Winter Warriors GB 2008

Hermesminiatures wrote:

Plastic_cross - I've ruined some T-34 rear panels that way too...happens to every builder of Russian armor.

Thanks Hermesminiatures.  And Dupes.......I took this as a bad omen and figured I should just build the M7 instead.  I had already tried re-crafting the panel using some parts from one of my T-34 kits, and it almost looked passable.....but not up to the quality that I'd like to contribute to this Group Build.

Larry

dupes wrote:

Buffle - I SWEAR I've seen that second reference pic of yours somewhere before...

OMG!  I can't believe I TOTALLY forgot that's the photo on our GB badge!!  What a doofus!

Still, it shows the winterketten.........

dupes wrote:

Have you ever seen a pic of one of these winterized? I haven't, but I imagine it would be pretty neat!

I have, I just can't remember where!!   I also saw a military channel show recently that had one.  What show you ask?  Ummmmmmmmmmmm............?

Bufflehead - check out ebay seller tankratsafvdepot - he usually has 50+ Tank figure sets on hand (even if they aren't listed on eBay), and could probably order those for you if Model Point can't.

Plastic_cross - I've ruined some T-34 rear panels that way too...happens to every builder of Russian armor. 

Larry - No problemo, I can switch you over to the Priest...how bad was that rear panel? Anything that can be fixed given the proper motivation?

Buffle - I SWEAR I've seen that second reference pic of yours somewhere before...

Hermes - that certainly is a shaggy little beast. Talk about a "field-applied" paint job.  

Well.....I already hosed up the SU-100 I started for this GB.  Cut out the rear panel to replace with PE screen + cover, and really botched it. 

Rather than try to fix it up, I'm going to set it aside and build the new Academy M7 Priest instead.  I checked my references, which indicate that the M7 Priest was deployed by the US in Germany during the winter of '44-45, so I'm thinking that it would qualify as a Winter Warriors candidate.

Dupes - could you update my participation to be the Academy M7 Priest instead of the Dragon SU-100?

Thanks,

Larry

hehe, the Dragon string is broken!  LOL!   Nice to see those Tamiyas as well guys!  I think I may have a couple of them in my stash .

I found some really NICE winter Panzer crew figures from TANK Models, a Russian company, but the only U.S. distributor is Model Point.  The Model Point website says..."OUT OF STOCK" on almost all the TANK figs   Anyone know where else to buy these figs from?

Also, anyone know if winterketten tracks would be appropriate for LAH SS Panzer IVs during the Kharkov battle of 1943?  I found a photo of a Das Reich SS Pz IV and another of an unknown Div.

I only have the kit decals to use.  The reason I ask if that I have a set of Dragon Winterketten tracks that I was planning on using for a winter wash Pz IV and I figure now is a perfect time to use them!

Oh, and I started the kit last night!!  I managed to assemble ONE drive sprocket to see if the winterketten would fit!!

Hermesminiatures wrote:

There are some significant differences between the early and the initial. Issues aside, he doesn't necessarily want to build that particular tank - he wants a winter camouflaged late with no zimmerit. Which I doubt exists... In my previous post I was thinking of Gruppe Fehrmann. They commandeered five Tiger I's from an armor training school in January 1945 and fought until the last Tiger was destroyed in April. This was quite the mix of tiger parts - un-zimmed lates with early turrets. Don't know if you have an early turret though to use with the late hull. IF you did, you could model a hypothetical winter-camo version - the only photos are ones taken by the British when they destroyed the Tigers in April. It seems that there are dozens of choices from early and mid Tigers in winter camo, but next to nothing as far as late models, especially if you want something without zimmerit. Seems the most common variant with winter camo is the early mid, which essentially has all the features of the mid Tiger except that it retains the fold-up cupola. The only kit that can be used to model this variant is the CH Michael Wittmann Tiger, which is OOP and can only be gotten on eBay at $200 or more. I'd go with a later mid, the one represented in the widely available Taimya kit.

Thanks Hermesminiatures, I was hoping for a late Tiger without zimm, but I may not have the option. Did find a zimm set from  Eduard model accessories Czech that looks to be right. Can order that from Squadron.

I do appreciate all the help on this. Going to do some more research and find the zimmed winter Tiger I to pique the interest.

Dale 

Here's a 221 in winter camo - I'm sure they would have done it on 222's as well.

Hey, I just did one of those for War In The Desert...came out pretty decent, even OOB.

Have you ever seen a pic of one of these winterized? I haven't, but I imagine it would be pretty neat! 

Waaaaaaaaaaaait a second...are you joining this build Manny? Didn't think we'd see you around these parts!

Thanks to the tiger experts for the timely ID, btw.

There are some significant differences between the early and the initial. Issues aside, he doesn't necessarily want to build that particular tank - he wants a winter camouflaged late with no zimmerit. Which I doubt exists...

In my previous post I was thinking of Gruppe Fehrmann. They commandeered five Tiger I's from an armor training school in January 1945 and fought until the last Tiger was destroyed in April. This was quite the mix of tiger parts - un-zimmed lates with early turrets. Don't know if you have an early turret though to use with the late hull. IF you did, you could model a hypothetical winter-camo version - the only photos are ones taken by the British when they destroyed the Tigers in April.

