Knights of the Sky II- The End

StephenLawson

Truly sorrowful about the Nieuports.  But your skilled hands should have them back in shape in no time at all.

Frank please add two more Fokker Dr.I types to my name on the build page.  But these are DML / Dragon 1/48 kits.

Here is a bit of fun concerning 1/48 scale streaking and a further note of how to do it.

Fokker Streaked camouflage 1/48 - painted. At right the base coat is a light almond colour representing unbleached linen. At left the finished Fokker type streaked camouflage. The dark solid fields were for the crosses. It was ordered to bring the factory white fields of the pattee or iron crosses down to a narrow border. With the balkan crosses the border was at first widened then narrowed down in specific ratio later in the war.

Fokker Streaked camouflage 1/48 - painted. Here the finished Fokker type streaked camouflage. The wings were hand painted at the factory and the streaked fields varied from airframe to airframe.

To continue, here are some examples of hand painted streaking on Eduard and DML Dr.I kit fuselages.

Ludwig,

Thanks for the link!  I will have to look for them at any future shows that I attend.  Perhaps I can pick some up at the IPMS nationals this year.

Justin,

What exactly are you beating yourself up over?  That triplane looks awfuly good as is!

Stephen,

Once again, thanks for sharing some great informaiton!

Frank,

Here is the box top of my project as the Tirpitz build is done done!  I sprayed the wood base color in the interior earlier today, and will see about streaking it with oils this evening, and possibly starting some construction.  Lots going on this weekend getting ready for graduation next Sunday, as there will be several folks here to see my son.  Anyway, I am back on board, and glad to be here!

Ok I finally have made some progress on the fuselage of my Fokker. I think I have spent more time on the fuselage than I have ever spent on one before. I chose an early D VII with the streaked camo. I assumed it was a decal because it was so complex and had so many colors it would be impossible to paint. By the time I looked through the ten sheets of decals and realised I would have to paint it the model was half build. Thats why I put it aside for a while. I decided the only chance I had to make it look anything like the pictures was to use artist oils and blend the colors together. The long drying time of the oils makes this possible as well as the ability to wipe anything of you do'nt like without ruining any of the acrylic paints already on the model. It is not an exact match for the pictures but its the best I can do. I plan on putting a coat of dullcoat that I have that has gone bad and dries with a slightly milky apperance. I am hopeing this will toneit down and fade the colors together. I have used it before to give a plane a overall sunfaded apperance and it works pretty good. Let me know what you think and please if you think it sucks tell me. I know you guys are all to nice to say something like that but I really would like to know exactly what you think. If you think it sucks tell me! I'm a big boy I wo'nt cry I promise.

                                                                              Soulcrusher 

Scott- Got your new build on the list!  Was it OK that I placed it over the other one (forgot what it was now! )?

SC- I gotta admit, I like the effect you acheived though as far as accuracy- I cannot comment.  Looks a little stark between the top deck streaking and the sides, hope the clearcoat blends it in.  Have you ever considered using a highly thinned dusty color such as Tamiya buff to blend?  I use that technique (especially on desert AC) and I like how it turns out.  Here's an example on a 109 I did a few years ago:

Before-

After-

Anyway, that's my honest opinion, hope it helps!

(Hehehe... can you believe I found a way to post 109 pics here?)

Thanks for the honest opinion Frank. I thought about the buff overspray too but I have never tried it before. How much do you thin the paint down. It sounds like a good plan because I should be able to control how much I lighten it by how many passes I make with the airbrush. I have only tryed something similar on Luftwaffe mottleling on the sides of the fuselage to blend the mottleing in with the lightblue background and I have always been pleased with the results. If you could suggest how thin to make the dusty overcoat I think I might try it.

                                                                                            Soulcrusher

MrDrummy wrote:

". . .On the top of the wing of my Fokker, I basically have two options:  I can start on the left hand side of the wing and simply go across until I run out of room, or start from the center, and head outwards, correct. . .

