Way Too Many Props GB April 18, 2011 - Extended to July 28, 2012

Just got done doing that very thing last week!  I always put them in before sealing the fuselage.  I glue them in and let dry.  Using one hand to support the window, I place tape over it and barnish the tape down with a toothpick or something.  After barnishing, the edges between the clear piece and fuselage should be distingishable, if not use a pencil to trace the edges.  Then just trace use a knife to cut the tape free.  After the taping is down, wipe off the inside of the glass with a cloth/q-tip to clean up any fingerprints.  Did the same thing to the landing lights on the wings.

That's how I do windows like that anyway.

B17Pilot

Just got done doing that very thing last week!  I always put them in before sealing the fuselage.  I glue them in and let dry.  Using one hand to support the window, I place tape over it and barnish the tape down with a toothpick or something.  After barnishing, the edges between the clear piece and fuselage should be distingishable, if not use a pencil to trace the edges.  Then just trace use a knife to cut the tape free.  After the taping is down, wipe off the inside of the glass with a cloth/q-tip to clean up any fingerprints.  Did the same thing to the landing lights on the wings.

That's how I do windows like that anyway.

I do mine the same way, just about. I mask mine right before painting, when the fuse` has already been sealed. Like you said Doogs...I just knocked a set of windows out of my Betty while trying to remove the masks.... I used white glue but will be using CA in the future, for better holding strength. The parts won`t craze as long as you dip them in Future...at least they haven`t crazed on me yet. Another thing you could do for small windows is make your own, after painting, with the Testor`s white glue/ window maker....that`s what I had to do on the Betty. Sometimes it takes a few applications to get it to look right but eventually, it looks good.

B17Pilot

 Speaking of invasion stripes, been trying to find a picture I saw of some paratroopers waiting to board a C-47 and saw that the paint from the invasion stripes had run down the side and onto the star and bars insiginia.  Talk about putting them on in a hurry.  Man where did I find that picture?

  Most units probably did a rush job with those 'limited time' stripes and the GIs had a great many airplanes to paint them onto. Now , it probably didn't take much time for them to start looking dirty, but they were painted on aircraft that had already weathered, so they should still be fresher than the rest of the aircraft. 

 I also feel some out fits may have put more care into painting the stripes. Where there was more man power, fewer acft.,  etc. Probably fighter and bomber units mostly , but I remember seeing pics of some pretty hastily applied stripes to Mustangs, Jugs, others too. Most of the troop carrier pics I've seen seem a bit on the hurried on side of things. 

 I think I'll do a bit of weathering , mask and give the stripes a light base coat of paint , then finish like one normally would. Then as part of my final weathering after a flat clearcoat , I'll give another coat of paint to the stripes freehand with a flat brush about the scale width of ones I've seen being used in reference pics. That should give just enough ragged edge , even some light brush strokes . Then maybe a light wash and dusting to give them the look of sitting around in the nasty English weather of that time.

 As to Doogs masking challenge. Another idea might be to mask the windows and trim to the edges before installing them. Just be sure the tape is down tight over the "glass" so none of the glue wicks under the mask  when installing the windows. I've also had Future give some protection from crazing even with regular cement but not always. Usually where it wicked up a seam or wrinkle in the masking tape.

 Howard 

Thanks for the suggestions, all. Need to think on it. There's also a tricky matter of some recognition lights in the underside of the fuselage, along the centerline seam. I'm thinking, instead of masking, of knocking them down ever so slightly and then dropping some MV lenses on top when all's said and done.

Finally have some pics to show, too. The office, more or less done. Not terribly happy with the seats' molded-on harnesses, but I guess the view inside's going to be restricted by the greenhouse, so I'm not sweating it too much.

I should also note that the iPhone blows out the raw umber wash and makes everything look far more green than it really is. Will see about some better pics tomorrow once everything's dried.

 Looks good there Doogs. I think the molded harnesses will be fine. 

 Got some WIP pics of the Pratt&Whitneys on my Goon'. 

First a thinned coat of flat black on the cylinders, followed with a drybrushing of MM steel . I prefer to use steel at this stage for the subtle tone variation with the aluminum detail painting to come. 

