Castles of Steel, 1880 - 1914 *Group Build* (pg 17)...

i think gmm is reasonably priced. will hold off on wem pe for dreadnought and see who else comes out. i have some kits that all i really need is generic railings and ladders. hope to get to BORODINO and MARKGRAF by the end of the week. looks like a simultaneous build along with 30min or so a day on 1/35 MAS boat until it is done.

fermis

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Manstein's revenge

 

fermis:

Wow, those screws look odd...???

 

Kudos to Bronco for getting them "handed".

Does anyone have any info on the draft markings? I wonder if they would be Roman, or Chinese?

I'm glad I do not have to make graphics for decals for those on Borodino.  If i remember the conventions properly, the draft markings are half  a unit measured tall.  So, in feet measure, 6" tall.  So, under that "swoop" some of those letters are likely 15-16" "tall" to fall between 6" (or half-meter) WL.

...ummmmmmm...did a few pages just get deleted from this thread???

Manstein's revenge

...ummmmmmm...did a few pages just get deleted from this thread???

Yep. They were off topic and non-modeling related.

Aaron

Aaron Skinner

Manstein's revenge:

...ummmmmmm...did a few pages just get deleted from this thread???

 

Yep. They were off topic and non-modeling related.

Aaron

*bump*

ouch... !

I havn't started yet.. still trying to finish up my final 3... grrr...

Stalled rigging Emden, need to repaint the red on the fortune cookie, just bought a Varyag.

I know, excuses excuses....

This GB otta be called "really stacked"!

Wow, did Fermis scare ya'll landlubbers off?

I'm recovering from my bout with the Ukrainain shipyard that made the components for my Konig. I am resting by trying some advanced weathering on an ancient Arii (Otaki) P-47D - my first serious model of an American subject I may add. Spending so long fighting Konig did shake the brain a little. Now it's very confusing to have the pieces fit together. Going to forgot how to use the sander if the parts are too accurate and the plastic more or less sound - fortunately the are enough gaps in a circa 1970 kit to let me expand techniques toward filler. I'm still looking for the perfect paint and am using artist acrylics on this (mostly Golden but also a great Canadian brand called TriArt.) After learning that in the art world there is white for mixing (zinc being the pigment) with low opacity and white for actually coloring (with Titanium and high opacity), I've stumbled on the best white I've ever used on a plastic. Might be worth reconsidering how to approach Oregon. I still may put her in Santiago war paint (the ship sailed almost as far to Cuba as the Baltic fleet did to Tsushima - and didn't get sunk doing it - a startling feat at the time) but was in wartime grey. But I want to do one of my oldies in peacetime rig. Thought that would be Mikasa with its sweet black, now I'm sorely tempted to assemble a member of the Great White Fleet. We'll see. But we'll try the acrylics on a ship regardless. The Triart neutral grey looks a really good USN color with a tad of lightening and both Golden and Triart make a great buff or concrete that would be great for a deck. (Will have to check into that: I think the WWII USN greys had a bit of blue in them - haze grey especially.)

Eric 

EBergerud

I think the WWII USN greys had a bit of blue in them - haze grey especially

Up until 1945 yes - in February of that year new formulas were released that were neutral, so there was a purple/blue haze gray from 1941 until 1945 and then a neutral Haze gray from 1945 until today.

time to jump into this. building alanger 1/400 ST PANTELIMON as a practice piece, zvezda 1/350 BORODINO and, icm 1/350 MARKGRAF. stacks, gun turrets, and hulls are just about ready to prime. lots of boats. all the port holes on all 3 are drilled out. ST PANTELIMON is somewhat rough. i replaced all the kit secondary barrels with brass or styrene. probably have to replace some mast parts too. injection marks go through the wood grain on the decks and some of the canvas shields look like they would stop a 305mm round.

i know the 2 russian ships were black but will probably use a dark grey. have various stuff for rigging and stack stays so will see what works best. i do have a 3x5 russian flag to use as a backdrop when they are done (plus maybe VARYAG and KNYAZ SUVOROV). have gmm for BORODINO/VARYAG and a generic 1/450 merchant ship set for ST PANTELIMON.

the bases are 2x2 scrap wood from home depot and will be replaced with nice bases when done. decided to epoxy the nut inside the hull to have more flexibility with final mounting height and base thickness.

waynec

time to jump into this. building alanger 1/400 ST PANTELIMON as a practice piece, zvezda 1/350 BORODINO and, icm 1/350 MARKGRAF. stacks, gun turrets, and hulls are just about ready to prime. lots of boats. all the port holes on all 3 are drilled out. ST PANTELIMON is somewhat rough. i replaced all the kit secondary barrels with brass or styrene. probably have to replace some mast parts too. injection marks go through the wood grain on the decks and some of the canvas sheilds look like they would stop a 305mm round.

