Model Shipways "Sultana" Group Build 2006

Fippy,

There may be some jigs available but I just establish it with a ruler and free hand the CL up the stem and stern post.  After its finished I hold the hull at many different angles and "eyeball" it.  Almost like checking to see if a 2x4 is warped.  I will keep making adjustments until I am satisfied.  I also got myself in the habbit of taking pictures.  It is sometimes amazing what is easier to see in a photograph.  If you have a digital camera take some shots at diferent angles and see what it looks like.

Chuck

Everyone who commented, Thank You.  That is exactly the feedback I needed.  I finished fitting out the boat and placed it into position on deck.  It seems to be growing on me also.  The rudder has been removed and placed in the boat with two oars and some coiled rope.  I made four oars but that was overkill.   Here is what it looks like now.  I have some close- ups and build photos of the jolly boat but I wanted to show you how it looks in relation to the entire model so far.   Chapter 5 will be available soon and the photos will all be included.  I will lash the boat to some eyebolts on deck tomorrow.

Thanks again,  It was a big help.

Chuck

Chuck,

My vote is to leave the ship's boat where you have it. Harold Hahn's book 'The Colonial Schooner' shows the boat just where you have it in the illustration on p. 57.

You can see where the Sultana's 'sisters' carried their boats in the photos at:

http://resolutionslog.bravehost.com/index.html

The photo on the index page is of Charles Parson's excellent model of the Halifax. The photo on the gallery page is of his model of the Hannah. These are excellent references for details on the Sultana.

enjoy

Chuck,

With respect to the yawl, I really think a well detailed boat adds a lot to the eye appeal of ships like Sultana.  I have to say that it is nice to be able to see how well the boat can look when it is worked up as you have done it.  Your latest photo has convinced me that my initial inclination to make the boat and put it on the deck is the way I would like to go.

Bruce

Hi Donnie

Sorry I didn't reply to this earlier but I have been on the "disabled" list  for a couple of weeks.  I will definately be with the Group (but only once).  I have been having some problems navigating the site.  You have probably covered this before but how do I get the logo on the Signiture line and how do i get new posts sent directly to my mailbox.

A little help on this and I will jump in and join the group.

Rad

Hi Chuck,

I've got to tell you that I look forward to every picture you post, the practicums and your willingness to share with us your experiences building the ship - thank you!  Nice modeling you're doing.

As for the ship's boat - I thing it looks fine. It will take on a smaller profile once the tiller is stored and, especially, when the masts are up.  The vertical height of the mast will have the affect of making the boat less obvious, I think.  In addition, the boat itself will add to the "eye candy" of the completed model and should, by itself, draw favorable comments from onlookers.  On the other hand, it is your creation and should please you - try it in different areas and place it where it most appeals to you.  Although not a historical fact for the Sultana (I don't know exactly what the Sultana did with this boat) most of the time the ship's boat was for transportation or rescue and as such would be placed in the most convenient area onboard for access without being in the way.  As sailors, or "swabs", needed access to the port and starboard sides of the ship, those areas were usually uncluttered.  If a boat was stored in that area, it was usually located above on racks.  When cargo was being off or on loaded, making the ship's boat the first item to be lifted off was just part of the process.  During the voyage there would be little reason to access those hatches therefore it would be the most practical solution as to where to place the boat unless hung by davits from the fan tail or the sides - not a good idea on a ship the size of the Sultana, for structual, sailing and balance reasons.  As I said, this is just general information not specific to the Sultana.

Personnaly, I like the boat where it is - it looks both good and "nautical" to my eyes.  There again, I wear glasses.

Back to mowing the lawn and thanks again for sharing with us.

Thanks Donnie,

No I wont be making a diorama.  I will probably place the yawl near the namplate.  I may also put it on a length og brass rod alonside the hull.  Today I will start building the masts.  The rigging should be interesting.  The plans in the newer kit are very different from the old one.  The replica in Maryland differs from both.  The 3 sets of plans I have for the Sultana are inconsistant as well.   I see no reason why I shouldnt just dive right in.

Chuck

Thanks,

But after some second thoughts and third, fourth thoughts.  I am going to remove the ships boat.  The rigging will not prevent me from lashing it above the hatches later.  I am also thinking about displaying the yawl towed behind the Sultana.  I am not sure if there will be enough room in the case so even at this stage there are many options.  I read that info from an older issue of the nrg magazine.  It sounds feasable but as you know so does every thing else you read in print.

Chuck

Chuck:

If you have some solid research that says they stored it over the hatch, then it should stay there. I had not seen any new literature on this particular vessel, so I was not sure. Good work.

Russ

From what I have read,  They would have stored it over the hatches.  Because it normally would have been towed.  It would be lashed over the hatches on long journeys only.  I read that all of the ships stores would have been placed aboard and only afterwards the ship lashed atop the hatches.  There would be no reason to enter the hatch on the journey.  The rudder will be removed and placed in the boat as you mentioned.  It is a working rudder with gudgeons and pintles and can be lifted off easily. 

