

Are we going to see it on a base with figures? I know you mentioned figures- or are they going to be standing on this thing with a few stonking great 12.8mm shells/shell cases littered about the place? That would work perfectly!

I see it's in 'travel mode' - that travel lock support for the barrel looks nowhere near substantial enough to support that massive tube!

Brilliant work - I am in AWE! SurpriseWow Bow Down

Keep photos coming!

Are the tracks kit tracks-they look GREAT? Lovely sag! Sorry if you have already mentioned this somewhere dude but I can't find it if you have.

All the best,

Ben Toast

On the Bench - Dragon Pz. IV Ausf. G (L.A.H.) Yes

Your image is loading...

 

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Saturday, February 18, 2012 10:37 AM

Karl - As usual a masterful finish. You toots are outstanding. I love the look of the model....it is such a mix of effects. The oil stains are a standout.

In general...another masterpiece....fantastic

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Saturday, February 18, 2012 1:45 PM

It really is the weathering that separates the men from the boys. That's why I will always remain in the little boy's corner of the room, because I'm more conservative.

Outlandish subject taken to another level.  Bravo, well done sir.

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Saturday, February 18, 2012 2:33 PM

Wow, man...that is a seriously sweet build. Superb weathering as usual!

(PM still forthcoming, sir)

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Saturday, February 18, 2012 5:32 PM

Ditto to what the others have said Karl, very nice work on this one and fun to watch it come together. Adding figs and a base will give it all context and add to the finished product I'm sure! Yes

My only small comment would be to tone down the bright orange on the exhaust pipe a bit and darken the mouth with some black pigment or similar...just to give it the look that it's been in use and rumbling about looking for something to destroy with that huge gun. Wink

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • From: Cygnus X-1
Posted by ogrejohn on Sunday, February 19, 2012 3:22 AM

Absolutely beautiful work Karl! 

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, February 19, 2012 2:07 PM

Once again, thanks sincerely, guys, for the kind and generous comments! Smile I can't tell you how good it was/is to get "back in the groove" and start modeling Armor again!

SuppresionFire--that was a cool little paragraph you posted. Thanks again for following this build and weighing in!

Tony--wow, that's high praise from one of the most consistent and talented modelers here! Thank you so much for putting a smile on my face! Big Smile

Steve--and I should say the same to you; I"m waiting for your next masterpiece to see what you teach us all about weathering "to the extreme". Thanks, buddy--I genuinely appreciate your comment--and you smileys!

Ben--yup, those are the kit tracks. I managed to get them together with a little help from my friends--uh, wbill76's blogs on his site in particular! Yes Thanks for following and commenting! Unfortunately, although this would look great in a dio, space considerations prevents that at the time. I've been running out of display room for the last two years or so, and I"m at the point of storing some completed models at Jenn's mom's house!

Mike, thanks so kindly as well. My head's going to need a "pop" with all these great modelers here giving me such generous comments!  Embarrassed (I think you know that won't happen!)  Wink

Tigerman--"ditto" as well. Thanks for such a generous comment!

And thanks too, dupes! (Still waiting on that PM if you get the chance? Wink) Take your time though; I'll be right here!

Bill--good call on that muffler pipe! I'll see to that! As I said to Ben, a dio base would look cool, but I'm just not finding the room lately! Maybe a vignette base in the future might work? And abandoned Waffentrager with some Russian soldiers might be pretty keen? Thanks again for the comments, and for your wealth of advice and info on this build!

John--thanks buddy! Glad to see that you're still around here! Big Smile

Big Smile Thanks again, guys!!

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 20, 2012 1:19 PM

Wow...extremely nice outcome on this ***'...

Well my first test for all armor is tho ask the question, "Does it LOOK heavy?"  And the answer is a BIG, HECK YES!...partularly nice work with those tracks...this thing wins in all areas...if you decide to show it I predict that it will get a LOT of attention...

YesLIKE!

  • Member since
    November 2004
  • From: Essex England
Posted by spacepacker on Monday, February 20, 2012 3:37 PM

Oh dear, I'm "gobsmacked" again,YesYesYes...cheers....Kenny

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Building models on my kitchen counter top~somewhere in North Carolina
Posted by disastermaster on Tuesday, February 21, 2012 1:59 PM

Hey guys ..... 

   look here......

     doog got a tattoo!

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s320x320/405410_10150567043483208_45564118207_8984233_1984901030_n.jpg

Just HAD to put that one up.

On the kitchen counter somewhere in North Carolina

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