PT-109

Hippy-Ed wrote:

Rob J wrote: Id love to order online but im only 16 so I need to use my dads credit card to order and he thinks that everything on the internet is a scam. Hey Rob, tell your dad here's the ph# and he can place the order himself 972-242-8663 (8:30am-5:30pm CST M-Sat)  Revell RM0310  1/72 PT-109    $13.96 Revell of Germany RG5048 Torpedo Boat PT-117    $11.46  (same class as PT-109 plus, has 4 figures) hth Eddie

Ha Now can call and bug the holy out of ya LOLJust kidding ED

Steel Panther wrote:

Hi guys Ive been checking all the PT boat questions,I just completed a 2 year build on a 1/20 scale elco,the 159 boat which led the rescue of the 109 crew. Mosquito boat hobbies.com is a great web site for kits,parts and links. the engines are a marine V12......I will post some pics soon, PS the decks on the elco boats were so perfect planking is not visable even on 1/20 scale boats...........have a good one...........Alan

Rob J wrote:

Id love to order online but im only 16 so I need to use my dads credit card to order and he thinks that everything on the internet is a scam.

EdGrune wrote:

Some of these have been reproduced in smaller format in Victor Chun's book 'American PT Boats in WWII' .   They are smaller, and all the information you may need are not there.  The popular-press books do not cover the kind of internal details you seek. BTW -- the aftermarket resin Packard engines sold for aircraft models are not directly applicable for those used on PT boats. You must really see the White Ensign photoetched detail set for the PT-109.  Many of the clunky details from the Revell kit are replaced with this kit.   They also make a mor accurate 37mm anti-tank gun which the PT-109 carried at the time of her loss.   Much better than the Hasegawa gun which has been used by may others previously. Colors - basically semigloss white interior and a locally brewed MTB green over a Copperoid bottom.  White Ensign makes the correct green.  Copperoid was a redish/orange   primer-like color

EdGrune, I just ordered the Victor Chun's book along with the WEM PE sets this evening. I'm looking foreward to their arrival Just wanted to let you know. Thanks

EdGrune wrote:

10 thou Evergreen would be about 3/4 inch in 1:72 scale (72 x 0.010).    Thirty thou would be about 2 inches.   I think I'd lay in a supply of 30 thou stock for the structural members and use the 10 thou for the sheathing.

Don't use 5-N Navy Green for the 109 as-lost. She was most likely in a local home-brew paint that came to be known as Tropical Green. We've got it as accurately matched as possible in our Colourcoats enamels, item US 29.

Cheers,

John Snyder, White Ensign Models, http://WhiteEnsignModels.com

Chun's book has some interior drawings.  If you go to ebay you will find the book without any problem. 

I would contact PT Boats Inc.  They have a list of drawings you can purchase and as I recall they have some interior drawings.  I got a very nice set of drawings from them for the PT Boat cradle. 

Best of luck with your project!

Remove the obvious and add the obvious

What were the diffrences?

Andy

Yep, that two-tone gray scheme was a variant on Measure 1 camouflage, and used the prewar #5 Standard Navy Gray on the hull, and everything else--including the deck--was 5-D Dark Gray. Both colors available in our Colourcoats enamels.

BTW, those Packard V-12s were NOT the same engine as used in their cars.

Cheers,

John Snyder, White Ensign Models, http://WhiteEnsignModels.com

Here's a copy of a post I placed earlier this year .  The only thing I would add is that the 109 would not have the heater unit which I believe is part number 51 from the kit.  I hope this helps....

"I can help you witht he paint scheme for PT-109. It depends on what period of time you wish to represent. Most people build it at the time just before it was sunk. Go with a dark green. Either White Ensign Model 5-NG Navy Green or Model Masters "Grn. Drab Enamel". If painting with a spray brush I would suggest adding a few drops of white to lighten up and provided hilight to represent weathering.

Here's my latest information on how to build an accurate PT-109 from the Revell kit.

"Preparation
1. Buy the White Ensign Models (WEM) Photo Etch set for the PT Boats and the 1/72 37mm anti-tank gun.
2. Two options for drawings. One is the Squadron Publications PT Boat book. It's not too expensive and has a good drawing of the 109. The other is to pick up drawings from PT Boats Inc. which are 1/48 scale and very detailed. Just a couple of mistakes. 3. Paint - For the entire boat I would recommend either Testors Dark Green FS34079 or White Ensign Model Navy Green N-5G. Lighten this up a little with white to give it a more scale look. Weather as you like. Typically these boats had oil stains along the water line. For the bottom I like White Ensign Model Anti Fouling Red.

Details
Starting from stem to stern this is my recommendation...