 

 

The kit has you mounting the engines, then assembling the props and front reduction gear housing later.

I preferred to have the engines complete with all wiring/plumbing beforehand. Plus, the ignition harness ring at the front of the engine mounts to the the front gear housing.

So, I drilled out the prop centers and fit a plug to be drilled out for a shaft mounted in the engines. Made new prop shafts from sprue and fashioned bearings in the front covers for the shafts to ride in.  

 

 

 

 

The new prop shafts installed.

Back side before intake and exhaust manifolds.

 

Where I'm at so far.Now to install the wiring and plumbing. The manifolds will be the last to go because of the difficulty of mounting the plug wires between them in such a tight space.

 Howard

 

Nice engines, Howard!

Well I got the fuselage together and the wings are attached!  Smaller than I thought it would be.

Hey All....I`m having major computer trouble...it keeps crashing to a blue screen, something about a kernal page error..???  Every so often, it let`s me on for a while so I figured I`d report my Betty being 99.9% done but can`t post pics because of the crashing. I`m starting back up on the Mossie and should have it done shortly. If anyone knows why my laptop is crashing...KERNAL PAGE ERROR..I believe that`s what it s saying, please feel free to contact me back channel if you have a possible fix. Thanks,

Len

DoogsATX

Question for the group - the Ventura's my first "windowed" build in a LONG time. How do you all deal with masking windows that have to be inserted before the fuselage is closed up?

I'm thinking there are three options:

 

• First - just try to mask the things with tape. Difficulty - curvy windows.
• Second - put them in, try to mask them in position with something like white glue. Difficulty - getting it off, chance of knocking out window, etc.
• Third - prime and paint exterior color around window area, then mask window + area around before real painting.

 

I'm leaning toward the latter, figure I could paint pretty large areas around the windows (they'd be either intermediate blue - or white for the various nav lights), just mask a small area, then engage in blending so there wouldn't be a "square of masking" left behind. 

Also, assuming rain tonight, I should be moving into detail painting the interior tonight. IP is more or less done, and relevant pieces have been interior greened.

I'd go with option #3 - BUT when you go to mask the area, take your tape to the nearest panel lines. Save you blending so afterwards & adds a little variation to some panels for you.

Blue screens can be caused by a number of things.  Unfortunately, none of them good.  It could be any of the following.

1.  Windows is corrupted and needs to be reinstalled.

2.  The system's memory is having issues and may need to be replaced.

3.  The Systems CPU may be malfunctioning and may need to be replaced.

These are the top three causes of Blue Screens.

Can you provide me with some more detailed info on your exact system.  Hardware, version of Windows, age, brand and model?  Was the system doing anything unusual before the BSOD (Blue Screen Of Death)  (No kidding, that's what it's called..)  Any system errors recently, and have you installed any new software recently or changed anything in the hardware or software?

Let me have some more info and I will try and help as much as I can.

Rich

 

troublemaker66

Hey All....I`m having major computer trouble...it keeps crashing to a blue screen, something about a kernal page error..???  Every so often, it let`s me on for a while so I figured I`d report my Betty being 99.9% done but can`t post pics because of the crashing. I`m starting back up on the Mossie and should have it done shortly. If anyone knows why my laptop is crashing...KERNAL PAGE ERROR..I believe that`s what it s saying, please feel free to contact me back channel if you have a possible fix. Thanks,

Len

VanceCrozier

 

DoogsATX:

 

Question for the group - the Ventura's my first "windowed" build in a LONG time. How do you all deal with masking windows that have to be inserted before the fuselage is closed up?

I'm thinking there are three options:

 

• First - just try to mask the things with tape. Difficulty - curvy windows.
• Second - put them in, try to mask them in position with something like white glue. Difficulty - getting it off, chance of knocking out window, etc.
• Third - prime and paint exterior color around window area, then mask window + area around before real painting.

 

I'm leaning toward the latter, figure I could paint pretty large areas around the windows (they'd be either intermediate blue - or white for the various nav lights), just mask a small area, then engage in blending so there wouldn't be a "square of masking" left behind. 

