Model Shipways "Sultana" Group Build 2006

I just got off of vacation and I am resuming my build today. I hope that I can get some pictures up soon - maybe late this afternoon  Just slow progress.

Donnie

As I mentioned a while ago, for the stern windows, rather than use a thin sheet of transparency. I tried something else. It worked pretty well, giving a little glossy reflection under light. I am sure I'm not the first person to try this...

I used Elmers Craft Bond, an acid free glue pen that my wife uses for scrapbooking. Basically I fixed a sheet of black paper behind the window cut-outs. A couple of blobs from the glue pen fills each window nicely. Just spread it around gently with a toothpick. It sets glossy and transparent. Then just attach the white frame using tape, paint, a white paint stick, etc. My photos didn't really do it justice. I think Chuck had the same problem.

I'm just touching up the paintwork and then once I have attached the stern fashion pieces I'll post photos.

Hey folks,

 

I am finally starting to get back into the groove.

Chapter six was finally finished.  It should be available on MSW shortly. The owner is on vacation but will post it when he returns.  In the meanwhile I thought I would post a photo.  The anchor buoys are made from Sculpey.  I have one more rope coil to add to the other side of the shrouds.   I will start constructing the boom, gaffs and yards next and that should finish it up.  More or less.  I have yet to rig the back stays because they would make rigging the gaffs and yards more difficult.

Chuck

Absolutely gorgeous, Chuck! There's not much else to say. You are indeed a master shipwright.

Thanks Fippy,

 

You are not doing such a bad job yourself.  Its been quiet on this board for a while.  I wonder where everyone went.  If I remember correctly we started with about 10 or so participants.  I can tell you are hooked on it now.  Cant wait to see more pics of your build.

 

Chuck

Here's the results of my painting, and I definitely am not the neatest painter in the world :( I'm sure I will improve with practice.




And here's the stern. Boy did I fight over this one. It's not really like the plans: The transom is too vertical, the fashion pieces are too flat rather than quarter-circles.. but I guess each model is unique in its own way. I need to go over the window frames at some point too. I am probably expecting too much from my maiden build... Chuck and Donnie make it look too easy. :)



Next up are the cap rails.

Fippy, 

Dont be so critical.  I have seen worse paint jobs on the models of seasoned builders.  That is a very clean model you have there.  The fact that the staern isnt constructed perfectly is OK.  When the model is finished it will look great.  Infact,  I bet in a couple of years you will revisit the Sultana after you get a few more models under your belt.  I no longer have my first model, but I can tell you that yours is much better. 

Wheres Donnie?  I was hoping to see some pics of his progress also.  I guess the 2 of you are the only actual builders with the group. 

Chuck

Donnie, Fippy, and Chuck, you all have some really nice models coming along.  I wish I had the time to build with you all.

Regards,
Scott

Thanks for the encouragement! I'm having a great time building Sultana and am not in a rush. Sometimes I can be a perfectionist which doesn't always do me any favours. :)

I wish more of the group joined in too. I learn a lot by hearing what other builders have to say and their photos.

I want some help.  With the Sultana, yes, only not with the Sultana.  The issue: do you think the Sultana kit from Model Shipways that you are all working with can produce a museum ready model?  I expect at this point in your build you are very familiar with the kit.

 

I hope to build such a model, remodeling the Sultana kit as her contemporary vessel, the Liberty, the first warship of the American navy.  I’ll build my own hull from my estimate of her lines (underwater she derived from a St. Lawrence River galley built in the 1740s, while her upper works were designed to serve the social life of her builder, Col. Skenesborough).  I expect to build in plank on frame (maybe reshape the solid original hull?), but the plans, furnishings, and rigging supplies for Sultana might make a good start for my own model, I think.  Does the kit you’re working with, in terms of cordage, armament, and other equipment  scale well for the size of the model?

 

My model will not end in one of the world’s great museums, I expect, but it has a place.  The Skenesborough Museum (http://www.whitehallchamber.com/skenesborough_museum.htm) contains many memories of the early days at the head of Lake Champlain, but it has no detailed model of the most important ship in the history of the region, Benedict Arnold’s flagship Liberty, which began in 1775 as a small colonial schooner generally like Sultana.  I plan to donate my model to their collection after I finish her.

 

For more about the Liberty (aka Lady Katherine) and her story, you can look at  Dan Forth’s (that’s me) nautical novel Seizing the Forts on Lulu.com.  A download of the electronic (.pdf) version is free.  I am the author, and I know no better summary of this dimly known ship from 1775.

 

Dan,
I think you should be able to perform a museum quality build. Actually just last week I was in a model shop buying bits and I saw an incredible-quality Sultana model sitting there in the shop. Whilst Sultana is a small model as museum pieces go, it definitely looked museum quality. I only wish the builder had been there in the shop. Go for it, and if you do we'd love to see your build notes and photos here!

I intend to download your novel and read a few chapters about the Liberty. If it is promising then I shall buy the paperback, which I hope you make money from. I have no problem rewarding good writing.