Overall
1. Follow the WEM instructions for the photo etch set with the exceptions listed later.

Deck Details:
1. Remove the bow light leaving the base. The wiring trails off to the port side of the mount.
2. Sand off most or all the deck detail including the torpedo tube mounts. I don't think that the WEM set has the large scoop vents on the foredeck so I would leave those. Many people say that the deck was not planked but on this class it was. The problem with the kit is that it's out of scale. My recommendation is to remove it all. Be sure to remove the brackets for the raft. They are way out of scale. 3. Don't install the standards on the foredeck. 4. 37mm - This was never installed for action on the boat. They got so far as to bolt down two long 2 x 8 planks. Metal brackets were fitted over the axles to hold it in place but this was never completed. To keep from losing it they used additional lashing that probably extended to the toe rails.
5. There should only be one depth charge rack and it is located on the starboard side. The one that was originally on the port side was smashed through the deck when the port side, forward torpedo accidentally launched in high seas and blasted the depth charge through the deck nearly killing one of the crew who was trying to rest below. Due to this I would expect that more of the toe railing on the port side would be missing. Imagine a torpedo slamming into the depth charge and how much of the deck would be destroyed because of it. Imagine the repairs. They probably didn't have extra toe railing laying around.

Chart House/Cockpit
1. The horn should be removed and corrected or left off all together. If you install it refer to photos. I think you can scratch build one fairly easily. There are no photos showing the horn. 2. The windows on the forward side of the chart house should be painted over. I can't say about the port and starboard windows and there is no photographic evidence. Typically these were not painted over. 3. The cockpit was surrounded with armor which extends level with the top of the replaced windscreen all around and to the back. There's no photo evidence to see what was done on the starboard side. It was either painted over or armor. So I would just paint it over. The windscreen itself was also replaced with armor. 4. Typically the machine gun attached to the chart house would be rotated to the 4 o'clock position with the gun pointed skyward. This was done because the gunner would typically access it from forward of the turret on the starboard side of the chart house where there is a step.
5. The mount for the spot light is wrong. The mast is typically mounted behind the cockpit and not on the deck. When the boats were built there was a mount attached to the port side of the cockpit so the skipper could operate. Photos of the 109 indicate that this was removed. Probably scavenged by some other boat.


Day Cabin
1. There were no shades over the windows. These should be removed.
2. Do not install a mast. I'm certain it was gone. There is one photo of the boat in action and the mast isn't up. I would suggest installing mounts for the mast only. According to the skipper of PT-105 masts were either stowed or gone all together. Since it's not up while under way I would bet it didn't exist. 3. There is probably a flag box on the forward side of the day cabin and directly behind the cockpit.
4. There is a spay shield on the top of the day cabin adjacent to the rear turret. On the kit it is open into the day cabin. That's all wrong. It's simply a shield and the roof under it should be repaired and sealed up.
5. The spray shields extending from the day cabin should have support rods installed. You'll need a drawing that shows that. It would be tough to explain.
6. I would throw the life raft on top of the day cabin. The crews typically just threw them up there to keep them out of the way. It wouldn't be wrong to not have it all together. They certainly didn't have it after the collision. In port PT-109 had a dingy at their disposal that was scrounged.

Finishing
1. The numbering did not have black backgrounds. There are NO numbers on the hull. I would only put numbers on the forward side of the Chart House, the side of the forward turret, and on the port side of the cockpit just under where the window might have been. Just a hair more than a foot down from the top of the cockpit. Finally on the 20mm turret mount on the rear. The numbers with the kit are too large. I don't know where to find scale numbers. I would suggest putting a post on the FSM forum and see if anyone has any ideas.
2. The pin holding the 20mm in place broke. To keep it from flying around they tied it off to the depression rail so that's a nice detail.
3. Except for the windows on the front side of the chart house, the windows were glass and had covers on the inside of the boat. The WEM set has covers but to do it right you would mount them on the inside of the windows. A way to model this is to put a clear finish over the painted windows to give it the appearance that there is glass over the cover. Make sense?

I've never seen a model of the 109 done right, particularly in this scale. It's a lot of work but if you follow these instructions you'll have it nailed.

I hope that helps and doesn't make you crazy. Enjoy and be sure to post some photos!"

And the decks should be in carrier-deck "deck blue" if stateside, if I remember it rightly.  Makes for a rakish paint job next to the "solid" green Papa Tares.

I've some family testimony that some of the early Higgins boats were "camoflaged" in every gray in the base's paint locker.  Speed was the goal, rather than precision or neatness--so there was some disregard for what we'd want to model as a "proper" paint job . . .

Hmm, how to make "scraper marks" in paint overspray on cockpit windows . . .