It seems that there are dozens of choices from early and mid Tigers in winter camo, but next to nothing as far as late models, especially if you want something without zimmerit.

Seems the most common variant with winter camo is the early mid, which essentially has all the features of the mid Tiger except that it retains the fold-up cupola. The only kit that can be used to model this variant is the CH Michael Wittmann Tiger, which is OOP and can only be gotten on eBay at $200 or more.

I'd go with a later mid, the one represented in the widely available Taimya kit.

Thanks for the expertise guys, like I said, I'm not very knowledgable on these. Sounds like I need to order the Zimm after all.

I do actually have the Dragon "initial" version in the stash, but had planned on getting really carried away with that build adding the full interior and engine bay. The Tamiya was sort of the break in build into the Tigers, since I haven't done one yet.

All the late Tigers had the Zimm then?

Thanks again guys

dale 

Hermesminiatures wrote:

From what I can see (not much), that's a very early mid production model - it has the mid wheels and has lost the Feifel air cleaners, but still retains the originial cupola with the fold-up hatch. There's currently no kit of this variant available - your best bet would be to base it off an early tiger kit. Seeing as that's an illustration and not an inerrant photo, it could also be a later early production model, depending on the road wheels (and this picture really isn't enough to tell) Either way, you'll end up using the early Tiger as your base kit if you want to model that vehicle. It's definitely not a late Tiger (you can tell most easily by the rubber-rimmed road wheels as opposed to the steel wheels of the late production model) There were some old Tiger I's formed into a stop-gap Kampfgruppe during the winter of 1944/45, although I don't rememeber the name off the top of my head. They had all three variants of the Tiger and some winter-camo lates with no zimmerit. Will look around and see if I can find a picture.

From what I can see (not much), that's a very early mid production model - it has the mid wheels and has lost the Feifel air cleaners, but still retains the originial cupola with the fold-up hatch.

There's currently no kit of this variant available - your best bet would be to base it off an early tiger kit.

Seeing as that's an illustration and not an inerrant photo, it could also be a later early production model, depending on the road wheels (and this picture really isn't enough to tell)

Either way, you'll end up using the early Tiger as your base kit if you want to model that vehicle. It's definitely not a late Tiger (you can tell most easily by the rubber-rimmed road wheels as opposed to the steel wheels of the late production model)

There were some old Tiger I's formed into a stop-gap Kampfgruppe during the winter of 1944/45, although I don't rememeber the name off the top of my head. They had all three variants of the Tiger and some winter-camo lates with no zimmerit. Will look around and see if I can find a picture.

Here's the pic Dupes. Now, I'll be the first to admit my knowledge on dates for this tank is rudimentary at best. Is a 1943 Tiger considered a late version? I've read that some Tigers were coated with Zimm starting in July '43, but not all. 

Dale 

Someone finally broke the Dragon-string...you're killing our sponsorship requirements!

Do you have a scan of your ref pic available? I'm sure someone here can validate it's accuracy for you.

Here's your non-Dragon post up Dupes. It's going to be a bare, (not zimmed) Tiger in white. I found a pic of a late Tiger without the zim and went with it. No real idea if this will be historically correct though. Just finally get to build this.

Dale 

darson wrote:

There seems to be an awful lot of parts there for a 1/48 scale kit

Wow, you aren't kidding! Kits like this make me wish I could make myself do some 1/48's some time...but all of that 1/35 in the closet is talking me out of it.

Well I never actually got started on New Years day like I planned but last night I did break out the T-34 and de-bag it.

There seems to be an awful lot of parts there for a 1/48 scale kit  

One piece that I did think was quite nifty was the PE engine vent cover which is already attached to the styrene.

Maximum no of kits I can work on at once is about four.  That way I can put one down when I need a break and do some work on something different.

Cheers

Heh. Forgot I had hosted this pic of me and Boots for another thread. For those of you that wanted to see the "front side" of the Tiger VII:

I DO have another cat...but he isn't into cardboard (or modeling) nearly as much.

"Orange Tiger VII" - I love it! I may have to change his name now...

As for whitewashing him, I could just toss him out the front door of the house - in the past 3 days we've gotten (best estimate, eliminating drift effect) 28 inches of snow. On top of the 2 or 3 feet of snow we had before. Meh. I'll try to take a picture tomorrow morning before I come in to work - it's totally nuts. Can't see over the snowbanks to get out of the driveway!

BBrownii - it is absolutely NOT too late to get in on the GB! It just got officially rolling yesterday, and only a couple of guys have made real starts to their builds. Just tell me what you want to build and I'll add you to the (extensive and glamourous) list on the first page!

Hey guys,

A lot of great looking kits in this build!  I love the looks of the Panzer III and IV!  Might have to pick one (or both) of those up one day...  Is it too late to jump on board?  I promise to do something from a different manufacturer (I have a couple Tamiya kits in mind...)!!