As a segue to my own progress on Sultana... :)
I'm working on the cap rails and spiral fashion pieces, as well as the planksheers and quarter badges/windows. I realize that the mistakes I made on my stern are propogating along my hull. My wale is definitely too far "north" at the stern which is requiring me to shorted the quarter badges to fit them in. I'm basically chopping off the tails below the windows. I may also opt to remove the whole planksheer that runs at the same height as the chains, since I am worried about my wale and the two planksheers and the cap rails being far too close together at the stern. Maybe I should call my Sultana a sister-ship too. :)

It doesn't bug me too much that my hull is diverging from the Sultana. As my maiden build I need to make mistakes to learn from them on my next build. Once I get above deck level everything should re-align with the kit again.

More photos once my cap rails are on.

Hello again,

Sorry for the long absence, as I explained to Donnie early in the planning for this build I have started a new job which might require my time... and it has!  I have been watching the threads but have had no time to do any modeling (other than thinking about what I would like to be doing) but the models you guys are working on look great!  Hopefully in the next month or so I'll be back to building.

Keep up the good work

We're moving house at the end of the month, so our realtor told me to pack up my workspace so that our house is nice and neat and uncluttered to prospective buyers. Bah! So alas I am at anchor for a few weeks but I WILL be back and raring to install my freshly painted caprails.

BTW, my sculpey scrolly things came out far too large to look right, and try as I could I just couldn't make them small enough to look good. I've decided to skip the scrolls and try them on a future model. After all, if my ship came out as good as Chuck's on my first time, I wouldn't have any motivation to build another ship! :)

Fippy

 

Thanks, I made like 30 of them.  If I didnt throw them away ( I will check when I get home) I could mail them to you.  I believe you will need 12.  Six clockwise and six counterclockwise.  I will let you know.  I am in the home stretch.  My model could be finished in a week or so.  woo hoo!

 

Chuck

Chuck,
Thanks, I'd appreciate that! Depending on just how small they are I might have to cut my bulwarks lower to accomodate them. I only have about 3mm between the middeck and the little step up caprail astern. I'm afraid to lower the bulwarks any more since the space between my caprails and wale is already looking tight as I mentioned in an earlier post.

I can't wait to see the next installments of your practicum and see your Sultana in full rigged glory!

Hi Chuck,

Just downloaded chapter 6 of your Practicum - nice work on the masting.  Haven't yet had time to read it, just admiring the photos.  Feel like I could climb aboard and sail her off...

Looking forward to 7, thanks for sharing with us.

Thanks Seamac,

 

Chapter Seven will finish it up.  Looking forward to my next project.  The Syren will have to wait also.  I just picked up a commission to build a model of the Mayflower.  It will also be a plank on solid hull.  Should be fun.  I have already started reading and researching.  Mostly the work of William Baker.  He designed the replica now in Plymouth. 

As much as I wanted to build the Brig Syren I cant pass up a paying gig.  I will keep all of you posted if there is any interest.

Chuck

Oh,  Fippy...I looked for those Sculpey Scrolls and must have thrown the extras away.  Good luck with your move. I bet you will be itchin to model over the next few weeks.  Sorry about that though, I should have looked for them first.

Hi Chuck,

I don't know how much you want to get into the history of the new Mayflower now at Plymouth but, if you are interested, a book exists (I have a copy) entitled "Give Me a Ship to Sail" by Alan Villiers.  Captain Villiers was selected to sail the newly built Mayflower from England to Massachusetts and he, in turn, selected the crew.  He writes about the building of the Mayflower and how it was altered from the original to meet the then current standards for shipbuilding.  Even at that he was a little skeptical that it wouldn't flounder!  The book covers, in much less detail, other sailing adventures of his at a time when the large, commercial sailing vessels were at the very end of their careers.

If you want I'll mail it to you for the cost of postage to and back.  Keep it as long as you need - now once read it will be a while before I'll have need of it again.  You can let me know here or contact me off line at: cmac@myeastern.com .

Congratulations on the new commission - the person receiving it will be getting a beautiful model.

Thanks seamac,

 

It sounds really interesting but the two books I have written by Baker go into great detail about the construction methods during that time.  Its more than enough information than I need to create a great model.  It will be as historically accurate for the time period as I can make it even though no one really knows how the mayflower looked.  Rather than second guess the so-called experts I will attempt to give the model the "kitch" look everyone fondly expects of a mayflower model.  You are probably aware of the rediculouss debates surrounding models of the Mayflower.  Some feel she is not worth modelling because we dont know exactly how she looked.  I disagree, and the model will show how worthy a subject she is.  I'll thank you again for offerring.  I might ask you a few questions when I get into the thick of it. 

I hope it was as much fun for all of you as it was for me.  The final chapter of my practicum will be available very soon.  Any comments are welcome. Sorry for all of the pictures but I am celebrating.  I am already working on my next project.

Thanks for all of your endless support and encouragement.

Chuck

What a beautiful model!  What's particularly impressive is that, without making any serious compromises with historical reality, it looks so much different than any of the others in the group build.  This is the sort of thing that a conscientious, skilled modeler can do with a basically sound kit.