Also, assuming rain tonight, I should be moving into detail painting the interior tonight. IP is more or less done, and relevant pieces have been interior greened.

 

 

I'd go with option #3 - BUT when you go to mask the area, take your tape to the nearest panel lines. Save you blending so afterwards & adds a little variation to some panels for you.

You Canadians...always so wise!

I actually really like that. Now...need to sort it in my head whether I want to use MM, Tamiya or Gunze for the colorfest.

DoogsATX

 

 

You Canadians...always so wise!

...

Canadians: good for more than hockey, beer and maple syrup!!! 

I`m going to try and sneak a few pics of my Betty in while my computer is cooperating....

sunshades made from toilet paper..

 

 

 

It`s about 99% done. I want to give the bottom a wash and then install the fiddlies and antennae wires. Now...on to the Mossie...I`m really glad about the extension to July!  Thanks for looking!

Len

B17Pilot

Nice engines, Howard!

Well I got the fuselage together and the wings are attached!  Smaller than I thought it would be.

I agree about the size - much lower wing area than I'd assumed for something this size.

So you're putting the wings on first?

Honestly, on mine, the fit is so amazing that I'm planning to paint the wings and the tail off the fuselage. The tail, especially, snap fits very snug and in perfect alignment on mine. 

Also, where's the astrodome? You planning on putting that in through the opening where the turret mount goes?

Yea, I thought she be about the size of a B-25, but instead she's closer to an A-20.

I had a small issue with the starboard wing.  Had to sand the corner of the tabs down to get it to fit in there, maybe I didn't press it together good enough when gluing it..  Of course, I always attach the wings to get seams covered and blended, that plus the little fit issue with the tabs.  Definietly like the tail, too.  Nice tight fit! And alignment. Heck I used the tail to help hold the fuseladge together while the glue dried! 

After several trial runs before gluing the fuseladge together, I found that I could reach the astrodome from the turret opening, so I left it out to make seam repair easier. Plus still trying to decide how I'm going to mask the thing, go with tape, or liquid mask? I'll add it after the seam has been fixed.

I am leaving the bomb bay doors off till the end. Going to leave them open anyway.

Quick update on the Ventura. Sprayed the areas around the windows and wing lights with MM enamel primer tonight. I'm going to pursue the paint it, mount the windows, mask the area approach.

Also, B17, what you said about being able to get the astrodome in after joining the fuselage got me thinking. As far as how to mask, why not take the same tack I'm doing for the side windows? Paint the area sea blue first, then insert the dome? That way who cares if you mask a bit of the fuselage in the process? Masking the hole would be easy enough - just roll up some paper, insert, and unwind until it fills the space.

Final note...I was extremely unhappy with the True Details prop set, so I picked up the Vector set. Miles better. Don't think I'm going to use the crankcases, but the props are better and require virtually no cleanup, and their connection to the hub is notched very well, almost foolproof really. Which I certainly appreciate.

Got the Intermediate Blue sprayed on the fuselage around the windows tonight, and a slightly off-white on the underside of the wings where the clear parts will go.

I've also decided to replace the forward .50 cals with some Quickboost resin I picked up for a B-25 gun nose awhile back. Should spice things up a bit, and give me the freedom to install them after paint.

DoogsATX

Got the Intermediate Blue sprayed on the fuselage around the windows tonight, and a slightly off-white on the underside of the wings where the clear parts will go.

I've also decided to replace the forward .50 cals with some Quickboost resin I picked up for a B-25 gun nose awhile back. Should spice things up a bit, and give me the freedom to install them after paint.

I`m keeping an eye on your build Doogs. I`m planning on building mine for another GB soon and plan on an OOB build...maybe a little PE if I can find some.

troublemaker66

I`m keeping an eye on your build Doogs. I`m planning on building mine for another GB soon and plan on an OOB build...maybe a little PE if I can find some.

 

Heh - speaking of PE, I stole some leftover PE to busy up the cockpit sidewalls. Also added some Mig Beach Sand pigment to dirty up the proceedings since the cockpit just felt way too clean. Going to add some wiring, too, to busy up the office.