i know the 2 russian ships were black but will probably use a dark grey. have various stuff for rigging and stack stays so will see what works best. i do have a 3x5 russian flag to use as a backdrop when they are done (plus maybe VARYAG and KNYAZ SUVOROV). have gmm for BORODINO/VARYAG and a generic 1/40 merchant ship set for ST PANTELIMON.

the bases are 2x2 scrap wood from home depot and will be replaced with nice bases when done. decided to epoxy the nut inside the hull to have more flexibility with final mounting height and base thickness.

not sure what is going on with aft superstructure fit. it is so off it looks like it is designed that way. well now there are a couple of little decks as you will see in the photos. got the decks down. they fit tight with some gaps. the edges going into the superstructure needed some work. kraxy kat cya w/ the brush and accelerator are your friends in a time like this. that and knowing i am probably more knowledgeable of russian predreadnoughts than 99.9% of folks in colorado so many faults will go unnoticed if the building and painting is skillful. it's warm here today so i can prime the hull and decks in the garage. acrylis are fine in the basement but enamels tend to get strong.

the decks. after i fixed the missing rudder half, jazzed it up and put it on, i found the iother half (which is in the middle of the hull.stern deck with the "new hatches" and new decks.

the gaps are filled with dry whiye glue which is why they still look gapped. primer will tell if this was successful. it works well on angles like the seam between a tank hull and fender where it is hard to sand. the white squares are "new hatches" to cover some injection marks that wold cause more damage to fix than hide. some will be hidden under the boats or the gun turrets. i also need to fill the bottom gap with the bulkhead and deck since the bulkhead was VERY warped in 4 dimensions. told you it was VERY warped. again cya and accelerator. the bulkheads will be painted dark grey so the fill pieces will blend into the shadows. for consistency i did all sides fore and aft.

in order to trace the shap i needed to fill the gaps (the 2 flat white pieces on the stern superstructure) i put an led flashlight in the hull and was able to trace ove a 3x5 card. that worked great for the edge but, due to some steps i had to really trim the backs.

thought i would jazz up the boats and steam launches a bit. these are a tad rough too. after this BORODINO will seem like a dream and HIKAWA MARU  will be like heaven. glad i have a BORODINO becuse the instructions for the masts are a bit vague.

apologies for my verbosity.

Looking like you're making some real progress here...

You're a braver sailor than I. I've read that the early generation 1905 Zevezda ships are all a handful: might explain why Borodino is available for under $30. As I found out the hard way, every ugly warning that was circulating about Konig was true and then some. I once put together a Soviet era plane - it was absolutely amazing. The plastic felt like soap, nothing fit, nothing like pegs and holes (probably for the best - they wouldn't have worked anyway) etc. Yet it was a popular hobby in the bad old days on the wrong side of the Berlin wall. Probably because it was relatively cheap. Anyway, their market expected crummy kits - things much cruder than 60s era US-UK stuff that was none too sweet either. When I did my first Zevezda tank, (IS-152)  a recent vintage and not a bad build really, the tracks were almost laughable. No problem, I hit it with a ton of mud. But Konig, put out by Ukrainian ICM in 2000, was a thing to marvel at. The superstructure was simply out of whack. The slots provided to guide complex build-up ended up in the ashcan of history and I eyeballed almost everything. (A perfect example of a model maker trying to add complexity without the precision to back it up. I would have been much better off working with fewer and larger parts. The ancient Revell (or whatever) DE England has 100 parts at 225 scale, so it could be done.)

But after you hack away long enough and employ a bucket of filler (still have to pump Aves Apoxie Sculpt for any gap that Mr Surfacer can't handle: it's so benign that if you make a mistake is actually pretty easy to peel off with no harm done) you will get done and the ship will look neat. (I assume you'll be scratch-building topmasts: Konig's wouldn't have supported rigging thicker than a spider web, and I can't train spiders.) I know that some really good modelers almost relish this kind of build. (There are some great Borodinos over at ModelWarship.com. At least one explains the surgery the modeler decided to use. A lot of purists on that site.) You do learn about basic scratch building no error whether you want to or not. For this build I'm taking on the Glencoe Oregon: haven't a clue who built it originally: it's early 60s though. So I know to be ready for damage control. But the part count is one third Konig's and quantity does change quality.

Still looking good though. And I'll root for you. But I won't be building Borodino. 

Eric

Speaking of Oregon, if anyone out there is considering Olympia, Tom's makes a joint Olympia/Oregon PE set because the two came out together sometime around the Cuban Missile Crisis. If anyone wants to go halves on a set let me know: I think the chances are somewhat less than zero I'll ever work in 225 scale again.