I do feel obligated to mention one point.  (I do so with two thoughts in mind.  1- If I don't somebody else will; and 2- it's easy to fix.)

The diagonal red stripe in the British ensign represents the Saltire of St. Patrick.  It was added to the flag in 1801, when the Act of Union brought Ireland under the jurisdiction of the British Parliament. Prior to that time, the diagonal stripe in the flag was all white.  I don't recall the history of the Sultana's last years, but if I'm not mistaken she was gone well before 1801. 

I'm not sure about the flag on the jackstaff.  British practice in those days was far less formal than American practice is now.  (It appears that, on numerous occasions, British sailing warships didn't fly jacks at all.)  I'm accustomed to seeing a jack that's identical to the field of the ensign - i.e., red and white crosses on a blue background.  But the red cross on the white background may be right.

Tradition has it that the first jack of the American Continental Navy was a picture of a rattlesnake over the words "Don't Tread On Me."  It's occurred to me that, if the design of the such a flag were left to the modern U.S. Navy, it would read:  "No Step."

Bottom line:  it's an outstanding model.  Congratulations!

Thanks,

I was wondering about the flags.  I had to create them myself using a graphics program.   I did research it on the internet.  But silly me.   I ended up using the wrong one.  I am providing the flags in my practicum for anyone who wants to print them out to use.  It will be a simple fix.  I also printed a pennant but decided not to use it because I thought it would be too much.  

Thanks for the kind words.

Chuck

Hi Chuck,

Congratulations on completing a fine model.  While I am s-l-o-w-l-y working on my first wood ship with the help of this group, I have built quite a few models in my model RRing days and I compliment your efforts.  It came out very well and has acted as an inspiration for the rest of us - I'm glad you were here and I look forward to the last installment of your practicum.

Are you considering doing the same thing (practicum) for the Mayflower?  As that model is being built from scratch, and I am assuming, will be a plank on frame, I for one would be very interested in following the build.  At the least, will you be posting pictures as you go?

As for Mr. Tilley, well sir, I blame you in part for my slow progress!  I enjoy your writing and have been back reading through the ship forum looking for your comments in particular.  Your knowledge of ships and modeling, along with the easy read of your comments, keep me searching for more.  Thank you for your insight and willingness to share.

As for my progress, when I last posted I said I was cutting out the templates for the hull.  Before I had a chance to get far on that project my new job interfered and I didn't get any further.  The learning process now lessening I have more time and am finishing up the cutting of those templates.  The workweek keeps me busy, only leaving the weekends for now, so I suspect I will be working on the hull by next weekend... we'll see.  How is everyone else coming along?

 

No I wont be writing a practicum for the Mayflower.  It will be plank on solid hull.   I will however keep everyone posted with progress photos. 

I happen to be lucky in that I have a first edition of "The New Mayflower - Her Design andConstruction".  It is signed by the author William Baker.  The information it contains along with his second book on the subject is facinating.

 

Chuck 

Chuck, as always I am speechless at the quality of your model. I can see why you have received a commission(s) - easily museum quality. A wonderful job sir. I can't wait to see your progress on the Mayflower and I hope I get to work in a group build with you again in the future and even better, to get to use another of your practicums. Your Sultana one is extremely helpful.

Seamac, Congratulations on the new job and I'm glad that you are going to be continuing your Sultana build. I can't wait to see your progress.

I'm still in the moving process so I shan't be continuing for a while yet. My dear Sultana is ina  box, lovingly packed in bubble wrap. I'm glad that I'm moving before the more fiddly (and breakable) pieces go on.

Is everyone in this group also a part of ModelShipWorld? It seems a convenient place to keep in touch with everyone once we all complete our Sultana's and move on. Not that the group is breaking up now of course, just that Chuck's completion made me look to the future. :)

Thanks Fippy,

The final chapters have been posted.  Let me know if you have any questions.  I will still frequent this forum and am not going anywhere.  I will post photos of my next project as it develops on www.modelshipworld.com.  I do enjoy lurking here and will post if I have something to contribute.  I am anxious to see how everyones Sultana turns out. 

 

Chuck

Great work Chuck, and many thanks for your internet practicum.

Scott

Well I'm in the new house but we are still unpacking and I haven't set up the craft room / workshop yet. Sultana made the voyage safely and awaits my attention. Hopefully I shall have her back in drydock within a couple of weeks.
How is everyone else doing?

Another brief status report. I'm back modelling and installing my cap rails.

One thing I have noticed about my work is that I often end up touching up my work after I have glued pieces together, either filling and/or painting. Painting often involves a couple of colours too, usually a hull colour and black for the trim I have been working on.

I know I'm a newbie so I'm sure I will get more proficient over time, but any tips on avoiding this kind of extra work. It is very time consuming.

How is everyone else doing? I hope you haven't all quit?

I'm sure all of you are parsecs ahead of me...but I am cranking away, yet!  Boy, that is one stunning ship.