From the left was a Fokker Schwerin  practice.  The others went from the middle / center by all accounts.

MrDrummy wrote:

Is it as "simple" as finding a photo of the aircraft I'm modeling, or did certain factories tend to do one or the other. . .

Remember that the wings were interchangable And repairs were an ongoing issue.  Its the serial numbers that will give you the greatest help in an airframe's identity.

MrDrummy wrote:

I'm also expecting to do a half-turn on every other section of lozenge on the top wing.  Would this be correct for a factory late Albatros built D. VII. . .

Yes, and the lower wing as well.

soulcrusher wrote:

Soulcrusher

Pardon me but why are the sides green?

StephenLawson wrote:

From the left was a Fokker Schwerin  practice.  The others went from the middle / center by all accounts.

Then I'm starting from the center!!

StephenLawson wrote:

Remember that the wings were interchangable And repairs were an ongoing issue.  Its the serial numbers that will give you the greatest help in an airframe's identity.

According to the Roden instructions, the serial number of this a/c is unknown.  I'll be building this one.  Another black aircraft!  What can I say?  I do notice one thing right off the bat-- I'll need to use the telescopic gunsight from the Fokker Dr. I that I didn't use, as Roden doesn't include one.

The story of Willy Rosenstein is a fascinating as well!

StephenLawson wrote:

Yes, and the lower wing as well.

Thanks, Stephen!  As always, most helpful!  I'm painting the engine today, and probably going to get a coat of gloss paint down on the wings to set the decals on.

Soulcrusher--

I'm with Stephen here.  If that's supposed to be your typical Fokker streaked camo, then the top looks great, but the sides are green.  It kinda looks like you copied what's in that book.  I'm not a pro, but I've never seen it green like that.

I'm terrified of that streaked camo!  Seriously, great job on that top bit.

StephenLawson wrote:

soulcrusher wrote:                                                                               Soulcrusher Pardon me but why are the sides green?

All I have to go by is the color booklet. I have no pictures of the real thing so I copied the booklet. I whish I never chose this particular plane. I think it was a big mistake. If it really is that far off I might just dump the whole thing in the round file. I am really getting tired of repainting the fuselage. I bought the Dual Combo kit so at this point I am seriously thinking about just building the late version with the second kit without the streaked fuselage camo. Its just not work the time and trouble.

                                                                                     Soulcrusher

No no no!! Don't dump it!!  Just finish the sides like the top.

Start on the later version, and set that one aside for a little bit.  I really think that you've got the technique down, because that top section is awesome, SC.  Just take some time, and do a little of the sides at a time, and when you're done, man, that thing will be awesome.

Don't dump it!!!

Thanks Justin. This fuselage is really pissing me off! So the sides of the fuselage are suppose to look like the top? Then I'm gonna kick some Eduard Butt! here is scan of the color profile. I thought they were suppose to be boxing the best WWI kits out there. How can they make such a huge mistake?

I had no problem streaking the upper fuselage. I sprayed the fuselage MM Tan the I got some green artist oils and sreaked the top and adjusted it till it looked like the picture. If the sides are suppose to look like the top then I would have had this fuselage sides done last week when I did the top.!!!! Once agian I am screwed by an instruction sheet. I wiped off all of the green from the fuselage sides. At least the oil paints were not dry so they came right off. Now I am going to paint the fuselage for about the fourth time now.  Mabye tomorrow after I've cooled down a bit.

                                                                                    Soulcrusher

Hey, SC--

Yeah, as far as I know, (and Stephen would definitely know better,) the Fokker camo should be the same on the top and the sides of the fuselage.  Maybe this particular aircraft is green, but doubt that Stephen would have said anything about it if it were supposed to be!  I'm certain that he'd know about such an oddball aircraft.

Eduard does some strange things sometimes.  I'm pretty sure that they got a couple of colors wrong on some of their lozenge sheets, and their color callouts are sometimes a little iffy.  I've seen some erroneous calls on some of their WWII stuff as well.  Maybe they're just taking for granted that we're already supposed to know what that Fokker streaked camo looks like.  Who knows.  The Roden kits are definitely sparse when it comes to information!!