I should have time, since I lost one of the fuselage windows last night and have to wait on a replacement.

Also snipped off the barrels of the nose .50s and tested the Quickboost resin. Me like! Need to add some styrene boxing around to keep the barrels from accidentally falling into the fuselage. And doesn't it look like a surprised fish?

 

Looking Nice Doogs ! I got the Lone Star models new props ,wheels and exhausts for my PV..

 

troublemaker66

...maybe a little PE if I can find some.

I won't mind a mask set from Eduard!  Good thing I already put the barrels in on mine, otherwise I would have to go get me a set and put them in.....but then it wouldn't be OOB anymore

Guess the next one will have all the goodies!

Yeah I ordered the LSM exhausts and tires. Then I saw that Ultracast has their own tires now. Sorry LSM, but there's no beating Ultracast tires...

Wouldn't mind an Eduard mask either...hoping I can drag out the build long enough for that to become a reality!

DoogsATX

troublemaker66:

I`m keeping an eye on your build Doogs. I`m planning on building mine for another GB soon and plan on an OOB build...maybe a little PE if I can find some.

 

 

Heh - speaking of PE, I stole some leftover PE to busy up the cockpit sidewalls. Also added some Mig Beach Sand pigment to dirty up the proceedings since the cockpit just felt way too clean. Going to add some wiring, too, to busy up the office.

I should have time, since I lost one of the fuselage windows last night and have to wait on a replacement.

Also snipped off the barrels of the nose .50s and tested the Quickboost resin. Me like! Need to add some styrene boxing around to keep the barrels from accidentally falling into the fuselage. And doesn't it look like a surprised fish?

 

LOL..Yeah, it kinda does!  You say you lost 1 little window?  Have you ever tried making your own with Testor`s white glue? I think the home made windows look better `cause they`re way thinner than the kit ones. I knocked 2 out of my Betty with no way of putting them back in  so, I made my own. If I can do it it`s gotta be a simple thing..lol. You could even try it on the Ventura while waiting for the new one and if you don`t like it, wipe it off.

That's kind of why I'm waiting for the last possible moment to install the canopy on the top and bottom.

B17Pilot

troublemaker66:

...maybe a little PE if I can find some.

 

I won't mind a mask set from Eduard!  Good thing I already put the barrels in on mine, otherwise I would have to go get me a set and put them in.....but then it wouldn't be OOB anymore

Guess the next one will have all the goodies!

I`m not a big AM parts guy....half the time you can`t see it once everything is closed up.My Betty `pit is all PE but ya can`t really see it. I have the "Visible" B-17G That I`m planning on doing as a cut away and have every PE set made for it and been eyeballin` the resin sets for it. I never have much luck with mask sets...rather use Tamiya tape and cut `em myself.

troublemaker66

 

LOL..Yeah, it kinda does!  You say you lost 1 little window?  Have you ever tried making your own with Testor`s white glue? I think the home made windows look better `cause they`re way thinner than the kit ones. I knocked 2 out of my Betty with no way of putting them back in  so, I made my own. If I can do it it`s gotta be a simple thing..lol. You could even try it on the Ventura while waiting for the new one and if you don`t like it, wipe it off.

 

So I just found out I have to jump through stupid 20th century hoops to get a new part (send the UPC from the box by mail to them? WTF? Should I use carrier pigeon or pony express? I wonder if smoke signals travel that far...), I'm inclined to try this method. Tell me more - the one time I tried to use this stuff before it was a fail since I could never get it to reach across the distance. What if I used a clear acetate backing in the square mount in the fuselage, then used Testors' clear parts cement from the outside, with that as a backing?

DoogsATX

troublemaker66:

 

LOL..Yeah, it kinda does!  You say you lost 1 little window?  Have you ever tried making your own with Testor`s white glue? I think the home made windows look better `cause they`re way thinner than the kit ones. I knocked 2 out of my Betty with no way of putting them back in  so, I made my own. If I can do it it`s gotta be a simple thing..lol. You could even try it on the Ventura while waiting for the new one and if you don`t like it, wipe it off.