Eric

I have both the Olympia and the tom's PE.. and it does do both,, it does either.. if I have some left over, you're welcome to it.. I am building the Olympia Casles Gb.. just havnt started yet..

oops... not both... it will do either..

here is the latest. took y=the base off to prime and there is enough cleanup work to put the base back on and stick it in the vise. i will do this for all future ship models. MY MISTAKE, THE BASE IS 3/4" X 3/4" NOT 2"X2". must gace gad 2s on my mind. everyrging is just set on there. notes to date. i think all the yards are goung to be brass wire and i have to figur out how to secure the mast to the ship in a more solid way. might mean cya a plastic rod and somehow cya that through the deck to the bottom of the hull. tried hiding sink marks inside the boats with mr surfacer but that didn't go well and the squares are too obvious so will ponder that. the hull turned out nice and the deck fit isn't great but not as bad. i fear the tan wood deck will show up "missing" planks. given i am painting the hull dark gray or black, i will paint the decks first and mask them off for the superstructure. btw not everything in the pics is primed or glued on.

might be time to pull out ZRZ-99 chinese mbt and do something easy relative to this like building the indy tracks. actually i think with effort this will look nice on the shelf and will be good practice. of course if thety have a dumb asses who enter 50 year old models in contests and expect to place catagory i'm all set.

nice Wayne...

I don't plan to start until early spring when we make the trek to St. Paul. If possible, keep me in mind after you start. It would be nice to have railings. If not, I'll try to do some scratch building. Chat over at ModelShip is that both Oregon and Olympia are pretty decent efforts despite their age.

Eirc

thank you. definitely a 3 footer. i used my microchisel to fet the medal deck edge closer to the deck height in some spots. have to be slow and careful but with some sanding will be good enough for this model. if you recall the boat pics i had white plasticd covering the sink marks. that didn't work but i was able to chisel them out using micro chisel, xacto, and, surprisingly, my pointu axacto hole punch. i obviouslt floode the area with enough plastic glue that something melted into the holes. my question is

what does anyone suggest to "fill in" the roughness without having to sand. i'm thinking judicious use of mr surfacer 1200, maybe rhinning my 3m red body putty w/ acetone or maybe a drop of thin cya and just let it flow and fill. on these ships the boats capture a lot of attention. this one has 10 4 of which are rather crude plus 4 steam launches which turned out quite nice. they woill be painted hull color plus waterline. the other boats are shown hull color but i may paint them light grey with brown seats which will show up the marks more. now to fix my steam launched on BORODINO which i have screwed up.

another question. obviously the flying bridge railings look like 3 " armor thickness. any suggestions on thinning them. i'm not thinning the same on the boat deck because they don'y look too bad but i may have to trace out the bridges and make a new one. probably plastic with the "railing" in brass.

i think GMM has a set for oregon and olympia.

Is Borodino an old kit? Hadn't dawned on me it might be a rebox although I know Zvezda does it. I got the IPMS journal with photos of all of the category champs from their last national show (winning Flak Panzer is an absolute jaw dropper) and it's startling how many categories they have. Didn't see anything for Eastern European antiques though. Maybe it goes under the scratch build category.

Been going through the ShipModeler to check scratch railings. Did see one really neat idea. Some gent downloaded the plans for a 1/96 free turn of the century British armed river boat. It's from a place that provides plans etc for card modelers. He used the plan for a scratch-built plastic kit. Hasegawa it isn't but it is very neat and looks like a mortal could handle it.

So the PE was either/or? Knew it was too good to be true. There are generic railings for 1/192 but they're not cheap. We'll see, maybe just get the PE.

Eric 

EBergerud

Is So the PE was either/or? Knew it was too good to be true. There are generic railings for 1/192 but they're not cheap. We'll see, maybe just get the PE.

Eric 

it Says it will work on either ship, just not both together.. if thats not true, when I'm done, ur welcome to what ever is left over...

The Borodino is a reissue of an Eastern Express kit.

Wayne that's a real eye opener, what an unusual subject. I would get rid of those bridge railings. Unless they are rows of sandbags, which was not uncommon; but probably not here. My choice for this, and I'd replace the fighting tops too, is sheet brass. Look though your PE fret supply, because the borders of those things usually yield a number of inches of brass.

compared to my alanger kit it looks new. haven't gotten far enough along on her or MARKGRAF to address the fir issues. the deck sits on the hull nice on both so the only "serious" issue is the superstucture that holds the raised forecastle as it projects over the lower deck. DREADNOUGHT looks ok.

nationals was a hoot. 2013 is up the road so i will be stating big cased models in miscellaneous and submarines. not even going to compete in cars, tanks, planes, figures, or sci-fi. obviously that still leaves a lot.

i laid out a pe set of reailings for a friend. i think they were 1/192, not sure since it was a wooden scratchbuild and they scale differently ie 3/16", quarter scale most of which i habe never figured out. he gave me dimensions and i created the artwork and we had it printed in cal. think it was $275 for a 12" long, not sure how wide, sheet. and that didn't include graphics since he is a club member and we swap experience. the GMM set has a twofer BORODINO and VARYAG. yes i have a couple of them and all 3 BORODINOs. and an old soviet kit (probably a pyro) of a 1/110 or /144 lightship. i will scratch build railings for her bit it's all straight lines. guess i'm just a glutton for punishment.