Anyway, don't dump that thing, buddy.  Just breathe,  and recreate the same effect on the sides as you have on the top.  It's really going to turn out great, SC!!

Thanks agian Justin. I've cooled down now and the fact that I was able to remove the green without damaging the rest of the fuselage means I have gotten past the point where I wanted to dump it in the trash. That and the fact that I found a way to duplicate the streaking with oils means she will live to see another day. I usally build WWII stuff and I have been doing it for so long over 30 years that I do not need to realy on instruction sheets to obtain the proper camo colors. In fact the Hasegawa Macchi 202 I just finished I caught several mistakes in the kit and the camo pattern and color call outs in the instructions were 100% wrong. I found actual pictures in that case. My complete lack of knowledge of these WWI birds and lack of photos is why I feel prey to the lousy Eduard color call outs. The main reason I joined this GB was to learn more about these early biplanes and I definetly have. Some lessons the hard way too!

                                                                                        Soulcrusher

MrDrummy wrote:

No no no!! Don't dump it!!  Just finish the sides like the top. Start on the later version, and set that one aside for a little bit.  I really think that you've got the technique down, because that top section is awesome, SC.  Just take some time, and do a little of the sides at a time, and when you're done, man, that thing will be awesome. Don't dump it!!!

 Hey SC, Dont Do It, Step Back, Take A Good Look Around, Then try it again. If you only knew how many times a kit, not just a biplane, I've earmarked for the round file, Gessh. I've even had to rescue one from the dreaded hanger 13 once(or mavbe twice), dust it off and try again. My third attempt at a DVII looks like it belongs with the Jimmy Hendrix Magical Flying Circus! Hehe. But seriously the top looks great and like MrDrummy's said you've got the oil technique down. Just a little more stickwithitiness and that DVII will look cool.

 OBTW Frank, that is one fine 109.

Thanks Mobious. I already wiped off the offending green paint from the fuselage sides and resprayed it Tan agian. I am going to let it dry tonight and put some stripes on the fuselage tomorrow. Man I knew these birds were not easy to build but this one is really busting my chops! It is a good thing it is such a nice kit otherwise I might have pounded into the table by now. When I finish it I will be able to say I learned alot of new techniques. A first for lozenge decals a first for WWI biplane and a first at using oils to obtain a finish. Wow this is almost like work! I would not have been able to do it without all of the help from all of you guys here. Thank you everyone Justin Frank Stephen and Mobious. I really appreciate all of the input.

                                                                                       Soulcrusher

Good news Frank I apllied the same technique to the sides of the fuselage as I did on the top and it was able to achive the same effect. I ended up going with a little more streaking than the pics posted of the Dr I in the earlier pics but that was a different plane so mabye it was'nt done exactly the same way. I also took yur advice and gave it an overspray of Buff wash and it gave it a nice weathered faded look and tied the two colors together better, It also lighten the base color that I used which was a little to tan and lighten it a bit. I am sure it is not exact but it looks resonable. I will post some pics later after it dries a bit. Thanks agian to everyone who has helped me through this minefield of information. I feel like I'm back in school agian but I am learning and trying many new techniques I would not have tried otherwise. Which was the very reason I joined this GB to learn. So what grade do I get so far Frank? (Substantial bribe to follow upon receiving good grade) Shhhh do'nt tell!

                                                                                   Soulcrusher

SC--

Very, very cool!  I'm glad that you didn't toss that thing.  I'm sure that it looks great, dude.

I should have some pictures of my Fokker's engine this evening, if I can peel myself away from the nice day we're having outside!  Ah.  So nice to sit and have a cold beer outside...