I guess my real question is does the model look ok with the jawl?  Or does it look to large and inconsistant with the rest of the build?  Does it add or detraract from the overall presentation?

Chuck

Chuck:

I have two thoughts. First, if the boat is stored on deck, would not the rudder be unshipped and stored inside the boat? I doubt they would leave it shipped as it sat there on deck as it would be more liable to damage. Second, I am not sure I like storing it right over the hatch. Getting into the hatch means moving the boat. I have seen a pic on the box (or so I thought it was) where the boat was stored off to one side, starboard, I think. I do not know what to tell you about this aspect as I just have not seen much research on it for this particular vessel.

Russ

I am almost finished building the ship's boat.  Details on how it was stored on deck are scarce and I opted for the method in the photo.  The boat would have been clinker built but the small size made it difficult.  I chose to build it with a smooth hull.  It has been glued to the deck but can be easily removed.  I am not sure I like it.  Granted, there will be 4 oars and some coiled rope in the boat and it hasnt been lashed to the deck yet.  But what do you think?  All of you will eventually be faced with the same decision.  Should you build the yawl or not?  Hopefully seeing this picture in advance will help you.  For me,  I spent a week building it already.  I could really use a new impartial set of eyes looking at it. 

Please share your thoughts.

Chuck

cthulhu77 wrote:

you all are waaaaaaaay ahead of me.

Shoot...I have a house closing tomorrow morning, and haven't even had time to do much more than look at the hull...you all are waaaaaaaay ahead of me.  Hopefully, starting tomorrow around ten, I'll be able to get back to modeling !  This work stuff sucks.

               greg  the builder

I had a few good days with not much to do as we were soaked in rain so I was able to get the hull shaped.  I did cut off the bulwarks and after a few tries was able to locate the wale in I believe to be the right place.  I will start carving the 1/16 above the wale this weekend and will hopefully be planking the hull soon.   As far as decking I went to Home Depot and found birch wood veneer strips, the kind you iron on for edging on boards.  I am going to experiment with ripping it down to 3mm widths and see how it looks as decking. 

Dan

Fippy,

You have the right idea.  Try and get the correct shape of the hull first.  After carving the hull exterior you will have a better idea how comfortable you feel carving it.  The wood is soft and takes some getting used to.  Only then should you decide if carving the bulwarks down will be tricky for you.  If that should turn out unsatisfactory then by all means lop the bulwarks off and plank the hull.  Should that happen, there have been some alternatives mentioned for carving the step into the hull a few pages back. 

My advice is go slowly and carve away from your body and hands.  If you create any gouges dont worry about it.  They can always be filled in.  Worse still, if the hull gets destroyed beyond repair, Model Shipways will send you another one.

Chuck

Hi All,

Here's an update as to where I am in the build.  I have an older kit that does not include the printed templates so I have to "lift" them off the  plans.  No big problem, I made 12 copies, cut out each profile and glued to thin wood.  But at this point I'm undecided as to what to do next, use the profile templates to shape the pre carved hull, or mark out full sided "ribs", discard the carving, and go to plank on bulkhead framing.  As this has been a very busy week I haven't had a lot of time to work on the model, so that decision will have to wait until the weekend.  If anyone has any advice/comments please feel free to post them, I would especially appreciate any comments from experienced ship modelers, but everyone should feel free to reply.  If I decide to stay with the solid hull I will also remove the bulwarks.

To the person who posted the links to the current Sultana - Thanks, they will be a big help in modeling her.  Out of curiosity, is any one modeling her as she appears today?  I'm sure the rope rails, as well as much of the other fittings that show in the photos, weren't available on the original!

On another note, in experimenting with veneer strips I think they are the solution to planking the hull without carving it down  the .002" - at this thickness it will add less than 6" scale inches to the finished model and, given that wood swells when in water, would come closer to representing the actual dimensions of the ship when in use rather than out of water for repair!  OK, that may be stretching it a little, but it justifies the added dimensions in my mind.  The pear veneer I am using is very flexible; I made a quick solid practice hull and applied the strips to see how they would fair and they comformed to multiple twisting/bending without problem.  Still, applying them is going to take longer than just carving the hull and painting.  Again, any comments would be appreciated.

OK, back to work and Good Luck to everyone in the build.

Hello all!

Just picked up the kit today from my LHS. I've been meaning to do that for weeks, but I had to save up my allowance and lunch money . The kit looks great, the parts are all there, and I'm happy to finally get started!

Jose Gonzales

Yes, The template is off.  This will also throw off the placement of each station.  You should hold these templates over the plans to check that they are correct.  Make any adjustments to the station placements as well.  You would be surprised how much difference this makes. 

Looking forward to seeing some pictures.  I was working on the jollyboat today and suspect that this will take several days to complete.  I am not even sure I will use it.  When I am finished I will ask for help deciding.  Its always best to have a second pair of eyes take a look.  Or in this case several.