 

 

So I just found out I have to jump through stupid 20th century hoops to get a new part (send the UPC from the box by mail to them? WTF? Should I use carrier pigeon or pony express? I wonder if smoke signals travel that far...), I'm inclined to try this method. Tell me more - the one time I tried to use this stuff before it was a fail since I could never get it to reach across the distance. What if I used a clear acetate backing in the square mount in the fuselage, then used Testors' clear parts cement from the outside, with that as a backing?

Unfortunately, that`s how Revell does it. Keeps the free parts requests down I suppose. Anyway...would be alot easier to show you than explain but, here I go...You have to puddle it a little on one end of the opening and kinda drag it  down one side while dragging across the opening, back and forth until you reach the other end of the opening. Once you have a film covering the entire opening, let it completely dry...it will dry absolutely clear. If it looks good to you,let it be. If not, you can put another layer right over the top of the 1st. You could back it with acetate, lost the Betty`s bomb aimer`s window and did just that,larger the hole, the harder it is to make the window. Don`t know if you can remove the acetate after drying...I would think no. It`s all a trial and error thing...once you see what you have to do to fill the window port,it`ll click in your brain and you`ll have it mastered in no time. Practice it a couple times on your "paint Mule"..if it has small windows. Once you get it down I think you`ll love it...dries perfectly clear. like real glass. Worth a shot anyway!

Well, I've decided to give windowmaker a shot. Now I just need to pick some up. Thankfully I need to run to the LHS something fierce (need to put in an order for some PE for the Laffey, pick up some paint to tackle my first figure...) so hopefully they'll have some I can snag.

Some pretty major progress last night. The fuselage is together. The wings are mostly together (need to weld a few last spots) and the engine pods are tacked on front and rear. The engines and cowls are just taped in place at this point, and will be until after painting. Still trying to make up my mind if I want to wire up the engines or not, but it looks like they'll be pretty prominent, so I'm leaning toward yes.

A few pretty big exceptions from the instructions for those following along...

- I've left out the bomb deck. I'm planning a closed-bay build, so a well-sorted, perfectly installed bay is kind of pointless. Leaving the bay out for now also gives me access up into the fuselage, so I'll be able to install the astrodome long after painting. With some cutting of the portion up under the cockpit, I can also fit it after the fact and adjust it through the dorsal turret piece (which fits so tight it probably doesn't need to be glued at all).

- I'm leaving the gear struts out for now. They fit with the engine pods in place, so why put them in early? There's no reason.

- Wings are staying off until the end. They fit very well. Droop a bit unaided, but with some epoxy or something at the join, they'll hold just fine. Honestly, the weight of the fuselage once they're supported by the landing gear would probably be enough.

- I've ordered a single-piece bay doors from D-Mold. The four-piece chaos of the kit is very obviously designed for an open bay. Why they couldn't do a second, single piece is beyond me.

- I've ordered a single-piece bay doors from D-Mold. The four-piece chaos of the kit is very obviously designed for an open bay. Why they couldn't do a second, single piece is beyond me.

[/quote]Now...where`s the challenge with a single piece bay doors. After all, this is a Revell kit, there`s a certain amount of anger, frustration and swearing in every box....

DoogsATX

- I'm leaving the gear struts out for now. They fit with the engine pods in place, so why put them in early? There's no reason.

Helps with painting a lot if they aren't attached.

I'm getting the engines all painted, though reading Doogs' post, I'm considering leaving them off and tacking on the engine cowls and front pieces till after painting, won't have to mask the engines.  Will have to check panel lines vs. seams to see if I can pull this off.

B17Pilot

 

DoogsATX:

 

- I'm leaving the gear struts out for now. They fit with the engine pods in place, so why put them in early? There's no reason.

 

 

Helps with painting a lot if they aren't attached.

I'm getting the engines all painted, though reading Doogs' post, I'm considering leaving them off and tacking on the engine cowls and front pieces till after painting, won't have to mask the engines.  Will have to check panel lines vs. seams to see if I can pull this off.

I'm certain you can - if anything you can assemble the cowl sides and forward ring, and drop those onto the pods after the fact. Very clean, good fit right there.