Ok no major set backs today. I masked of the bottom of the fuselage and painted it. Then I gave the whole fuselage a coat of Future so I can do some decaling tomorrow. I have left the radiator off so I can install the exhaust pipes last. I had installed them earlier but in the early version they exit right through the side of the cowl and I kept breaking them loose so I am going to install them later. Here is a pic of where I'm at now. Almost like building the real thing. Build a bunch of sub assemblies then put them all together. The fuselage colors all got much darker when I put a coat of Future on it but they will lighten up once I spray some dullcoat over the whole thing after decaling.

                                                                         Soulcrusher 

Now THAT looks great SC!  Well done, looks so much better.  Sure am glad you decided not to round file this baby, she's really looking the part now.

Hi:

Daywalker was very kind, calling my atention to this great GB (there are some many great models over here!!)!

I originally posted these WIP photos on the Aircraft subforum.

I don't usually build WWI stuff but this little model has received my constant attention for the last week or so.

This is Eduard's 1/72 stripped down version of a Fokker Dr.I. I'm building it almost OOTB. I'm not modeling a specific airplane (it is kind of a airplane before being covered with canvas, during construction). 

 I planed it to be painted as sub-assemblies, shown in the following photos:

 I started painting it last Saturday and this is its present state:

I hope you like it as much as I'm having fun building it.

Cheers

SC-- VERY NICE!!!  Man, that really looks great.  Hurry up and finish this thing!  You're almost there.

Marco- WOW!  In 1/72 scale!?  That thing looks better than most of the much bigger kits that I've seen built.  How'd you paint your propeller?!  Wow, great job!

Thanks for welcoming me and your kind comments!

The propeller was painted with a light sand color (I used Tamiya Acrykic paint). After being completly dry, I painted a thin layer of Burnt Umber oil paint (reduced with a bit of terbentine). After the oil was a bit dry (just some 15 to 20 min.), using an old brush (with the hairs split apart) moistened in clean turbentine (dried on a paper towel after diping it on the turbentine) I made the wood grain, just by draging it along the propeller. At this stage it seems as one piece of wood (not laminated wood). After a couple minutes more, with a fine tiped brush, moistened in turbentine, I cleaned the regions I want to be light wood. I left it to dry for a whole day and checked its look before clearing it with two coats of satin varnish (Laquer). Care must be taken not to touch on the parts painted with oils before sealing them- they are extremly fragile.

I hope I was clear enough. If not, feel free to ask!

Cheers

Frank,

By all means replace the Hansa-Brandenburg W-29 with the Pfalz D.III.  I still have not figured out what to do with the floatplane.

Soulcrusher,

The repaint looks great!  Until Knights of the Sky grou build one (last year), I thought that the base color for the streaking was a light shade of blue.  If you look at the old Squadron In Action booklet, that is what they show and describe.  As it turns out, the base should be a linen (light tan) color.  Just like you, I have learned a lot by taking part in these group builds.

Marco,

Looking good!  I built the same plane for Knights of the Sky part one last year.  I tried something different by painting the wooden parts and the fabric parts.  The other Edurad strip-down kits that I built were straight out of the box with only the plastic parts receiving paint.  I will anticipate your future updates.

Marco that is an absolute work of art. Glad to have you here in this GB. That engine looks like you could flip the switch on the magnetos and turn her over.

Justin I can feel it all coming together now. Nothing but clear sailing ahead!

Scott man I am learning about WWI biplanes. Sometimes the hard way. Information is not as easy to come by as in WWII subjects and good photos are scarce. I am sure there are books out there but I do not want to spend alot of money on books that I am not going to use alot. There is probally just as much wrong info out there as there is correct. As you have seen the color guide for my Eduard kit is pretty much worthless. I had no idea this was going to be this tough!

                                                                                           Soulcrusher

Exellent catch on the paint streaking SC. Ive heard thats its a difficult technique to get right, but it looks like youve nailed it. I loved that kit. I built the fully lozened version for this GB earlier. I must admit though, that i like the look of yours much better.

Marco, what a fantastic looking kit, and in 1/72 as well. I need one of those. Does anyone have a link to the supplier? Ive looked but cant find one here in the UK.

...Guy